The Absolute Worst Fire Emblem Characters.

[SpearOfLies]

1 hour ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Okay. I thought that was what it was.

 

I never did try Awakening Lunatic, or Fates Lunatic for that matter.

How would you do it? It might be easy enough on normal mode, but on hard mode? Grinding is much less feasible since Reeking Boxes are much more expensive relative to normal mode, and with his bad bases (his best non-luck stat is Strength... At a whopping 4.)... Yeah. You'd have to go out of your way to make him usable, and he NEEDS a Second Seal to function. And even with it? He has to fight his way out of bronze lock AGAIN.

Because his bases suck, and he has to risk dying if I try to feed him something that isn't an archer.

I do, and tbf, I find he can hold his own.

Okay. Personally, though, Arthur's good defense is compromised by his awful crit evade, and thus he's a dangerous investment that can easily blow up in your face. Also, as for magic classes, I disagree on Grandmaster and Oni Chieftain being good magic classes - I find the former in particular rather underwhelming for how much of a pain in the butt it is to get.

I mean strategist, not Grandmaster. It was 2:00 am when I wrote it.

 

I find Oni Chieftain the real dark mage/sorcerer class. He have the stats what dark mage/sorcerer should have. Fates make me value more defensive stats than offensive one. I played half of conquest without a situable tank(Effie have good basic def but maybe unlucky or bad growth it was not good enought, still her strenght is insane), but cannot go forward cause the gangbang became insane and I hate ninja.

[Shadow Mir]

5 hours ago, SpearOfLies said:

I mean strategist, not Grandmaster. It was 2:00 am when I wrote it.

 

I find Oni Chieftain the real dark mage/sorcerer class. He have the stats what dark mage/sorcerer should have. Fates make me value more defensive stats than offensive one. I played half of conquest without a situable tank(Effie have good basic def but maybe unlucky or bad growth it was not good enought, still her strenght is insane), but cannot go forward cause the gangbang became insane and I hate ninja.

Okay then. I thought Grandmaster because it was related to the class you mentioned. 

My big problem with Oni Chieftain is the poor distribution. It doesn't help that the class is mostly given to physical units. That said, I understand what you mean by Fates making you value defensive stats - dodgetanking doesn't work nearly as well in that game as it did in others. Anyways, if you can't trust Effie on the frontlines, what makes you think you can trust Arthur, who's liable to eat triple damage hits from most anything, to hold them??? As an aside, I don't see the appeal of Vantage, as far as this game's concerned.

Edited February 19, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[SpearOfLies]

1 hour ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Okay then. I thought Grandmaster because it was related to the class you mentioned. 

My big problem with Oni Chieftain is the poor distribution. It doesn't help that the class is mostly given to physical units. That said, I understand what you mean by Fates making you value defensive stats - dodgetanking doesn't work nearly as well in that game as it did in others. Anyways, if you can't trust Effie on the frontlines, what makes you think you can trust Arthur, who's liable to eat triple damage hits from most anything, to hold them??? As an aside, I don't see the appeal of Vantage, as far as this game's concerned.

Hayato can get it and Rhajat too(which rekt most of enemy in my lunatic birthright alone having as mother Rinkah).

 

Did I say I use Arthur as my tank? 

 

Vantage is my favorite basic class skill because they fit my favorite strategic: Kill or get killed. Adding together with an offensive skill became bloken as shit. 

[Just call me AL]

21 minutes ago, SpearOfLies said:

Hayato can get it and Rhajat too(which rekt most of enemy in my lunatic birthright alone having as mother Rinkah).

Funilly enough, I could argue Hayato being one of the lesser units on Birthright. Probably worse than Mozu there. And that's because he joins with Mozu's most crippling issue there, in addition to having worse availability than her.

1 hour ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

As an aside, I don't see the appeal of Vantage, as far as this game's concerned.

It can help provide some extra defense for Birthright!Silas, Birthright!Sophie, Revelations!Saizo, Revelations!Percy, a Conquest or Revelations Kaze who's married Charlotte or Selena, or a Revelations Xander who's married either of the spouses mentioned in Kaze's case. It's also kinda fun to see Ophelia use it in almost perfect conjunction with Bibliophile and Awakening.

[Shadow Mir]

25 minutes ago, Just call me AL said:

It can help provide some extra defense for Birthright!Silas, Birthright!Sophie, Revelations!Saizo, Revelations!Percy, a Conquest or Revelations Kaze who's married Charlotte or Selena, or a Revelations Xander who's married either of the spouses mentioned in Kaze's case. It's also kinda fun to see Ophelia use it in almost perfect conjunction with Bibliophile and Awakening.

