Fire Emblem Heroes General Discussion and Links

[Maymeimai]

17 minutes ago, Extrasolar said:

Meanwhile, I'm over here sitting at 5 healers... My biggest problem is how difficult they are to train up. The staff EXP takes too long (in the spirit of the main series...lol), and you can't even grind out scratch damage heals because eventually the game cuts you off entirely. So all my healers are lagging behind in levels permanently compared to the rest of the units they're fielded with.

Also the fact that staff damage gets cut in half is super annoying. I know the staves are meant to be about the effects, but...it's hard for healers to get SP in the first place, so why does the game think you'll be able to afford Assault and Pain in any timely manner? >.>

Actually, I think training healers is so easy, I trained my Lachesis in one day, just used 1 stamina potion..

Just use a high-level unit with fury, then go to the first floor of the training tower, put the fury unit to tank hits from an archer or mage, the unit will always take a bit of damage so you can heal them every turn, the end

[Extrasolar]

Just now, Maymeimai said:

Actually, I think training healers is so easy, I trained my Lachesis in one day, just used 1 stamina potion..

Just use a high-level unit with fury, then go to the first floor of the training tower, put the fury unit to tank hits from an archer or mage, the unit will always take a bit of damage so you can heal them every turn, the end

....I have zero units with fury though....

[Elieson]

26 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Wow, that makes zero sense.

But oh well, I guess I'll swap out female Robin for male Robin since he can at least counter Takumi and other colorless people and help take care of red units. He's 4 star too, not 3 star. I actually ended up pulling a much better male Robin in my last summon, so the terrible 3 star Robin got merged with him.

 I would only consider a team heavy of one type if it has three or more units of the same color. I only used two green units.

The game features more red units (with more reds to come no doubt) than any others

Reds are the most reliable counter to all dragons, a common arena staple against greens due to Triangle advantage, and most of them have good supporting options along with high speed which very important unless you have incredibly high attack or effective damage like buffed Nino, Julia, Linde etc. Of course, red counters exist, but since so many reds are great units and easy to access, there's naturally a lot of them.

 

1 minute ago, Maymeimai said:

Actually, I think training healers is so easy, I trained my Lachesis in one day, just used 1 stamina potion..

Just use a high-level unit with fury, then go to the first floor of the training tower, put the fury unit to tank hits from an archer or mage, the unit will always take a bit of damage so you can heal them every turn, the end

FYI you can unequip your units so they have Fury but don't counter. I did this for Bartre so he could still Smite but never hurt people

[MaskedAmpharos]

Just now, Arcanite said:

Well your robin is only 4 star and if he isn't max level then you should expect that. But if you have a 5 star level 40 robin against a max Takumi, he only does 8 damage lol

This basically. Stars and levels make a huge difference. Assuming equal rarity/level, any Robin absolutely wrecks any Takumi. 

Also @Anacybele, Arena in general is pretty red-dominated since most of the good units are red (which makes sense given that most Fire Emblem main characters are sword users), so greens will only get you so far (unless their name is Hector or Nino). I get that you don't want to part with your current team members, and obviously you don't have to. But if you want to rank higher in Arena it'd be better to focus more efforts on units you have that would solve your current problems, even if they're currently weaker than the rest of your team (thankfully it shouldn't take more than 2 hours or so, excluding stamina recharge time, to get a unit from level 1 to level 40 in Training Tower, speaking from personal experience).

Robin, for example, seems to be the answer to a number of your problems. If you get his rarity/level up, he counters Takumi and 1-2 shots literally every healer in the game, he does good damage against the red units you see so much of, and provides both the ranged magic damage and high-ish res (for a mage his res is okay, but compared to your other units he should fare better against mages) mage counter you've been needing as well.

I know Freddy and Palla are the current MVPs of your team, but if you have a Robin that's the same rarity and level as them, he should do quite well, often better than those two, in Arena. This is from my own personal experience (I also have Frederick and Palla, both at 4*) and the experiences of others. If you want to just play with your favorites, that's of course perfectly okay, but competitive play doesn't cater to that (not just in Heroes but in most games). If you want to do well in Arena you may have to use units you don't like as much, and if you want to just use units you like then you may need to set a lower goal for Arena. It's all about finding the right balance. 

[Anacybele]

WELL AS I'VE SAID DOZENS OF TIMES, I CAN'T GET 5 STAR CHARACTERS WITHOUT UPGRADING.

