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Barren

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    Three Houses

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  1. @pingso it’s a good idea to later or rather earlier to bench Cecil because of how frail she is at the start. I guess my thinking was that I was going to see how she fares for the first time. But still it’s good to note that I don’t have to train all the members of the 7th platoon if I shouldn’t have to. If the other pegasus knights are way better than her in terms of bases and growths then yea I’ll definitely bench her from that point. I did look at her growths and damn her speed growth as a archer is insane. But yea super weak in most other areas otherwise. Using her to obtain treasure easier or at least be a distraction is probably a decent time to reclass her as a Pegasus Knight like you said. And thanks for the clarification regarding the Lady Sword. I think I should be a bit more prepared on who to keep using and when to bench some. I’ve read that Luke and Ryan are good and Rody is neither here or there. Still, I want to use them for at least a couple of chapter battles.
  2. That’s a good point. I didn’t even think about that. I never used Sacred Shield but I have used Retribution a couple of times not counting Chalice of Beginnings. So SS can stack with Retribution…..Interesting
  3. @Dark Holy ElfPlus if your grappler/war master has Tomebreaker and/or a pure water activated they can safely make the enemy warlocks waste their siege tomes. Ward can also accomplish the same thing. Silence can technically bypass the need for tomebreaker but then you would have to make sure that your bishop isn’t going to be punished for it by having another enemy flank them to death. Still thought it was worth mentioning.
  4. Thank you @Shaky Jones and @ping for your input. And don't worry about if you aren't trying to come off as you're telling me how I should play. The impression I am now getting is that almost each FE game tends to have a different meta in mind when it comes to which classes are good to use and which are not. So I think I have a decent idea thanks to you two for how I am going to approach at least the first few chapters of this game. I want to at least give it a shot and see how they turn out. Also part of the reason why I may make Cecille a mage is because while her base magic stat is 3, her magic growth is 50% and her speed would be at 80% so she should be able to double rather consistently at least early on. I can still make her a Falcon Knight or Draco Knight because she also seems like to be a good candidate to be a flier. I can always relcass her as a sage or bishop pending on how things go. MU! Chris Mercenary, Pirate (get axe rank to D). Mercenary (get sword rank up to C before promotion). Promote to Hero. Reclass to Draco Knight for chapters 7 - 13 Reclass to Hero by chapter 14. End game class Hero or Berserker Ryan Archer. Promote to Sniper Luke Myrmidon. Promote to Swordmaster Rody Cavalier. Promote to Paladin Cecille Mage. Reclass to Pegasus Knight as soon as Lady Sword is obtainable. Promote to Falcon Knight Gordin Archer. Promote to Sniper Draug Hunter. Promote to Horseman.
  5. Here at least War Monk for males can grab brawl avoid +20 then move onto Grappler. For females it’s their only choice for them to get Fistfaire. I can also understand where you’re coming from when comparing them to their Awakening variant since in that game they can wield axes and staves. This can also be augmented by axefaire in which only a handful of women can inherit. Robin and Henry come to mind when passing down axefaire.
  6. Hello, I have gotten started playing FE12 Hard mode. I wanted to get used to the game before I try Lunatic mode. I’m at chapter 1 and while I have some ideas about who reclass early on but I’m not sure on what to start with. So far, I have made my male avatar a mercenary then reclassed him into a pirate so I can work on my axe rank. I do plan on eventually turning him into a Hero. Unless I should just stick to merc for now. My other units are Ryan as a Archer, Luke as a Myrmidon, Rody as a Cavalier, Cecille as a Mage (though I am considering Pegasus Knight instead), Gordin as a Archer, Draug as a Knight (though I am considering a Dark Mage instead) and Arran as a Paladin. If any can give me some reclassing tips to at least get me started that would be great. Thanks in advance.
  7. I never considered Edelgard as a War Cleric but it does sound like a fun idea. You can even give her Darting Blow from the Pegasus Knight class and add weight-3 since she has a boon in heavy armor. She could also make a decent Valkyrie or Dark Knight because she can take advantage of both black and dark tomefaire at the same time. El has a budding talent in reason magic but black magic crit +10 only effects fire and bolganone. Neither of which has an innate crit chance.
  8. I usually just slap on the blue lions dancer gambit onto someone I know that can function in the front lines as long as the -1 strength and magic doesn’t cripple me too much. The 20 avoid is always nice to utilize other than the one time refresh for your dancer and three other units. Like sometimes Byleth, Lysithea or even Flayn could get away with it. Yuri is another one. It just all depends on your team formation really. As far as giving it to Annette, I’d rather have her be one of the recipients so she could either rally another physical fighter or have someone else rally her to do better damage.
  9. There’s a wiki that explains the endings for each pairing pending on the route if you want to look it up for yourself.
