Shin Megami Tensei Mafia Day 5

[Cú Chulainn]

lol

come fite me scrub

do you even lift

[Marisa Kirisame]

not feeling that well; I'll post more comprehensively in the morning.

just not seeing the FANGIRL IS TOWN FOR EFFORT AND TRYING TO GET PAST RVS conclusions; I see someone whose first case looked contrived and self-conscious and who hides not very much content behind a lot of :words: and RPing. Beyond the initial TF vote I didn't see any effort to look at, say, Red Eye for sheeping, or the people voting him for that.

@knuckles- not sure if I said this but your sig is funny. I don't think I ever said that I found the act of cross-voting scummy; it was the self-awareness afterwards behind it.

@TF- a) is just why she found you scummy, not why you were worse than Scum Goon (no comparison) and b) came after my initial question about it. Regardless I don't currently think Wife is scum.

@wife- didn't mean to imply that changing votes before getting a reaction was scummy, just suboptimal. Even if a vote isn't specifically a reaction test you should try to get something out of the vote first IMO. But TF was around afterwards so I guess it isn't that bad.

@knuckles again- probably am clinging too much to Fangirl but I'm just not seeing the Scum Goon case (I'll look at his posts again in the morning) and I think that explicitly admitting to sheeping isn't scummy (in the case of Red Eye). It shows a distinct lack of not caring how people perceive him. Would like him to say more on other people though.

@stickmanramp- by the logic of "an extra vote wouldn't increase pressure because nobody is getting lynched at that point" most earlygame votes are pointless and achieve no result. Your vote is not new and adds nothing particularly novel other than the bit about the vote being pointless (which is not really true). In fact it's sheeping that's worse than Red Eye bc it looks like it isn't,

actually this is my major problem with the Red Eye wagon; it's a wagon against sheeping and all the votes after the original (Scum Goon's) are just sheeping themselves.

also fun fact I used to name some of my MMO characters Stickmanclan clearly this ramp dude is ripping off me

[Ochako Uraraka]

In fact it's sheeping that's worse than Red Eye bc it looks like it isn't,

lol wat

IMO lynch this guy after Red Eye (not really maybe who knows)

also fun fact I used to name some of my MMO characters Stickmanclan clearly this ramp dude is ripping off me

1v1 me irl scrub

[Marisa Kirisame]

also death's wife vote is weak and he doesn't really explain how there are no justifications for either of wife's votes.

I was going to case twitter famous kind of but knuckles makes a good point about defending the people attacking him

oh and @wife- scum goon said that he agreed that it wasn't that good a vote, but that it still wasn't scummy (hence the 'what else should he have said')

[Marisa Kirisame]

are you implying that you were the first person to accuse Red Eye of sheeping?

[Ochako Uraraka]

I think you and I have very different definitions of what the word "sheeping" means

[Marisa Kirisame]

1v1 me irl scrub

I was in a fight once irl and we both punched each other. I fell down and then got bored and went home true story

[Marisa Kirisame]

I think you and I have very different definitions of what the word "sheeping" means

To me, sheeping is using somebody else's reasoning for a vote. When done in disguise of an Actual Original Vote it's scummy because you're trying to look like you're contributing and doing stuff while you're actually just paraphrasing somebody else, whereas if you explicitly admit it you're not pretending.

What is sheeping to you? You have: 8 hours and 36 minutes to formulate an answer

[Cú Chulainn]

@stickmanramp- by the logic of "an extra vote wouldn't increase pressure because nobody is getting lynched at that point" most earlygame votes are pointless and achieve no result. Your vote is not new (...)

... You know, I was going to say that if only I decided not to because I wanted to see Red Eyes justify himself.

also thanks manix, it sure is cool right

just not seeing the FANGIRL IS TOWN FOR EFFORT AND TRYING TO GET PAST RVS conclusions; I see someone whose first case looked contrived and self-conscious and who hides not very much content behind a lot of :words: and RPing. Beyond the initial TF vote I didn't see any effort to look at, say, Red Eye for sheeping, or the people voting him for that.

I'm not buying the 'contrived' part (and the 'self-conscious' I already said that I find it nitpicking) because her vote doesn't seem that serious to me. She just wanted to get past RVS and abandoned the case as soon as there was more content. I agree with your point about her not doing much past RVS though, I do want to see more from both of you now that we're done with it.

oh and @wife- scum goon said that he agreed that it wasn't that good a vote, but that it still wasn't scummy (hence the 'what else should he have said')

My issue with this is the way he expressed himself, actually. He criticized you for voting her based on "what else should she have said?" after criticizing her reasons to vote TF. If anything he didn't actually counter your case, he nullified his own read.

damn my logic sucks at 00:23

lol wat

IMO lynch this guy after Red Eye (not really maybe who knows)

1v1 me irl scrub

ttly an omgus here guys

also stop using my catchphrase scrub your not even ripped enough to be boasting around

[Cú Chulainn]

To me, sheeping is using somebody else's reasoning for a vote. When done in disguise of an Actual Original Vote it's scummy because you're trying to look like you're contributing and doing stuff while you're actually just paraphrasing somebody else, whereas if you explicitly admit it you're not pretending.

