What if Pokemon Evolutionary Lines were playable in Smash?

[Lord_Brand]

This is an idea I just thought of when designing a Gardevoir moveset: What if Smash in the future featured entire evolutionary lines of Pokemon as playable fighters? The idea is that their movesets are largely identical (save for obvious exceptions like Charizard being able to multijump and use Fly while Charmander and Charmeleon cannot) but they provide three distinct weight and speed builds. All members of the evolutionary line are grouped together on the roster, occupying a single space.

So, for example Ralts, Kirlia, and Gardevoir would have a largely similar moveset, the main differences being their respective sizes, speed, and weight. Ralts is the smallest, fastest, and lightest, Gardevoir is the tallest, slowest, and heaviest. Gallade could potentially be grouped with them as well being an alternate evolution of Kirlia, though his moveset is more distinct.

This would of course mean that Pichu, Pikachu, and Raichu now all appear together as well. Riolu would appear alongside Lucario. In Pokemon Trainer's case, the three starters could rotate evolutionary stages like so:

• Bulbasaur, Charmeleon, Blastoise
• Charmander, Wartortle, Venusaur
• Squirtle, Ivysaur, Charizard

Or alternatively each trio belongs to one of three Trainers: Red, Leaf/Green, and Blue. In which case Red gets the Charizard trio, Leaf/Green gets the Venusaur trio, and Blue gets the Blastoise trio.

I do realize this would drastically swell the number of Pokemon fighters in the game, but the freedom to reuse movesets between stages would help streamline a lot of the workload since in most cases you only have to design one core moveset and just make a few tweaks to it. It's almost like having a bunch of Echo Fighters, but vertical rather than lateral.

[King Marth 64]

I think any Pokémon Evolutionary Line except for Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Charizard would make them as Newcomers and I think that's going to fill up the too much Pokémon Rep Fighters (+too much Kanto Region variants in Smash as well) in Super Smash Bros. series. I do think Sakurai is pretty much have to stick with the next Generation Pokémons as Newcomers in future Super Smash Bros. games because I think Sakurai did said that he might have to stick with limited amount of Pokémon he chooses to be in the roster.

[Race64]

It would be cool though.

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

I don't really see traits like "weight", "size", or "floatiness" as enough to make three different fighters with nigh-identical movesets out of. And people won't see "there are three Pokemon fighters and six echoes", they'll see "there are nine Pokemon fighters". I'm generally against this sort of cast bloat, and I'd honestly like to see Smash 6 take a hatchet to most Echo Fighters. The cast should be small enough that I can find and distinguish everyone on the TV screen without playing "Where's Waldo".

To take things in a different direction, I would like to see Mega evolution make an appearance. Have fighters like Lucario and Mewtwo "go Mega" for their final smash, even if it's a temporary transformation. 

[Lord_Brand]

16 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

I don't really see traits like "weight", "size", or "floatiness" as enough to make three different fighters with nigh-identical movesets out of. And people won't see "there are three Pokemon fighters and six echoes", they'll see "there are nine Pokemon fighters". I'm generally against this sort of cast bloat, and I'd honestly like to see Smash 6 take a hatchet to most Echo Fighters. The cast should be small enough that I can find and distinguish everyone on the TV screen without playing "Where's Waldo".

To take things in a different direction, I would like to see Mega evolution make an appearance. Have fighters like Lucario and Mewtwo "go Mega" for their final smash, even if it's a temporary transformation. 

I did have the idea that evolving mid-battle could be possible, which would help justify the similarities.

When you say "take a hatchet", do you mean "remove entirely" or "change to make them more distinct"? Personally, I like Echo Fighters (even if I disagree with the specific choices).

I get why Ultimate sorted everyone in order of appearance, but the option to sort by series would help immensely.

Don't Lucario and Mewtwo already turn Mega for their Final Smashes?

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

2 hours ago, Lord_Brand said:

Don't Lucario and Mewtwo already turn Mega for their Final Smashes?

I looked it up, and you're right, they do. So I guess I wouldn't really change that. Charizard did in Smash 4, too, but that was reverted once it turned back to "Pokemon Trainer".

2 hours ago, Lord_Brand said:

When you say "take a hatchet", do you mean "remove entirely" or "change to make them more distinct"? Personally, I like Echo Fighters (even if I disagree with the specific choices).

I would generally remove them, yes. I understand the motivation (more characters represented), and understand that there's less effort involved than making entirely new characters. But the cast is quite enormous as-is, and having characters with nigh-identical movesets just feels like so much unneeded glut. I'm hoping that the next game favors quality (diverse characters who play distinctly) over quantity (oodles of characters, though some play quite similarly).

[Lord_Brand]

On 9/8/2022 at 4:52 AM, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

I would generally remove them, yes. I understand the motivation (more characters represented), and understand that there's less effort involved than making entirely new characters. But the cast is quite enormous as-is, and having characters with nigh-identical movesets just feels like so much unneeded glut. I'm hoping that the next game favors quality (diverse characters who play distinctly) over quantity (oodles of characters, though some play quite similarly).

Well, of the Echo Fighters we have so far, Richter and Ken at least make sense, though Richter could probably be converted into a costume alongside other Belmonts, say Trevor and Leon (maybe giving each one a color swap referencing a different Belmont, similar to what they did with Dragon Quest's Hero).

Chrom and Lucina, I'm all for getting revised movesets reflecting the other weapon types they can use in FEA, with costumes for each of their classes (Lord, Great Lord, Cavalier, Paladin, Great Knight, Archer, Sniper, and Bow Knight), though this means Chrom might end up an Echo of Lucina or vice versa. They could focus Lucina's costumes and moves on her possible mothers instead, those being Robin, Sumia, Sully, Maribelle, and Olivia. I'd also change their Final Smashes to showcase their respective generations of units attacking the enemy in tandem, or at least teaming up with another unit to attack similar to Robin's Final Smash.

Daisy could be differentiated from Peach more, but she's long been presented as the Luigi to Peach's Mario, so it also makes sense that they have some similarities. Since she's primarily known through spinoffs, I'd guess her moveset would focus on those much like Waluigi's would, though the Power Ball from Super Mario Land would be a cute nod to her origins.

Dark Pit I don't care too much for, he can be folded back into a costume. Dark Samus, I'm ambivalent on as she is the face of the Metroid Prime trilogy and could potentially be differentiated from Samus further in a future game.

As far as Pokemon "echoes" go, what if there was an express connection between the fighters? Say, what if Ralts can evolve into Kirlia and then Gardevoir, either in the middle of a match or as a fighter in general by accumulating experience? All three are grouped into the same roster slot as different stages of the same fighter. You can think of it like transformation, only it's one-way. Evolution midbattle can be triggered with shield + special once the EXP gauge is filled. Ralts needs 100 EXP to evolve into Kirlia, while Kirlia needs 200 EXP to evolve into Gardevoir. Even if it is "roster bloat" in some sense, it's mitigated by the fact additional roster space is not taken up.