Intelligent Systems' PR and Fans' Faith/Trust in Heroes and Company

[XRay]

I hope I am not stepping on a landmine.

Anyways, Blizzcon ended a few days ago, and Activision-Blizzard made a huge PR fuck up with Diablo Immortal at the end of the event. You know the saying about "saving the best for last?" Well, upper management thought that announcing a mobile game to a PC audience/market was a good idea during the most hyped-up anticipated time spot, which is at the end of the event. The backlash was swift and immediate during the Q/A session following the announcement. The reaction was excessively and overwhelmingly negative; the trailer with 4,100,000 views got 22,000 likes and 591,000 dislikes , so in my opinion, this is not just some vocal minority. There is also a general journalist backlash against the gamers' overreacting backlash.

And that leads me back to Fire Emblem Heroes. For this game, much of the vocal backlash is primarily aimed at alts. While I personally am indifferent to alts (I would still play the game if the next 10 Foci got nothing but Camilla alts), I do care about the game and Intelligent Systems doing well financially, as well as the size and health of the fandom. In my opinion, our backlash is much less prominent than the backlash against Diablo Immortal, but seeing the parallels between the backlashes makes me a little worried. Even with the backlash against alts, I am not worried about the immediate financial impact nor our fandom shrinking/dying, but I am worried about Intelligent System's and the fandom's reputation and Fire Emblem brand in general.

As for my thoughts on the companies, I believe Activision-Blizzard definitely deserve the stock drop and negative feedback for failing to read its audience and market. On the other hand, I do think the fans are overreacting a bit since Blizzard will obviously continue to make PC Diablo games. While I am not sure if some of the toxic feedback is appropriate, I think the dislike numbers is definitely justified. Similarly, I think Intelligent Systems definitely needs some work in their PR department and communicate with fans better. From my perspective, I do think the disappointment and negativity surrounding alts is justified, but it does need to be better expressed and it seems to me that female characters are more likely to receive a lot more negative feedback than male characters.

So how do you think our community can handle expressing backlashes better? I personally do not agree with staying silent about your opinions, so I think we should definitely voice our pleasure or displeasure about the game freely. However, I think it is generally a good idea to keep the disappointment concise, since the longer we rant, the more likely we might ruffle the other side's feathers. Other than keeping our opinions concise though, I am not sure how we can express ourselves better.

For the poll, I think Intelligent Systems'/Nintendo's handling of PR is somewhat good, but it needs a lot of improvement. Treehouse is god awful in my opinion, but the rest of Nintendo seems good. In terms of Heroes though, I do not think they are handling PR well and I think they are somewhat bad at it for this game in particular. I feel very good about Intelligent Systems and Nintendo as companies, and they would be almost perfect in my opinion if Treehouse did not exist. As for the state of Fire Emblem Heroes, I think it is fair; the game is not bad, but it definitely could use some improvements. I am not sure if reading other people's responses would change how I think about Heroes and Intelligent Systems, so I will just say no for now, but I will edit it if I do change my mind later.

Oh, I almost forgot to ask, how do you think Heroes can improve its public relations? At this point, I think it is best to just be transparent with future Foci and release information about them instead of keeping it in the dark. If that is not a good idea, I think a good compromise might be to keep 1 or 2 characters in each future Foci hidden as surprises, but the rest of the characters should be public knowledge.

Edited November 10, 2018 by XRay

[Tryhard]

Diablo II is my favourite game of all-time. It's hard to state the context about how badly one of Blizzard's flagship franchises was received.

we haven't had any news about a new mainline Diablo game in four years, which is when the expansion to Diablo 3 came out, and Diablo 3 itself came out six years ago, which was already a controversial game. Instead, Warcraft 3 remaster got announced (which is fine and cool, because it's another one of my favourite games)

This wouldn't be so bad, if they announced at the same time that they were also working on a mainline game. Even a logo or some shit to show us it was in the works would be fine, like when Bethesda announced Elder Scrolls Blades, their mobile ES game, and then showed a video of clouds for 20 seconds and then Elder Scrolls VI - we'll make it eventually perhaps maybe. Blizzard are known for being a "PC-first" company so the shift here is strange.

And now it was revealed that it is being developed in part with NetEase, who are a Chinese developer who have a reputation for being bad (and sucking money out of players via microtransactions in their previous games). Obviously, they are trying to market to the Chinese mobile market because it is profitable. But from the gameplay footage they showed, it looks very similar to a previous NetEase published game to the point where it looks like a cash grab re-skin. They also had a PR blunder when asked if the game would ever be coming to PC, the response was just a questioning of "you guys have phones, right?" which isn't the point to say the least. Many of these people that attended this conference paid money to travel and it isn't a free public conference - they need to pay for attendance. After the aforementioned question, there was audible booing from the audience when they said there was no plans to bring it to PC. These are diehard Blizzard fans, and to my knowledge this is the first time there has ever been booing at their own conference.

Blizzard have a history of cancelling games when it isn't up to their high standards, like Starcraft: Ghost, and a Warcraft: Lord of the Clans (90's point and click adventure game). This is comparitively low effort to carry their name. Activision have fused with Blizzard so it really isn't surprising they would go down the anti-consumer route in recent times.