Whether you pretend or not, you're still doing it, therefore it doesn't change the fact that it something bad that must be addressed.

[Ochako Uraraka]

What is sheeping to you? You have: 8 hours and 36 minutes to formulate an answer

what if i don't answer

what then

... You know, I was going to say that if only I decided not to because I wanted to see Red Eyes justify himself.

I'm laughing IRL because I literally removed a line that said something to the effect of "if you are unironically trying to get L1F lynched I will smite you" because I noticed that I am unironically trying to get Red Eyes lynched

ttly an omgus here guys

also stop using my catchphrase scrub your not even ripped enough to be boasting around

o no

ive been caught

idc how ripped u r ill win bc im a WOLF

[Ochako Uraraka]

On a more serious note "you're a hypocrite" isn't actually a defense

[Ochako Uraraka]

On a more serious note "you're a hypocrite" isn't actually a defense nor does it inherently make the argument any less valid

[Sham]

##Vote: Scum Goon

inb4 i am voted for sheeping the wife

inb4 i am voted for being self conscious

inb4 i am voted for being ironic and using strikethrough so much

Anyone who votes you for sheeping town and being ironic is dumb.

[Sham]

After that first post, L1F is so clearly a villager it hurts

Disregarding the explicit sheeping for a moment (although honestly sheeping is a classic wolf tactic anyway; it's such an easy way to get away with not having to bullshit their own cases on an innocent and lets them not have to take responsibility for a misflip), I dislike this because it's pointless. What exactly are you trying to accomplish with this vote? It doesn't really add more pressure because there's absolutely no way L1F getting lynched at that time. To me this seems like a wolf trying to blend in "hey look at me, I'm being useful!"

Why couldn't it conceivably come from a wolf? It's such an easy thing to say, and talk is cheap

##Unvote

##Vote Red Eye

Waifu bothers me but she's also doing good, pro-village things so I'll ignore it for now.

Explain your townread on the fangirl.

Sheeping isn't scummy because it draws attention to the fact that a person doesn't have content. Also it DOES help draw associative reads later on so there's nothing wrong with it as long as it is explicit.

I already said why it was less likely to come from scum. Probably will reread since so many people seem to have an issue with my town read there. Or not. I do what I want.

[Sham]

oh and @wife- scum goon said that he agreed that it wasn't that good a vote, but that it still wasn't scummy (hence the 'what else should he have said')

What, really? Fuck.

[Sham]

Meh, every time I give out a read there's a lot of resistance to it and I'm not sure if it's because I'm correct (and scum is trying to discredit me) or I fucked up somewhere. Going to reread the game and hopefully have a more definite idea of who is what.

[C. C.]

Whoops, sorry for not thinking everyone who votes against me or suspects me is scum. I guess I'm playing this game wrong.

[Refakitty³]

But it was a #preemptive attempt at #deflection just in case my #jokevote wasn't accepted. Props to #Fangirl because if anyone was self-conscious it was me.

@Deathbound: For someone making a case against someone trying too hard to imply scum intent in another's post, you're pretty much doing the exact same thing, no?

##Unvote

##Vote:Red Eye

That was a silly sheep. Someone's got to take something over seriously in order to get out of RVS, otherwise we get nowhere.

Didn't reply to this initially because it was another close window post and I had to go cook food and other things (I made enough to pack a lunch for Lucifer too, but I'm kind of embarrassed to give it to him tomorrow, aaaaaaaaaaaaah). Overall a satisfying rebuttal where TF owns up and acknowledges, yet is more than just pure defensive. I give a pass on the attempted claim I saw later that it was sheeping Scum Goon because close post timing, and I know those feels.

The confusion made between Red Eye and Scum Goon later is a bit baffling for me though, when they have such different avatars, and I'm slightly confused on their changing opinion of me (going from "props" in #66 to an agreement that I write just heaps of bullshit you don't want to read. I mean, seriously, this isn't even my final form! I should show you the fanfic I'm writing, it's glorious )

All in all though, their behaviour doesn't warrant my continued vote.

##Unvote

Initial impressions of The Wife are mostly favorable. I might have to give their posting style a try sometime, just do things one page at a time (or maybe even just significant clump) and post what I have when I have it whenever I find myself behind a number of pages and facing that struggle to catch up. It does come with its own set of inconveniences though... Proceeding along with some direct replies to their posed questions.

