Vykan12 Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 (edited) Saphy. Eh good point, though she's kind of exceptional for being in a game where staff users become more important than fighters for the second half of the game, then she has exclusivity to a 5 use repair staff, and the earliest access to warp/re-warp/silence/etc. Clarine doesn't have any of that really. As for Serra, dunno. Guy, Raven and Ninian/Nils make for some major competition. Edited December 29, 2008 by Vykan12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swordsalmon Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 Saphy. And Yumina. ^_^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SupremeRulerOfJugdral Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 How about some new faces? Take GONZALES, for example. He maxes STR and SPD invariably, and his only real weakness is the fact that his resistance growth is 5%, which leaves at an average of 2 resistance by the time he's 20/20. That exact fact, for me, is negated by the OTHER fact, where his Str cap is 30 and his Spd cap is 24, which he maxes both all the time. He has almost NO PROBLEM with Double Striking and Hitting HARD. Gonzales, too, can double most Generic NomadTroopers. His skill may be a hinderance in the beginning, but this isn't BEST SKILL, but best OVERALL in terms of usage. And seeing how FE6 bosses are FULL OF Armored Units, Gonzales can smack down his way through the thick armor. His HM bonuses make him downright godly, too. And how about them apples, Clarine? She can max out Speed and Luck anytime she wants to, and under the right circumstances, she can have up to 110 avoid. That's a GOOD THING. Luck also plays a huge role in finding stuff in the Desert Chapter and also avoiding Criticals from SwordMasters and Berserkers. With supports from Rutger (who I think is amazing, by the way), she can be as great as Gonzales. Also, when she promotes into a Valkyrie, since Anima magic is so broken (Lol, Fire for 1 Wt.) her ridiculously high AS doesn't have a chance of not doubling. Her magic may not be as phenomenal as Ellen's or Saul's, but you really don't need high mag for healers; Just give them Mends if it's really low. It's the avoiding you need for a decent one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vykan12 Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 (edited) Your arguments are too endgame minded, what matters is how a character performs over time, not just their raw potential. Also, you didn't look into Gonzales' durability other than pointing out his fail res or put any emphasis on how Clarine's really poor mag stat hurts her offensive potential despite being an avo tank. Edited December 29, 2008 by Vykan12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seph Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 His HM bonuses make him downright godly, too. The attack missed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekkah Posted December 29, 2008 Author Share Posted December 29, 2008 He maxes STR and SPD invariably, and his only real weakness is the fact that his resistance growth is 5%, Have you ever even used Gonzales? He has like 60% real hit on stuff like Fighters the moment he joins. That shit is bad. Much more of a weakness than a lame Res growth that half the cast shares anyway...he's actually better off against Mages than most because he he insane HP. And seeing how FE6 bosses are FULL OF Armored Units, Gonzales can smack down his way through the thick armor. Bosses are on thrones. Thrones give 30 avo. Gonzales' hit is going to fall in like 30-40s there. Awful. His HM bonuses make him downright godly, too. I wish this saying would die out already. HM bonuses have no innate value, all they do is boost a character's stats, no more, no less. His HM bonuses have already been factored in at his combat performance, they don't add anything beyond that, and they're only overkilling his already good stats (HP, Str, Spd), while not exactly helping out in poor areas (Hit, Hit, Hit and Hit). Also, Gonzales has suck supports. Clarine is a good unit, but she has several problems. - Her supports are super slow, though with good units. - She can't attack prepromotion. While healing is obviously cool, this also makes her useless on enemy phase, pretty much negative durability right there. - Her offense sucks. She's 100% reliant on supports + a critical hit to even one round anything. Luck also plays a huge role in finding stuff in the Desert Chapter Sorry, what? You're going to let Clarine run around in the desert to pick up stuff with her 1 unpromoted movement (2 if promoted)? Just use a goddamn thief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 Your welcome. For supports which really dont matter for fir because she kills anything easily noah is a fine support, and the shin support is great. Sacae is no reason to not be a good support besides the loss of arena. 1.2 hp? I'll live. 2 defense? fir had 4+ luck.maybe. You have to look at the final stats- 10 extra luck! Dont reply with luck isnt useful, or he has better def or hp, because 2 def hardly makes a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ϲharlie Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 You have to look at the final stats- 10 extra luck! Max level stats count for very little. It's unlikely that anyone will reach that high without lots of abuse. Rutger far overpowers Fir when she fist joins, unless you don't use him for some reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 Even if its not max, level there is still an advantage in proportion. Somehow they still do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thanibomb Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 Yes, it's a price to pay,Sue is a less good version of Shin, lacking a little in strengh, but I think she's still good. About the unmounted archers... who's the better overall, IYO? Klein is quite decent, considering he's a early prepromote, and has good growths. He's my pick. Yes, Klein is the best unmounted archer IMO. Hard Mode Bonus. :D Dorothy ends up really good in my playthroughs, too, but personal experiences don't count. D: Saphy. Agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rei Rei Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 Yes, but it's rather strange, a pre-promote being the best of his type. Most of them suck major. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekkah Posted January 3, 2009 Author Share Posted January 3, 2009 This thread is about the best unit guys, not "hey what am I going to support Noah with". Please stop derailing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 This thread is about the best unit guys, not "hey what am I going to support Noah with". Please stop derailing it. So I am supposed to "back myself up" without saying anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Spoon Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 I nominate Rutger for best unit in the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 HM bonuses can give her 3+ STR, so the average 18, is 21. the Shin support give nice AVO. Rutger is slightly overrated, his luck is bad, so little avoid, and since is defense is also bad...thats he weakness. Clarine support- clarine is off healing or something diek support- well, that is acutally good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ϲharlie Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 (edited) Fir's luck may seem a lot better than Rutger's, but it really isn't once you think about it. Fir only beats Rutger by five luck right before promotion. That only gives her five more avoid, five more CEV, and two more hit. That's almost nothing. It should also be noted that comparing Fir and Rutger at the same level is biased toward Fir. Edited January 4, 2009 by Musashi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clonez Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 HM bonuses can give her 3+ STR, so the average 18, is 21. the Shin support give nice AVO. Rutger is slightly overrated, his luck is bad, so little avoid, and since is defense is also bad...thats he weakness. Clarine support- clarine is off healing or something diek support- well, that is acutally good. Rutger can get 25 avoid from AClarine/BDieck. Add that plus his good speed means that he's dodging everything. Shin makes you use a pegasus knight or else you're going to go to Sacae. Eww. Clarine is healing...which means she's right next to amazing frontline units like Rutger. Level lead>>>>Luck. They're pretty much the same everywhere else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeldafreak007 Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 Rutger/Dieck/Clarine. No questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bros Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 I prefer Fir over Rutger. Fir's luck being higher than Rutger doesn't matter to me. What I don't like is Rutger's luck is too low. It's personal experiance but at level 20/12 he had 8 luck. That got him killed very often. I still like Rutger but I prefer Fir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeldafreak007 Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 I prefer Fir over Rutger. Fir's luck being higher than Rutger doesn't matter to me. What I don't like is Rutger's luck is too low. It's personal experiance but at level 20/12 he had 8 luck. That got him killed very often. I still like Rutger but I prefer Fir. lolluck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 So you cannot use nomad? ever? Sacae is a fine, route; nothing wrong with it. or using a pegasus knight. Fir's offense has no problem- great luck and skill= far more critical which means that a few less points of str and regained + more. Fir gets 5 skill and 2 speed whereas rutger gets 2 and 1. The average stats dont seem to include promotion gains. Fir get the similar avo from shin/noah. Firs also great speed and better luck means more evade than rutger. So clarine is only healing rutger? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ϲharlie Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 The speedy nomads in Sacae are difficult to take down. That's why most prefer to avoid it. Another thing: Luck has nothing to do with how often a character scores a critical hit. Fir's supports may give similar bonuses, but Rutger can start building his before Fir even joins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Tarrasque Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 The fact Rutger comes earlier than Fir and her CON should already nuke any attempt at saying Fir >>> Rutger. Rutger is clearly the best unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekkah Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 So you cannot use nomad? ever? Not never, but it keeps him from being the best unit. Shin's stats aren't even better than Lance's or Rutger's, or if they are, not enough to offset his other troubles (he also can't do close range until promotion). Sacae is a fine, route; nothing wrong with it. or using a pegasus knight. Both of those rape your combat rank. The former because your units aren't countering enemies 80% of the time, or if they are, they're doing it with 60% hit Javelins, or risking death (Lugh). In addition, only Rutger and friends can double Nomads, and he needs a crit to one round, while nearly everyone can take down Pegs in one round. Or at the very worst two, but then they'd prolly be taking three hits for Nomads. Using a Pegasus means you have to weaken a lot of enemies you could have killed easily just to raise a crap unit. Good unit forcing me to use a bad unit means mediocre unit overall. Fir gets 5 skill and 2 speed whereas rutger gets 2 and 1. The average stats dont seem to include promotion gains. Yes, they do include those. So clarine is only healing rutger? No. Just because you support him doesn't mean you're healing him. Anyway, what you seem to be saying is that Fir's tiny leads when she is at even level despite being about 10 levels behind > Rutger's tiny but more significant leads + level lead + better supports (his supports are all with God/High tiers, while neither Shin nor Noah are anywhere near that good) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bros Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 The fact Rutger comes earlier than Fir and her CON should already nuke any attempt at saying Fir >>> Rutger.Rutger is clearly the best unit. So are you saying joining time can ruin a unit? Nino joins very late but she is a great unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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