Serenes Forest's Teehee Thread

[GuardianSing]

Blood pact is so much better.

I mean of course the peasants are siding with the land lords lord, she actually has the power to repeal land tax.

"Write a more dynamic and interesting reason for the conflict!"

For the character that was more or less a prop in part one I'm only thinking now how interesting of a life this guy probably led before he became King. I wonder what Pelleas was doing during the Mad King War or where he was taken to by his mother and why. She was obviously from the dragon tribe I knew that from the beginning and I'm sure we'll hear more about it then but he didn't seem to know that, nor did he know he was mixed race like Micaiah.

And in the lead up to this war he was clearly growing, enough to give insights like this. He's really someone who lived his life not knowing he would become king and when he did he was far from ready.

Part of me wonders if a character was robbed here because of the Death Pact and him exiting the story before we got to learn much about him while he was still alive, but on the other hand his death and his willingness to die almost is what makes him interesting to me. Now that he's dead and can't share his secrets I can't help but wonder what exactly was going through his head before and after becoming King. He knew he wasn't ready, we know that much.

As a side note, I can't fucking believe there was a Fire Emblem game in which a mother and son were present and it was the son who died and not the mother.

-The Soviet Union during WW1 probably

Ohhhh, that's depressing to see after a conservation literally about dreaming for the day the war will be over.

Oh hey she's here to bring neutrality continental!

There is an alternate timeline in where this franchise is called "Flame Medallion"

So it's like a Fire Emblem awakening?

7 years ago an IS developer was trying to think of ways to revive this dying franchise, hopeless that it would ever be possible after the poor financial success of the previous games, and when replaying Radiant Dawn had a third eye opening moment when he got to this chapter.

You'd be surprised at how may wars have been started because of pieces of parchment.

Wait didn't we already know this.

Or I guess they didn't know.

I mean I know it was your son, but hey! 1/2 ain't bad!

Unlike many parental deaths in this series, I find this one more emotional than all of them just because it was the other way around and I didn't expect it. Pelleas was not a forced to be likable mentor figure that was practically mechanized in the narrative to die at a specific point early on to be specifically motivate the main character who would forget about them 2 seconds later, he was a kid who didn't know what he was doing and was just trying to help his people. His death is late into the game at this point he was a well established character. I feel more for this side character in losing her son than I do for pretty much all avatars in Fire Emblem whose parents were axed early on, especially since he didn't need to die, at least not this early.

I just love how the literal last surviving member of the Daein royal bloodline just died, the entire crux of the Independence war to justify the country's legitimacy just died less than a year after it happened and yet they're just going about as usual, fully allowing Micaiah to take control.

I can't wait for this guy to become the savior of the entire plot

Oh, nope. Micaiah is gone now as well. It's a rogue army at this point.

Well considering the end of this chapter it was more the other way around

Oh and um, red axe guy died. Sad.

"Lethe my love, how tragic it is that we should find ourselves on the opposite sides of the battlefield. But it was you who made me see the error of my ways, you who taught me what true love was, so even though we face off against each other now, know that I appreciate everything you have done for me."

"...Babe, you sided with the Nazi's"

Wait so why does Mist feel the medallion but Ike doesn't, I don't remember if they explained that.

You'd think for that reason this room alone would have like 1000 guards.

That this Dark God's reason for being the antagonist is because they've given up in humanity is not uncommon but still far more interesting than how most FE games do it.

Huh, a white haired protagonist being the vassal of a dark god...

Is...is the plot of Tellius basically Awakening but significantly better?

And here I thought Three Houses was the one with Javelins of Light

Welp, we're in it for the long haul

 

 

 

[Acacia Sgt]

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

Blood pact is so much better.

Maybe, but it is a signed document after all.

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

For the character that was more or less a prop in part one I'm only thinking now how interesting of a life this guy probably led before he became King. I wonder what Pelleas was doing during the Mad King War or where he was taken to by his mother and why. She was obviously from the dragon tribe I knew that from the beginning and I'm sure we'll hear more about it then but he didn't seem to know that, nor did he know he was mixed race like Micaiah.

And in the lead up to this war he was clearly growing, enough to give insights like this. He's really someone who lived his life not knowing he would become king and when he did he was far from ready.

