NekoKnight
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Posts posted by NekoKnight
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I don't really see why people liked the PoR support system. The GBA method was tedious and illogical but at least you could A-support anyone if you were patient enough. With PoR, the game screwed you over if you decided not to use a unit for a mission. Awakening makes way more sense and is easier in most cases as well.
As for things I'd like added back in, practically everything that was in the GBA games that wasn't in Awakening, including:
-Strength based magical weapons
-Poison, Silence, Stone, Sleep, Berserk inducing weapons
-Reaver weapons
-Balistas on the map
-More victory conditions
-Light magic and Dark magic
-Alternate missions/New game from different perspective
-Thieves being able to steal
-More meaningful terrain
-characters being recruited by someone besides the Lord
Also, Soldiers/Halberdiers from Tellius.
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I think that's the opposite of what Viole is saying. I think what he's trying to get across is that he preferred the fact that Mustafa wasn't that important in the long run because it felt like this is what's happening to all the soldiers? So it seems much sadder because of the fact that in the long run nobody really cares about what he did? Correct mt if i'm wrong Viole.
As for my opinion, I'm all for more fleshed out characters, boss or otherwise. If the way that is going to be done is through more Camus' then fair enough. The only problem I can see is if they overuse it in 14 and it becomes bland. Personally, I much prefer the Hardin archetype, as I prefer tragic to sad characters. Whilst the majority of Hardins have been the final boss/secondary antagonist I still see no problem doing what FE10 did with Dhenginsea. The problem with this archetype is that it is much easier to make this kind of character feel forced and hackney then the Camus, due to the often "he wasn't loved" back-story.
These are definitely not archetypes and tropes to overuse. If there are too many of such characters, the emotions will seem forced and cheapen the effect. I think the tragic/sad characters need to fit into a larger narrative where the player can feel what they did was ultimately the right thing to do, but feel saddened by the losses suffered by friend and foe alike. There is room in the story for developed, tragic figures you have to defeat for the greater good and one-shot characters who exist primarily to show that kind and honorable people exist on the enemy side as well.
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My problem with gender locked classes isn't that one gender becomes overpowered, it's that it arbitrarily stops one gender from being something for no good reason. For example why can't women be berserkers? The class is literally just an axe user that doesn't care much for defense. Does having boobs somehow stop you from getting reckless? Does the feminine jawline make it too hard to strap the skull to your head? If so that could easily be solved by making a woman like Sully or Echidna.
I can't make any commentary on the male only classes (unless a masculine build is required to weild the axes in the way they do) but for Pegasis it's implied that they will only accept female riders, so there's that.
Female:
Troubadour
Cleric
Dancer
Manakete
Pegasus Knight
Trainee
Bride
Princess
Male:
Fighter
Barbarian
Pirate
Priest
Monk
Villager
Pupil
Bard
Prince
Journeyman
Conqueror
Dread Fighter
To be fair, a number of the classes listed are only used by one character so to say they are gender-locked is a little misleading.
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Normal mode: nothing different.
Hard mode: all enemies have unique names.
Lunatic mode: all enemies have unique names and mugs.
Lunatic+ mode: all enemies have unique names, mugs and death quotes.
Have. Fun.
When you beat the mission on Luntatic+, there is a black screen with big red words "SHAME ON YOU!" and then the save file deletes itself.
Fire Empathy
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A few antagonists that you can sympathize with is always refreshing. Imagine a map where the player grievously wounds the enemy leader and his second in command leads the rest of the troops in a last stand so their liege lord can escape. You could even make it better by having SEVERAL non recruit-able named characters on the map who know each other to show that the enemy is not so different than the player's army. Alternatively, it could be an "Escape" map for the ENEMY, and you need to defeat them before the boss escapes.
Fire Emblem: Prepare to Cry Edition
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Legionary sounds pretty good. Makes it sound like the most durable of the single weapon classes which is cool to me. You could give them a bit of both the resistance tank and dodge tank roles to reflect this, maybe some support skills...At this rate I'm going to have to make my own class list soon.
Don't forget about the bonfires confirmed a little beforehand.Yeah, I like those ideas. I thought it would be nice to have the Soldier line be complimentary to Knights. The latter is a solid wall that can tank physical hits and the former would be quicker and have enough resistance to handle enemy mages. One skill I had in mind was something that enhances terrain bonuses.
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Fair enough. Once again I come to the old class name problem. Perhaps hoplite could work? Those guys used spears a lot, and weren't too heavily armored.
Actually you'll find sword axes are better suited to the task.