Diablo 1 and 2 are known for being the games to popularise and propel the genre "hack n' slash". Games that followed this formula were called Diablo clones for years. It should be a high-singing franchise, but recently it seems like its the red-headed stepchild that gets no attention.

People were understandably mad we got nothing else, not that necessarily there is a mobile game, and that red-shirt guy up there questioned them at the official Q&A. Look on the gameplay videos of Diablo: Immortal and see the dislike ratios. So there was some games journalist media types that were writing articles about how Diablo fans are elitist, entitled, and that Blizzard owes us nothing.

For what it's worth, the stock drop could be unrelated to the Diablo Immortal announcement. It is worth noting that some people seem to believe that Blizzard may have been deleting dislikes and/or comments on the extremely poor received videos shortly after they were uploaded, probably with Youtube's collaboration.

 

So yeah, with all of that out of the way, I don't really play or pay attention to Heroes, but considering that Intelligent Systems at least teased FE Three Houses at the same time as they announced Heroes, it's infinitely better than what Blizzard did.

Edited November 10, 2018 by Tryhard

[VincentASM]

I think it's an interesting discussion, but as pointed out, the two situations are vastly, vastly different. Although the topic is the same.

For IS to screw up as badly as Blizzard, they would've had to announce Fire Emblem Heroes without a new mainline Fire Emblem and there had to have been a major gap since the most recent FE. Seeing as Fates came out not too long ago, the situation with Heroes wasn't nearly as grave.

From our perspective, the flood of alts in Heroes seems like a slap in the face, but in the grand scheme of things, it's a drop in the pond compared to Blizzard's situation. Besides, the huge difference in the like/dislike ratios kinda suggests that ^^

Regardless, I personally would like IS to have more transparency when it comes to reveals. They sort of do it sometimes, like when they announced the Thracia, Radiant Dawn and Binding Blade banners way in advance. Or when they admitted that Grand Conquests still needs fine-tuning.

Other than that, I'm fairly content with the way they've been handling things. I do think they need more FEH Channels though. Maybe they could do mini ones to fill in the gaps. But I suppose those cost money (to direct/produce and to pay the English and Japanese voice actress).

[dethneer]

IS is pretty good in responding to feedback from fans IMO, especially recently. Fans want more multiplayer and base building? They introduce Aether Raids. Fans hate BST and bonus unit kills in arena? New mode doesn't have it. Fans want to be able to +10 GHB heroes? Now you can get holy grails to summon 20 of them. And for that one dude in the entire world whose favorite character is Bartre and has been pissed off since launch because he sucks so much, Bartre is now getting a legendary weapon refine. Combat manuals, etc, all improve quality of life in the game. You can tell IS is trying to make their game better with each iteration. I think it's worth cutting them some slack when sometimes they go into full business mode and release a banner full of nothing but sexy alts to raise money.

And regarding Blizzard's Diablo shenanigans, people might be overreacting, we can't tell until the game is released. Lots of people hated Diablo 3 when it first came out too because it was so different from D2, but it kept getting better and Reaper of Souls fixed most of the issues in the base game. Personally I would prefer a mobile Diablo game for completely selfish reasons, have no time to play full blown PC games like I used to. Diablo gacha here we go lol

[Fabulously Olivier]

The Diablo Immortal backlash occurred because Diablo fans have been waiting 4 years (since Reaper of Souls) for anything substantial to happen to the Diablo franchise, with a vocal crowd disappointed in Diablo 3 (meaning that they've waited even longer). This 4+ year wait was met with a mobile game as the only announcement. In other words, I sympathize with the fans on this one. They were shafted, and as a Diablo fan myself, I am personally boycotting all Blizzard games going forward until something substantial does happen with the Diablo franchise proper. 

 

By contrast, when Fire Emblem Heroes was announced, we received simultaneous announcements of a Gaiden remake and a Switch title. That direct was an exciting time to be a Fire Emblem fan, and thus a mobile announcement that could have been controversial became a small (and eventually pleasantly received) footnote in a larger hype train. 

 

Blizzard should take note. 

[TheWill]

With how Intelligent Systems has absolutely neutered the Paper Mario series, pushed Fire Emblem into a direction more aligned with "dating sims" to appeal to the otaku fanbase and essentially abandoned the Advance Wars series... I have a very poor impression of them right now. It doesn't help that Three Houses has had virtually no news since the initial trailer and Heroes has been in a controversial state ignoring the existence of almost half the franchise and regurgitating the same characters over and over. I do have positive thoughts towards the company as well, but corporate and monetary decisions, as well as essentially ignoring fans in the case of the Paper Mario franchise, has made me especially jaded towards them.

It's worse, because Paper Mario and Fire Emblem were beloved franchises to me. I'm definitely hoping Three Houses invigorates the spark the franchise used to give me (although I'm skeptical to the similarities to the Persona series), whilst the Paper Mario series, I... really don't have any hope at this rate. If the Switch entry is no good, I'll give up on it. 

[Sire]

I heard about the Diablo Immortal incident. As a Path of Exile player, it was somewhat blowing up on the PoE Reddit as "Diablo Refugees"  found themselves playing PoE instead and loving it.