  10. Thanks everyone for your responses so far. I can totally see where you would all be coming from. And to those who said that maybe a better comparison would have been Paladin vs Wyvern Rider since these two are advance classes. Yes you guys are correct in saying that Wyvern Rider is much easier to certify into than Paladin by comparison. Since in general you only need flying at rank D+ and then Axes at B rank so you would have a little north of a 70% chance of certifying. Paladins of course need Lances at B rank and then riding at C+ for similar chances or riding at rank C which is basically a coin flip whether or not you'll pass. Also if I may: I was going for more of a distinction between Paladin or Wyvern Lord when ending up in your final class. The reason why I said that Paladin needs low-mid investment because by chapters 10 or 11 (maybe at earliest 9 pending on your levels during maddening) you can certify into a Paladin early and that if you're plan is to stay Paladin by the end of the game then you're pretty much set. You would only need an advance seal which you get as early as chapter 7 in Lorenz's paralogue or wait until I think chapter 8 or so to buy them. Plus if anything you just keep working on your lances, riding and authority for stronger battalions, better lance rank for end game weapons and movement +1 which combines nicely with canto. You all have made good points about Dimitri being a Paladin when it comes to Atrocity since this maximizes his kill potential on player phase. Windsweep which I have used on my maddening run is another great tool for him to punch a hole in the enemy's HP and then have someone capitalize on said punched hole. I didn't mean to discount Frozen Lance like I might have implied. Under the right circumstances, same with Vengeance actually, they can be nukes on Player Phase where they can dip in and out. It just requires a proper set up and/or AI manipulation to an extent. Wyvern Lords while certainly just an direct upgrade from Wyvern Rider, I was making that comparison when it comes to using the best combat arts in the game. Which in my opinion, Lances has the best array of combat arts. Bows are a strong second, but I don't think Axes has that many reliable combat arts even with Axefaire. I wasn't counting on the Hero Relics or Lord class exclusive arts initially but you factor those in that's where we may all (at least me) second guess which set of CAs are the best to abuse. Yes Axes has Smash which is always great and Spike which is some ways slightly worse than Smash but not by too much. Lightning Axe I suppose is good one too but only Edelgard and Annette can make the most of it since they have a good magic growth. Sylvain would rather use Swift Strikes than Lightning Axe. Alert Stance+ takes as long as Movement +1 to achieve regardless on which route you take though. But I would 100% agree that Alert Stance+ wins. As for Terrain Resist, since it bypasses hazard damage from battalions, it's just a layer of protection while nice could have been so much more. Again thank you everyone for contributing to this discussion so far. I just hope that I was able to explain a little better where I was coming from.
  11. This is something that I noticed was scattered throughout topic threads that was derailed for a number of reasons (and I can imagine this one going to be derailed as well). But this is something I've wanted to turn into a full blown discussion for a while. Though I can understand if we're going to sound like broken records at this point but I think it's still fun worth discussing. But here goes: The debate about is Paladin still worth using over Wyvern Lord has been going on for awhile and while I can see where most people would pick Wyvern Lord over Paladin, I would like to at least attempt to point out some niches Paladins have over Wyvern Lords. First off, between the two, Paladins are easier to get into rather than Wyvern Lord. Wyvern Lords of course have a higher investment required but a lot of the times it is worth it. But let's do a quick comparison and highlight their pros and cons. This will also factor in the combat arts Swift Strikes and Vengeance in particular since these two tend to the most used by end game. I can sometimes see Tempest Lance or Knightkneeler used throughout the game, especially in the beginning. I'll point out some pros and cons for the both of them. If I am missing something or you disagree, please respectfully comment down below. Paladin Pros Low-Mid Investment (Lance rank B and Riding rank B required for 100% certification) Solid growths across the board though the spread in growths are mostly minor Lancefaire at level 20 for both male and female units 8 move, can dismount and Canto Access to infantry, horseback, heavy armored, and flying battalions which tends to offer better overall stats Can be paired up with follow up, healing and guard Adjutants Cons While growths are still solid the glaring negative is -10% in speed Terrain Resist is too situational to be useful Hates traversing through sand and thickets as it hampered their movement thus you're forced to dismount if you want slightly better move Lower strength growth and stat modifier than Wyvern Lord It's mastery Aegis while can be helpful at times, it's proc is dependent on your Dex stat which isn't always consistent. So it is a cautious con at best Wyvern Lord Pros Great growths in HP, Strength and Speed in particular Axefaire at level 20 as a Wyvern Rider onwards Avoid +10 combines beautifully with Alert Stance and it's plus variant 8 move, can dismount and Canto Flight allows them to fly over all terrain maximizing the support from Stride, Rescue and Warp for insane movement and positioning Higher strength growth and modifier than Paladin It's mastery Defiant