Why do I have to keep repeating myself? People need to stop telling me to upgrade/use 5 star character. I CAN'T.

I lost my five win streak this time. This is really fucking annoying. I could have enough feathers to finally upgrade someone to 5 star between the arena and the gauntlet, but things are too unfair for that to happen. I need 2400 more feathers to reach 20000. My arena score would only give me 1500 right now, and so far in the gauntlet, I'll get 900. I don't know if I'll also get the 500 for team victory though. If I do...

Let's see, 1400 + 1500...That would be 2900! But as I said, I don't know if I'll get both the 900 and the 500 in the gauntlet.

I'm not upgrading male Robin though. At least not yet. Frederick is my priority for 5 star upgrading.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Anacybele

[Maymeimai]

10 minutes ago, Extrasolar said:

....I have zero units with fury though....

Not even bartre? o: Oh well, I hope you can get one, since you have so many healers..

[Extrasolar]

Just now, Maymeimai said:

Not even bartre? o: Oh well, I hope you can get one, since you have so many healers..

Nope. No Bartre. How many units even get fury?

[MaskedAmpharos]

1 minute ago, Extrasolar said:

Nope. No Bartre. How many units even get fury?

3 iirc. Bartre, Hinata, and Eldigan.

[Extrasolar]

Just now, MaskedAmpharos said:

3 iirc. Bartre, Hinata, and Eldigan.

Well there's no way in hell I'm getting Eldigan (most likely), and I don't have Bartre. I do have a Hinata, but he's 3*...how worth is it to train him up, anyway?

[MaskedAmpharos]

Just now, Extrasolar said:

Well there's no way in hell I'm getting Eldigan (most likely), and I don't have Bartre. I do have a Hinata, but he's 3*...how worth is it to train him up, anyway?

Short answer: it's not. Obviously it depends on what other units you have, but for the most part Hinata subpar compared to most other sword units. The only thing going for him, really, is that he has high-ish BST because of Fury, but otherwise you're better off spending your time and effort on other units. 

This is just my opinion though, of course. If someone else on this forum thinks Hinata is a god and can convince me of such, I'm willing to hear them out. 

[Anacybele]

Uh, Jagen can get Fury too. It's in his skill list for me. But why the hell would anyone use that? It deals damage to your own unit. Up to 4 damage, in fact.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Anacybele

[MaskedAmpharos]

Just now, Anacybele said:

Uh, Jagen can get Fury too. It's in his skill list for me. But why the hell would anyone use that? It deals damage to your own unit.

Oh yeah, I forgot about Jagen. Anyways, people use Fury because it gives +3 in all stats, which usually makes up for the damage you take. You don't last as long, but you deal more hurt and get more kills while you do last. 

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, MaskedAmpharos said:

Oh yeah, I forgot about Jagen. Anyways, people use Fury because it gives +3 in all stats, which usually makes up for the damage you take. You don't last as long, but you deal more hurt and get more kills while you do last. 

And lose all the exp and possible level up you got out of it. No thanks.

EDIT: Well I feel dumb now. I thought I'd already put Fortify Cavalry on Jagen, but I didn't. No wonder I didn't seem to have the option to use it to boost Freddy. Now I can boost Freddy tho, yay.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Anacybele

[MaskedAmpharos]

Just now, Anacybele said:

And lose all the exp and possible level up you got out of it. No thanks.

Well, the idea is to not die (no duh, I know). If you space properly you can generally get in with a Fury unit, kill, and then be safe from retaliation. This is made even easier with dancers or units with Draw Back to get you out of the way or healers, but none of that's necessary with good positioning. Also, the extra defense/resistance from Fury can often more than make up for the nonlethal -6 hp. My Eldigan has Fury and because of that he takes about 5 damage from Hector, and Hinata with Fury takes 0 damage from Takumi, which I find to be hilarious. 

[Arcanite]

24 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I'm not upgrading male Robin though. At least not yet. Frederick is my priority for 5 star upgrading.

Well if healers seem to be an issue then you should think hard about this. Frederick is an okay character but you probably don't see too many effies which is really all he's good for. His low speed and resisitance make him fall off the edge a little. Robin is an A-list hero, and one of the top blue heroes in the game. He will always serve a purpose from getting of chip on blues, smacking up reds, and destroying anything gray, including Talumi. To each his own but just keep in mind that Robin is an A-lister, and a character a lot of people want for he is the perfect takumi counter. Jagen can help freddy a lot with the fortify but think long and hard about your decision.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Arcanite

[Othin]

Yeah I'm definitely in the boat of not liking what I'm hearing about skill inheritance. They've shown a willingness to listen to feedback so far, but this doesn't seem like something they could clean up easily once it's released.

