Fire Emblem Heroes General Discussion and Links

[DefaultBeep]

Just now, KongDude said:

I'd go for red I guess.

I think most people would. Although I guess Boey has gained some popularity for being a potential Reinhardt and CYL Lyn counter. Mae seems to just be a worse Linde, with slightly more Atk and Res and Def, and noticeably worse Spd. She's like a blue and not-quite-as-good Sanaki/Lilina.

[Ae†her]

Couldn't Saizo be pretty trippy if he was +Atk/Spd/Ded , and ran Poison Dagger+ with Close Counter? Seems like he would be pretty good against any physical infantry unit, and could even give him Vantage 3 if he needs to kill mages, or increase your defense score.

[Hilda]

4 minutes ago, Logos said:

Couldn't Saizo be pretty trippy if he was +Atk/Spd/Ded , and ran Poison Dagger+ with Close Counter? Seems like he would be pretty good against any physical infantry unit, and could even give him Vantage 3 if he needs to kill mages, or increase your defense score.

Considering the current meta is mostly run by mages and really strong defensiv melee units:
Any decent mage that sniffs at him will destroy him due to his low Resistance.
Any Raventome user will obliterate him and they are rising up due to Brave Lyn
Any Bulky Melee unit will destroy him, because he has too low attack, and with Close Counter you are giving up even more attack.
Flyers and Horse Emblems will overrun him.
and Armor units will just laugh at Saizo due to his pittyfull dmg.

Just look at Kagero. She is okeish, but she doesnt survive the current meta much, so why should a worse version of her doe much better?

[Ice Dragon]

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

She's worse at positioning because, even though she can reach the people she ploy better because she can be as close to the front lines as possible, other people have greater reach, so they neither need to be as close as possible to reach and have better spots to stand in if they don't need to hit the person they ployed.

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

You skip over the positioning requirement because apparently 'it's on Est so positioning is free' is your logic. No, the logic is that 'It's on Est so at best it's an extra movement point.' Ranged and Cavalry all have the same positioning even if they're always one square behind Est, which is an utterly ridiculous situation, it means they have the same reach even if they're ploying for a 2 range melee (who has to stand as close to the threat line as possible), and better reach if they aren't. Range Cavalry, who are the best wielders, have better reach even when they're ploying for a 2 range melee. Using ploy for yourself is at most a +1 square advantage, something having range or a horse matches, and a range horse surpasses, and part of the reason you say ploy is good is that you don't always ploy for yourself. (I have no idea why you discount the reach requirement when Est isn't ploying for herself, what if she has to ploy for another 2 range melee? Now she's 1 square behind the threat line and can't hit anyone without some kind of mobility skill.)

I don't see why you assume that all four of your units need to be in range to attack the opponent at once. When playing with melee flying units, you're picking off units as they approach you and not running in to kill everything in one turn because you simply can't do that, and you can take advantage of the terrain to put yourself at an advantage. You can't use the same tactics that you use with cavalry, and therefore how you use your positioning is different. You don't need to be able to reach the next unit over because that unit isn't threatening you (and if it is, you should have positioned your units to take that unit out first or at the same time).

You're trying to use cavalry tactics with fliers, and that simply doesn't work.

 

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

The C-slot requirements hits Est hard because she's not a tome user. Tome user C-slots cost less than other unit's C-slots because buff skills don't buff the owner, meaning the person who benefits the most from buffs pay the least in skill-slot costs for carrying not carrying a buff skill.

And you're (1) assuming that you have a tome user in your party, which you can't do, and (2) assuming that if you do have a tome user in the party, that the other two members of your party are not equipped to provide the buffs in Est's place, which is similarly invalid (see below).

 

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

Resistance requirement is okay, seeing how Est has 32 base Res, and DB 3 is fairly good since Est can't reasonably expect to survive a counter regardless (meaning no point to fishing for x4 hits---Cordelia being bulkier than DB3 Est on the physical side even after L&D hurts a lot here).

Est's 30 Spd with Life and Death isn't good enough to fish for double attacks anyways because the assumption is that you don't have Hone Fliers on your team.

 

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

Further, you say there's no reason to boost Leo or S!Corrin for Def Ploy because they don't boost the unit themselves, and forget that Def Ploy is a bloody SUPPORT SKILL.