Part of me wonders if a character was robbed here because of the Death Pact and him exiting the story before we got to learn much about him while he was still alive, but on the other hand his death and his willingness to die almost is what makes him interesting to me. Now that he's dead and can't share his secrets I can't help but wonder what exactly was going through his head before and after becoming King. He knew he wasn't ready, we know that much.

Well, there is some stuff about him revealed posthumously, but also... do you know already or are you willing to play through this in a second playthrough to find out on your own?

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

As a side note, I can't fucking believe there was a Fire Emblem game in which a mother and son were present and it was the son who died and not the mother.

Well, at least you said present, since it has certainly happened before.

Igrene's child in Binding Blade, to give an example. Oh wait, in Genealogy you kill Ishtor long before Hilda.

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

-The Soviet Union during WW1 probably

Then they wised up and had like two reserve lines ready to kill any possible deserters from the line in front of them.

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

There is an alternate timeline in where this franchise is called "Flame Medallion"

And also Tellius was the first continent?

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

I mean I know it was your son, but hey! 1/2 ain't bad!

That said, it's still a contract. So the devil is in the details...

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

I just love how the literal last surviving member of the Daein royal bloodline just died, the entire crux of the Independence war to justify the country's legitimacy just died less than a year after it happened and yet they're just going about as usual, fully allowing Micaiah to take control.

Ultimately proving Izuka right, funnily enough.

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

Wait so why does Mist feel the medallion but Ike doesn't, I don't remember if they explained that.

I'm pretty sure they did. Though I can't recall either if it was already or you've yet to see it.

Maybe it was even back in PoR.

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

Is...is the plot of Tellius basically Awakening but significantly better?

To be fair, Awakening kinda tried to be everything at once. Jack of All Trades...

7 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

Welp, we're in it for the long haul

Good to see this back.

Now we're back to standard "beat evil dragon/god and save the world" FE standard fare.

[BrightBow]

3 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

As a side note, I can't fucking believe there was a Fire Emblem game in which a mother and son were present and it was the son who died and not the mother.

I would like to note that the mark at some point after this transfers over to Micaiah. Unlike the usual dumping down of dialog in this abridged script, the scene where this was shown got cut out entirely outside of Japanese Maniac Mode. So you never see this CG.

I'm pointing this out because despite all those cuts, there is still dialog left over that alludes to this fact. Which can be really confusing if you don't know about the full script.

Maybe this kind of approach is how we got "The Hierarch" and all those other gems that make the Awakening script such a work of art. The might have made those really crude cuts with no concern for how it would impact the rest of the script, so stuff is either coming out of nowhere or is being set up just to not actually go anywhere.
Although Awakening never quite gave me the same feeling as Radiant Dawn, that people were at least trying to create something worthwhile but had to fight those who were convinced that strong writing was actively detrimental to the series' sales. As Yamagami put it:

Yamagami: Other than the dialogue scenes, which are integral to advancing the plot, there are also other scenes that, for example, reveal the kind of connection two characters have with each other. While these kind of scenes may be highly enjoyable for the Fire Emblem enthusiasts, for new players they might seem completely unnecessary, having no effect on how much they will enjoy the game.

In other words, by taking out the scenes concentrating on character building, we hope that players new to the series will be able enjoy the game more by just concentrating on the main story. We’ve heard from the more casual players that the storyline was too hard to follow in our previous games, so we’ve thought out this new structure and have found it to be the best solution to this problem.

https://serenesforest.net/general/interviews/radiant-dawn/nintendo-dream/page-2/

Presumably after Radiant Dawn's flop, the folks who were pushing for gutting the script were allowed to have their way in the future.

Still, I wouldn't be too surprised if there is an okayish draft of Awakening's script out there. If only because of how disturbing it is to imagine that someone intentionally wrote a scenario where the player self-insert burns hundreds of thousands of people to death while all the characters act towards this unprecedented destruction of human life in such a casual and chipper way as if they just got a rare pull in a gacha. There is absolutely no reason for it to be written in such a completely fucked up manner.

Heck, we literally have the same scenario here in Radiant Dawn, and all the characters are appropriately freaking out about how messed up the whole thing is.

[Lightcosmo]

5 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

Wait so why does Mist feel the medallion but Ike doesn't, I don't remember if they explained that.

They do, and if I recall, it has something to do with their "balance" within themselves, which is why Mist can touch the medallion but not Ike. (This is explained by Volke in PoR, I think?