I don't see it as all that great unless you were specifically getting attacked by a unit that was low enough on HP that you could kill them before they got the chance to attack, otherwise you have to luck out if you don't want risk a reset (note we ARE talking about a game that's been called Low HP Emblem...)... Also, Awakening is not only tied to a class that you can only get one of, it's also a level 35 skill, so that doesn't help your case, as far as I'm concerned.

1 hour ago, SpearOfLies said:

Vantage is my favorite basic class skill because they fit my favorite strategic: Kill or get killed. Adding together with an offensive skill became bloken as shit. 

See above. Also, offensive skills are unreliable. So Vantage doesn't come remotely close to being "broken as shit". 

Edited February 19, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[Harvey]

If you're talking about units who come very late and are pointless to train unless to give an additional challenge...

Nino

If you're talking about character with boring personalities or that are an absolute chore to play with

Roy

 

[SpearOfLies]

54 minutes ago, Just call me AL said:

Funilly enough, I could argue Hayato being one of the lesser units on Birthright. Probably worse than Mozu there. And that's because he joins with Mozu's most crippling issue there, in addition to having worse availability than her.

I can't argue here. I didn't use him in my main team. Only for recruit Rhajat and try Oni Chieftain mage type to have better synergy with her personal skill.

 

[Augestein]

3 hours ago, Harvey said:

If you're talking about units who come very late and are pointless to train unless to give an additional challenge...

Nino

If you're talking about character with boring personalities or that are an absolute chore to play with

Roy

 

I wouldn't give that to Nino. She can save your EXP ranking if you're going for a S rank. 

[Just call me AL]

6 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

I don't see it as all that great unless you were specifically getting attacked by a unit that was low enough on HP that you could kill them before they got the chance to attack, otherwise you have to luck out if you don't want risk a reset (note we ARE talking about a game that's been called Low HP Emblem...)...

The use I had intended when I said what I did was defensive in nature. Specifically, killing the enemy before he kills you wasn't a necessity for what I had in mind. Each of the units I listed would end up having Sol access in addition to Vantage access due to buddy and marriage supports. Not saying it's efficient, but the practical applications are there.

6 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Also, Awakening is not only tied to a class that you can only get one of, it's also a level 35 skill, so that doesn't help your case, as far as I'm concerned.

Note that I didn't say it was a good strategy. Only that it was fun to use. The character I mentioned should have been a big clue to the fact that it's not an efficient strategy. Also, a skill that you get at Lvl 35 in a special class isn't much different from a skill that you get at Lvl 15 in a promoted class, literally.

[Shadow Mir]

13 minutes ago, Just call me AL said:

The use I had intended when I said what I did was defensive in nature. Specifically, killing the enemy before he kills you wasn't a necessity for what I had in mind. Each of the units I listed would end up having Sol access in addition to Vantage access due to buddy and marriage supports. Not saying it's efficient, but the practical applications are there.

Note that I didn't say it was a good strategy. Only that it was fun to use. The character I mentioned should have been a big clue to the fact that it's not an efficient strategy. Also, a skill that you get at Lvl 35 in a special class isn't much different from a skill that you get at Lvl 15 in a promoted class, literally.

Sol ain't reliable, and it ain't even that good in this game.

You're right about the part where it's essentially a level 15 skill. But still, there's the part where you can only get one Exalt's Brand... and the part where Great Lord as a class is underwhelming imo.

[Slumber]

7 hours ago, Harvey said:

If you're talking about units who come very late and are pointless to train unless to give an additional challenge...

Nino

If you're talking about character with boring personalities or that are an absolute chore to play with

Roy

 

Nino fits the Est archetype, and is VERY good when trained up. Bar-none the best Sage you can get, considering Pent will be decent, but start to fall behind as more units start to promote, and Erk is a mediocre unit that the RNG gods hate with a fiery passion.

She's far from the "absolute worst Fire Emblem character". She has the best growth rates in the game behind Lyn and Hector, who are lords, which typically have higher growths than normal units(FE7 is a case of lord having higher growth rates than non-lords), and pretty much the only logical contender for Afa's Drops.

 

[Shadow Mir]

29 minutes ago, Slumber said:

Nino fits the Est archetype, and is VERY good when trained up. Bar-none the best Sage you can get, considering Pent will be decent, but start to fall behind as more units start to promote, and Erk is a mediocre unit that the RNG gods hate with a fiery passion.