IT BOOSTS THEIR SUPPORT RATING.

Except that it doesn't significantly boost their support rating because it's comparable to Hone Atk in its absence. Hone Atk is worth +4.8 damage at weapon triangle advantage, and Def Ploy is worth +5 flat damage.

Putting Def Ploy on a unit that cannot use its effect for themselves is a slight boost to their support ability, but putting Def Ploy on a unit that can use the effect for themselves is a boost to their support ability and a boost to their own damage output.

This is why it boosts Est's rating and not Leo's.

 

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

Any minors gains Est gets in offenses (which are really minor, since 5 speed is, after all, better than 1 Atk, 5 def, 5 res, even on a brave user, especially considering her crappy stat distribution) are more than canceled out by the fact that Est's support rating got dumpstered for running Def Ploy over Hone Type.

And here you are (implying that you are) talking about tome users as teammates and Hone Fliers (because the only way Def Ploy is worse than a Hone skill is if said Hone skill is Hone Fliers or you are running magic users), neither of which are relevant in this discussion.

 

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

On Est it's more like Rally attack---if she's helping someone else with it, particularly another 2 move melee, her positioning suffers a lot, often to the point of not getting to use her unit-turn to attack.

1. As mentioned above, not every unit attacks on a given turn. That's not how you use melee fliers.
2. Est doesn't give up her turn to use Def Ploy even if she is out of range because she can still use her actual assist skill.

 

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

The buff assumption thing... isn't. Est is one of those 4 units on the team, 4 - 1 = 3. You can't just treat Est's C-slot as free because 'someone else will handle it.'

Except that someone else will handle it. That's the entire point of team-building.

For an extreme case, my own infantry mage teams only use Hone Spd with no other buffs, meaning they already have all of their buffs covered. My own movement-type teams only use Hone with no other buffs, meaning they already have all of their buffs covered.

Cookie-cutter Litrblade teams already have Eirika, Ephraim, or Azura in their party. If you have only two of the three units as Litrblade infantry, you can run identical buffs on your two mages and a different buff on your last unit. You'll be down one buff each turn, but there's rarely a reason you would have needed both buffs on both mages.

 

53 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

I'm not saying Est can't carry Def Ploy, I'm saying that other units are better at carrying Def Ploy, meaning they should rise more because of the existence of Def Ploy than Est.

With that argument, everyone that prefers having Def Ploy support rises because Def Ploy support exists, everyone that can actually hit things with Def Ploy (mostly units that can't actually take advantage of the effect themselves) rises because of an increased support rating, and everyone that can do both rises for both of those categories, which still puts Est as rising twice.

As such, the characters that get higher ratings from the existence of Def Ploy are still the characters that can both put it to use (Brave physical attackers) and have the Res to hit enough of the game with it, not units that only do one or the other.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Ice Dragon

[Rezzy]

38 minutes ago, Hilda said:

I am not sure why we are discussing Positioning for Def Ploy, when you can manipulate the AI and cherry pick and spread the Eneyms on the Map around and kill them one by one.
Positioning depends entirely on:
-Starting Position
-The Map itself
-Unit Range (which comes in handy or not depending on the Map) and movement type
-Team composition with Positioning Assists.
So all in all the positioning Discussion is effectivly moot.

Some maps, it's very hard to position well, namely the parallel wall map, the bridge map, and the lava map.

[MrSmokestack]

50 minutes ago, DefaultBeep said:

-Owl banner.

It has to happen eventually.

i hope

Defiant Resistance banner or riot

[Ae†her]

27 minutes ago, Hilda said:

Considering the current meta is mostly run by mages and really strong defensiv melee units:
Any decent mage that sniffs at him will destroy him due to his low Resistance.
Any Raventome user will obliterate him and they are rising up due to Brave Lyn
Any Bulky Melee unit will destroy him, because he has too low attack, and with Close Counter you are giving up even more attack.
Flyers and Horse Emblems will overrun him.
and Armor units will just laugh at Saizo due to his pittyfull dmg.

Just look at Kagero. She is okeish, but she doesnt survive the current meta much, so why should a worse version of her doe much better?