[Acacia Sgt]

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

Wait so why does Mist feel the medallion but Ike doesn't, I don't remember if they explained that.

1 hour ago, Lightcosmo said:

They do, and if I recall, it has something to do with their "balance" within themselves, which is why Mist can touch the medallion but not Ike. (This is explained by Volke in PoR, I think?

Okay, might as well say it.

Fun fact: The balance thing is a localization invention. In the Japanese version, the reason is that Mist is highly attuned with Order. You know, like the Herons, who can also touch the medallion safely and, like also happened to Mist, also felt faint as more and more Chaos was happening. Makes much more sense if you ask me, perhaps.

Why localization changed it, I don't know.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Saint Rubenio]

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

For the character that was more or less a prop in part one I'm only thinking now how interesting of a life this guy probably led before he became King. I wonder what Pelleas was doing during the Mad King War or where he was taken to by his mother and why. She was obviously from the dragon tribe I knew that from the beginning and I'm sure we'll hear more about it then but he didn't seem to know that, nor did he know he was mixed race like Micaiah.

And in the lead up to this war he was clearly growing, enough to give insights like this. He's really someone who lived his life not knowing he would become king and when he did he was far from ready.

Part of me wonders if a character was robbed here because of the Death Pact and him exiting the story before we got to learn much about him while he was still alive, but on the other hand his death and his willingness to die almost is what makes him interesting to me. Now that he's dead and can't share his secrets I can't help but wonder what exactly was going through his head before and after becoming King. He knew he wasn't ready, we know that much.

As a side note, I can't fucking believe there was a Fire Emblem game in which a mother and son were present and it was the son who died and not the mother.

Blood pact contrivance be damned, I'm a big fan of this sequence of events and it's a large part of why Pelleas is probably my favorite character in this game. Pelleas made a ton of mistakes and was very much not suited to be a leader. He was thrust into the position and used by Izuka and Lekain at every turn. But he meant well, and he truly cared for the people of Daein. In the end, he chose to make the ultimate sacrifice to correct his ultimate mistake, saving his people in the process. Classic moment of redemption.

...And it's completely and utterly pointless. It accomplishes nothing, his finest moment amounts to jack shit, and any other way to phrase this. It's such a brutally bleak end to his life and I fucking love it.

Also making Tauroneo kill him allows him to finally acquire his name, King Killer. Which he couldn't get in PoR because he cannot damage Ashnard. Fuck PoR.

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

And then there's the part that everyone else loves, this chapter. It fell flat for me because the gameplay execution is absolutely horrid. Thanks to Ike, because of course.

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

Unlike many parental deaths in this series, I find this one more emotional than all of them just because it was the other way around and I didn't expect it. Pelleas was not a forced to be likable mentor figure that was practically mechanized in the narrative to die at a specific point early on to be specifically motivate the main character who would forget about them 2 seconds later, he was a kid who didn't know what he was doing and was just trying to help his people. His death is late into the game at this point he was a well established character. I feel more for this side character in losing her son than I do for pretty much all avatars in Fire Emblem whose parents were axed early on, especially since he didn't need to die, at least not this early.

Almedha's a pretty good character too. Her desperate latching on to Pelleas as a way to fill the void left in her heart, only to lose him in a sacrifice that served no purpose, it's such good stuff. Poor woman is so empty and broken for the rest of the game.

I suppose I'll mention, since nobody else has yet and it doesn't make a difference for you here - on a second run you can choose to spare Pelleas and eventually recruit him. It's a fun little "what if" scenario, you get to expand on his and Almedha's characters further. He gets some really good exchanges with bosses later on, too. Considering replaying the longest FE is a tall order, I would recommend looking up the new stuff you can see in this scenario. There's a decent amount.

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

Anyway, this map. Since you play as the Greil Mercs, it's won from the start because nothing can beat the Greil Mercs. But the game wants you to kill 50 things for plot. So you watch the game play itself for like 45 minutes until enough kills are accumulated and shit hits the fan. If only I could've chosen to play as the Dawn Brigade instead, this map might've actually been fun. I know it's not an issue for you. I... really wish it wasn't an issue for me either lol

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

Huh, a white haired protagonist being the vassal of a dark god...

Is...is the plot of Tellius basically Awakening but significantly better?

I mean, this particular tidbit is often described as one of the story's weakest points, so...