I know my dad loved playing Diablo II while I was not too big into it during its heyday. Ever since Blizzard merged with Activision, Blizzard definitely seems to have been making choices bother me. I remember when they replaced the VA for Kerrigan for Starcraft, and some other VA mixups. I remember the launch for Diablo III to be terrible, and how Diablo III can be found lacking when compared to its competitors. Stories for Blizzard products are going downhill.

I don't keep up with everything Blizzard does, but it seems the the newer stuff (Overwatch, Hearthstone, and Heroes of the Storm) are an overall happier crowd than the original mainline (Diablo, Starcraft, Warcraft). I want to be excited for Warcraft III Reforged, but with what Blizzard is doing it makes me question if I want to send money their way. Maybe Blizzard got too big and the stuff that one part of it does reflects on the people who actually do cool things.
- - - - - - - - - -
As for Nintendo, a recent incident I can recall is the Metroid spinoff Federation Force, and how many fans were angry about that. I don't remember the specifics, just the fact that people were upset about Federation Force because they wanted a new mainline Metroid title. Then there was also the Paper Mario stuff with Sticker Star and Color Splash. I'm still waiting for a proper Paper Mario game reminiscent of the original 64 game or Thousand Year Door. Super Paper Mario was enjoyable for what it was (the story and charm held it up and the gameplay, while different, did not bother me as much), but I rather see a traditional Paper Mario game again.

Now for Heroes, for the most part I'll say they are all right when addressing the community. They stated when the next Binding Blade and Radiant Dawn banners will appear, they brought us Aether Raids and a way to get limited units, and apparently learned from the Ayra incident. I think the main points of contention are the alts and some of the "filler modes" (Blessed Gardens, Tap Battle, Voting Gauntlet, etc.), while some may raise concerns about BST and the new skills. I personally stepped back from Heroes and stopped being too invested in it, so I just take developments as they come along. My main wish for Heroes is an actual developed story, and having more character interactions (like support or base conversations) would be awesome.

For suggestions on how to follow PR, I would say follow Path of Exile's model (Grinding Gear Games). They are active with their community, post up development manifestos that explain why they do certain things, and even directly address concerns that the community has. Community concerns are remedied in a patch or GGG doubles down and explains to the community why a feature works the way it does.

[DarthR0xas]

The problem here is that I have differing opinions on IS and Nintendo. I view them mostly in the same light, generally good with a few notable fuck-ups, but Nintendo has something for me that IS doesn't, nostalgia. I've been playing Nintendo anything since I can remember, meanwhile I got into any IS made game about 3 years ago, which was Advance Wars, and then I proceeded to get into Fire Emblem the year or so after. So I have a natural Nintendo bias to kinda shove aside some of their faults, while being able to look at IS's head on.

Both generally handle public relations well, Nintendo has the problem of too many franchises and they literally can't appease everyone unless they have an hour long Direct in which a new game for all of their franchises and that somehow appeals to literally every fan of said franchises occurs, which is silly and won't happen. That said, I feel Nintendo talks to the fans more, which admittedly makes since, but even if IS had like a blog or something, where they posted minute details about Three Houses, maybe put a few music tracks up. The Smash Ultimate website basically, then their PR would be much better. Sure, you lose a bit of the mystic of the game, but fans prefer a small, yet steady stream of information as opposed to a large bundle of info, once the cat is out of the bag, of course. This isn't to say Nintendo hasn't messed up, like their handling of Online, but I'd say both are pretty good here. Solid B+/A-. 

Nintendo basically has no involvement in Heroes outside of the Direct. IS is technically doing the smart business thing, appealing to the larger fanbase of their audience with more Fates/Awakening stuff, but that pisses off the much more vocal older fans. They tend to be forced into doing damage control more often than not, or preemptive damage control like we saw with the "Hey, we're going to release Binding Blade and Radiant Dawn banners, don't worry" before a Fates Banner of almost all alts. Although, I was very happy about the prologue we got with that banner, so maybe we lit a bit of a fire under their asses to actually give a damn about the stories they're writing. We'll have to see if that's a trend, or a one time deal. Sorry, that was a bit of a tangent, anyways, IS is doing a decent job at PR, could be doing slightly better, around a B I'd say.

There has only been one purchase of a Nintendo game I regret, that being Arms. Even then, it's my go to two-player game on the Switch, or if I want to show someone what the Switch is about I'll pop in Arms. Despite their flaws, I'd be hard-pressed to think of a Nintendo game I truly hate, same for IS. I've always been impressed with the calibre of their games, and it is always a joy to play them. If IS can get me to unironically enjoy an NES (well technically Famicom) game that isn't Classic Mario Bros, they've done something right. My favorite games list is filled to the brim with IS games, and while they can make mistakes (see Paper Mario Sticker Star), they aren't plentiful and don't overshadow the amount of fun I've had with every other game of theirs. A+ from me.

Heroes is pretty good, it has problems (maybe I just have terrible luck but I haven't gotten a Five Star, or another version of a unit I'm trying to merge in months), but that one just stems from Gatcha elements. Heroes is Fire Emblem in your pocket, and I think it's on the way to greatness. It seems to be improving at a steady rate, so I'm going to say A-.

[EricaofRenais]

Well since I don't play PC games I don't have a comment about the whole Diablo thing.

