redlight Posted April 3, 2018 Share Posted April 3, 2018 1 minute ago, DragonFlames said: Hence why I said it was annoying and why I find it so hard to believe it takes only 40 minutes using only the first dungeon. You also haven't answered my question yet. I am genuinely curious. Just skip the enemy phase and finish off what's left Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonFlames Posted April 3, 2018 Share Posted April 3, 2018 Just now, silveraura25 said: Just skip the enemy phase and finish off what's left Okay then. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redlight Posted April 3, 2018 Share Posted April 3, 2018 1 minute ago, DragonFlames said: Okay then. Thanks! Also, don't attack the enemy. Otherwise you're closer to them at the start of battle and have to waste time getting other units out of the enemy's range. Just run into them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slumber Posted April 3, 2018 Share Posted April 3, 2018 Mage!Kliff always did well for me in the early and mid game, but due to movement issues, fell off compared to Archers and Mercs. On the whole I'd say Mage!Kliff is fine. Not quite as good as he could potentially be as a Merc or Archer, but those two classes are broken in SoV, so no duh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayni Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 Certainly not as good as in Gaiden sadly. I'd still consider it a good option for him as a class, though Kliff has the growths to make most classes work anyway. Movement is a concern that affects all mages and while other units do get more magic now, he still has a more versatile offensive list than most of those you'd compare him to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Hardin Posted April 7, 2018 Share Posted April 7, 2018 The only real bad class is anyone as a Soldier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamison(Forgot old login) Posted April 9, 2018 Share Posted April 9, 2018 I dont think SoV really gets hard enough for it to matter so you should just use what you enjoy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kammaru Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 On 4/1/2018 at 4:49 PM, DisobeyedCargo said: I've seen a lot of people agree that Mage is one of Kliff's worst classes. I just don't see it. He does start off with low speed, but that's easily fixed with the speed fountain and his high speed growth. He also has a great spell list. So why is it one of his worst classes? He always does well in that class for me. For me, the answer is going to be representative more of the type of player. If you like to rush the game, play everything as it comes and make it as difficult as you possibly can, then he's going to lag behind. If you like to grind, built units up slow, and level up even the weaker units to see what they could be, then he's going to be a beast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L9999 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 (edited) Mage Kliff is complete garbage. 1 AS should be more than enough to know he is worthless. Edited April 25, 2018 by L9999 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatManThree Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 (edited) Kliff only has 1 AS at base as a mage when using his fire tome. This means that without grinding he will not be doubling anything at all for a while, limiting his contribution. There's also the fact that mages are often considered shit in SoV due to their awful mov and single late promo, but that's besides the point. If you want an early game mage, just use Mage Tobin. He can actually double things at base and gets Excalibur incredibly quickly. Edited April 25, 2018 by CatManThree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatManThree Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 (edited) On 4/7/2018 at 1:46 AM, Emperor Hardin said: The only real bad class is anyone as a Soldier. The Cavalier class got nerfed and Mages overall are often considered bad for multiple reasons. Edited April 25, 2018 by CatManThree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azz Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 3 hours ago, CatManThree said: The Cavalier class got nerfed and Mages overall are often considered bad for multiple reasons. Cav ain't that bad. My Cav!Kliff was great from the outset and later on down the line became a 2nd Mathilda with actual bulk. Though I will agree, it is still the third best option after Merc and Archer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DisobeyedCargo Posted April 25, 2018 Author Share Posted April 25, 2018 (edited) 9 hours ago, L9999 said: Mage Kliff is complete garbage. 