Is Kenji scum.

Kenji is pretty null for me, considering their disappearance. I don't put too much stock in their attempt to paint me with the brush of omgus, because the question of whether or not it was a seriously held opinion. Until more develops from him, I honestly can't say.

What is the point of this post.

I have a (bad?) habit of trying to reply to direct enquiries, and I because curious about opinions halfway through typing it. It's not my greatest of contributions, to be sure, but as long as I don't drop to the level of spam or shit-posting, I like to think the more I can manage to get myself to post, the better. Injecting some (apparently not so appreciated) roleplay into things is also how I keep myself entertained, if that was the part you were objecting to.

The big thing I disagree with how Wife proceeded was the whole thing with the wincons. As I already snarked at Deathbound for, giving free outs is never something you really want to do. Yeah, it's not the thing that is often going to end up being a deciding factor, but why discard potential tools without even giving them a chance.

Why are you concerned with my activity when we have 50 hours left in the phase?

This is a terrible attitude to have and you should be ashamed for holding it. Activity is always precious. How often do things fall apart in the last few hours of a day before deadline because people have been taking the lax approach of "oh, we have plenty of time." Now, I'm aware that I'm not always on point for being a model citizen of constant posting, I acknowledge my faults and try to work past them.

Was that really necessary. Also what walls are you reading. His post have been pretty concise and to the point IMO.

This is just silly, I'll freely acknowledge that my prose can veer towards the purple end of the spectrum (though at least I've not stooped to referring to a certain user as Vermillion Optics, lol! Thanks for putting a smile on my face, and maybe trying to butter me up, but my heart is already spoken for. I need no white knights (nor death knights) defending my honor.

Maybe wife is scum. She sorta jumps between SG and TF without really explaining why. Not to mention both of the justifications for voting them don't exist. And obviously Minerva is scum for dodging my super scum hunting idea.##Vote: The Wife. Oh also manix is still the hidden cult leader.

This post really does not sit well with me at all. It feels like Death isn't really reading the thread (as I thought the answers to their concerns were already addressed), and their attitude is currently rubbing me the wrong way. For now I feel their content is poor enough to justify a vote.

##Vote: Death

Actually, I'm honestly getting pretty tired, and there's still a lot more to catch up on (stickman and knuckles, for one, the acclaimed game for the genesis), I think I'm going to have to just post what I have now.

[Kamina]

I can't give an honest unbiased read on The Wife because fsr I find his avatar/username so funny that I really really want them to be townbuddies with me, but at the same time I have a bad feeling about her that I can't place (but this might be me compensating for the first thing)

Whoops, sorry for not thinking everyone who votes against me or suspects me is scum. I guess I'm playing this game wrong.

Apology accepted.

Stickman: Scum or just dumb? Currently leaning dumb. His logic makes no sense and he's very narrow minded. However, he's done p much nothing other than hound my case so might be scum trying to look useful

Knuckles: What would you rather someone do when they agree with someone's case and have nothing to add? This is a REAL THING that happens in REAL MAFIA GAMES. Get over this idea that if someone isn't constantly producing new content that they're doing something wrong

Death said he was gonna reread since we're out of RVS but has yet to really do fuck all. See, buddy, this is what I was saying when I said you needed to do shit eventually. Your posts since are half useless and your Wife vote is terrible

Lucifer can you take a course in technical writing so that your posts aren't so absurdly tldr. FUN FACT: I haven't read your posts

actually this is my major problem with the Red Eye wagon; it's a wagon against sheeping and all the votes after the original (Scum Goon's) are just sheeping themselves.

Well duh, that's why I called out Twitter Famous on being dumb

also I'm not even trying to hide who I am so I'll be disappointed if you didn't get me after like 2 posts =(

Who the fuck am I even voting

##Unvote, ##Vote: Death

I don't wanna vote Scum Goon since idk votals and waiting for him to respond, currently think other players might just be dumb so this is my best lead

[Kamina]

Actually Lucifer could also be a lead but it feels wrong to vote a guy whose posts I'm not even reading.

[Nemu Kurotsuchi]

Any particular reason you're being so particularly impudent Red Eye? Your posts are devoid of any meaningful content, and instead seem to consist of insults and nonsense. Hell, and you just voted Death without providing any sort of justification. Which seems to be a common theme with you.

Probably the most wtf-worthy thing you've said is that you're not even reading Fangirls posts. Analyzing the posts of players is the point of the game.

I don't think your acting as such just for the hell of it either. It seems more like it's intentional. This is a bastard game after all, so it's not entirely out of the question.

I'll have a more comprehensive post in a bit concerning the others, but this needed to be said as soon as I could.