As to Nintendo I feel they are pretty good and I love a lot of their games, but they tend to withhold info a little too much and I wish they would give more timely updates.  I know that they are better then some companies, but I want them to improve more then what they are now.

As to IS, I feel a little mixed.  While I love every FE game I have played, they really need to get better at having a good story in the next one and keep in mind the things that players love about the older games. They should do better with their other IPs and I feel bad for Advance War fans since it seems like they let that IP die.

As to Heroes, I feel like they have too many people deciding things.  While I am glad they listen to feedback and I am very happy with the way they have handled backlash, they really should be able to see some of the issues before they happen.  I really think the person in charge of banners needs to be changed since it seems like they can't tell what would be a bad choice.  I can tell that them saying RD and BB banners are coming next year was trying to ease some of the backlash from this latest banner, but if the person in charge was smarter they would not of had that problem in the first place since they would have never done a 3 alt regular banner in the first place.

Edited November 11, 2018 by EricaofRenais

[Shiki]

21 hours ago, XRay said:

I hope I am not stepping on a landmine.

Guess, I will have to prepare a sermon for your funeral.

Just talking about IS alone because I have a far more positive view of Nintendo. IS on the other hand .... uff.

1. Their handling of new Fire Emblem titles has been very questionable in more than one way. I was very vocal about my misgivings of Heroes recently so I won't repeat myself but some of the aspects like poor story and greedy design are a problem in their other titles.
No one can tell me that Fates has any semblance of a good story. Conquest and Relevation were one of the worst stories I have ever seen in a RPG and Birthright, while trying to be relatively classic, still can't work without Relevation's meddling. That is not the way to tell a story.
Corrin is the worst Lord by a mile and it's made even worse that this is supposed to represent you. Something has gone really wrong if you feel shameful about your own Avatar.
There is also the thing that their money-grabbing tendencies have been apparent even before Heroes. Again, Fates sets a bad example by having 3 separate titles which you have to pay for. Without doing that you miss out on the full experience. Technically you do get 3 games out of your money but it's still bad practice to make a different product necessary for the one you already paid for. It's especially infuriating for the ones that appreciate only a single side of the conflict.
DLC is another failure on their part. The west didn't get all the Fates DLC and Echoes Season pass was overpriced. Being optional content doesn't mean you can give it a price tag surpassing the original product.

2. They don't respect their franchises. Paper Mario is a disfigured corpse of its former self and I'm someone who was fine with Super Paper Mario. The recent two entries are so bad, that you can only hope they lay it down to rest forever not to drag the series' good name further into the mud. That's really sad for one of Mario's best spin-offs in the past.
And of course Advance Wars apparently never existed. It's really mind-boggling because the games were very well received so it doesn't make sense to leave them to die. The latest entry, Days of Ruins was different in tone but it was an excellent game regardless and praised by the majority of fans.

So yeah, what can I say? IS' way of handling things really make me doubt that they have a good direction at all. Considering their success with Awakening I'm certain that they will continue these questionable practices seen in Fates and Heroes.

Edited November 11, 2018 by The Priest

[Roflolxp54]

I can't really say anything about Blizzard/Activision since I don't follow what the company does.

As for IS, they've shown that they are indeed receptive to feedback from the playerbase. However, they are often slow to act on that feedback - the main times during which they act remotely quickly were if there are any gamebreaking bugs or exploits. Not helping this view is that IS plans things out several months in advance, so they can't exactly make quick changes on the fly. Also, it's a JP company; JP companies are typically known to be risk-averse.

Many of the gamemodes are often way too similar to one another and FEH has become a huge grindfest - and a boring one at that due to the amount of time-gated resources such as feathers, coins, refining materials, and now grails and Aether materials. Many players, especially those who are still waiting for their waifu/husbando to be added to the game, often don't have anything better to do in FEH besides grinding so better rate of material acquisition could make playing FEH more enjoyable - it sucks that a lot of progress is easily halted by not having the feathers for those 5* merges on TOP of not having the premium skill fodder.

And of course, some of the decisions they have made during its run are pretty questionable. Arena is pretty much locked from any further major changes with the introduction of the Duel skills - IS is pretty much committed to the current scoring formula. I wasn't very excited about the Aether Raids update mainly because it felt like it was basically Arena 3.0 with less BS on top of its introducing even more time-gated currencies.

[SoulWeaver]

I've personally liked IS' PR, bar FEW, we're still trying to figure out how that PR crash even happened. I'm not terribly invested in them, so the lack of Three Houses info hasn't been an issue for me, and my only complaint about the PR involved for the 3DS games was that they should have warned us they weren't going to share the Fates' Bond Festivals with the rest of the world.

As for Heroes, I'm not sure what I think. I'm glad they let us know when to expect new Binding Blade Units, but the fact that they apparently hadn't planned to add any of them for like a year after Klein troubles me. I also personally saw Heroes as a chance to give more of a face and voice to characters who didn't really have one, so the lack of less popular characters has been a little sad for me, though for the most part I'm happy about the odder additions that have made it in.

I'm not really certain on the third question. Personally, I like what I've seen of both companies, but admittedly, I haven't seen everything.

