Is Fire Emblem Really That Complicated?

[SSbardock84]

I've tried getting many people in the past to try and Fire Emblem games but they can never figure out how to play it and they just do everything . . . wrong. Is it just easy for me because I've played these games my whole life? Is the game really that complicated for people or do I just have sort of dumb friends? Idk have any of you guys had friends like this?

[MCProductions]

Yeah, me about a year and a half ago when I first picked up Awakening and FE 7.

I'd say it isn't extremely complicated, but it appears deceptively simple. It's a bit like chess in that people pick it up expecting something simple, and then get their butts royally handed to them.

The series is more or less unforgiving to newcomers unfortunately, with the exception of the games with Casual mode of course. Heck, New Mystery has Casual mode, and it's debatably still highly unforgiving to newcomers regardless

[The Geek]

It took me awhile to really understand what I was doing in FE. FE7's tutorial really helped out in that regard.

One thing that really irked me is that I don't think any game really explains weapon weight.

[King Garon]

No, it's not that complicated. We just make it seem that complicated. I mean you don't need units with godlike stats, but people reset for better stats anyway. The only real way to do everything wrong is kill and under-level everyone but the lord(s) and the jegan. Even then, you can always start over.

[Ycine]

I also tried to corru... I mean make people play Fire Emblem games.

And it was a Great Success!

I introduced them to Fire Emblem using FE13. This was the perfect opus to start and learn!

They didn't have any problem at all. Sometimes they asked for informations but nothing "complicated".

As of today, most of my newcomers friends have already played at least 4 FE games!

To answer your question :

I don't find the game difficult! The tutorial is always nearby!

Ans my friends didn't find it difficult too. Until some tries Lunatic mode.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Ycine

[Knight Falchion]

Even if I didn't have the easiest time getting into the series, I don't think it's really that complicated. I'd even say it benefits from its simplicity as compared to the other SRPGs I've played. That doesn't make it easy, though, and I think MCProductions had a good point in saying it appears deceptively simple. Even though the mechanics are fairly straightforward, there are still things that go unexplained or aren't easily grasped on first attempts, like when engaging in combat might be better on enemy phase.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Ambling Falchion

[Parrhesia]

People make mistakes in FE until they get the hang of it. In FE, mistakes are punished severely - by a unit death, and depending on the new player, a reset. The reverse difficulty curve of FE - the start is always harder than the end - doesn't help, either.

[kantoorfarina]

I've been thinking about that, too. My friend couldn't get past Chapter 5 of Sacred Stones, even on Easy Mode and I was wondering... How could you possibly fail that badly? This isn't just me tipping my ego, I really had no idea what they possibly could've been doing wrong.

That said, the Talk command is rarely outright explained and that's sort of unfriendly to newcomers. Who would ever have your healer, Natasha, stand in front of a Myrmidon holding a Killing Edge? Had Sacred Stones been my first FE, I would've assumed Joshua was a mini-boss and his conversation with Natasha at the start was an introduction.

[Shrouded In Myth]

People aren't used to the sort of thinking required to play Fire Emblem. Especially keeping track of probabilities, which is why newcomers think the games are to luck-based while veterans will tell you that is blatantly false.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Shrouded In Myth

[The Geek]

I think a big problem I had was that my first SRPG was the GBA version of Lord of the Rings The Third Age, which has no punishment for losing units (unless you play Sauron mode and even then that only applies to your heroes because your army is mostly made up of generics) and my first FE game was Shadow Dragon which actually tells you "don't be afraid if you lose a unit" which I took to far and therefore got stuck at Chapter 11 because my army was made up completely of generics and Marth.

I don't even think I really got "good" at FE (I say good in quotations because I'm not really that good, good enough to get through each game on the median difficulty but that's about it) until after I played Awakening. Which was my 7th FE game. Yeah it took a long time. The only reason I got through my initial FE6 playthrough was because I abused the arena and savestates to hell.

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

People aren't used to the sort of thinking required to play Fire Emblem. Especially keeping track of probabilities, which is why newcomers think the games are to lick-based while veterans will tell you that is blatantly false.

its mostly this, its a small numbers game where you wanna do everything you can to tip the numbers in your favor, even then you gotta make sure the probabilities of what happens is safe.

its definately one of those "easy to play, hard to master" with some of the more useful tips (like trading with a unit to switch which weapon they are equip with) isn't told in any of the games, thus some stuff requires experimentation, which can be risky with permadeath

[The Geek]

its mostly this, its a small numbers game where you wanna do everything you can to tip the numbers in your favor, even then you gotta make sure the probabilities of what happens is safe.

its definately one of those "easy to play, hard to master" with some of the more useful tips (like trading with a unit to switch which weapon they are equip with) isn't told in any of the games, thus some stuff requires experimentation, which can be risky with permadeath

In addition to that, I can't remember if any game actually explains how weapon weight works. Which is, you know, kind of important like money

Edited September 13, 2015 by The Geek

[eclipse]

That said, the Talk command is rarely outright explained and that's sort of unfriendly to newcomers. Who would ever have your healer, Natasha, stand in front of a Myrmidon holding a Killing Edge? Had Sacred Stones been my first FE, I would've assumed Joshua was a mini-boss and his conversation with Natasha at the start was an introduction.