One other thing this highlights is an issue with matchmaking in the Arena. People paying for +10 units isn't as big of a deal because you don't fight them unless your team is close enough in stats, but skills aren't factored into matchmaking, and they should be. Having skills and maybe even movement type impact a character's "score" for matchmaking would go a long way in helping people stick to fair matches.

[Extrasolar]

4 minutes ago, MaskedAmpharos said:

Well, the idea is to not die (no duh, I know). If you space properly you can generally get in with a Fury unit, kill, and then be safe from retaliation. This is made even easier with dancers or units with Draw Back to get you out of the way or healers, but none of that's necessary with good positioning. Also, the extra defense/resistance from Fury can often more than make up for the nonlethal -6 hp. My Eldigan has Fury and because of that he takes about 5 damage from Hector, and Hinata with Fury takes 0 damage from Takumi, which I find to be hilarious. 

 I do have a Fae for Draw Back and an Olivia Dancer, but then again, there are some maps that screw over any hopes of good positioning in the first place.

[Anacybele]

Just now, Arcanite said:

Well if healers seem to be an issue then you should think hard about this. Frederick is an okay character but you probably don't see too many effies which is really all he's good for. His low speed and resisitance make him fall off the edge a little. Robin is an A-list hero, and one of the top blue heroes in the game. He will always serve a purpose from getting of chip on blues, smacking up reds, and destroying anything gray, including Talumi. To each his own but just keep in mind that Robin is an A-lister, and a character a lot of people want for he is the perfect takumi counter. 

No thank you. For one thing, Frederick cannot be pulled as a 5 star while Robin can. And for another, Frederick is my favorite of all the units I have. I'm not a competitive player and I prioritize favorite units.

Effie is not the only armor in the game, dude. Heck, she's not even the only lance armor (Gwendolyn exists you know). Frederick can do a lot of damage to pretty much any of them with his hammer. Give him def boosts from someone like male Robin or Jagen, which I'm doing now, and he can barely be scratched by anything that's not a mage. Mages will wreck him, but every unit has a weakness.

And by your logic, Robin is only good for Takumis and some red units. His res and speed are low too. He'll get doubled by a lot of things and mages will deal a lot of damage to him too. He has decent defense, but there are better defensive tanks out there.

Like Frederick. He's also not that slow, actually. He's about the same speed as male Robin, in fact.

[Elieson]

11 minutes ago, Extrasolar said:

Well there's no way in hell I'm getting Eldigan (most likely), and I don't have Bartre. I do have a Hinata, but he's 3*...how worth is it to train him up, anyway?

IMO, Hinata's just ok. His humongous defense (highest red defense and candidate for highest in-game defense) is offset a bit by Fury burn and Ruby Sword making him that much worse against Blues and not too fantastic against Reds with his middling offense and awful speed.

8 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Uh, Jagen can get Fury too. It's in his skill list for me. But why the hell would anyone use that? It deals damage to your own unit. Up to 4 damage, in fact.

Up to 6*

5 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

And lose all the exp and possible level up you got out of it. No thanks.

EDIT: Well I feel dumb now. I thought I'd already put Fortify Cavalry on Jagen, but I didn't. No wonder I didn't seem to have the option to use it to boost Freddy. Now I can boost Freddy tho, yay.

There's pros and cons.

• Pros
  • Higher Rating = More potential for greater Feather count in Arena
  • Higher stats mean more effectiveness in combat
  • If you're doubled, the 3 Def/Res added to you through Fury offset the damage you would have taken anyway, so there's no actual difference, except for the fact that you won't die because Fury won't kill you, making your first instance of combat more effective due to increased lifespan opportunity
  • 3 Atk could turn an 2HKO into an OHKO, 3 Spd could let you double/not get doubled...it all makes sense
  • You cannot actually die from Fury's burn
• Cons
  • 2/4/6 Dmg per combat instance adds up and can set you up for issues if not careful
  • Relying heavily on Fury units to engage in frequent combat drains their HP faster
• KindaSorta Both
  • Higher Ratings for Arena technicaly matches you against harder opponents, requiring more careful strategy

[MaskedAmpharos]

1 minute ago, Othin said:

Yeah I'm definitely in the boat of not liking what I'm hearing about skill inheritance. They've shown a willingness to listen to feedback so far, but this doesn't seem like something they could clean up easily once it's released.

