Fire Emblem Fan Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 Heath's weapon and refine are way better than I expected them to be. I'm satisfied and happy with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 Heath: Hyperion Lance Base effect is: Effective damage against cavalry With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Reduces opponent's Atk/Spd/Def in combat by 10% of unit's Def at start of combat Guard effect Refine effect is: If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats Guaranteed follow-up During first round of combat on each phase: 40% damage reduction on opponent's attacks and AoE Specials, excluding Rokkr Specials During subsequent rounds of combat on each phase: 20% damage reduction on opponent's attacks and AoE Specials, excluding Rokkr Specials Heath keeps his effective damage, as I suspected he would. Additionally, he gains about +12~14 to all stats depending on his Def stat, a guaranteed follow-up, Guard, and a slightly weaker version of Guard Bearing 4, but that grants the boosted damage reduction on both phases instead of only enemy phase. Compared to Trabant's weapon, he receives a smaller boost to effective Def due to the lower scaling (Trabant's is 15% of Def), but instead gets a boost to Atk and Spd based on his Def stat (which Trabant doesn't get). Heath also doesn't get Special acceleration, but instead gets a weaker, dual-phase version of Guard Bearing 4. The Atk boost is pretty useful since it allows him to at least pass up most of the other slow dragon knights in raw Atk, but it still falls behind Spring Michalis and Areone and lacks any form of Special acceleration, which is at least somewhat justified. His previously middling Spd stat gets a pretty huge boost, and he might actually be able to compete with actually fast units when run with a Spd Asset. Even if he gets only +12 Spd from his weapon, that puts him at the equivalent of 43 base neutral Spd for a current-generation unit (if he has maximum-minus-5 Dragonflower levels and the current-generation unit has none) with only weapons equipped, which is actually competitive. The only weird thing is you'll probably want to run him with Spd/Def skills in his A slot and Sacred Seal slot to get additional Spd boosts, which means passing up on Atk, and that's a bit awkward. Chad: Wildcat Dagger Base effect is: If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Boosts all stats in combat equal to the opponent's stat bonus on the corresponding stat Reduces all opponent's stats in combat equal to the opponent's stat bonus on the corresponding stat Offensive Tempo effect Refine effect is: With a Blow condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher: +4 to all stats in combat 30% damage reduction on opponent's first attack Additional damage equal to 10% of Spd, excluding AoE Specials Okay, that's one way to fix Chad's stats. They just flat-out give him Binding Necklace, which grants a maximum of +12 to all stats. On top of that, he gets the usual +8 to all stats, additional damage equal to 10% of his Spd, 30% damage reduction from the opponent's first attack, and the offensive Tempo effect. This kit is just asking you to give him Flash Sparrow and Lethality. Nothing else to say because Binding Necklace is just somewhat kind of broken. Lakche: Larcei's Edge Base effect is updated: Slaying effect If unit's Spd is higher than opponent's Spd at start of combat or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher (previously 100%) at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Nullifies opponent's stat bonuses Offensive Tempo effect (new) Refine effect is: If Special cooldown is at maximum at start of turn: -1 Special cooldown If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Additional damage equal to 15% of Spd, excluding AoE Specials If Special cooldown is at maximum after combat: -1 Special cooldown Lakche doesn't get Null Follow-Up, but she does get offensive Tempo. She also gets Time's Pulse 4, but the after-combat part of is conditional on her HP at the start of combat. Other than that, she also gets an additional +4 to all stats and additional damage based on her Spd. Honestly, it's probably better to switch her over to Vital Astra and Phys. Null Follow instead of her default Regnal Astra and Repel. Her weapon effectively having Time's Pulse 4 on it also means her C slot is open to run Atk/Spd Oath 4 instead of Time's Pulse 4. So as expected, she just does fast infantry sword things, just as before. Tsubasa: Mirage Feather Base effect is updated: Effective damage against armor and cavalry Permanent +3 Spd With a Blow-or-Unity condition: +6 Atk/Spd in combat (previously with a Blow condition and if at least 1 ally has ended their turn) Offensive Null Follow-Up effect (new) With a Blow condition and if at least 1 ally has ended their turn: Desperation effect Refine effect is: Canto (2) If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +5 Atk/Spd in combat Nullifies stat penalties to Atk/Spd With a Blow condition and if at least 1 ally has ended their turn: +5 Atk/Spd in combat So Tsubasa ended up still being player-phase-centric, but still gets some decent boosts on enemy phase. The stats from her base effect were moved to a Blow-or-Unity condition, which the Desperation effect remains on the old condition. She gains an additional +5 Atk/Spd, another +5 Atk/Spd with the unrefined weapon's condition, offensive Null Follow-Up, nullifies stat penalties to Atk/Spd, and Canto (2). Overall, she gets a total +16 Atk/Spd on player phase if at least 1 ally has ended their turn, which is a lot of stats, and she has both Null Follow-Up and Desperation to go along with it to avoid taking damage. She also has Canto (2), which means her B slot is open to run something like Wings of Mercy 4 or even Windsweep. Spring Fir: Bun-Bun Baton Base effect is updated: Effective damage against armor Slaying effect Null Follow-Up effect If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat (new) Offensive Tempo effect (new) Refine effect is: +7 Phantom Spd With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher: +4 to all stats in combat Reduces opponent's non-Special