I think Heroes is doing alright. I'm a little bugged by some of the stuff, but for the most part I'm also willing to say it doesn't matter, it's just a mobile game. The one thing I do have beef with is Legendary Heroes - I heard Legendary Heroes were going to be a thing, I expected actual Legendary Heroes, beginning with Anri and working through Fire Emblem's history, with Marth being the only normal Unit who might get Legendary Hero treatment due to his status by the time of Awakening. Instead, I got...uh...

[Silverly]

As someone who has absolutely zero experience with the Diablo series, I have no comment.

Now Nintendo is a company that I have a strong connection to, as someone who has always owned a system of theirs of some sort since I was in kindergarten. They make a lot of quality games and put forth a lot of effort into their franchises. Pokémon and Mario are some of my personal favorites for nearly two decades, as with Fire Emblem though I had grown attached to it for over three or so years. In terms of their PR, I think it was... rather subpar in earlier years, bordering pathetic at times. Nintendo is really trying to step that up recently, though there are still practices and instances that tend to shake the hive (overall inept handling of internet services, being strike happy on Youtube as well creating unappealing programs with pitiful returns, being overall unfriendly to fan-made games). 

Intelligent Systems, on the other hand, I’m more null on as I’m not very familiar with their other IPs. After all, it’s pretty much a second party company to Nintendo. The only Paper Mario game I completed from beginning to end was Super Paper Mario which many cite as the start of the series decline (though I personally really enjoyed the game). Meanwhile, I never played an Advance Wars game in my life. 

Now for Heroes. Unlike many fellow players, I’m mostly content with the state of the game, even before the release of Aether Raids. There are some things I would like to be changed or added, but I still do enjoy the game and wish to support it regardless. Their PR could be way better though. Until around the last quarter of the previous year, we were often left in the dark concerning events and banners. As of writing, we still don’t even have an event map for November yet. They tried to cool the flames by announcing banners for RD and BB (my own favorite) in advance, though the reception was widely mixed. I think it wouldn’t hurt to give a clear layout of what to expect so there’s less grumbling. Still, I’m still willing to give the game my trust, and I eagerly await 3.0 for more good stuff.

[Johann]

Other than FE, I don't think I've played many IS games, but I recall hearing that a lot of people felt disappointed with the last few Paper Marios. Three Houses is really a major point for IS to showcase their ability, given how the series has never been as big, and the Switch could really propel it much further.

Heroes is in a great place, despite, at the risk of sounding rude, the vocal players who, as I see them, aren't patient and can't handle that they won't get everything they want.

[Icelerate]

I think they're quite good at it. Announcing and releasing Aether Runs right after the new Fates banner was a genius move because whatever bad feelings people had would quickly be replaced by the joy of getting more TT and GHB units along with the fun new mode. To top it off, they gave us a light at the end of the tunnel by announcing FE10 and FE6 banner. 

 

[Vince777]

They are seemingly in this weird position that seasonal banners are more profitable but will also garner more negative feedback so they are to do what makes the most sense financially while still occasionally throw a bone to those that dislike this aspect of the game. 

I personally really dislike seasonals. I'd take them all out minus perhaps the Legendary heroes which I feel can be relevant to reintroduce important characters that were power-crept. I do understand that seasonals are not going away and I can still live with that. I just wish alts weren't included in banners advertised to contain new heroes. That's what I'd like the balance to be.



 

 

Edited November 11, 2018 by Vince777

[Lau]

Nintendo and IS are far from perfect, but they're certainly not the worst.

Nintendo has definitely improved their PR in recent years as someone else has said - I think my only gripe with them is that they just cannot get online right, but hopefully, they'll refine it throughout the Switch's lifetime.

IS on the other hand...I couldn't care less about Paper Mario and Advance Wars. I've never played them, and they've never interested me. I have heard that the last couple of Paper Mario entries were poor, and that TTYD is like, the holy grail of the franchise, but I've also heard that the opinion on Colour Splash is slowly becoming "eh, it's good for what it is".

As for FE, hoo boy. I've never had a problem with them. I came in with Awakening, loved it. Fates looked amazing before its release, but when I actually played it, it was disappointing, but it still had some hidden gems. I played a few of the older games, enjoyed them except for Sacred Stones and NMotE, but that has nothing to do with IS' PR. In terms of how IS has handled their main series, I'd say that they've done nothing different than from any other game developer.

As for FEH, they give out compensation orbs when really, they don't have to. You could argue and say that mistakes shouldn't have been made in the first place, but it's only a mobile game, it's not perfect. They have a few FEH channels scattered throughout the year, that's quite good for a mobile game. I don't see Pokemon GO or Pocket Camp getting anything like that, unless I'm somehow missing them. They're definitely learning from their mistakes, so yeah, I don't have a problem with them.

[Hilda]

24 minutes ago, Johann said:

Other than FE, I don't think I've played many IS games, but I recall hearing that a lot of people felt disappointed with the last few Paper Marios. Three Houses is really a major point for IS to showcase their ability, given how the series has never been as big, and the Switch could really propel it much further.

Heroes is in a great place, despite, at the risk of sounding rude, the vocal players who, as I see them, aren't patient and can't handle that they won't get everything they want.

