We Need Serenes Forest Mafia Mafia 5 After All! - GAME OVER

[Snike]

On 4/13/2018 at 7:46 PM, Shinori said:

Can you explain on this a bit more.  I disagree with this and the fact that Kirsche said stuff along the same lines.

I'd like to hear peoples reasonings again for voting Bartozio > Athena at the end of the last day phase.  Mainly from Nightmare, Kirsche, Fable, and Fenrir.  Up until Nightmare's vote they were tied(I think?) and I feel that Nightmare's vote was the spark that pushed people towards voting Bartozio.  I wish I could have Hijacked Snike and co's votes back towards Athena but that's more of a hindsight is 20/20 thing.

I also don't think everyone should claim their characters but that's just my personal opinion.  You could probably guess some peoples roles based on just who they are and even though I'm leaning town on Via there is no proof that he isn't Third party of some sort.

##Vote: Nightmare

I missed this; This is obvious in retrospect, but look at bold.

Do you think he would code a message to his scumbuddy for later towncred?

In addition to letting him claim Godfather immediately on sub in?

In addition to letting him be townread super hard by said buddy?

In addition to shading him for fishing on Page 41?

In addition to going along with the idea of a turbo wagon?

[Makaze]

1 minute ago, Snike said:

I missed this; This is obvious in retrospect, but look at bold.

Do you think he would code a message to his scumbuddy for later towncred?

In addition to letting him claim Godfather immediately on sub in?

In addition to letting him be townread super hard by said buddy?

In addition to shading hir'm for fishing on Page 41?

In addition to going along with the idea of a turbo wagon?

FTR I don't read you mafia

im just trying to get you to prove that world wrong by seeing reason and giving you rope to hang yourself with if you're not

so far the tunnel isn't dying and you've had actual reasons for tunneling

you're just wrong about them

now please help me find the mafia outside of mack

if it isn't kirsche, who is

[Mackc2]

46 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

Posting walls that don't even belong to me is hard.

Overall, Snike thinks Mack's responses to our theory read as someone being angry at being called out.

Mack completely flipped on his Town read on Kirsche from yesterday and earlier today, half-based on what we did and only after we came up with the theory, which reeks of OMGUS. Mack also forgot that we switched our vote to Kirsche after Junk's fake claim, as we bought into the fakeclaim somewhat and wanted to see if the role was provable.

The second point does not accurately reflect what was going on Day 1; Mack probably glossed over it.

This sounds rather angry. Mack flip-flopped again on Kirsche, since he defended Kirsche early Day 3, but is now suddenly going back to his N1 read.

Snike thinks this could be a smear on Kaoz to create doubt about Kaoz being confirmed.

This argument is wrong, because

A) is only valid if scum thought Mack was WIFOMing his night action, but there was no indication of that.

B) We already publicly claimed we got the item, so that can't happen. We would still end up getting associated with Shinori if he fake claimed Town Inventor.

Snike thinks Mack isn't even bothering to properly consider our arguments based on the tone of this post; he had already written us off.

Hah tell me about it, I had to do that for paper in P5 

Yes I was angry, I was very angry, I get angry when I think scum is pushing me. 

Addressed this definitely didn't read Kirsche as town, just wasn't sure if my theory was good enough to lynch him on 

I did, I haven't gone back to read D2 either, and I'm probably not going to bother unless something really needs to be checked. 

Read point 1 and 2 

I was looking for another option because you basically admitted you had to be scum to me, I was looking for a way that perhaps you where misguided town who had been puppeteered by someone else, you kinda shot that down. 

Oh cool you shot down the only other option possibly making you town in my eyes, cheers. 

You are partially correct, I have written you off.  

Look I was willing to accept that this was all some misunderstanding, but you are shooting down all the options here and your insistence to keep pushing me isn't doing much to help in that regard. 

[Snike]

World where Mack isn't scum and is tunneling townie; poe becomes Athena/Gaius/Walrein/Arcanite/Makaze IMO

I don't think Makaze is scum at this point in time anymore despite zeus poe. That could be scum defending his slot for easy towncred.

Athena is probably clear on associatives.

So it would be Gaius/Walrein/Arcanite. I

am on Arcanite as of right now.

Like I have said in the past, the hijack onto mack would be shinori trying to get towncred.

 

[Snike]

Makaze this probably isn't much but what do you think about the early shinori comment on walrein then forgetting about it when asked by eclipse?

[Snike]

Also did you factor the weapons announce into his read?

[Snike]

empower*

I'm talking about the redirect

words

[Makaze]

1 minute ago, Snike said:

World where Mack isn't scum and is tunneling townie; poe becomes Athena/Gaius/Walrein/Arcanite/Makaze IMO

I don't think Makaze is scum at this point in time anymore despite zeus poe. That could be scum defending his slot for easy towncred.

Athena is probably clear on associatives.

So it would be Gaius/Walrein/Arcanite. I

am on Arcanite as of right now.

Like I have said in the past, the hijack onto mack would be shinori trying to get towncred.

 

Like I said, I believe this is what happened, and that's all there is. Your entire case is bananas.

How do you read Walrein based on tone? Do you think he is being genuine?