percentage damage reduction by half Dodge 3 No Canto is a bit of a bummer, but I can't believe she actually got Phantom Spd to match an opponent's Dodge 4. She also gets +8 to all stats, offensive Tempo, Dodge 3, and halves the opponent's percentage damage reduction. That's not quite as much as I wanted, but is about as much as I expected. Dodge 3 means she doesn't necessarily need to Sweep anymore and can run something else, but Windsweep is still a pretty good option. Interestingly, her refine effect uses the Stance condition instead of the Blow condition as its phase-based condition, which is a bit weird, but armors these days are more likely to be weaker on their player phase than on their enemy phase, but the player-phase condition is still easy enough to fulfill. The Stance condition also pairs well with Guard Bearing 4. Overall thoughts Chad's and Tsubasa's look to be the best ones in this batch. Chad getting Binding Necklace came out of left field, and the total potential +20 to all stats is insane. Tsubasa gets a reliable +16 Atk/Spd and Null Follow-Up to pair with the existing Desperation effect. Fir's is extremely solid, but isn't quite as insane as the previous two, and not getting Canto is a bit of a bummer. Lakche's is also solid, but it's pretty much just what every other fast sword infantry does. Heath's is good, but he's not quite as strong offensively as Trabant due to his lack of Special acceleration and not quite as strong defensively as Cormag due to his lack of flat damage reduction. However, he's now legitimately fast, but has to pick between running Atk/Spd skills or Spd/Def skills since he might actually want those 1~2 extra points of Spd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 I will probably refine Fir and Tsubasa. I don't have Larcei, and I don't care about the others two. 12 hours ago, Ice Dragon said: Lakche: Larcei's Edge This is funny to me. Calling her by the japanese name, but using the localized name for the weapon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuiltyLove Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 @Diovani BressanLooks like Phina doesn't get her refine and that Marth gets his own refine instead! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 11 minutes ago, GuiltyLove said: Looks like Phina doesn't get her refine and that Marth gets his own refine instead! Yeah, just like what we talked about in the Marla's GHB thread. It is disappointing that Phina is being skipped just because she is a dancer, but... to be honest, kinda expected. It would be great if Phina would open the door for non special Dancers refinement, but oh well... I can understand the people who got mad because of this. With that said... I am quite excited for this update. Young Marth, Plumeria and Flame Emperor are the ones I want the most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted November 1, 2023 Share Posted November 1, 2023 Translation notes for the new weapons: Brilliant Rapier is "光明レイピア" (kōmyō reipia), "Bright Rapier". "光明" (kōmyō) literally translates as "bright light", but it also refers to "hope" and "a bright future", as "明" (myō) can mean both "bright" and "tomorrow". Flame Battleaxe is "炎帝の烈斧" (entei no reppu), "Raging Axe of the Flame Emperor". And the usual hopes and predictions, many of which are rather short because we've seen these unit archetypes plenty of times already: Young Marth: Brilliant Rapier Currently has Rapier, which has effective damage against armor and cavalry and Vantage 3. I'm expecting Vantage to be made able to activate a full health, either by lifting the HP condition entirely or by giving it an alternate condition. While it's possible he'll get the Slaying effect added to his new weapon, it would be better to just give him Special Spiral 4, which would give him more options for his B and C skills. And given that Hero's Blood is just Fire Emblem with a different name, he'll probably also get Bonus Doubler 4 like Brave Marth. Flame Emperor: Flame Battleaxe Currently has Guard Axe, which grants the Guard effect. She's a melee armor. She'll either get the usual melee armor defensive effects, or she'll get some version of Raging Storm. Divine Vein (Flame) would also be fitting, given that she can't inherit Flared Sparrow, but I doubt they'll give something that strong to a Grail unit, even if it's Edelgard. Plumeria: Flower of Plenty Current effect is: Permanent +3 Res Grants +3 Atk/Res to allies within a rectangle 5 rows by 3 columns centered on unit The remixed Sweet Dreams now also grants a guaranteed follow-up on player phase and Hexblade to the dance target. Plumeria's new skill is Atk/Res Hold, which is simply an upgrade of her existing Atk/Res Rein. As a dancer, there's a lot they can do with her in terms of support effects. I expect her weapon to inflict at least one additional debuff on dance and probably also grant a mobility effect. Given that Sweet Dreams is also having its debuff range increased to the closest enemies within 5 spaces of the target, it's possible she'll grant the Formation status effect, which allows ranged units to target enemies up to 5 spaces away when teleporting. She could also grant Assault like her Rearmed version, but I don't think they'll overlap that effect. If they want to do something more interesting, inflicting False Start on dance or at the end of her action would be a great way to get around Freyr's shenanigans. She also does actually have a good Atk stat and will almost certainly get a guaranteed follow-up to help out her combat performance and might also get post-combat debuffs like Mirabilis. Legendary Dimitri: Areadbhar Current effect is: Slaying effect If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +5 to all stats in combat Dodge 3 Atrocity's remix only really adds obligatory stat boosts, first-hit damage reduction, and the addition of Guard to its post-combat debuffs. Dimitri's new skill is Atk/Spd Clash 4, replacing Sturdy Impact. Atk/Spd Clash 4 indicates that they want to double down on mobility. While he has Odd Tempest by default, it's sub-optimal to actually use when there are better skills available like Oath 4, so he might get Tempest