I contradict to the 2. statement. Heroes is not in a great place imho.  Aether Raids is fun and a push in the right direction, but they failed to adress Arena and AA. Duell skills are in my opinion not the way to fix Arena, but that ship has sailed. I think Arena would be in a much better place if BST wouldnt be factored in (everything else like merges etc. can stay). I even think the babysitting bonus unit is fine for Regular Arena, because it adds a layer of strategy on Teamsynergy and builds instead of going for just the ORKO setups that can be used for AA.

Some modes are just borderline not fun and too many maps get reused:
- VG is just a mess and a glorified Sacred coins farming spot.
- Conquest is kinda meh
- Tap battle was fine at the beginning but is now getting also meh, though i dont mind it. (I rather have a soundtrack playback option)
- Blessed gardens... oh wow reused maps AGAIN for the gazillioned time, now with the restriction of blessings... seriously!?
- Quests: I wish for more restrictiv Quests on GHB reruns, something that pushes people to involve/invest into the Askrtrio more. They are the main lords of this game.

Modes that are well executed:
- GHB (the addition of Abyssal mode was excellent)
- LHB are very nice expecially with the addition of Abyssal mode
- BHB are nice but could be a bit harder, Amelia and Tana was perfect
- Aether Raids leaves a positiv impression on me
- Tempest Trial I am ok with, the rewards are great although its just a glorfied grind, but the grind is ok and you get alot out of it in terms of SP/HM/and rewards so I dont mind the reuse of maps

Sadly we get alot of reruns/new stuff of the upper half (VG etc) then from the lower half
- Bonding, the grind could be a bit less, but so far I am fine with it. The story telling hopefully gets a bit better, but its ok for now.

What i miss:
- a true coop mode (giant boss battles you can tackle with up to 3 friends)
- a mode that lets you create your own BHB/GHB banners with inflated stats (you can adjust to your will) to share for other people (Aether raids is kinda going in that direction)
- maybe unique GHB once in a while with the map size of conquest map and the ability to field up to 8 units, but those maps better be challenging.
- Skill shop of some sort. Seriously the main selling point of this game for me is building interesting units, with the amounts of units we have it has kinda become very hard to get by specific skills, considering how bloated the 3-5 star pools are.
-Rebalance of classes: this one is kinda tricky, some classes are very good for PVE content but are horrible for anything else and vice versa (see daggers/bow users in PVE vs Arena and Armor users in PVE vs Arena)
- Bring back unique skills. Seriously the most interesting units for me are units like Arvis, Sigurd, Arden, Legendary Ephraim  that have a specific exclusiv Skill slot/weapon. I dont mean broken things like Ayras Regnal Astra/Black Luna. But those skills really make those units interesting. Those things have shifted towards Legendary units only sadly...

[Mercakete]

I'm of the opinion that whether something is being done wrong or right is the prerogative of the creators of a product, not the consumers. That we get to play this at all is because it's being shared with us. We have no right to be telling them how to run their business, and too often the producers of products are de-humanized just because the product isn't to an individual consumer's ideal. Rather than acting entitled, consumers should be grateful to be included, and thankful for what they get.

That said, it doesn't mean that I don't have my own wishlist, or changes I would make if I were calling the shots. But I believe that just about everyone does, if we're making that general of a statement, since everyone's unique and everyone has an opinion. Also, I would categorize what moral choices people make separately from what business choices people make. Not that you can't have one influence the other, but in areas like "do we release a seasonal banner or a new heroes banner?" I think that only the ones actually making the product have the right to decide that, as it's subjective, and so "should" doesn't really come into play.

Part of this is that I hate double standards, and it seems like people think that if you're an artist (whether in visual arts, literary arts, music, or what have you) that you should express what you think, and put it out there for other people to appreciate. However, if you're part of a big company (that is, if you've successfully turned your dream into a money-making career) then suddenly, you're not supposed to put your product out there; you need to create what everyone else tells you to or there will be public outcry. It's not right to do that to people, which is why it bothers me so much when people complain so much about the latest gift (I.e., banner, update, etc.) they put out there for the players. I hardly ever see any appreciation, and no one ever thinks to say "thank you." I just can't stand it, which is why I've begun speaking out more about this issue.

I hope you take the time to read the above and the next time you're about to talk down something, reconsider the fact that human beings with feelings are the ones providing you with the games you enjoy.

[Etrurian emperor]

I think its pretty good so far. They are pretty generous with apology orbs after mistakes and are generally quick to share new events and such. I also don't recall them saying incredibly stupid things when making a mistake. 

 

[Hilda]

9 hours ago, Mercakete said:

I hope you take the time to read the above and the next time you're about to talk down something, reconsider the fact that human beings with feelings are the ones providing you with the games you enjoy.

Not sure who this is directed towards, but there is a difference between talking something down and sharing/voicing your opinion on a product because it has some flaws in your eyes.

Besides anything that has a price tag on it isnt anymore Art its a product that needs to meet demand and supply.

[SoulWeaver]

1 hour ago, Hilda said:

Besides anything that has a price tag on it isnt anymore Art its a product that needs to meet demand and supply.