Personally, I find Ike's role in the story a lot worse, but that's because I'm the only person in the world who doesn't worship Ike as the specialest little boy.

14 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Okay, might as well say it.

Fun fact: The balance thing is a localization invention. In the Japanese version, the reason is that Mist is highly attuned with Order. You know, like the Herons, who can also touch the medallion safely. Makes much more sense if you ask me, perhaps.

Why localization changed it, I don't know.

T R E E H O U S E
R
E
E
H
O
U
S
E

Edited December 1, 2023 by Saint Rubenio

[Acacia Sgt]

2 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Personally, I find Ike's role in the story a lot worse, but that's because I'm the only person in the world who doesn't worship Ike as the specialest little boy.

Oi, it ain't an exclusive club, you know!

[Interdimensional Observer]

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

I will say that I like Pelleas's patheticness. He isn't the most suited for the role he has been thrust into, yet he tries however he can. Nonetheless, that simply isn't good enough, and he is so pathetic that he can't even make a meaningful self-sacrifice.

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

Unlike many parental deaths in this series, I find this one more emotional than all of them just because it was the other way around and I didn't expect it.

In Japanese...

Micaiah:
“Yet, King Pelleas’s mark…”

Almedha:
“Yes… That is something I do not understand. Why was the mark of the blood pact… transferred to you? Heh heh… Heh heh heh heh… If you were to die by somebody’s hands now… perhaps the mark might disappear still. How about it? Do you wish to give it a try? You sacrificed my dear Pelleas… It’s only fitting that you should die as well, wench! If nobody has the heart to kill you, I’ll do it myself!!”

...sick with grief very much.

7 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

Welp, we're in it for the long haul

Thankfully for you, Part 4 is shorter than Part 3. ...You'll just need to make sure you set aside a nice deal of time for when you end things with Part 4 Endgame, it's long.

-Also, word of advice, Haar and Jill should probably go with Micaiah as it'll help in the upcoming chapters. I find the default arrangements are otherwise fine. Unless you want to train someone up a whole lot, then put those characters with Tibarn. -You'll see what I mean soon enough.

 

27 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Fun fact: The balance thing is a localization invention. In the Japanese version, the reason is that Mist is highly attuned with Order. You know, like the Herons, who can also touch the medallion safely and, like also happened to Mist, also felt faint as more and more Chaos was happening. Makes much more sense if you ask me, perhaps.

Why localization changed it, I don't know.

"Balance" you could spin as sounding like good propaganda perhaps. Ashera then being the goddess of balance, instead of a goddess of one trait with a potentially equally-respectable opposite. ...But I doubt the localizers at the time of PoR knew the truth RD would reveal.

Although, order, balance, harmony. They're synonymic enough in general- "cosmic order", "balance in the universe", same thing. For PoR, perhaps this was fine. But for RD, balance is no longer a viable choice of words, since "balance" implies "equal portions of different things, producing a good result", when Ashera is clearly too leaning in one direction, she is not balanced.

...Although in Japanese, Ashera is the Positive Goddess/Goddess of Positive Aspects and Yune the Negative Goddess/Goddess of Negative Aspects. Order and Chaos being less abstract localization choices that pick one such positive/negative thing which Yune mentions that could potentially summarize the rest of them. Apparently Ashera could also be translated as the "Goddess of Superiority/Correctness/Justness" and Yune "Goddess of Defeat/Bearing Responsibilities" -the pregnancy of meaning found within kanji.😆

 

13 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Personally, I find Ike's role in the story a lot worse, but that's because I'm the only person in the world who doesn't worship Ike as the specialest little boy.

You're far from alone, so quit kvetching.😝 -Although I've no dislike for Ike, nor strong feelings in favor of him either.

It's weird, but I don't blame Ike, I blame the writers for any issues. -Which is strange, since everyone else in Fire Emblem, like him, is a fictional character with no agency of their own, so I technically can't blame any of them for anything they "do".

But in Ike's case... Perhaps it's, if we pretended that he was a real person, that any excessive limelight-absorption he has, is not of his own agency. It's the godly hand of the writers that contort spacetime and the phenomena within that place give him the importance. Ike doesn't actively butt-slam shouting "Miiiiiiiiine!" anyone else off the mountain peak of relevance.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Interdimensional Observer

[Saint Rubenio]

5 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

You're far from alone, so quit kvetching.😝 -Although I've no dislike for Ike, nor strong feelings in favor of him either.