One other thing this highlights is an issue with matchmaking in the Arena. People paying for +10 units isn't as big of a deal because you don't fight them unless your team is close enough in stats, but skills aren't factored into matchmaking, and they should be. Having skills and maybe even movement type impact a character's "score" for matchmaking would go a long way in helping people stick to fair matches.

I'm doing my best to stay optimistic about the whole thing, at least until it's released. I'm telling myself that already-good characters like Takumi won't be able to get as much out of skills, but it could make currently meh characters viable in higher-ranked Arena, adding variety to the meta (which I imagine was the original intent behind skill inheritance in the first place). If worst comes to worst, and everyone has the potential to be OP, I'll still be happier with a character I really like having OP skills than a current top tier. 

In the words of Syndrome: if everyone's OP, no one is. 

Just now, Extrasolar said:

 I do have a Fae for Draw Back and an Olivia Dancer, but then again, there are some maps that screw over any hopes of good positioning in the first place.

Oh yeah, there are definitely maps that make good positioning really difficult (if not outright impossible). Fury units aren't optimal in all settings, I'm just trying to advocate for their good points in some areas. 

[Anacybele]

4 minutes ago, Elieson said:

Up to 6*

There's pros and cons.

• Pros
  • Higher Rating = More potential for greater Feather count in Arena
  • Higher stats mean more effectiveness in combat
  • If you're doubled, the 3 Def/Res added to you through Fury offset the damage you would have taken anyway, so there's no actual difference, except for the fact that you won't die because Fury won't kill you, making your first instance of combat more effective due to increased lifespan opportunity
  • 3 Atk could turn an 2HKO into an OHKO, 3 Spd could let you double/not get doubled...it all makes sense
  • You cannot actually die from Fury's burn
• Cons
  • 2/4/6 Dmg per combat instance adds up and can set you up for issues if not careful
  • Relying heavily on Fury units to engage in frequent combat drains their HP faster
• KindaSorta Both
  • Higher Ratings for Arena technicaly matches you against harder opponents, requiring more careful strategy

6 damage is even worse.

I still don't like the skill. I'm no strategist or competitive player, I never really have any idea how to effectively position my units. Some maps make this impossible as far as I can see too. I don't see myself ever using it right.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Anacybele

[Eleanore]

3 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

No thank you. For one thing, Frederick cannot be pulled as a 5 star while Robin can. And for another, Frederick is my favorite of all the units I have. I'm not a competitive player and I prioritize favorite units.

Unless the first focus ever comes back, no he can't. 5* Robin was a one time thing with the first focus, normally he can only be pulled as a 3* or 4*. I mean, they could put him up as a focus character again, but that's just as likely as Frederick being a focus character one day.

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, Eleanore said:

Unless the first focus ever comes back, no he can't. 5* Robin was a one time thing with the first focus, normally he can only be pulled as a 3* or 4*. I mean, they could put him up as a focus character again, but that's just as likely as Frederick being a focus character one day.

Oh, I thought Robin was one of the base possible 5 stars. But even so, I'm not changing my decision. People really need to stop telling me to (not that you're doing this, I'm just saying).

[Extrasolar]

7 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Effie is not the only armor in the game, dude. Heck, she's not even the only lance armor (Gwendolyn exists you know).

I know people that have gotten like 4 Gwendolyns... But...that armor movement...just so painful.

 

7 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

And by your logic, Robin is only good for Takumis and some red units. His res and speed are low too. He'll get doubled by a lot of things and mages will deal a lot of damage to him too. He has decent defense, but there are better defensive tanks out there.

M!Robin is...okay, imo. He's very high on the tier list, but I just don't see him able to compete with the likes of Klein (unless I'm using him wrong or something). He's just okay in everything. Okay attack, okay speed, okay defense and such. Bonfire does help him out and there's Defiant Speed to let him possibly double, and I guess his advantage over colorless units are a thing, but... Julia and Tharja have far higher attack, for example.

I'm still training him as an off-tank that can deal decent damage, but I've never been all too impressed by him.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Extrasolar

[Anacybele]

My point exactly. Robin appears to lean on average in everything. He's nothing real special and his only perk is having that advantage against colorless people.