I don't know that I agree with that 100% - there are artists out on the internet who create two variations of their work and post one version to everyone but lock the other behind a paywall such as a Patreon Tier. Are we saying the same piece of art is simultaneously Art and Product simply because one version has a price tag? Artists do have to make a living, yes, but at the same time they can have the desire to just share things with others without need for monetary compensation. Does this somehow make their free stuff better than their stuff they charge for, since one is Art and the other mere Product? What about when they offer free teaser images composed of a cropped variation of their normal work? Does the cropped part of the normal work cease to become Product since it was showcased for free, or does the part cropped out cease to become Art because it was hidden behind a paywall? Though I do see where you're coming from, it's hardly a black-and-white question.

[XRay]

On 11/10/2018 at 3:02 PM, Tryhard said:

And now it was revealed that it is being developed in part with NetEase, who are a Chinese developer who have a reputation for being bad (and sucking money out of players via microtransactions in their previous games). Obviously, they are trying to market to the Chinese mobile market because it is profitable. But from the gameplay footage they showed, it looks very similar to a previous NetEase published game to the point where it looks like a cash grab re-skin. They also had a PR blunder when asked if the game would ever be coming to PC, the response was just a questioning of "you guys have phones, right?" which isn't the point to say the least. Many of these people that attended this conference paid money to travel and it isn't a free public conference - they need to pay for attendance. After the aforementioned question, there was audible booing from the audience when they said there was no plans to bring it to PC. These are diehard Blizzard fans, and to my knowledge this is the first time there has ever been booing at their own conference.

Blizzard have a history of cancelling games when it isn't up to their high standards, like Starcraft: Ghost, and a Warcraft: Lord of the Clans (90's point and click adventure game). This is comparitively low effort to carry their name. Activision have fused with Blizzard so it really isn't surprising they would go down the anti-consumer route in recent times.

Diablo 1 and 2 are known for being the games to popularise and propel the genre "hack n' slash". Games that followed this formula were called Diablo clones for years. It should be a high-singing franchise, but recently it seems like its the red-headed stepchild that gets no attention.

Yeah, it is sad to see that the studio or media franchise you love change for the worst.

I was a huge fan of Runescape when I was a kid, but some of the changes that Jagex (the developers) did were very unpopular (such as trade limitations) and I sort of lost my enthusiasm for the game little by little over time. They did remove trading limitations and fixed some stuff years later, and my interest did increase a little bit, but after the company got sold to a Chinese company, I just gave up and stopped returning to the game completely since the Jagex I knew is no longer the Jagex that existed.

On 11/10/2018 at 3:15 PM, VincentASM said:

Regardless, I personally would like IS to have more transparency when it comes to reveals. They sort of do it sometimes, like when they announced the Thracia, Radiant Dawn and Binding Blade banners way in advance. Or when they admitted that Grand Conquests still needs fine-tuning.

I wish they are more transparent too. I am not sure if it is a cultural thing, but I heard that Japanese companies are generally more reserved and are not as open with their customers like western companies are.

On 11/10/2018 at 3:16 PM, dethneer said:

IS is pretty good in responding to feedback from fans IMO, especially recently. Fans want more multiplayer and base building? They introduce Aether Raids. Fans hate BST and bonus unit kills in arena? New mode doesn't have it. Fans want to be able to +10 GHB heroes? Now you can get holy grails to summon 20 of them. And for that one dude in the entire world whose favorite character is Bartre and has been pissed off since launch because he sucks so much, Bartre is now getting a legendary weapon refine. Combat manuals, etc, all improve quality of life in the game. You can tell IS is trying to make their game better with each iteration. I think it's worth cutting them some slack when sometimes they go into full business mode and release a banner full of nothing but sexy alts to raise money.

That is true. Sometimes, we get too focused on the bad things. I am not sure if I will change my votes, but this certainly changed my mind a little. I just wish they figure out a way to respond in a more timely manner.

On 11/10/2018 at 4:14 PM, TheWill said:

With how Intelligent Systems has absolutely neutered the Paper Mario series, pushed Fire Emblem into a direction more aligned with "dating sims" to appeal to the otaku fanbase and essentially abandoned the Advance Wars series... I have a very poor impression of them right now.

I have not played Paper Mario, so I cannot really comment on that. I am fine with the dating sim aspect, but if it is any consolation, Shadows of Valentia got none of that so I do not think they will implement that in every future game. I was very disappointed with them abandoning Advance Wars too, and I do not think they will go back to that IP anytime soon since they already have Fire Emblem filling in for that genre.

On 11/10/2018 at 4:14 PM, TheWill said:

It doesn't help that Three Houses has had virtually no news since the initial trailer

I am not sure if that is normal, but I am pretty sure we will get more news as the release date gets closer.

On 11/10/2018 at 4:43 PM, Sire said:

For suggestions on how to follow PR, I would say follow Path of Exile's model (Grinding Gear Games). They are active with their community, post up development manifestos that explain why they do certain things, and even directly address concerns that the community has. Community concerns are remedied in a patch or GGG doubles down and explains to the community why a feature works the way it does.

22 hours ago, Roflolxp54 said:

However, they are often slow to act on that feedback - the main times during which they act remotely quickly were if there are any gamebreaking bugs or exploits. Not helping this view is that IS plans things out several months in advance, so they can't exactly make quick changes on the fly.