Well, yeah, "only person in the world" is a gross exaggeration in 99.99% of cases. But still.

5 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

It's weird, but I don't blame Ike, I blame the writers for any issues. -Which is strange, since everyone else in Fire Emblem, like him, is a fictional character with no agency of their own, so I technically can't blame any of them for anything they "do".

But in Ike's case... Perhaps it's, if we pretended that he was a real person, that any excessive limelight-absorption he has, is not of his own agency. It's the godly hand of the writers that contort spacetime and the phenomena within that place give him the importance. Ike doesn't actively butt-slam shouting "Miiiiiiiiine!" anyone else off the mountain peak of relevance.

This is true. But I prefer to blame Ike. Ike is shorter to write than "the writers."

[Acacia Sgt]

14 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

You're far from alone, so quit kvetching.😝 -Although I've no dislike for Ike, nor strong feelings in favor of him either.

It's weird, but I don't blame Ike, I blame the writers for any issues. -Which is strange, since everyone else in Fire Emblem, like him, is a fictional character with no agency of their own, so I technically can't blame any of them for anything they "do".

But in Ike's case... Perhaps it's, if we pretended that he was a real person, that any excessive limelight-absorption he has, is not of his own agency. It's the godly hand of the writers that contort spacetime and the phenomena within that place give him the importance. Ike doesn't actively butt-slam shouting "Miiiiiiiiine!" anyone else off the mountain peak of relevance.

Ironically, that kind of favoritism by the writer is kinda the definition of Mary Sue. Ironic, since for years it was Micaiah the one saddled with that label. Although, I'm pretty sure there was a sizable amount of people also calling Ike a Gary Stu back then too.

Thus Elincia and Part 2 beats them both.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Interdimensional Observer]

Santos Claus is leaving the House!

Santos Claus is leaving the House!

Santos Claus is lea-ving the Houuuuuuuse!

The Committee made a list

they checked the price

of watching naughty on-line.

Santos Claus is leaving the House!

Santos Claus is leaving the House!

Santos Claus is lea-ving the Houuuuuuuse!

He knew was in deep s***

when he walked away.

He knew he was bad not good

so he cried he was burnt at the stake!

Santos Claus is leaving the House!

Santos Claus is leaving the House!

Santos Claus is lea-ving the Houuuuuuuse!

-I know I usually am not the one to bring up politics here. But I was somehow able to come up with the above parody on my own.😆 And it's at last the end (barring the court cases that'll get underway next year) to a surprise absurd scandal nobody could've seen coming in 2022.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Interdimensional Observer

[Codename Shrimp]

Santa you say

[Saint Rubenio]

5 hours ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Ironically, that kind of favoritism by the writer is kinda the definition of Mary Sue. Ironic, since for years it was Micaiah the one saddled with that label. Although, I'm pretty sure there was a sizable amount of people also calling Ike a Gary Stu back then too.

Thus Elincia and Part 2 beats them both.

Ludveck did nothing wrong?

6 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Santa you say

Ew, anime.

[Codename Shrimp]

7 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Ew, anime.

[Interdimensional Observer]

I get you're a masochist, but this is... 🍄☠️😮.

-Finally, I try to resume.

There is my annoying tendency to just leave games incomplete, which has plagued the Rune Factory franchise for most of it. I only ever finished RF1 and Frontier, twice oddly for RF1. Even stranger is that I did two runs of Tides of Destiny, not sure why when I couldn't finish the first.

Yet, another issue specific to Rune Factory and Story of Seasons has been the fact they're farming sims. You get into a daily rhythm with these games, taking a break interrupts that beat. Resuming one of these comes off as intimidating, even though no deadlines and RF5's overlong days means it's extremely forgiving to taking a little time to find the groove again.

A third problem has been of more recent origin. Getting glum does make me try to find futile escape in 💘, which makes me amenable to RF. And yet, the first two matters, and the lack of focus and challenge of physically getting myself to open the game and start playing it when I'm terrified, means I don't. Instead, I settle for half-baked melodramatic fantasies created in my mind. I know full well professional writers can make better fictional romance than I, and that I should pursue those instead of my own amateur thoughts. Yet having them cluttering the brain makes me feel like I can't properly move on and partake of video game romance. So I get stuck in my head, unable to make a clean break.