1 AS should be more than enough to know he is worthless. What about the water of speed in the beginning though, can't that easily patch him up? Edited April 25, 2018 by DisobeyedCargo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinks Their Own Way Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 (edited) For me he relied to heavily on needing to critical to do anything and he barely landed critical hit (a problem I have with a lot of the units in Echoes). I benched his ass for Delthea (my MVP) I'm not going to lie. Edited April 26, 2018 by I'm a Spheal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatManThree Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 22 hours ago, DisobeyedCargo said: What about the water of speed in the beginning though, can't that easily patch him up? The two speed increases only brings him up to 3 AS. So he is still not gonna double anything unless you grind him level ups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatManThree Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 23 hours ago, Azz said: Cav ain't that bad. My Cav!Kliff was great from the outset and later on down the line became a 2nd Mathilda with actual bulk. Though I will agree, it is still the third best option after Merc and Archer. I was not referring to Cav!Kliff, I was referring to the class as a whole. The Cavalier isn't as good as there aren't very many units who can actually function well in the class due to it not receiving growth modifiers, and their no longer as impressive bases. The only units not counting pitch fork reclassing that can function all that well without special treatment to my knowledge are every unit who joins as a member of the Cav line other than Clive, Faye, and Kliff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L9999 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 (edited) On 25/4/2018 at 10:49 AM, DisobeyedCargo said: What about the water of speed in the beginning though, can't that easily patch him up? Those belong to Silque. http://aminoapps.com/p/zejaor Math on why Kliff with spd boosts blows. Edited April 28, 2018 by L9999 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DisobeyedCargo Posted April 28, 2018 Author Share Posted April 28, 2018 1 minute ago, L9999 said: Those belong to Silque. Why silque? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmine Sword Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 The speed boosts let her double brigands and archers in the next few chapters after her recruitment, making it easier for he to get exp and reach Warp sooner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DisobeyedCargo Posted April 28, 2018 Author Share Posted April 28, 2018 Just now, Carmine Sword said: The speed boosts let her double brigands and archers in the next few chapters after her recruitment, making it easier for he to get exp and reach Warp sooner. I uh, never let silque fight, like ever ive always given them to Kliff so he can build up his speed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harvey Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 (edited) I'll say it once and I'll say it again. Kliff is the most flexible unit out there. Any thing you promote him into and he'll do fine and Mage!Kliff is no exception. Really, you almost can't screw him up and while he may not be able to use Seraphram, he's still passable as a Mage and mages in this game are really good. There's nothing wrong in what class you put him on overall. Edited May 1, 2018 by Harvey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Holy Elf Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 On 4/25/2018 at 6:05 AM, CatManThree said: There's also the fact that mages are often considered shit in SoV due to their awful mov and single late promo, but that's besides the point. Maybe by people who have terrible opinions. Mages having actual weapon flexibility (without needing to trade), targeting res in a game where the gap is higher than normal, and ignoring terrain in the game where terrain is the most impactful in the series, all help make them very useful indeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De Geso Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 Mage Kliff is not bad. He's pound-for-pound the same as FE2 Kliff. The difference is, every other unit in Echoes is mostly better than their FE2 counterpart, meaning that Kliff is no longer far and a way the best at being a mage (because of Tobin's early Excalibur). He's still a good mage though - he's good in any class not called Soldier, really, it's just that now he doesn't outclass all the other mages like he did before (well, he arguably doesn't outclass FE2!Luthier). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L9999 Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 On 2/5/2018 at 7:55 AM, YouSquiddinMe said: Mage Kliff is not bad. He's pound-for-pound the same as FE2 Kliff. The difference is, every other unit in Echoes is mostly better than their FE2 counterpart, meaning that Kliff is no longer far and a way the best at being a mage (because of Tobin's early Excalibur). He's still a good mage though - he's good in any class not called Soldier, really, it's just that now he doesn't outclass all the other mages like he did before (well, he arguably doesn't outclass FE2!Luthier). Mage Kiff sucks ass in Gaiden. The only reason he is made a mage is because Kliff is the most disposable of the villagers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazuya Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 I've always made Kliff a mage, always. He isn't bad for me, ever. I've never Kliff bad as a mage either, his spell list is fine, his stats are fine, he was good in Gaiden for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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