Hoplite is an option. Another name I like is "Legionary" which gives an elite sounding vibe. Plus it would fit with the new roman themed western army in this Fire Emblem.
Also, small cat Laguz wearing Beorc armor confirmed for playable characters. -
Ehh, I don't care one way or the other for soldiers, but if they do come back I'd rather that they didn't promote to dragoons. So many franchises have used "dragoon" that it's become a staple of jrpgs. Halberdier is a much more unique sounding class than dragoon, and I'd like fire emblem to keep its uniqueness.
I swear it's like spears were specifically made to hunt dragons or something.
Well, you can't deny the influence of Final Fantasy. :)
I'd be happy enough with another name but Halberdiers don't even use halberds so that could use a change.
And yes, spears are specifically made to hunt dragons. I happen to be an expert on this topic.
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Flyers need a nerf anyways, but wind already presented this threat and it didnt nerf them, why would this?
Bows should have 2-5 range, no close range yet near the same ridiculousness of FE2s
Wind was a bad idea for a flying counter because 1. Pegasus already have high resistance, which makes Wind magic only useful against the Wyvern line and 2. Wind tomes have such pitifully low Might that even effective damage is negligible. I think bow users could use a buff but their range shouldn't be THAT good.
If they had 2-3 range on normal bows and 2-4 with a longbow, they could outclass mages on their turn but still be vulnerable for the counterattack.
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Then just attack with a not Flyer? Problem solved
If you have non-flying units as escorts then sure but I can think of plenty of situations where flying units will be sent ahead because of their superior movement and need to take out enemy archers before they can attack. Archers are enough of a threat to fliers when they can't counter-attack, let alone if they could.
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I'd very much like to have them back but highly doubt their inclusion. The new classes will likely be brand new ones and IS seems determined to keep Soldiers the cannon fodder enemy.
I had hoped to see Soldiers restored as playable units that could promote to Dragoons (Lance specialists) and Sentinels (Lance and Bow).
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FE's classes have been fairly gender-neutral on the whole over the years with Pegasus knights and Warriors being the only 'true' gender-segregated classes on the whole (that aren't specific to one character at least). Not only do we have the 'bard' counter-part to the dancer, but also heron Laguz so that class is pretty 'gender neutral' as well. Honestly, as I mentioned before, I'd rather keep peggies and warriors gender-segregated and keep that uniqueness about them than introduce male peggies/female warriors just for the heck of it.
You're forgetting Berserkers and Valkyrie, unless I'm mistaken.
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Mind if I add my two cents?
If a promoted class uses multiple weapons, one could go to A rank and the other to S rank depending on what they promoted from
Examples:
Bow Knight:Bow rank S/Sword rank A
Hero: Sword rank S/Axe rank A
Paladin: Lance rank S/Sword rank A
I liked the Blazing Sword method the best where you can only S rank 1 weapon type but it's whatever the player reaches first.
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The only other way I could see it working is if you restrict max weapon level like FE9-10 did where the max staff rank a Sage/Valkyrie could get is only like C or B, enough to use a Physic staff I guess, and make all the really good staves higher rank that only one class could get to. I don't really like that idea though.
I've mentioned it in other posts, but yes that is basically what I'd be advocating for (but it would be class based, not weapon rank). The Sniper, Swordmaster, Berserker and Dragoon (new, lance only promoted unit) would compensate for their limited weapon skills by having weapons that are exclusive to that class. The Saint, only having staves, would have exclusive access to some really good staves like Warp and Fortify.
Plus the two skills I suggested
Staff Mastery: All staves have +1 range.
Divine Favor: Enemies will choose other targets if available.
This would make an unparalled support class. Perhaps even more valuable than other magic classes that share support and combat functions.
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I think it would be neat if the MU could be another race such as Manakete or Taguel and make some story adjustments to accomodate this. It would be like Dragon Age where certain interactions are different depending on your race and maybe have a few special missions as well.
I don't want to simply ride dragons, I want to be one.
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Edit: Unintentional double post. Apologies.
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Using Awakening as a point of reference, for the next Fire Emblem I'd like to see:
1. More defensive maps and more terrain that can be used strategically. I want to see maps that require you to retreat to avoid being overwhelmed or have to gamble to retrieve treasure while under heavy siege.
2. Make each class have a defined role and have skills to support said role. No generic "This unit's evasion is slightly higher when the sun is shining and it's on a Tuesday" skills.