Crit while some don't like it because of it's requirement, but can be devastatingly powerful when knowing how to manage low HP Cons High investment needed (Lance rank at C, Axe and Flying rank at A is required for 100% certification) Can only access flying battalions which only a couple off hand offers good stat buffs Can only be paired with Follow up adjutants Has to dismount in order to take advantage of Heal/Avoid tiles. While it is minor con, they are noticeably slower than Falcon Knights in terms of speed growth. There are probably more you guys can think of than me but these are the things that come to mind for me. One thing I can also point out, while Paladins can also take advantage of the Stride and others, buildings and in some cases terrain can still slow them down. Especially when there are enemies in the way. The exception to the rule is if you're using Pass with Bernadetta and/or Anna and they are in the Cavalier/Paladin classes so they can zip right pass them. Pass while not required on any end game set can be a fun ability to take advantage of, couple that with dancing and on a non crimson flower route, dance of the goddess (Blue Lions Dancer and Opera Company) you can pull off a lot of neat strategies if you're looking to either clear as many enemies as you can or if you're doing a LTC run. When it comes to the combat arts Swift Strikes and Vengeance, this is where it gets interesting. The paladin class offers a +2 strength modifier while wyvern lord offers +4 in strength, but paladin gains Lancefaire which allows them a +5 attack when using lances so those combat arts among other lance combat arts gets the maximum damage. Let's say that we are using the Cichol Wyvern Co. Battalion in this example. If were to do the math this can look like this: Strength +2 ability from the Fighter Class Strength +2 as a stat modifier for Paladin Death Blow (+6 in attack) Lancefaire (+5 in attack with lances) Cichol Wyvern Co (+7 in attack when max level) +3 might from a unit they share a special bond with i.e Seteth with Flayn Now this looks great as a Paladin. As a Wyvern Lord though, since they only have a strength +4 as a class modifier they won't maximize the damage out with this set up but for some it doesn't really make that much of a difference. Seteth and Sylvain are the two of the three swift strike users that can fully maximize their damage thanks to supports. Sylvain can go with either Ingrid or Felix, or even both (I think they can stack but don't quote me on it) so he would be the benefit the most out of getting that additional +3 might. Especially if he is next to Ingrid thanks to his Philanderer ability where he'll get another +2 attack. Ferdinand gets the short end of the stick because he only gets a special bond support with Lorenz and it only ends at support rank B. While +2 Might is still good, you have to get Lorenz in position where not everyone really wants to Lorenz just for that purpose. Though at least Lorenz is usable on maddening but far less useful compared to those three. Vengeance can be used with Bernadetta, Dedue and Cyril and that has a number of factors going into which of the three is the best vengeance user. Bernie has the advantage over the two of them since she bores a crest and has Persecution Complex which grants a +5 attack when under 100% HP. It's an amazing ability for sure but she is much more frail so she needs a guard adjutant and or the blessing gambit activated. Dedue is the bulkiest and has a better strength growth but has a bane in riding so it'll be a slow grind before he can jump into Paladin. Dedue also has a special bond with Dimitri so that plus 3 might can be helpful for sure. Cyril can potentially reach better stats among the two of them but requires some baby sitting himself since his bases aren't the greatest starting out. Also fun fact: the Azure Moon route is the only route where you can have 3 vengeance users while on a non Crimson Flower route you can have all 3 swift strike users. There are other combat arts that we can go into like Frozen Lance or Shatter Slash that can do along with other abilities pending on which character you're using but honestly that will take some effort but can be worth using as well. Frozen Lance more so if you're going down the magic route. What do you guys think? Do you still prefer Wyvern Lord over Paladin anyways? Have you given the Paladin class a shot since you like to maximize the swift strikes/vengeance damage? Was it worth the time and investment to reach these classes? By all means comment here.
  12. There are other candidates with a boon in bows like Hanneman with a magic bow. You could do the same with Hubert if you wanted to as well. But yea, everyone else mentioned are the more conventional bow users.
  13. Plus if Dark Knight doesn’t tickle your fancy, there is Dark Flier. Dark Flier won’t boost Annette’s magic as much as a Gremory or Dark Knight would, but it does give a boost to her speed growth and flight as well. Yes the only flying magic battalion is only accessible when you reach authority rank B, but consider this: Annette has a boon in authority plus she can pull off being a rally bot. And it doesn’t require as much investment as a dark knight or even Gremory would.
  14. I tend to pass down Astra with Gauis and then Luna with Tharja to Noire. Plus thanks to Gauis being Noire’s father, she can go into Dark Flier and grab gale force. If it’s a normal play through, then something like Swordfaire for Assassin or even Sorcerer is a good fit for her. But Apotheosis you’ll want Bowfaire.
  15. For me if I know I want an ability for a special point in the game, I set it as my goal from the start. I managed to get Claude alert stance by the end of part 1
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