20 hours ago, SilvertheShadow said:

Their PR could be way better though. Until around the last quarter of the previous year, we were often left in the dark concerning events and banners. As of writing, we still don’t even have an event map for November yet. They tried to cool the flames by announcing banners for RD and BB (my own favorite) in advance, though the reception was widely mixed. I think it wouldn’t hurt to give a clear layout of what to expect so there’s less grumbling. Still, I’m still willing to give the game my trust, and I eagerly await 3.0 for more good stuff.

Yeah, I think more communication would definitely help. They do have a Twitter account, but it does not seem to be used very to communicate actual meaningful game play updates.

23 hours ago, DarthR0xas said:

The problem here is that I have differing opinions on IS and Nintendo.

23 hours ago, The Priest said:

Just talking about IS alone because I have a far more positive view of Nintendo. IS on the other hand .... uff.

Yeah, now that I think about it, I should probably separate the two or maybe just focus on Intelligent Systems and not lump Nintendo with them.

23 hours ago, EricaofRenais said:

As to Heroes, I feel like they have too many people deciding things.  While I am glad they listen to feedback and I am very happy with the way they have handled backlash, they really should be able to see some of the issues before they happen.  I really think the person in charge of banners needs to be changed since it seems like they can't tell what would be a bad choice.  I can tell that them saying RD and BB banners are coming next year was trying to ease some of the backlash from this latest banner, but if the person in charge was smarter they would not of had that problem in the first place since they would have never done a 3 alt regular banner in the first place.

I agree. I think some of their management definitely needs to be changed if not fired. The stuff they do to make players go "WTF!?" seems to increase a bit lately, with Relay Defense and the bonus kills in Arena.

16 hours ago, Mercakete said:

I'm of the opinion that whether something is being done wrong or right is the prerogative of the creators of a product, not the consumers. That we get to play this at all is because it's being shared with us. We have no right to be telling them how to run their business, and too often the producers of products are de-humanized just because the product isn't to an individual consumer's ideal. Rather than acting entitled, consumers should be grateful to be included, and thankful for what they get.

16 hours ago, Mercakete said:

Part of this is that I hate double standards, and it seems like people think that if you're an artist (whether in visual arts, literary arts, music, or what have you) that you should express what you think, and put it out there for other people to appreciate. However, if you're part of a big company (that is, if you've successfully turned your dream into a money-making career) then suddenly, you're not supposed to put your product out there; you need to create what everyone else tells you to or there will be public outcry. It's not right to do that to people, which is why it bothers me so much when people complain so much about the latest gift (I.e., banner, update, etc.) they put out there for the players. I hardly ever see any appreciation, and no one ever thinks to say "thank you." I just can't stand it, which is why I've begun speaking out more about this issue.

5 hours ago, SoulWeaver said:

I don't know that I agree with that 100% - there are artists out on the internet who create two variations of their work and post one version to everyone but lock the other behind a paywall such as a Patreon Tier. Are we saying the same piece of art is simultaneously Art and Product simply because one version has a price tag? Artists do have to make a living, yes, but at the same time they can have the desire to just share things with others without need for monetary compensation. Does this somehow make their free stuff better than their stuff they charge for, since one is Art and the other mere Product? What about when they offer free teaser images composed of a cropped variation of their normal work? Does the cropped part of the normal work cease to become Product since it was showcased for free, or does the part cropped out cease to become Art because it was hidden behind a paywall? Though I do see where you're coming from, it's hardly a black-and-white question.

Well, consumers have a huge right to voice their opinions since it is their money that the artist is taking; consumers are not patronizing artists out of charity. Also, the fact that consumers care enough to voice their opinion is a good thing so the artist does not have to guess what the consumers like; it does not take a marketing genius to browse through social media and fan forums and then sell what players want. Artists can make whatever the hell they want if they are not dependent on consumers for a living, but if they want consumers to buy it, they have to appeal to the consumers. There is no such thing as a free lunch and that applies to the artist too; if the artist is not producing something that is lunch worthy, then they deserve to starve just like everyone else.

With that said, Intelligent Systems is listening to the the majority of their consumers, otherwise they would not be releasing so many alts in the first place. On the other hand, I think they could have done it in a better way that pleases the minority of their consumers too.

[SoulWeaver]

2 hours ago, XRay said:

Well, consumers have a huge right to voice their opinions since it is their money that the artist is taking; consumers are not patronizing artists out of charity. Also, the fact that consumers care enough to voice their opinion is a good thing so the artist does not have to guess what the consumers like; it does not take a marketing genius to browse through social media and fan forums and then sell what players want. Artists can make whatever the hell they want if they are not dependent on consumers for a living, but if they want consumers to buy it, they have to appeal to the consumers. There is no such thing as a free lunch and that applies to the artist too; if the artist is not producing something that is lunch worthy, then they deserve to starve just like everyone else.

Hm...I suppose you have a point, though that's not quite my point. I will admit I took a bit of a tangent, though.

[Ice Dragon]

3 hours ago, XRay said:

There is no such thing as a free lunch

Excuse me for nitpicking, but this is a phrase that bugs me when it's misused. "No free lunch" means "everything has a cost somewhere, even if it is free for you", which actually contradicts the "you can't get stuff for free" that you're using it to mean.

/psa