3. Make logical branching promotions. No units should lose or change their mount on promotion. No one should lose a weapon skill they had in their base class (ex. Dark Mage > Dark Knight)
4. Keep S level supports but limit the pairing options. I want to see real relationships, not "anyone with anyone" to support Eugenics Emblem.
5. Related to the above point, I want to see a strong cast without 2nd generation children.
6. More weapon diversity. Magic weapons that deal damage based on Strength and the Reaver weapons would be welcome returns. Also status-inducing weapons and staves.
7. Light and Dark Magic to return along with the magic triangle.
8. Make second seals rare outside of NG+. Make it so the 2nd skill of the promoted tier is learned earlier.
9. Item scrolls to learn non-class specific skills.
10. MU to be a significant character character but not the star or co-star of the plot.
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Letting archers counterattack at range one with damage and/or accuracy penalties is something to consider but I fear it might nerf flying units too much. Unless you one-shot the archer, that's like attacking a hammer wielding foe with your Knight.
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To be fair, the teleportation is always ridiculously good, staves had alot more variety when status aliments were a thing still too. I personally don't think we need offensive staves. Imagine Saul in FE6 for a moment with access to super long range attacks all because his base stave rank is awesome and his magic is nothing to sneeze at.
That's what I was thinking. Some staves are really good, maybe too good, but they could be balanced by handing them to a Staff exclusive class. Not having an attack may suck but if you are given enough incentive (and tweaks to gaining experience), even a Staff only unit could be enticing. My vision of an improved Fire Emblem would be for every class to have a distinct usage. Everything being super combat oriented gets boring.
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Bishops/Saints in FE10 got Light magic, and leveling them with staves was a pain. This is coming from someone who makes a conscious effort to train Laura for the endgame. LAURA.
Supposing that minmaxing is nonexistent just makes the class seem worse. IT WOULD MAKE IT SO THAT YOU'D LOSE ALL ABILITY TO ATTACK WHATSOEVER FOR THE REST OF THE GAME.
One of the biggest motivators for promoting my healers it to let them Attack and gain EXP easier.
In addition, War Cleric was a pretty bad class due to the typically low Str of Clerics. Sure, Bolt Axes helped (specially since you could just buy them from L'Arachel) but getting the axe rank was tedious.
Giving Clerics no magical attacker promotions just made it worse on them.
What's more, your sages/whatever would be able to heal just as well and survive from crazy dodging skill quite easily. Making them even worse in comparison.
Fair points. I understand the frustration of having units without any attack so it could be worth it to give Saints a magic attack. I just wanted to make Saints different than Bishops. I never thought very highly of War Monks/Clerics because it's not really a good idea to turn your squishy healer into a frontline fighter. Maybe if they got the Defense of a Sorcerer it would be worth it. I'm at a loss for creative things to do with the staff using units. I want to avoid making them the same as Sages/Bishops/Sorcerers.
Edit: A possible idea for Saints would be that they get unique attack staves that can be used as you would a magic tome but are not affected by the magic weapon triangle. Minor distinction, but would make them a bit more unique. (The animation of Bishops in the GBA titles already appear to do this.)
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Things I noticed:
Why the hell do fighters share with Griffons? You also completely dropped Warriors, which is the most common promotion for Fighters. Bezerkers are more associated with Brigands.
I'm going to be blunt about the Saint Class... a stafflocked promoted class outright sucks. You screwed over Priests big time. Yeah, the skills are nice, but being unable to attack/counterattack at all is a massive drawback. It hurts EXP gain (since I'm 90% sure we won't have FE13 rescue back). Give them Light magic or SOMETHING to attack with.
More of a personal thing: but FE8 Mage Knights were great with Anima/Staves...
Thanks for the feedback. And now for the reasoning behind the choices:
Fighters are paired with Gryphon Riders because they are themantically similar (in my headcanon) and both use axes. Because the one-unique/one-shared promotion system necessitates base units being in even number, I had to drop one of the axe users or create another base class to pair with gryphon riders. Either Barbarians/Brigands or Fighters, I don't have a preference but generally player characters are Fighters. The Sky Hunter is aesthetically and functionally a Gryphon mounted Warrior, hence the reason I cut the Warrior.
For the Saint, I chose Staff only because it's unique, and like the other one-weapon-skill classes, they would get weapons exclusive to that class. The class skills are to let them be able to use their staves without getting into danger so they don't need to fight. They are, by definition, dedicated support/healer units. For experience, you would need to adjust the experience values they get to compensate for the fact that they can't kill anything personally (I think Radiant Dawn did this).Another thing to keep in mind is these classes are partially designed around the philosophy that second seals aren't readily available to the player. If you are a min-maxer/collect the best skill sets kind of player, it would be better to choose a different class as your final promotion.