...Only played ingame one day so far 😅, the laptop doesn't last me more than two before having to recharge. Spent that time on readjustment, made slightly awkward by the fact that sometime after I put the game on pause, I inverted the confirm-deny button setup on Steam, resulting in A-B button prompt mismatch. It's not my fault that the correct setup as invented by Nintendo isn't the norm on other systems. Decided to chat up everyone for their "Autumn is approaching dialogue", Martin and Ryker both randomly asked Ares if he wanted to tag along with them. I don't ever recall that happening before I placed the game on extended hiatus (nor in RF3), must happen sometimes once you reach high enough LP or something, nice to see the NPCs take the initiative for once (does this game have reverse-proposals as I heard a few SoS do? I'm guessing not.).

[Saint Rubenio]

Anyway, continued playing Prey. I explored the deserted space station until I found Helpful Droid Assistant. I promptly destroyed it for no reason.

The real surprise is that I have just found living people! I didn't think I would. I can help them finish their escape, or I can cause them to suffer a terrible accident, for no reason... Hmm. Decisions, decisions.

[BrightBow]

https://km-hs-lr22.hatenablog.com/entry/2018/01/22/182646

[Interdimensional Observer]

Official.

---

Official -ly scrapped. Vetoed by Miyamoto out of Mario Power Tennis. The artist, who had previously invented Waluigi, has also thrown together a 3D model of what "Wapeach" would've looked approximately like.:

[BrightBow]

https://km-hs-lr22.hatenablog.com/entry/2019/12/25/022215

[Saint Rubenio]

1 hour ago, BrightBow said:

https://km-hs-lr22.hatenablog.com/entry/2018/01/22/182646

Look at that dad. So dadly. I'm sure he won't suffer a dadish fate offscreen.

51 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Literally just purple Peach. This one doesn't have a red-ass massive nose and a permanent teethy grin. Because God forbid the female character not be conventionally attractive.

9 minutes ago, BrightBow said:

https://km-hs-lr22.hatenablog.com/entry/2019/12/25/022215

Is that literally everyone?

The artstyle makes it difficult to tell them apart but I'm definitely recognizing some folks. Though I feel like I'm seeing Roleck in like three different places, so I'm not sure.

[Lightchao42]

The wind blows hard in December

On 11/29/2023 at 7:14 PM, Interdimensional Observer said:

I did read comments saying he's retiring. Shadow, the commenters hypothesized, could be the villain.

Carrey said he was considering retirement, so we don't know if he'll be in Sonic 3 yet. We also don't know who's voicing Shadow yet either probably Keanu Reeves or Robert Pattinson.

On 11/29/2023 at 7:14 PM, Interdimensional Observer said:

The issue is both endings involve fighting Eggman. -But there's only three final boss options. Diablon would be weird there with the Black Arms presumably fiercely fighting elsewhere, and there aren't any Black Arms assaulting Eggman's base, so Black Doom wouldn't make any sense either.

That's true, but one of the fights could be Eggman testing Shadow to see if he'd be a worthy minion or something to that effect, since the Dark mission already has Shadow helping him.

22 hours ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Kissinger x Death OTP?

 

52 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Official -ly scrapped. Vetoed by Miyamoto out of Mario Power Tennis. The artist, who had previously invented Waluigi, has also thrown together a 3D model of what "Wapeach" would've looked approximately like.:

She looks more like younger Peach in a funny outfit than Peach's 'evil' counterpart. Either way, I'm glad Waluigi didn't get vetoed, the Mario universe is better with him around.

I wonder if there's any concept art of Wadaisy...

[BrightBow]

19 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Is that literally everyone?

The artstyle makes it difficult to tell them apart but I'm definitely recognizing some folks. Though I feel like I'm seeing Roleck in like three different places, so I'm not sure.

Seems to be just about everyone. Even Ma'aya's mother is there. She is never even shown, but I guess Aslanne must have commented on how much Ma'aya looks like her mother or something.
Other dead characters are present as well. There is Tamthir and Adeleide. All transparent with a halo. Well, Tamthir's isn't visible but that's probably because he is peaking out of a corner.

I think I figured out everyone. The beardman on the roof is Gyshkal. The beardman in the bottom left is Grevandel. Roleck is the one in the window at the right, above Barzelphen.