moved to his weapon instead. Otherwise, because Atrocity's improvements are pretty generic, it doesn't really give us any hints as to what else they might do with the refine. This version of Dimitri is a Spd tank with good mobility, and the effects that would complement the role most would be flat damage reduction and passive healing. Giving him +1 Special charge rate or Pulse effects would also help him activate Specials like Galeforce and Godlike Reflexes that fit that role. Similarly, because Atrocity isn't getting the Tempo effect added to it, there's a decent chance he'll get it on his weapon. Altenna: Earthly Gae Bolg Current effect is: Permanent +3 Def If opponent is infantry, armor, or cavalry: -5 Atk/Def to opponent in combat Nullifies opponent's stat bonuses to Atk/Def Altenna is the next unit in this nonstop parade of dragon knights month after month. She'll probably get some new permutation of the effects that the other dragon knights have gotten. Thematically, getting Rein Snap on her weapon would be pretty fitting. Othin: Vouge Current effect is: Slaying effect If HP is 50% or higher at start of combat: Distant Counter Othin has decent Atk and decent Spd and would be able to function as a Spd tank if they give him the usual +8 to all stats and a Dodge effect. What would make Othin stand out, though, is if they gave him Tempo and an unconditional post-combat (or pre-combat) Pulse, which would make him able to reliably use Godlike Reflexes without having to worry about the opponent having Guard or Tempo to prevent it from charging up. And unlike Felix, Flame Lyn, and Timerra, he wouldn't need to give up Atk/Spd Finish 4 to get Distant Counter. Mamori: Mirage Axe Current effect is: Permanent +3 Res With a Unity condition: +6 Def/Res in combat Follow-up prevention Ideally, she'd get a guaranteed follow-up so that she could run something other than the guaranteed follow-up Fighter skills, but that's not strictly necessary. Either way, she'll probably just get a ton of defensive effects. It would be nice if we got another unit with Divine Vein (Stone), though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRay Posted November 3, 2023 Share Posted November 3, 2023 As long as Flame Emperor can Galeforce twice, I think I will be happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted November 6, 2023 Share Posted November 6, 2023 (edited) Refines are now up: Young Marth: Brilliant Rapier Base effect is: Effective damage against armors and cavalry Permanent +3 Spd With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Nullifies opponent's stat bonuses to Spd/Def If HP is 80% or lower and with a Stance condition: Vantage effect Refine effect is: With a Blow-or-Unity condition: +4 to all stats in combat Bonus Doubler 4 effect Additional damage equal to 15% of Spd, excluding AoE Specials As expected, Marth gets Bonus Doubler 4. He also nullifies the opponent's stat bonuses to Spd/Def and gains additional damage based on his Spd. Vantage only got a small upgrade, raising the HP threshold from 75% to 80%, which is a bit disappointing. He also didn't get any Special acceleration of any sort, which is also pretty disappointing and means he's basically forced to run Special Spiral. Given all of the skill effects that Brave Marth has on his weapon, this one is pretty underwhelming. At the very least, they should have at least given Young Marth something like the Desperation effect on enemy phase to set him apart. For comparison, Genesis Falchion has a total of: Effective damage against dragons Slaying effect +15/10/10/10 Bonus Doubler 4 effect 40% damage reduction on non-follow-up attacks Null Follow-Up Offensive Tempo effect 7 HP regeneration after combat Vantage effect whereas Brilliant Rapier only has a total of: Effective damage against armors and cavalry +8/11/8/8 Additional damage equal to 15% of Spd Bonus Doubler 4 effect Nullifies opponent's stat bonuses to Spd/Def Vantage effect On top of that, Young Marth is already 3 Atk and 4 Spd behind Brave Marth at neutral when both have max Dragonflowers (and 4 Atk and 5 Spd with Assets since Brave Marth has a superboon in both and Young Marth has neither), and Young Marth needs more Dragonflowers. Flame Emperor: Flame Battleaxe Base effect: If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: Reduces opponent's Atk/Def in combat by 15 minus 2 times the opponent's max Special cooldown, minimum -7 If opponent has no Special equipped, -7 Guard effect Refine effect: At start of turn, inflicts the following status effects on enemies within 3 rows and 3 columns centered on unit: -7 Atk Sabotage With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher at start of combat: -5 Atk/Def to opponent in combat Guaranteed follow-up No Raging Storm is clear proof that Flame Emperor is for reals not Edelgard. Flame Emperor inflicts a massive total -12~18 Atk on the opponent depending on their max Special cooldown. And that's before accounting for the -7 Atk stat penalty and Sabotage status effect that she inflicts with Ploy 4 range and no condition. She also gets the usual guaranteed follow-up and the Guard effect from her original weapon, though amusingly with a worse condition (since the original weapon had no condition). While she doesn't get Raging Storm, having the Ploy 4 range on her debuffs is asking to be run with Assault Troop, and Sabotage requiring enemies to remain close to each other is also helpful for player-phase use. That said, the gigantic amount of Atk debuffs she inflicts is pretty good for use with Near Save. Plumeria: Flower of Plenty Base effect is updated: Permanent +3 Res If there is an ally within a rectangle 5 rows by 3 columns centered on unit: +5 Atk/Res in combat (new) Grants +4 Atk/Res in combat to allies within a rectangle 5 rows by 3 columns centered on unit (previously +3) Refine effect: If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +5 Atk/Res in combat Guaranteed follow-up If unit attacked in combat: Inflicts Gravity on opponent and enemies adjacent to opponent after combat The remixed Sweet Dreams now also grants a guaranteed follow-up on player phase and Hexblade to the dance target. Plumeria's new skill