She's far from the "absolute worst Fire Emblem character". She has the best growth rates in the game behind Lyn and Hector, who are lords, which typically have higher growths than normal units(FE7 is a case of lord having higher growth rates than non-lords), and pretty much the only logical contender for Afa's Drops.

 

Bold: Ha! Don't make me laugh. By the time Nino enters the picture, most enemies just drop like flies to any remotely respectable unit. Kinda hard for Nino to get trained up when everyone else is annihilating everything, no?

Second bold: Not even - Afa's Drops don't even have that much of an effect, for one, and second.... See above.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[Slumber]

Just now, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Bold: Ha! Don't make me laugh. By the time Nino enters the picture, most enemies just drop like flies to any remotely respectable unit. Kinda hard for Nino to get trained up when everyone else is annihilating everything, no?

I mostly mean that Pent falls behind in like, the last 3-4 chapters, when Pent's stats start to lag behind and he stops making super meaningful contributions to the team. Erk is Erk, and will usually struggle to stay on pace with the rest of your team throughout the whole game unless you get incredibly lucky, and even then, you have to be even luckier for him to turn out any better than "alright". And even if you REALLY want a Forblaze user for the final chapter, neither will likely have the stats to take on the Black Fang Morphs comfortably.

Nino is deliberately meant to be difficult to build up, that's why she's tossed at you as a level 5 unpromoted unit ~7 chapters before endgame. BUT, to call her "the absolute worst Fire Emblem character" as a unit, when there is still time to build her up(Granted you really need to baby her until promotion) AND she fills a spot that no other unit fills exceptionally well? Plus, she's not even a big hindrance on even ranked runs, as mentioned, she boosts you EXP score by a lot, since she'll level faster than anyone else on your team at the time she joins.

[Shadow Mir]

11 minutes ago, Slumber said:

I mostly mean that Pent falls behind in like, the last 3-4 chapters, when Pent's stats start to lag behind and he stops making super meaningful contributions to the team. Erk is Erk, and will usually struggle to stay on pace with the rest of your team throughout the whole game unless you get incredibly lucky, and even then, you have to be even luckier for him to turn out any better than "alright". And even if you REALLY want a Forblaze user for the final chapter, neither will likely have the stats to take on the Black Fang Morphs comfortably.

Nino is deliberately meant to be difficult to build up, that's why she's tossed at you as a level 5 unpromoted unit ~7 chapters before endgame. BUT, to call her "the absolute worst Fire Emblem character" as a unit, when there is still time to build her up(Granted you really need to baby her until promotion) AND she fills a spot that no other unit fills exceptionally well? Plus, she's not even a big hindrance on even ranked runs, as mentioned, she boosts you EXP score by a lot, since she'll level faster than anyone else on your team at the time she joins.

You do realize that this is FE7 we're talking about here, right? Most enemies aren't really capable of hanging with your units by the time you get into lategame. And if Pent and Erk won't have the stats to go toe-to-toe with the Black Fang Morphs, what in the seven hells makes you think Nino will when she's hard to train, mostly for reasons mentioned already?

Again, how can I baby her when by the time she joins, most enemies are just too weak to go a round with your badasses and live to tell the tale, and most of the few that CAN are of classes you don't see very frequently? Also, I fail to see what spot she's "filling exceptionally well"... Oh, and this is ignoring Hector Hard mode, where she's just screwed.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[Slumber]

Just now, Levant Mir Celestia said:

You do realize that this is FE7 we're talking about here, right? Most enemies aren't really capable of hanging with your units by the time you get into lategame. And if Pent and Erk won't have the stats to go toe-to-toe with the Black Fang Morphs, what in the seven hells makes you think Nino will when she's hard to train, mostly for reasons mentioned already?

Again, how can I baby her when by the time she joins, most enemies are just too weak to go a round with your badasses and live to tell the tale, and most of the few that CAN are of classes you don't see very frequently? Also, I fail to see what spot she's "filling exceptionally well"...

FE7 enemies are pretty slow and  squishy in the late game, but you're making it sound like it's impossible to even use Nino. It really isn't. I think tons of people will tell you that they've managed to level up Nino at a rankable pace. I did it once, and I was probably like, 14 when I did.