Edited December 1, 2023 by BrightBow

[Interdimensional Observer]

24 minutes ago, Lightchao42 said:

That's true, but one of the fights could be Eggman testing Shadow to see if he'd be a worthy minion or something to that effect, since the Dark mission already has Shadow helping him.

Good point. Not like Eggman hadn't made his lackeys fight to the death before. Gamma being tested against one of siblings in Adventure before he goes AWOL comes to mind.

I didn't play much Sonic in general, but the Egg Dealer seems so... underwhelming for a final boss. I know Sonic as a franchise looves casinos (Why did this become a thing? Because Sonic rolls into a ball?), but this wasn't the place for a slot machine boss. Eggman has done more menacing things before ...though he is in the same game as the aforementioned Black Doom (and Devil Doom), and Diablon, maybe it would've been foolish to compete.

 

26 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Literally just purple Peach. This one doesn't have a red-ass massive nose and a permanent teethy grin. Because God forbid the female character not be conventionally attractive.

True. TBF though, this was a just a first draft, maaaaaybe if Miyamoto had approved, there'd be a slim chance of it the design evolving into something less attractive.  Doubtful though. The sketch holding an axe at interpretably best suggests she could've been a little cold psychopathic.

Just bring back Captain Syrup for a female "companion" to Wario. Conventionally attractive she may be, a pirate who ultimately has self-interest in mind (and thus not a noble soul) is the best we'll get.

24 minutes ago, Lightchao42 said:

She looks more like younger Peach in a funny outfit than Peach's 'evil' counterpart. Either way, I'm glad Waluigi didn't get vetoed, the Mario universe is better with him around.

Waluigi I see speculation as the reason why Wapeach got scrapped. Miyamoto didn't even bother to look at the sketch, yet he thought Wapeach would resemble Doronjo, which he didn't care for at all. Doronjo being the sexy villainess from the late-70s Yatterman anime, whose tall & lanky grunt Waluigi does resemble, her other grunt is fat and strong, so quite roughly Wario. The trio being cartoonishly evil in a style that I saw described as "Anime Team Rocket-like", harebrained schemes that always end in utter defeat. -Wapeach as shown here decidedly isn't Doronjo, as the artist said (not to Miyamoto at the time) she wouldn't have been.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Interdimensional Observer

[Saint Rubenio]

52 minutes ago, BrightBow said:

Seems to be just about everyone. Even Ma'aya's mother is there. She is never even shown, but I guess Aslanne must have commented on how much Ma'aya looks like her mother or something.
Other dead characters are present as well. There is Tamthir and Adeleide. All transparent with a halo. Well, Tamthir's isn't visible but that's probably because he is peaking out of a corner.

I think I figured out everyone. The beardman on the roof is Gyshkal. The beardman in the bottom left is Grevandel. Roleck is the one in the window at the right, above Barzelphen.

I really need to replay both Vestarias back to back at some point. I cannot remember who Tamthir and Adeleide are lol

35 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

True. TBF though, this was a just a first draft, maaaaaybe if Miyamoto had approved, there'd be a slim chance of it the design evolving into something less attractive.  Doubtful though. The sketch holding an axe at interpretably best suggests she could've been a little cold psychopathic.

I sincerely doubt she'd have looked any different, honestly.

35 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Just bring back Captain Syrup for a female "companion" to Wario. Conventionally attractive she may be, a pirate who ultimately has self-interest in mind (and thus not a noble soul) is the best we'll get.

Syrup was fine, yeah. Alas, the entire Wario Land anthology has basically been discarded in favor of WarioWare. What a shame. 4 was such an insanely good game.

[Interdimensional Observer]

28 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Syrup was fine, yeah. Alas, the entire Wario Land anthology has basically been discarded in favor of WarioWare. What a shame. 4 was such an insanely good game.

You and me make two. Wario Land was good, quite distinctive from Mario platforming. I've dabbled in WarioWare, it does little for me (though sure, it's not exactly something overdone in gaming).

Alas, the Mario sub-franchises of DK, Yoshi, and Wario don't get enough attention from Big N. And in Yoshi's case, the post-SMW2 attention has been plagued by quality issues.

...Remind me, did you ever play Shake It! ("The Shake Dimension" in Europe)? Less transformations than 4 (and no Super Hard mode), but the general DNA is similar. If you get the itch and haven't given it a go, try it? The titular shaking could maybe be mapped to a button, and any tilting an analog stick.