is Atk/Res Hold, which is simply an upgrade of her existing Atk/Res Rein. Plumeria gains her obligatory stat boost of +10 Atk/Res, the usual guaranteed follow-up, and now has the effect of Gravity+. Her ally buffing effect was increased by 1 point. Not much to say. The remix to her dance skill is the more meaningful upgrade since she's still primarily a dancer, but Gravity is a pretty nice effect for combat. No damage reduction means she'll have to pick between Still Water for debuffing or Remote Mirror for combat, though. Legendary Dimitri: Areadbhar Base effect is updated: Slaying effect +7 Phantom Spd (new) If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +5 to all stats in combat Dodge 3 7 HP recovery after combat (new) Refine effect is: With a Blow-or-Unity condition: +4 to all stats in combat Tempo effect Nullifies half of opponent's percentage damage reduction Atrocity's remix only really adds obligatory stat boosts, first-hit damage reduction, and the addition of Guard to its post-combat debuffs. Dimitri's new skill is Atk/Spd Clash 4, replacing Sturdy Impact. Dimitri gets Tempo 4, Phantom Spd (i.e. Dodge 4 with only Dodge 3's damage reduction), and post-combat regeneration. No mobility effect is pretty disappointing, as it means he'll be stuck with Oath 4 as his optimal C skill to boost mobility (or Pledge with Oath Echo) as Tempest is still a sub-optimal skill for him to use in the Arena. It's worth noting that he doesn't have Null Follow-Up on either his weapon or his exclusive B skill. That seems like it could be an issue for him since he can't really afford to give up his Sacred Seal for Null Follow-Up due to being a Spd tank, which means he needs to be getting it from a teammate. I wonder if we'll be getting Null Follow-Up Echo, but even then, it'll become sub-optimal as soon as we get Darting Blow Echo. He's simultaneously good and disappointing at the same time. Altenna: Earthly Gae Bolg Base effect is updated: Permanent +3 Def If opponent is infantry, armor, or cavalry (previously existing) or if HP is 50% or higher at start of combat (new): -5 Atk/Def to opponent in combat Nullifies opponent's stat bonuses to Atk/Def Additional damage equal to 10% of Def, excluding AoE Specials (new) Refine effect is: With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher at start of combat: -5 Atk/Def to opponent in combat Guaranteed follow-up Nullifies stat penalties to Atk/Def Altenna gets an alternate condition so her weapon's base effect works against fliers. Additionally, she nullifies her penalties to Atk/Def, gets the usual guaranteed follow-up, and gains additional damage based on Def. Nothing too special to write home about, but unlike the other recent dragon knights that were more focused on bulk, Altenna's refine is more offensively focused. She also has no Special acceleration, which makes me think she's intended to be used with Gambit and a non-functional Aether. Othin: Vouge Base effect is updated: Slaying effect If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat (previously 50%): +4 to all stats in combat (new) Distant Counter Refine effect is: Bulwark effect With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat 30% damage reduction on opponent's first attack Ice Mirror effect 7 HP recovery after combat They did, in fact, give him the usual +8 to all stats and first-attack damage reduction to function as a Spd tank. Additionally, he gets the Ice Mirror effect and both Bulwark's movement obstruction and post-combat regeneration. He doesn't get +1 Special charge rate, but he can still run Tempo + Breath/Pledge or just Special Spiral to run a Godlike Reflexes build if he wants to. If you aren't dealing with opponents with Guard, he can give up Tempo to run Shield Pulse + Breath/Pledge for a bit more bulk. He can also run a standard Vital Astra build with Time's Pulse 4 if you aren't worried about percentage damage reduction nullification. Either way, he definitely leans towards running a Special with damage reduction in order to get more damage out of his Ice Mirror effect. Mamori: Mirage Axe Base effect is updated: Permanent +3 Res If there is an ally within 3 spaces (previously 2 spaces): +4 Atk/Spd in combat (new) +6 Def/Res in combat Follow-up prevention With a Stance condition: Reduces opponent's Atk/Def in combat by 3 times the number of enemies that have not ended their turn, max -12, min -6 (new) Refine effect is: Grants the following effects to allies within 2 spaces: +4 Def/Res in combat 7 HP recovery after combat If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat 30% damage reduction on all opponent's attacks, excluding AoE Specials 7 HP recovery after combat Mamori gains damage reduction against all enemy attacks, post-combat regeneration, and a variation on Shield Session. Additionally, she gets a slightly weaker version of Silque's Drive effects (+4 instead of +6 with the same post-combat regeneration). No guaranteed follow-up is a bit disappointing, but isn't a deal breaker since Fighter skills exist and are still really good. The Shield-Session-like boosts look like this: -6 Atk/Def if 0-2 enemies have not ended their turn -9 Atk/Def if 3 enemies have not ended their turn -12 Atk/Def if 4 or more enemies have not ended their turn Compare with regular Shield Session 3, which has: +3 Def/Res if 2 or more enemies have ended their turn +6 Def/Res if 1 enemy has ended their turn +9 Def/Res if 0 enemies have ended their turn The three tiers are the same if there are exactly 4 enemy units. Shield Session 3's conditions are better if there are 3 or fewer enemy units. Mirage Axe's conditions are better if there are 5 or more enemy units. Overall, Mamori gets a minimum of +14/14/16/16 from her weapon alone and a maximum of +20/20/22/22 on top of the 30% damage reduction on all attacks. The only real skill effect she ends up getting is follow-up prevention, which does mean that she's reliant on her passive skills for additional skill effects, which basically means she'll probably be stuck running Close Def 4 + Crafty Fighter. Hopefully, we'll get Crafty Fighter 4 soon and it'll have an effect that doesn't overlap with her existing follow-up