And despite the lackluster stats of enemies in late-game FE7, I'm gonna call bullshit on ALL of your characters just effortlessly ORKOing everything in their path. The game's still tossing promoted units at you that aren't going to go down instantly to everybody on your team. Especially if you're using units like Lyn or Guy, and you aren't just loading them full of Killing Edges. By the time she joins, Nino pretty much gains a level for every kill up until she reaches like, level 15. You could probably get her to at least level 10 in her recruitment chapter alone if you block the reinforcements and ferry her away from potential enemies with 1-2 range. You're likely going to be doing this anyway as you wade through the tons of reinforcements on the way to Ursula as it is, so it's really not that difficult to toss Nino kills here and there.

[Shadow Mir]

34 minutes ago, Slumber said:

FE7 enemies are pretty slow and  squishy in the late game, but you're making it sound like it's impossible to even use Nino. It really isn't. I think tons of people will tell you that they've managed to level up Nino at a rankable pace. I did it once, and I was probably like, 14 when I did.

And despite the lackluster stats of enemies in late-game FE7, I'm gonna call bullshit on ALL of your characters just effortlessly ORKOing everything in their path. The game's still tossing promoted units at you that aren't going to go down instantly to everybody on your team. Especially if you're using units like Lyn or Guy, and you aren't just loading them full of Killing Edges. By the time she joins, Nino pretty much gains a level for every kill up until she reaches like, level 15. You could probably get her to at least level 10 in her recruitment chapter alone if you block the reinforcements and ferry her away from potential enemies with 1-2 range. You're likely going to be doing this anyway as you wade through the tons of reinforcements on the way to Ursula as it is, so it's really not that difficult to toss Nino kills here and there.

We're talking about the same Nino who loses AS from any tome. And speaking of which, if she uses anything other than Fire, she risks being unable to double. Oh, and she starts with an Elfire tome that nukes her AS.

Likewise, I'm gonna call bullshit on getting Nino to level 10 in her joining chapter, because you end up killing most of the enemy en route to your objectives, and second, in Hector mode, Ursula happens to be at the southeast corner of the map, and once she dies, reinforcements stop altogether. And sure, you may see some promoted enemies, but you see much more unpromoted enemies. And let's not forget that FE7 enemies have zero luck, and thus are vulnerable to random crits.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[Augestein]

13 minutes ago, Slumber said:

FE7 enemies are pretty slow and  squishy in the late game, but you're making it sound like it's impossible to even use Nino. It really isn't. I think tons of people will tell you that they've managed to level up Nino at a rankable pace. I did it once, and I was probably like, 14 when I did.

And despite the lackluster stats of enemies in late-game FE7, I'm gonna call bullshit on ALL of your characters just effortlessly ORKOing everything in their path. The game's still tossing promoted units at you that aren't going to go down instantly to everybody on your team. Especially if you're using units like Lyn or Guy, and you aren't just loading them full of Killing Edges. By the time she joins, Nino pretty much gains a level for every kill up until she reaches like, level 15. You could probably get her to at least level 10 in her recruitment chapter alone if you block the reinforcements and ferry her away from potential enemies with 1-2 range. You're likely going to be doing this anyway as you wade through the tons of reinforcements on the way to Ursula as it is, so it's really not that difficult to toss Nino kills here and there.

It's not impossible to use Nino, but Pent certainly isn't falling behind ever. Dude has like... 4 Con over her. Any time she uses something over Fire she gets AS loss, and Pent doesn't until he tries to use Elfire where he loses 2 speed versus Nino's whopping 6. Even at max speed, Nino ends up having the same speed as Pent, and the only way for her to be faster is to use Thunder tomes (which are pretty sweet, but still).

 

Getting Nino kills isn't too hard, but she's still not going to be higher in level than Pent or get enough levels to truly surpass Pent or Erk. Even if she did get those levels, she'll never beat Pent's staff rank. 

[Slumber]

Just now, Levant Mir Celestia said:

We're talking about the same Nino who loses AS from any tome. And speaking of which, if she uses anything other than Fire, she risks being unable to double.

Likewise, I'm gonna call bullshit on getting Nino to level 10 in her joining chapter, because you end up killing most of the enemy en route to your objectives, and second, in Hector mode, Ursula happens to be at the southeast corner of the map, and once she dies, reinforcements stop altogether.

In either position of the map, it's very easy to wall off the reinforcements. If your units are buzzsawing through everything, it shouldn't be too big of a deal to leave two units to wall off the reinforcements while you have a few more go after Ursula on the other side, right? Neither scenario makes it very difficult to get Nino a few levels on that chapter. Regardless of the pace you want to go, I was more just giving an example of how it's not that difficult to give Nino levels at a semi-reasonable pace.