Simply because he can take his fair share of Melee hits. I did a damage calc for Defending, and +Atk/-Def Saizo with CC, QR3, and Atk+1 SS has 114:10:52 while Kagero +Atk/-Res with the same build has 113:36:27. Edit: Both are running Moonbow

Edited October 3, 2017 by Logos

[LuxSpes]

1 minute ago, MrSmokestack said:

Defiant Resistance banner or riot

So a banner with Est and Virion only?

I'll take it. Would give me a chance to another bonus unit aside from Alfonse this season.

[Rezzy]

58 minutes ago, KongDude said:

So uh... Any idea for the next skill banner?

Dancer Banner!

[DefaultBeep]

Just now, MrSmokestack said:

Defiant Resistance banner or riot

I'd almost be okay with that just because I will never 5-star Virion, so this would be the only way I'd ever see his level 40 conversation. And making a GHB unit pullable for a limited time only would actually be kinda neat, unless they just did two characters.

Also, I just looked at the list of skills, and I completely forgot that the Live for- skills even existed. I can't imagine why they haven't given us more skills that drop extra badges and shards/crystals...

[r_n]

I have 130k feathers and am honestly this close to just starting to 5* all the 3-4 star units for kicks. 

Not like I'll ever fill out the healer 40 conversations otherwise

[Interdimensional Observer]

On Voting Gauntlets, the last two featured the characters who starred in two new Banners (Summer Sexy Fight) and one new Banner (CYL- Cooked Your Lyn) respectively. So would the next VG feature the Performing Arts troupe? Don't know who would make the other half (another fancy new Seasonal?), but if the PA showstoppers made up one side of the VG, who would you support of them? 

Edited October 3, 2017 by Interdimensional Observer

[Rafiel's Aria]

5 minutes ago, DefaultBeep said:

Also, I just looked at the list of skills, and I completely forgot that the Live for- skills even existed. I can't imagine why they haven't given us more skills that drop extra badges and shards/crystals...

*slowly drowning in badges and crystals* Halp. Me neither. LOL Thank goodness there haven't been more skills like that.

Deathblow banner was nice. I have no idea what they'll do this time. They could probably do like a "special" banner. Maybe with Moonbow. It feels like everyone and their mother has Moonbow nowadays.

I also wonder if they'll release a monthly schedule soon. We're due for another GHB or BHB like...in a few days. (Tomorrow for me.) I can't imagne it'd be another returning GHB after Clarisse...

[Othin]

47 minutes ago, Logos said:

Couldn't Saizo be pretty trippy if he was +Atk/Spd/Ded , and ran Poison Dagger+ with Close Counter? Seems like he would be pretty good against any physical infantry unit, and could even give him Vantage 3 if he needs to kill mages, or increase your defense score.

Do people even still use physical infantry units?

[LuxSpes]

1 minute ago, Othin said:

Do people even still use physical infantry units?

My three-man arena core is all infantry, with two of them being melee (Nino, Lucina and Azura)

[Quintessence]

So on my quest for another dancer I just got an Azura dupe, this time +Atk -Def and I merged her with my old Azura.

Also, got a +res -def Fae @phineas81707 @SatsumaFSoysoy

[Rezzy]

2 minutes ago, Rafiel's Aria said:

*slowly drowning in badges and crystals* Halp. Me neither. LOL Thank goodness there haven't been more skills like that.

Deathblow banner was nice. I have no idea what they'll do this time. They could probably do like a "special" banner. Maybe with Moonbow. It feels like everyone and their mother has Moonbow nowadays.

I also wonder if they'll release a monthly schedule soon. We're due for another GHB or BHB like...in a few days. (Tomorrow for me.) I can't imagne it'd be another returning GHB after Clarisse...

It seems like every GHB has been featured in some way or had some connection to a recent Banner.  There's the rumored Arvis GHB, but I can't imagine that coming out before the rumored FE4 Banner.  There could be a Tellius GHB with like Ashnard or Petrine or something.  Or maybe they'll do another Bound Hero Battle to hold out until Arvis.  They've really slowed down on the GHBs after doing them every couple weeks for several months.  We've only had Valter  in the last couple months haven't we?  We didn't get one at all during September.

[r_n]

4 minutes ago, Othin said:

Do people even still use physical infantry units?

I'll see the twins most often with the occasional brave bow unit or Takumi.