prevention (like what Vengeful Fighter 4 got). Overall thoughts Honestly less impressive overall than other recent refines. Definitely-not-Edelgard and Mamori have pretty solid refines. Othin's also looks pretty good, and he has some variety in his premium build options. Plumeria's is fine, though lacking first-attack damage reduction makes it a bit harder to pick an A skill for her since she's torn between going pure support and actually using her combat effects instead of being able to do both with the same build. Dimitri's lack of Null Follow-Up seems like it'll be a bit troublesome for him, and it's disappointing that he doesn't get any form of mobility boost from his weapon to complement his new Atk/Spd Clash 4. Everything else about it is good, though. Altenna's is boring, but functional, being more offensively oriented than the other recent dragon knights, but with no form of Special acceleration whatsoever. It's basically begging to have her run Aether + Gambit (which isn't a bad thing other than Gambit's availability). Marth's is somehow the most disappointing refine, not because it's bad on its own, but because Brave Marth has almost the exact same thing, but better in literally every way except for the effective damage. Edited November 6, 2023 by Ice Dragon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted November 6, 2023 Share Posted November 6, 2023 I was hoping they would increase Plumeria's support range from 3x5 to 5x5. Honestly, her refinement is a disappointment. Having the refinement or not doesn't change much, because while it's cool to have some combat abilities, you better user her to dance than attacking. At least she can now tank mages better with that extra resistance I guess. 52 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said: Given all of the skill effects that Brave Marth has on his weapon, this one is pretty underwhelming. At the very least, they should have at least given Young Marth something like the Desperation effect on enemy phase to set him apart. Honestly... even though Marth is a special hero, he is also the 4* special rate of that banner. I wonder if they took that in consideration, and treated him as a demote refinement where while it is a good refinement it is still not a very strong one. For me, I didn't expect much outside a bunch of stats, so having Lull Spd/Def nad Spd based damage is a good thing. I never expected him to be on the same level as Brave Marth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted November 6, 2023 Share Posted November 6, 2023 12 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said: Honestly... even though Marth is a special hero, he is also the 4* special rate of that banner. I wonder if they took that in consideration, and treated him as a demote refinement where while it is a good refinement it is still not a very strong one. My issue with Young Marth isn't that he's worse than Brave Marth, but that they didn't bother to make him different in any way other than his effective damage. Against an opponent with +6 stat bonuses, Young Marth actually has slightly better stats than Brave Marth due to bonus nullification (by 2 points in Spd and 2~4 points in effective Atk), but he lacks damage reduction, the Slaying effect, Tempo, and Null Follow-Up, has a worse Vantage, and his Special grants fewer points in stats (and none at the start of the turn), which completely nullifies his stat advantage unless he's getting the full +6 from some other source. Meanwhile, they managed to release refines for 4 dragon knights plus 1 brand new dragon knight and have all of them build and play differently from each other despite having similar stat spreads. Would it have killed them to just give him one effect (other than the effective damage) to make him even slightly more different? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRay Posted November 6, 2023 Share Posted November 6, 2023 Boo! Flame Emperor is missing Galeforce on her Weapon! Anyways, she does not seem very Player Phase oriented. Kind of hard to give her a decent Galeforce loadout without some redundant/useless effects; best I can come up with are: Heavy Blade-Lull Spd/Def/Escape Route/Wings of Mercy-Assault Troop-Blade Session/Null Follow-Up Heavy Blade-Brash Assault-Assault Troop-Blade Session Atk/Spd Ideal-Lull Spd/Def/Escape Route/Wings of Mercy-Assault Troop-Bold Fighter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 Weird that they posted the Update Notification earlier than normal. They usually post it on the reset, but this time we got it 4 hours before it, around the same time we get trailers and channels. Anyway... refinements without the remixes look a little empty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Emblem Fan Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 There should be two or three additional refinements in updates without remixes. This is slower than a snail's pace, it's beyond ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 I feel like they should add more weapons to refine on months where we don't have a remix. Now that we get 2 remixes at a time, the off months feel a lot less exciting, not only because there are 2 fewer refines, but also because remix refines are stronger than other refines. Anyways, we get one new weapon, so here're the translation notes: Sacaen-Wolf Bow is "若き狼の鋭弓" (wakaki ōkami no eikyū), "Sharp Bow of the Young Wolf". And the usual hopes and expectations: Rath: Sacaen-Wolf Bow Currently has Slaying Bow. Rath has very unoriginal stats, having an almost identical offensive stat spread with Brave Lyn, Python, and Summer Wolt and even sharing a color with the latter two. Rath is currently the only Sacaen cavalry archer that doesn't have a version of Mulagir, but I wouldn't be too surprised if he borrows its signature Sweep effect. Additionally, unlike the Mulagir variants, Rath is likely to get the Slaying effect on his weapon since his base weapon is Slaying Bow. He has Glimmer on his base kit, which pairs well with the Slaying effect and the Sweep effect, though it does make me worry that they won't give him an additional effect to allow him to viably use Deadeye instead of