The Mage Knights are just renamed Dark Knights. I thought the name inappropriate considering they don't use Dark tomes here or even in Awakening. Dark Fliers were also changed to Seraph Knights to reflect their new weapon usage.
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Here is the new class/skill system I designed to make each base class have a unique promotion as well as a shared one, and have skills to better define their role. There are plenty of new classes and skills to balance things out.
First the class break down. Two base classes share a single promoted class (the middle one). Themed group names for no reason in particular.
The Lord
Lord (Sword) > Greatlord (Sword and Lance)
The Lancers
Soldier (Lance)/Squire (Lance)
Dragoon (Lance)/Sentinel (Lance and Bow)/Templar (Lance and Sword)
The Knights
Cavalier (Lance and Sword)/Knight (Lance)
Paladin (Lance and Sword)/Great Knight (Lance, Sword and Axe)/General (Lance and Axe)
The Swordsmen
Thief (Sword)/Myrmidon (Sword)
Trickster (Sword and Staff)/Assassin (Sword and Bow)/Swordmaster (Sword)
The Mercenaries
Mercenary (Sword)/Archer (Bow)
Hero (Sword and Axe)/Ranger (Sword and Bow)/Sniper (Bow)
The Mountain Clan
Barbarian (Axe)/Gryphon Rider (Axe)
Berserker (Axe)/Sky Hunter (Axe and Bow)/Gryphon Knight (Axe and Sword)
The Dragon Cult
Dark Mage (Dark tome)/Wyvern Rider (Axe)
Sorcerer (Dark tome and Staff)/Dark Drake (Dark tome and Axe)/Wyvern Lord (Axe and Lance)
The Holy Warriors
Light Mage (Light tome)/Pegasus Rider (Lance)
Bishop (Light tome and Staff)/Seraph Knight (Lance and Light tome)/Falcon Knight (Lance and Staff)
The Magi
Mage (Anima tome)/Tactician (Anima tome)
Sage (Anima tome and Staff)/Mage Knight (Anima tome and Sword)/Grandmaster (Anima tome and Dark tome)
The Healers
Priest (Staff)/Troubadour (Staff)
War Monk (Staff and Axe)/Saint (Staff)/Valkyrie (Staff and Light tome)
Others
Dancer
Taguel
Manakete
Next are the skills for all the classes which I retooled to give each class a different feel so even classes that share weapon types are quite different to use. Red skills are new ones and Bold skills are old ones that I reworked.
[Lord]Dual Strike+: Adds 10% to the Dual Strike rate
[Lord]Charm: Hit rate and Avoid +10 to all allies within a 3 tile radius
[Great Lord]Aether: Attack twice consecutively, with the first strike having a Sol effect and the second strike having a Luna effect. Skill/2%
[Great Lord]Rightful King: Adds 10% to Skill activation rates
[Recruit]Aptitude: Adds 20% to all growth rates during Level Ups
[Recruit]Underdog: Hit rate and Avoid +15 when user's Level is lower than the enemy (promoted units count as Level +20)
[soldier]Defender: Resistance +1 and Defense +1
[soldier]Iron Nerves: Take 50% less damage from critical hits.
[Dragoon]Defensible Position: Doubles the effect of terrain bonuses.
[Dragoon]Lancefaire: Strength +5 when equipped with a lance .
[sentinel]Quick-draw: Able to counter-attack with Bows at melee range for 75% damage.
[sentinel]Last Stand: Strength, Magic and Speed times 1.5 when health is under 50%
[squire]HP +5: Maximum HP +5
[squire]Escort: Stats +1 when paired up.
[Templar]Feedback: When hit by a Magic attack, enemy will be stunned. (Skill*2%)
[Templar]Mana Burn: Damage increased by an amount equal to Enemy Magic*0.5
[Cavalier]Discipline: Weapon experience x2
[Cavalier]Canto: Unit may use the remainder of its move after an attack.
[Paladin]Launcher: Paired allies may move immediately after separating.