 

5 minutes ago, Augestein said:

It's not impossible to use Nino, but Pent certainly isn't falling behind ever. Dude has like... 4 Con over her. Any time she uses something over Fire she gets AS loss, and Pent doesn't until he tries to use Elfire where he loses 2 speed versus Nino's whopping 6. Even at max speed, Nino ends up having the same speed as Pent, and the only way for her to be faster is to use Thunder tomes (which are pretty sweet, but still).

 

Getting Nino kills isn't too hard, but she's still not going to be higher in level than Pent or get enough levels to truly surpass Pent or Erk. Even if she did get those levels, she'll never beat Pent's staff rank. 

Nino will lose AS compared to Pent, but Pent will be slower than her by a comparable margin(Nino, a full 20 levels lower than Pent, only has 6 less speed by default and has 20% higher speed growth), seeing as he has a pretty middling speed growth. If by some miracle you get them both to max level, they'll likely have the same exact AS if you decide to use anything heavier than Fire.

[Just call me AL]

1 hour ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Sol ain't reliable, and it ain't even that good in this game.

It can still help a unit's survivability. I'm sure someone like Camilla would like it, for starters.

1 hour ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

You're right about the part where it's essentially a level 15 skill. But still, there's the part where you can only get one Exalt's Brand... and the part where Great Lord as a class is underwhelming imo.

It's basically a Hero that's traded Axes for Lances. I, at least, don't think that's so bad. And the fact that you only get one Exalt's Brand only means that you gotta choose wisely in who to give it to. Ophelia likes it for one because of the Awakening skill, and Hinoka likes it because of Charm. And by no means does the unit HAVE to be in that class to use its skills. Only to obtain them. Same goes for any other class, really. 

[Shadow Mir]

10 minutes ago, Slumber said:

In either position of the map, it's very easy to wall off the reinforcements. If your units are buzzsawing through everything, it shouldn't be too big of a deal to leave two units to wall off the reinforcements while you have a few more go after Ursula on the other side, right? Neither scenario makes it very difficult to get Nino a few levels on that chapter. Regardless of the pace you want to go, I was more just giving an example of how it's not that difficult to give Nino levels at a semi-reasonable pace.

You do realize we're talking about a fog of war chapter, right? That means you don't have a clue where the reinforcements are gonna show up. Also, just how quickly are you getting to Nino to talk to her? Only your main lord or Lyn can talk to her, and both of them have only 5 move (Lyn could potentially have 6).

Edited February 20, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[Slumber]

Just now, Levant Mir Celestia said:

You do realize we're talking about a fog of war chapter, right? That means you don't have a clue where the reinforcements are gonna show up. Also, just how quickly are you getting to Nino to talk to her?

Unless I'm remembering incorrectly, the reinforcements always spawn from the southwestern corner of the map. They may spawn from the southeast on Hector Mode, but I'm fairly certain that they only spawn from these two, easily controllable choke-points. I think some mounted units and thieves spawn from the stairs behind the throne room, but I think those stop when you kill Maxime.

And since Nino needs to haul her ass across the map to talk to Jaffar, recruiting her is the first priority, and I usually do it by the third or fourth turn.

[Augestein]

Just now, Slumber said:

Nino will lose AS compared to Pent, but Pent will be slower than her by a comparable margin(Nino, a full 20 levels lower than Pent, only has 6 less speed by default and has 20% higher speed growth), seeing as he has a pretty middling speed growth. If by some miracle you get them both to max level, they'll likely have the same exact AS if you decide to use anything heavier than Fire.

 

Which still takes her longer to catch up. Pent didn't exactly not level the whole time he was there and she wasn't. She's going to be slower for a longer period of time than Pent. You get Nino 5 chapters before the end. If I jam a ton of EXP in Nino, I can do the same on Pent. And no, give them both Fimbulvetr. Pent loses 4 AS, Nino loses 8. She's slower with Fimbulvetr. 26 - 8 < 22 .6- 4, because more often than not, that 22 speed will actually be 23. Even if it wasn't, it's still pretty messed up that we're saying that they are the same speed when earlier you were talking about how Pent falling behind when Nino has at 20/20 stats 3 more magic power than him? If Pent falls behind, then Nino is like... God awful according to your own logic. 