Glimmer. Otherwise, there's nothing else on his base kit that really says anything. Spd/Res Form is a useless skill in general and is even more useless on a cavalry unit, and Def Smoke is just a copy of Brave Lyn's Atk Smoke. Shannan: Balmung Current effect is: Permanent +3 Spd With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 100% at start of combat: Nullifies stat penalties +5 to all stats in combat Shannan is a bit weird as a unit. He had a higher Atk stat than other fast sword infantry at the time and made up for his lower Spd stat by having permanent Spd on his weapon instead of the Slaying effect, but that came at the cost of not having the Slaying effect. He was also designed as an enemy-phase sword infantry back before the class had all of the new tools it now has, like Dodge for damage mitigation, Finish for passive healing, and Time's Pulse 4 to recharge his Special. And this could be pretty easily seen in his base kit, which had Steady Posture 4 for damage mitigation and Wrath to recharge his Special. Given how outdated his base kit is, I hope they'll ignore it completely when designing his weapon's refine. Also, given how insanely saturated his class is, I'm also hoping they'll give him a more novel toolkit. My personal wish is that he gets flat damage reduction based on his Spd stat (not a Spd comparison) to basically function like a Spd version of Spring Maria or Duo Askr. Giving him -2 Special cooldown before his first attack also prevents him from needing Tempo or Time's Pulse and also discourages switching out his Imperial Astra for Vital Astra, especially if they don't give him the Slaying effect. A Scowl effect based on Spd would also be nice to have. I would also find it amusing if they gave him Diamant's follow-up prevention effect to reference the fact that the original Balmung granted a ridiculous +20 Spd. Iago: Iago's Tome Current effect is: Permanent +3 Res At the start of odd turns: If enemy is not adjacent to another enemy and unit's HP is at least 3 higher than enemy's HP, inflicts the following status effects on enemy: -4 Atk/Spd Guard At the start of even turns: If enemy is adjacent to another enemy and unit's HP is at least 3 higher than enemy's HP, inflicts the following status effects on enemy: -4 Def/Res Panic Iago would love to be able to use his max HP instead of his current HP for comparisons. It would also be nice if they updated his debuffs to be -6, to all stats, and activating at the start of both player's phases. Also add more recent status effects, like Discord, Sabotage, and Ploy. Despite his high HP, he might still have some difficulty hitting some armors, and it might be helpful if his debuffs also splash to any unit with Savior within 2 spaces of an affected unit. It would also be interesting if he could also just remove Decoy from enemies. Duo Palla: Whitedown Spear Current effect is: Permanent +3 Atk If there are at least 3 fliers on the team and with a Blow condition: -4 Atk/Def on opponent in combat Guaranteed follow-up If there are at least 2 flier allies within 2 spaces and with a Blow condition: Brave effect Her Duo Skill grants +1 movement to herself and adjacent fliers and refreshes at the start of every odd turn. Have her grant Triangle Attack, Formation, and Canto (1) to fliers within 2 spaces and also give her Soaring Guidance so that she doesn't have to run it in the C slot. Essentially, turn her into a stronger version of Harmonized Catria, but specialized for fliers. It would also be interesting if they granted it effects from the Whitewings' Echoes versions' weapons, but I don't think that would be entirely necessary. Eleonora: Mirage Longbow Current effect is: Bow common effect Permanent +3 Spd If Spd is higher than opponent's Spd: Sweep effect This weapon needs so much work, it's not even funny. Binary Spd comparisons are increasingly less reliable due to Dodge 4 skills all having Phantom Spd on them. Additionally, the Sweep effect has the distinct disadvantage that you can't use the opponent's counterattack to help charge a Special, which is even more of a problem if the unit doesn't have the Slaying effect. I don't like the precedence of adding effects that nullify Phantom stats entirely because that fucks with the viability of Phantom stats as a whole, especially considering that the opportunity cost of running the Phantom stat Sacred Seals is pretty high, but cutting the opponent's Phantom Spd in half seems like an effect that shouldn't break anything while still be immensely useful. Additionally, since Eleonora doesn't have access to Dodge 4 skills herself, give her at least +4 Phantom Spd to counter an opponent's Dodge 4 after it is halved. Addressing her difficulty in activating a Special with the Sweep effect, I think it would be best to give her the offensive Tempo effect and a Pulse effect that activates before her first attack if the opponent is incapable of counterattacking. This wouldn't let her run Deadeye, but it would let her run a 2-cooldown Special and have it actually activate on her follow-up. Deadeye is nice, but Phys. Null Follow is a decent enough substitute and is already more or less her best-in-slot B skill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 3 hours ago, Fire Emblem Fan said: There should be two or three additional refinements in updates without remixes. This is slower than a snail's pace, it's beyond ridiculous. 1 hour ago, Ice Dragon said: I feel like they should add more weapons to refine on months where we don't have a remix. Now that we get 2 remixes at a time, the off months feel a lot less exciting, not only because there are 2 fewer refines, but also because remix refines are stronger than other refines. They should at least use these non-remix months to give the refinement to older heroes. 5* Heroes that were skipped for dumb reasons, and even the staff units in the 3/4* pool or grails. Now that we have units dealing up to 21 free and unstoppable damage before first attack on their own (Flamed Sparrow + Flame Terrain + Occultist's Strike), and potential even more damage if you use that unit alongside Attuned Triandra, there is no reason to avoid not giving Surtr a refinement, imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRay Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 Or re-Refines. Lyn: Brave Lady's Mulagir was always crappy, so there was no point in ever using it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 5 hours ago, Diovani Bressan said: They should at least use these non-remix months to give the refinement to older heroes. 