[Sham]

I can't give an honest unbiased read on The Wife because fsr I find his avatar/username so funny that I really really want them to be townbuddies with me, but at the same time I have a bad feeling about her that I can't place (but this might be me compensating for the first thing)

I was too busy reading "The Art of Fakeclaiming", back off man; I'm like, married.

[Shiki Ryougi]

So there's actual content to go through, k.

Page 3

- Death..'s posts/spammage hurts the eyes. Pls no.

- Odd reaction, given that it's not unusual to see RVS votes scattered randomly on actual in-game players and non-players.

- Pot meet kettle. Post in itself does nothing to remedy the issue at hand.

- Post #57 (having some issues linking their posts) = Nitpicking on someone's RVS vote for what appears to be no reason?

- Though I can agree with not liking post #57, this post feels too graspy in itself. Also, the secondary notion wrt Death was kinda unnecessary imo.

- This defeats the purpose of an anonymous game.

Page 4

- Don't really see/agree in the point in this post- easiest pass on "hey contribute please" votes, when prod votes in themselves generally don't do a whole lot for progressing the game. And notions wrt players/anon shizz is getting old.

- Sheeping already? And why gripe about Death posting when there's more than enough time for meaningful content to come from him? (Filler much?) And enough with the "let's figure out the people behind the anon names".

- Post #63: I'm not seeing the whole "I honestly don't mind being voted" as being a townslip, since either side could easily say such a comment (and the logic behind it is likewise reasonable by either sides).

- Don't see/agree with how Lucy's being a tryhard, since a lot of responses are sorta RP/filler comments within the replies and otherwise doesn't seem any far out of the ordinary in terms of #effort.

- Weird buddying feeling towards Fangirl with the comment, and the reasoning behind the vote ("someone taking something seriously") seems weak in itself. The game was already coming out of the RVS state just fine at that point- not much of a bullet to take there.

- Lucy's posts =/= walls, post oozes of laziness, and the Twitter comment seems more like an ad hominem of sorts than anything.

- Wrt this: (As said above) Don't agree with the townslip notion, neutral on the sheeping notion (imo, Sheeping in itself is not scummy, but is an common trait/action/tactic of scum, as sheeping is much easier to do than to actually pull up their own full-fledged case on someone else.).

- Or you could've given town scum's wincon, since one could easily assume Light vs. Darkness regardless of which side/wincon they knew.

Page 5

- Disagree with Lucifer's posts being concise, and whether sheeping is scummy or not is dictated by how it's executed and why.

- I don't fully agree with the Wife notions- the Scum Goon vote seems to be justified due to the amount of "fence-sitting" based on prior posts, though I do feel that the TF vote feels more detached and lacks the backing the former vote had. (And must you still drag on the RVS shizz wrt Manix?)

- "I don't really see why he'd defend me as scum" is a flimsy reason at best; the logic is no better than "X wouldn't say/do Y as scum", in which said action/words can easily be said/done by either side.

- Wrt this: 1. Seems too easy of a town-pass to Fangirl, 2. Though I do not disagree that Red Eye's vote was bad, I feel that the post/explanation of such was borderline excessive, and the notion about "Lucifer's not getting lynched at that point" is beyond given- no one's going to quick-hammer anyone ED1, and the rest just looks like needless fluff. 3. Pot meet kettle wrt "it seems like trying really hard to make L1F a villager/could be buddying" - you said so yourself: "After that first post, L1F is so clearly a villager it hurts". and 4. Waifu notion sounds like you're giving another free pass to go- just because someone's doing something pro-town doesn't mean you don't look into them or ignore any sort of feeling.

- Content itself seems reasonable, but don't care for the padding text at the bottom that's struck out.

Page 6

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Actually, I'm deadpan tired, and I don't care to miss stuff while going over it all, so I'm going to sleep and continuing on Page 6 stuffs tomorrow.

Thoughts as of page 6:

- Wife, Twitter_Famous, stickmanramp, and Red Eye ping me atm; don't really like the gut vibes.

- Fine with Knuckles, want to hear more from Death, and unsure about Deathbound.

- Those who aren't alive need to be alive.

And, as a side note to all: Please stop with the player specs, and/or whatever nonsense that goes with it. Kinda killing the element of an anonymous game (even if it is a bastard one), which practically defeats the purpose of the game set-up itself. Even if you do know/find out who someone is/isn't, keep it to yourselves, please and thanks.

[Kamina]

Impudent? Not really. I'm just stating the truth (well, the reply to Twitter was perhaps a bit dickish, but I wasn't sure if he was joking or not). Most of the people voting so far have pretty questionable logic, as Deathbound pointed out. I guess your issue is that I wasn't very nice about it? If so, sorry I guess, but the logic in a lot of these posts is worse than what I expect from people, even newbies

I was too busy reading "The Art of Fakeclaiming", back off man; I'm like, married.

It's okay we're both ladies here