Sometimes even high tier guys will still use the occasional rando like Chrom or Lucina. You can kind of tell if someone either has a favorite or has been really unlucky in their pulls.

 

But even with that in mind it's still pretty rare. Infantry mages, armors and horses are most common. I rarely see fliers.

[bethany81707]

1 minute ago, Quintessence said:

So on my quest for another dancer I just got an Azura dupe, this time +Atk -Def and I merged her with my old Azura.

Also, got a +res -def Fae @phineas81707 @SatsumaFSoysoy

+Res helps her fight mages, but that's a major problem after Lightning Breath+ only. Moreover, she's already dealing with Reiny as a +Spd, which is allowing her to avoid doubles. I'm tempted to say more Res is just a dump stat for her- and since you're not giving her a Resistance-type Ploy, I question whether she needs more of it.

[Ice Dragon]

8 minutes ago, Othin said:

Do people even still use physical infantry units?

Eirika, Ephraim, Brave Ike, Brave Lucina, Ike, Bride Cordelia, 4 of the 7 dancers.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Ice Dragon

[LuxSpes]

1 minute ago, Quintessence said:

So on my quest for another dancer I just got an Azura dupe, this time +Atk -Def and I merged her with my old Azura.

Also, got a +res -def Fae @phineas81707 @SatsumaFSoysoy

Fae's great. I used her on my main arena theme as my blue counter for a while. Reinhardt doesn't like her at all.

[Ice Dragon]

Galeforce.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Ice Dragon

[DefaultBeep]

1 minute ago, Rafiel's Aria said:

*slowly drowning in badges and crystals* Halp. Me neither. LOL Thank goodness there haven't been more skills like that.

Deathblow banner was nice. I have no idea what they'll do this time. They could probably do like a "special" banner. Maybe with Moonbow. It feels like everyone and their mother has Moonbow nowadays.

I also wonder if they'll release a monthly schedule soon. We're due for another GHB or BHB like...in a few days. (Tomorrow for me.) I can't imagne it'd be another returning GHB after Clarisse...

They could easily have two Moonbow banners at this point. There are four units with it that are 4-star exclusives though, so maybe they'd be nice enough to give us that. And watch the world burn if they put Nephenee, Ephraim, and Tana as the units. For extra pain, replace one with Odin instead!

The last schedule was released through the News section on September 4th, so take that as you will. I think a New Mystery song was found in the recent datamine along with something about a BHB, so I think Luke and Roderick will be appearing next. If Katarina shares another banner with Luke... I might cry.

[Ice Dragon]

I wouldn't mind a Wrath banner, an Armor March banner, or a Steady Breath banner right about now.

[Rafiel's Aria]

Just now, Rezzy said:

It seems like every GHB has been featured in some way or had some connection to a recent Banner.  There's the rumored Arvis GHB, but I can't imagine that coming out before the rumored FE4 Banner.  There could be a Tellius GHB with like Ashnard or Petrine or something.  Or maybe they'll do another Bound Hero Battle to hold out until Arvis.  They've really slowed down on the GHBs after doing them every couple weeks for several months.  We've only had Valter  in the last couple months haven't we?  We didn't get one at all during September.

Yeah... No new GHB last month. I love the BHB because those orbs are NICE. But I don't think I like them more or less than the GHB. Those new characters are always sweet. Let's pretend Berkut is better than he is. I'd love to get a Tellius GHB. Oliver would probably be a really good choice for a PoR villain. But I suppose we did just get the BK. If I had to guess, we'll get another BHB before a GHB. But I've got my fingers crossed for Arvis sooner rather than later.

 

1 minute ago, DefaultBeep said:

They could easily have two Moonbow banners at this point. There are four units with it that are 4-star exclusives though, so maybe they'd be nice enough to give us that. And watch the world burn if they put Nephenee, Ephraim, and Tana as the units. For extra pain, replace one with Odin instead!

The last schedule was released through the News section on September 4th, so take that as you will. I think a New Mystery song was found in the recent datamine along with something about a BHB, so I think Luke and Roderick will be appearing next. If Katarina shares another banner with Luke... I might cry.

Roderick and Luke would be super cool!!! And it'd be fabulous to get the chance to pull for them. I'm still on the lookout for a +SPD Rody...and a non -ATK Luke. RIP. An all blue Moonbow banner would be hilarious though.