What do you make of Omega.'s slot? One of the things I'd really like to see from you is an in depth analysis of Omega., because I think you are one of the players better suited to objective stuff outside of tone (which is why I think you can still scumread Walrein)

[Makaze]

4 minutes ago, Snike said:

Makaze this probably isn't much but what do you think about the early shinori comment on walrein then forgetting about it when asked by eclipse?

I can't say I remember either this or the announce. I'll check the announce now but can you quote this to me?

[Makaze]

FWIW I can't see any scum claiming to receive an empower when they know where it came from. Or Shinori claiming to be an empowerer for that matter if they were just planning to use it on their scum mates. I don't buy that world.

[Makaze]

Read the announce. No that announce did not factor in I forgot about it immediately. But if Kirsche is mafia it would help a Weapons being on the same team case.

[Makaze]

9 minutes ago, Snike said:

empower*

I'm talking about the redirect

words

I'm confused on like

what you mean by redirect here

[Snike]

Ok, so I was wrong about context. Eclipse was asking eury about walrein when shinori chimed in.

Anyways, click the link to follow below first quote. Bolded is what I believe is addressed to walrein.

On 4/10/2018 at 4:22 PM, Shinori said:

Currently reading the thread: Only up to the end of page 3, 4-6 in a bit.  I'm not feeling great so this isn't gonna be super fast.  Hopefully I can have it up in about an hour or so though.

Moving on, no normally this place isn't that open about roles unless random circumstances cause it to be.  Some roles people are generally fairly open about, such as mayor, but that's about it.

This post seems extremely defensive in my eyes.  Don't really like it tonally.

This is a really graspy reason if it's a serious reason but I guess it is RVS esque?  The fact that you followed it up though by asking Junko why they didn't wait for a bit to post stands out to me that it is somewhat serious.  Followed by you unvoting them and moving to rein it's really weird.  This might just be my gut speaking but I don't like it.

This post is bad.

Please don't forget there is the possibility of an ITP.  And I could see the hydra slot OR the mayor being potentially ITP.   But yeah more than likely one of the two roles is town.  That's also based on probability of chance.

At the moment I would vote BBM but I want to finish reading before I drop a vote.  His random vote on Rein is really weird and his small back and forth with Junko also stands out to me, but less so than his Rein vote.

Below is page 8.

On 4/10/2018 at 10:34 PM, eclipse said:

All those words, and only a slight mention of Walrein.

On 4/10/2018 at 10:41 PM, Shinori said:

I also haven't mentioned Walrein that I can remember off the top of my head: How come you didn't bring this up WRT me but did so for Eury?  Or did you ask her something about Walrein?

Why Walrein in specific?  And why ask Eury specifically? I know he's been very active but I don't quite understand this post right now.

 

 

[Snike]

Basically the empower item was intended for mack to receive all along. For the towncred.

 

On Walrein: I was reading his posts as town, became worried after he flaked; read townie again, then he flaked again for about 48 hours. It's on and off from memory. I'm going to look in depth now but PoE would make him first in line.

[Makaze]

2 minutes ago, Snike said:

Basically the empower item was intended for mack to receive all along. For the towncred.

 

On Walrein: I was reading his posts as town, became worried after he flaked; read townie again, then he flaked again for about 48 hours. It's on and off from memory. I'm going to look in depth now but PoE would make him first in line.

i think in a vacuum he is hard town, and his flaking is annoying, but not alignment indicative. i have no reasons to scumread him. if he were flaking with null content itd be something else

[Snike]

After arcanite/gaius but I kinda believe gaius' claim. You've seen the rolespec in my previous posts.

Also you'd think mafia bookie would have had an extra kill last night.

[Makaze]

1 minute ago, Snike said:

After arcanite/gaius but I kinda believe gaius' claim. You've seen the rolespec in my previous posts.

Also you'd think mafia bookie would have had an extra kill last night.

i think that mafia bookie is a joke. theres no such thing as mafia bookie, esp in a game with itp. that would make potential x3 anti-town kill power. i think the bookie claim itself is false. there is no bookie, town or otherwise

[Snike]

Like, if we're going to be honest, I think Gaius is more likely to be itp than weapons is based off of the extra kill last night. That slot wasn't around n1 for starters.

[Makaze]

Just now, Snike said:

Like, if we're going to be honest, I think Gaius is more likely to be itp than weapons is based off of the extra kill last night. That slot wasn't around n1 for starters.

i can see this world. doesn't really matter as long as both are scum tbh

still would like to hear a real case on Omega's slot from you. pls form a case for your read on them

[Refa]

But Vig (variant) is like the worst ITP claim of all time.

[Makaze]

Just now, Refa said:

But Vig (variant) is like the worst ITP claim of all time.

at what point does this make it a good claim

[Snike]

Do you want walrein or omega first?

[Makaze]

Just now, Snike said:

Do you want walrein or omega first?

omega, you gave a decent enough walrein read

[Makaze]

i don't think a real walrein case is necessary to convince me of your position there, so walrein case at your own discretion

im more interested in stirring the pot wrt consensus town i have doubts on

[Refa]

1 minute ago, Makaze said:

at what point does this make it a good claim

it's bad because you 1) put a target on your back 2) let town direct your kill 3) are the most suspected if there are no nights where there are three kills 4) are screwed if mafia decides to rolecop you ever 5) you probably have a better fakeclaim 6,7,8,9,10) there probably more like five more reasons but tl,dr; claiming vig as sk is literally a meme on sf at this point.