This is one of those times where paying attention to the plot is important. Joshua bumps into Natasha before the chapter begins. Several other early situations are like this (Guy's recruitment).

---

IMO, Awakening was a bigger pain in the ass than the previous installments. The beauty of Fire Emblem is that many, MANY things can be calculated, whether it be odds of hitting or damage. Most of them can be done with a cell phone calculator, at most. What's hard is actually doing the math.

For FE8, play Easy Mode, because that comes with a tutorial. I'd start people off on FE7, because despite the tedium, the tutorial is amazing for a newcomer, and lays out a lot of basics.

[Tamanoir]

It took me awhile to really understand what I was doing in FE. FE7's tutorial really helped out in that regard.

One thing that really irked me is that I don't think any game really explains weapon weight.

I didn't remember having any problem understanding weapon weight.

It is pretty easy to figure out by yourself

("Oh, Florina is ablen to double this ennemy with her Slim Lance, but not with her javelin.

And she lost avoid too.")

What I had trouble understanding was the supports. No one tells you it's something you can do, and there's no sign you're doing the right thing.

It took a couple playthrough to understand the gist of it and have something else than Hector x Eliwood.

People aren't used to the sort of thinking required to play Fire Emblem. Especially keeping track of probabilities, which is why newcomers think the games are to luck-based while veterans will tell you that is blatantly false.

This.

There is a lot of things that ends up becoming automatism, but can be quite difficult to handle early on.

I've tried getting many people in the past to try and Fire Emblem games but they can never figure out how to play it and they just do everything . . . wrong. Is it just easy for me because I've played these games my whole life? Is the game really that complicated for people or do I just have sort of dumb friends? Idk have any of you guys had friends like this?

It's something I though a lot recently, but what do you means by "playing wrong" ? Is it because they get themselves stuck, or because they don't play "efficiently"/the same way you do ?

Because, most Fire Emblem games offers a good deal of flexibility in the way you play it, especially on the easiest mode.

And, in the absolute, there's not a really "better" way to play between Arena Abusing and LTC.

Both offers some advantages and disadvantages, and you can find how to adapt your playstyle to the games.

It's not because it's punishing it isn't flexible.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Tamanoir

[Anouleth]

The game isn't that complicated but it's very punishing if you make mistakes, moreso than most RPGs.

[The DanMan]

In a way, it is. Think about it; most of us here who are all "it's not that complicated" started the series when they were younger and adapted to it.

For example, I myself do not find Monster Hunter to be "slowpaced" or "clunky", but that's at least partially because I started playing it when I was 10 years old and adapted to it relatively quickly; I didn't have much in the way of expectations or experience in what I thought was something similiar to it.

[CrimeanRoyalKnight]

I guess it all depends on who you ask.

For an average person, it probably is complicated at first sight, too much stuff to calculate and consider. But for the average SRPG gamer? I highly doubt it.

And as some people said here, it's easy to learn, but hard to master. It's far simpler than some people make it out to be, for sure.

[omglmaowtf]

Well for many FE7 GBA was probably the first SRPG they've ever forayed into.

As for the rest of us probably have played SRPGs since they were on the older generations of consoles e.g. Shining Force on Genesis (I know, that's a less complex series than FE)

But FE, generally a complicated SRPG series? LOL wait till they try XCOM games

[Loki Laufeyson]

No, its not complicated. Its just tricky. The thing i like about FE is that its this kind of game without being hella complicated. I found Final Fantasy Tactics more complicated than FE. FE is designed to be challenging but simple (and flexible) to overcome.

[Radiant head]

Someone described FE mechanics in the other thread about SRPG's as "easy to learn, hard to master." I think that's basically it in a nutshell.

[Florete]

I've recently felt like FE is less complicated than it at first seems. When you're not familiar with it, you see all these stats and it can be hard to memorize what they all mean to the player: unit stats, weapon stats, enemy stats, weapon levels, terrain stats, skills. But when you get down to it, it's actually kind of simple: the stats HP, Strength/Magic, Defense, Resistance, and Move are all simple point-for-point values, meaning they just add or subtract easily wherever applicable. When a player figures this out, it makes damage calculation much simpler, which is going to be the most important thing for a novice. Even Speed, Skill, and Luck aren't really as complicated as the stats in other RPGs, though they take time to get used to reading.

[Yari]

I never thought FE as being complicated just hard when you're still a beginner but once you get a hold of it it's very easy to play while maintaining a bit of dificulty. It's tricky but not complicated wich makes it very good.

[deleted35362]

recruiting people can be a little complicated to new people sometimes. in fe7 you can play the game like 5 times and still be wondering why theres dark magic in the shops

[llee1000]

I remember when I played my first FE game. I was really bad and I didn't know what I was doing. It was FE:11 and by chapter 3 everyone but Marth, Draug and Jagen were dead. It wasn't for a while before I got gud. I remember having trouble with any chapters with reinforcements. When I went back to FE:11, I realized how easy it was.

There is some slight learning, but once you start playing a lot, you begin to get a hold of things and start to git gud.