5* Heroes that were skipped for dumb reasons, and even the staff units in the 3/4* pool or grails. Now that we have units dealing up to 21 free and unstoppable damage before first attack on their own (Flamed Sparrow + Flame Terrain + Occultist's Strike), and potential even more damage if you use that unit alongside Attuned Triandra, there is no reason to avoid not giving Surtr a refinement, imo. This is ... actually a really good idea. Using non-remix months to refine more weapons, including the older ones who were skipped. And it's not like we haven't had more than one weapon refine banner running simultaneously either. Why hasn't anyone running this game thought of this yet ...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othin Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 9 hours ago, Ice Dragon said: Eleonora: Mirage Longbow Current effect is: Bow common effect Permanent +3 Spd If Spd is higher than opponent's Spd: Sweep effect This weapon needs so much work, it's not even funny. Binary Spd comparisons are increasingly less reliable due to Dodge 4 skills all having Phantom Spd on them. Additionally, the Sweep effect has the distinct disadvantage that you can't use the opponent's counterattack to help charge a Special, which is even more of a problem if the unit doesn't have the Slaying effect. I don't like the precedence of adding effects that nullify Phantom stats entirely because that fucks with the viability of Phantom stats as a whole, especially considering that the opportunity cost of running the Phantom stat Sacred Seals is pretty high, but cutting the opponent's Phantom Spd in half seems like an effect that shouldn't break anything while still be immensely useful. Additionally, since Eleonora doesn't have access to Dodge 4 skills herself, give her at least +4 Phantom Spd to counter an opponent's Dodge 4 after it is halved. Addressing her difficulty in activating a Special with the Sweep effect, I think it would be best to give her the offensive Tempo effect and a Pulse effect that activates before her first attack if the opponent is incapable of counterattacking. This wouldn't let her run Deadeye, but it would let her run a 2-cooldown Special and have it actually activate on her follow-up. Deadeye is nice, but Phys. Null Follow is a decent enough substitute and is already more or less her best-in-slot B skill. What about an alternate condition? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 4 hours ago, Othin said: What about an alternate condition? I don't trust them to come up with an interesting alternate condition when they basically always just resort to Blow, Stance, HP threshold, Solo, or Unity, of which 3 make the condition trivial and the remaining 2 are as good as useless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othin Posted December 2, 2023 Share Posted December 2, 2023 On 12/1/2023 at 1:31 AM, Ice Dragon said: I don't trust them to come up with an interesting alternate condition when they basically always just resort to Blow, Stance, HP threshold, Solo, or Unity, of which 3 make the condition trivial and the remaining 2 are as good as useless. I'm not saying it's a desirable possibility, just a likely one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted December 5, 2023 Share Posted December 5, 2023 Trying to guess the refinements for January, and I will go with: Legendary Lilina Legendary Corrin Young Minerva Kiria Young Merric These five are pretty much guaranteed, in my opinion. The first 3 are obvious, since they are the 2 Legendary Heroes schedule for remixes and the next grail unit in line. Then we have Kiria, who is the last TMS to get refinement from her banner and in general, and to avoid color sharing in the banner I went with Young Merric and not Young Caeda for the seasonal refinement. The last two slots will depend... It could go: Leila Ferdinand Von Aegir or Fiora Bernadetta Again, considering no color sharing in the New Power banner and both Kiria and Merric taking the red and green colors already, the remaining colors are blue and colorless. So it will depend on who from the Blazing Blade banner gets their refinement first. If they go Leila, then the other will be Ferdinand Von Aegir. If they go Fiora, then it should be Bernadetta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuiltyLove Posted December 6, 2023 Share Posted December 6, 2023 Ehhhh... at least Palla has Canto. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire Emblem Fan Posted December 6, 2023 Share Posted December 6, 2023 You know? I'm okay with that weapon and refine for Rath. It's fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted December 6, 2023 Share Posted December 6, 2023 Yeah, Rath's weapon refine is acceptable. Guaranteed follow-up attack is good, and easy +8 to all stats under the right conditions is also fine. The 30% helps him survive if he has to eat a hit, so like. It's fine. It could've been worse for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted December 6, 2023 Share Posted December 6, 2023 (edited) Rath: Sacaen-Wolf Bow Base effect is: Bow common effect Slaying effect With a Blow-or-Unity condition: +4 to all stats in combat 30% damage reduction on the opponent's first attack Refine effect is: If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Guaranteed follow-up Offensive Tempo effect I feel like it's been ages since we last got a weapon that does what it needs to do without needing whole a master's thesis to explain it. No +1 Special charge rate is a bit of a bummer since it means he won't be guaranteed to land Deadeye on an opponent if they can't counterattack, though it's not that much of an issue since it'll still activate against opponents that can counterattack, and he can still run Ruptured Sky otherwise. Shannan: Balmung Base effect is updated: Permanent +3 Spd With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher at start of combat (previously 100%): Nullifies stat penalties +5 to all stats in combat Tempo effect (new) Refine effect is: If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Boost to all stats in combat equal to 15% of Spd at start of combat Dodge 3 effect Unfortunately, Shannan ends up with the usual cookie-cutter skill effects that other fast sword infantry have. They did still make sure that he isn't going to be using Vital Astra or Godlike Reflexes over his default Imperial Astra, though, as he has no form of Special acceleration at all on his weapon. On the plus side, he's a huge pile of stats, as the Spd-based stat boost should be able to get him about +7~8 points to all stats on top of the +9 that he already gets from the fixed-value effects. He already has an enormous Def stat that's somehow higher than his neutral base Spd stat as well as an above-average HP stat, so this just makes him even more comically bulky on the physical side. Iago: Iago's Tome Base effect is updated: Permanent +3 Res At the start of odd turns: If enemy is not adjacent to another enemy and unit's HP is at least 3 higher than enemy's HP, inflicts the following status effects on enemy: -6 Atk/Spd (previously -4) Guard At the start of even turns: If enemy is adjacent to another enemy and unit's HP is at least 3 higher than enemy's HP, inflicts the following status effects on enemy: -6 Def/Res (previously -4) Panic If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat (new) Refine effect is: At start of odd turns: Grants the following status effects to self and allies within 2 spaces: +6 Def/Res Follow-up prevention Nullifies opponent's stat bonuses At start of even turns: Grants the following status effects to self and allies within 2 spaces: +6 Atk/Spd Guaranteed follow-up with a Blow condition Hexblade With a Stance condition or if opponent's HP is 75% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Essentially, he grants +0/6/12/12 to allies on odd turns against opponents hit by his debuffs and +12/6/0/0 to allies on even turns against opponents hit by his debuffs with additional defensive status effects on odd turns and additional offensive status effects on even turns to complement the stat buffs. On top of the HP comparison, the Sabotage and anti-Sabotage conditions on his debuffs still make them too unreliable to use most of the time. However, the buffs from his refine are a completely different story. He's a really good unit to have for activating Prime, as the non-stat bonuses he grants are all pretty rare and are unlikely to overlap any that the unit with Prime will receive from its own skills. Since he grants 2 effects each turn, a unit with Prime only needs 2 other status effects to activate the Close/Distant Counter effect. Amusingly, he doesn't directly get a guaranteed follow-up from his weapon and instead gets it on even turns from his turn-based buffs. Duo Palla: Whitedown Spear Base effect is updated: Permanent +3 Atk With a Blow condition or if there is an ally within 3 spaces (previously "if there are at least 3 fliers on the team and with a Blow condition"): -4 Atk/Spd/Def on opponent in combat (previously only Atk/Def) Guaranteed follow-up If there are at least 2 flier allies within 3 spaces (previously 2 spaces and with a Blow condition): Brave effect Refine effect is: If there is a flier ally within 3 spaces: Canto (Rem.+1) If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +4 to all stats in combat Additional damage equal to 15% of Atk, excluding AoE Specials If there are at least 2 flier allies within 3 spaces: +1 Special charge rate Her Duo Skill grants +1 movement to herself and adjacent fliers and refreshes at the start of every odd turn. Palla no longer requires 3 fliers on the team (including herself) to activate the weapon's base effect. Additionally, all Unity positioning conditions have been changed to Finish positioning conditions, though some of them still require 2 flier allies. Most notably, she gets the Brave effect on both phases and Canto. She also gets something like 10~12 points of additional damage, which is kind of ridiculous given that she has the Brave effect on her weapon. She also gets +1 Special charge rate just in case it wasn't easy enough for her to activate Galeforce. Yeah, it's pretty busted. Unfortunately, she doesn't get Aerial Maneuvers and Soaring Guidance built into her weapon, but already having Canto on her weapon means she doesn't have much opportunity cost running those in her passive skill slots. Eleonora: Mirage Longbow Base effect is updated: Bow common effect Permanent +3 Spd With a Blow-or-Unity condition (previously "if Spd is higher than opponent's Spd"): +5 Atk/Spd in combat (new) Additional damage equal to 15% of Spd, excluding AoE Specials (new) Sweep effect Refine effect is: Slaying effect If HP is 25% or higher at start of combat: +5 Atk/Spd Nullifies stat penalties to Atk/Spd Nullifies stat bonuses to Spd/Def on opponent So they really did just give her an unconditional Sweep effect. Color me actually surprised. And they also gave her the Slaying effect. Unfortunately, she doesn't get Tempo or Null Follow-Up, which means she can't have both without giving up a stat-boosting skill to run Null Follow-Up in the Sacred Seal slot. Kind of a bummer, though it's not going to make or break her since she already has an unconditional Sweep. Both Tempo 4 and Phys. Null Follow have partial percentage damage reduction nullification, so running Deadeye isn't strictly necessary, and she can instead run Ruptured Sky if she wants. With Ruptured Sky, she won't need any other form of Special acceleration, which is nice. With Deadeye, she'll need either Flash Sparrow or Pledge in order charge it for her follow-up, and it's vulnerable to opponents with the defensive Tempo effect. Overall thoughts Palla's is obviously insane. All of the rest are solid, even if I have some nitpicks on some of them. Edited December 6, 2023 by Ice Dragon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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