[Slumber]

15 minutes ago, Augestein said:

 

Which still takes her longer to catch up. Pent didn't exactly not level the whole time he was there and she wasn't. She's going to be slower for a longer period of time than Pent. You get Nino 5 chapters before the end. If I jam a ton of EXP in Nino, I can do the same on Pent. And no, give them both Fimbulvetr. Pent loses 4 AS, Nino loses 8. She's slower with Fimbulvetr. 26 - 8 < 22 .6- 4, because more often than not, that 22 speed will actually be 23. Even if it wasn't, it's still pretty messed up that we're saying that they are the same speed when earlier you were talking about how Pent falling behind when Nino has at 20/20 stats 3 more magic power than him? If Pent falls behind, then Nino is like... God awful according to your own logic. 

That would be max level Pent. If we want to go further down this, Nino catches up to Pent(If we're saying Pent is level 20) at 20/11 in regards to speed, while being comparable in most every areas. And I don't know why you'd single out magic as the only area Nino wins in. It is an important stat, but she beats him in every other stat that isn't defense when they're both 20/20. And by a lot, in most cases. HP will end up being comparable, but that's about it. Nino trounces Pent in every stat that isn't defense. And yes, I'd say at minimum being 3 points better than Pent in every stat(Sans defense and HP) is "trouncing", if we continue hypothetically comparing 20/20 stats.

I don't know why this was the argument that got nitpicked. I never said that Pent was bad, or that Nino was the best unit ever. I said that Nino was statistically your best choice for an endgame Sage if you put the time into her, which isn't that hard to do. You even agree on that last point. I admit that I exaggerated that Pent wasn't endgame worthy and that Nino was(I let my friend borrow my FE7 cart when we were like, 13, and he had Marcus on the final chapter, so you could probably argue that anybody is endgame worthy), but that was more or less a slap-dash comment I made to address the idea that NINO IS THE WORST UNIT IN FIRE EMBLEM EVER.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Slumber

[Shadow Mir]

25 minutes ago, Just call me AL said:

It can still help a unit's survivability. I'm sure someone like Camilla would like it, for starters.

It's basically a Hero that's traded Axes for Lances. I, at least, don't think that's so bad. And the fact that you only get one Exalt's Brand only means that you gotta choose wisely in who to give it to. Ophelia likes it for one because of the Awakening skill, and Hinoka likes it because of Charm. And by no means does the unit HAVE to be in that class to use its skills. Only to obtain them. Same goes for any other class, really. 

It doesn't help enough for me to be impressed - Sol only heals for half the damage dealt. That means I'd have to do 20 damage to get the same healing I'd get from a healing item that's going to be obsolete by the time you get Sol. Disappointing. And that's ignoring that even if Sol activates, you can still miss.

For how much of a pain it can be to get (have fun with ninjas that poison lunge chain the crap out of you on anything higher than normal), I'd say it ain't that good.

[Augestein]

2 minutes ago, Slumber said:

That would be max level Pent. If we want to go further down this, Nino catches up to Pent(If we're saying Pent is level 20) at 20/11 in regards to speed, while being comparable in most every areas. And I don't know why you'd single out magic as the only area Nino wins in. It is an important stat, but she beats him in every other stat that isn't defense when they're both 20/20. And by a lot, in most cases. HP will end up being comparable, but that's about it. Nino trounces Pent in every stat that isn't defense. And yes, I'd say at minimum being 3 points better than Pent in every stat(Sans defense and HP) is "trouncing", if we continue hypothetically comparing 20/20 stats.

I don't know why this was the argument that got nitpicked. I never said that Pent was bad, or that Nino was the best unit ever. I said that Nino was statistically your best choice for an endgame Sage if you put the time into her, which isn't that hard to do. You even agree on that last point. I admit that I exaggerated that Pent wasn't endgame worthy and that Nino was(I let my friend borrow my FE7 cart when we were like, 13, and he had Marcus on the final chapter, so you could probably argue that anybody is endgame worthy), but that was more or less a slap-dash comment I made to address the idea that NINO IS THE WORST UNIT IN FIRE EMBLEM EVER.

But she's not statistically the best choice by end game. That's the problem. Pent has con on her forever, and has more defense. We know that they won't hit 20/20 by the end, which is what makes the comparison for how Nino could be better kinda silly. 

You said he fell behind, which is why people are even saying anything about it. It wasn't that you were explaining "Nino isn't that bad, check her out next to Pent, he's better, but Nino isn't super far behind with a bit of babying."