[Paladin]Aegis: Halves damage from bows, tomes and dragonstones. Skill%
[Great Knight]Luna: Ignores half the enemy's Defense or Resistance. Skill%
[Great Knight]Dual Guard+: Adds 10% to the Dual Guard rate
[Knight]Defense +2: Defense +2
[Knight]Phalanx: Defense and Resistance +1 for each adjacent ally
[General]Rally Defense: Defense +2 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[General]Pavise: Halves damage from swords, lances, axes (includes magical variants) and beaststones. Skill%
[Myrmidon]Avoid +10: Avoid +10
[Myrmidon]Vantage: When HP under half, always attack first during the enemy's Turn
[swordmaster]Astra: Deals 5 consecutive hits with half damage. Skill%
[swordmaster]Swordfaire: Strength +5 when equipped with a sword.
[Assassin]Pass: User can pass through tiles occupied by enemy units
[Assassin]Lethality: Activated ability (x2) Instantly defeats an enemy. Can't miss.
[Thief]Locktouch: Open doors and chests without the need of keys
[Thief]Movement +1: Movement +1
[Trickster]Acrobat: All traversable terrain costs 1 movement point to cross
[Trickster]Born Lucky: Critical Hit and Critical Avoid increased by an amount equal to the user's luck.
[Mercenary]Armsthrift: Attack does not reduce weapon usage. Luck*2%
[Mercenary]Disarm: Unequips enemy weapon. Skill%
[Hero]Sol: Recover HP equal to half the damage dealt to the enemy. Skill%
[Hero]Axebreaker: Hit rate and Avoid +50 when the enemy is equipped with an axe
[Ranger]Rally Skill: Skill +2 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[Ranger]Bowbreaker: Hit rate and Avoid +50 when the enemy is equipped with a bow
[Archer]Skill +2: Skill +2
[Archer]Prescience: Hit rate and Avoid +15 during the user's Turn
[sniper]Longbolt: Activated Ability (x2) Attack across the map with a bow. (Range = 2 + Strength*0.5)
[sniper]Bowfaire: Strength +5 when equipped with a bow
[Fighter]Gamble: Hit rate -5, Critical +10
[Fighter]Trade Blows: Can't be double hit.
[berserker]Wrath: Critical +20 when under half HP
[berserker]Axefaire: Strength +5 when equipped with an axe.
[sky Hunter]Deliverer: Movement +2 when paired up
[sky Hunter]Lancebreaker: Hit rate and Avoid +50 when the enemy is equipped with a lance
[Gryphon Rider]Brave Heart: Strength +1 and Speed +1
[Gryphon]Flock: All stats +1 when within 3 tiles of another (flying) allied unit.
[Gryphon Knight]Rally Movement: Movement +1 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[Gryphon Knight]Counter: Returns damage when attacked by an adjacent enemy (except damage that KOs the user)
[Wyvern Rider]Strength +2: Strength +2
[Wyvern Rider]Predator: Hit rate and Avoid +15 against (flying) enemies.
[Wyvern Lord]Rally Strength: Strength +2 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[Wyvern Lord]Ire: Fire a ranged blast (damage = strength) when you are unable to counterattack.
[Dark Drake]Cursed Weapon: Weapon hits reduce enemy skill and resistance by 50% for 1 turn.
[Dark Drake]Daunt: Enemies within a 3 tile radius have their Hit Rating reduced by 10.
[Dark Mage]Hex: Avoid -15 to a+ll adjacent enemies
[Dark Mage]Anathema: Avoid and Critical Avoid -10 to all enemies within a 3 tile radius
[sorcerer]Vengeance: Deals (user's Max HP - Current HP)/2 extra damage. Skill*2%
[sorcerer]Tomebreaker: Hit rate and Avoid +50 when the enemy is equipped with a tome
[Pegasus Rider]Speed +2: Speed +2
[Pegasus Rider]Relief: Recover 20% HP at the start of the user's Turn if no units are within a 3 tile radius
[Falcon Knight]Rally Speed: Speed +2 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[Falcon Knight]Swordbreaker: Hit rate and Avoid +50 when the enemy is equipped with a sword
[seraph Knight]Blessed Weapon: If the enemy's resistance is lower than their defense, this attack deals magic damage. Skill*2%
[seraph Knight]Sanctified: Allies within 3 tiles have their critical hit rate increase by 10.
[Light Mage]Faith: Critical Avoid +15
[Light Mage]Blinding Light: Enemies damaged by user's attacks have their Hit rate and Avoid reduced by 15 until the end of the next turn.
[bishop]Smite: Deals double damage to Monsters
[bishop]Crusader: Heal 30% of damage dealt to enemies.
[Mage]Magic +2: Magic +2
[Mage]Charge: After selecting Wait, next attack will deal 50% more damage.
[sage]Rally Magic: Magic +2 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[sage]Tomefaire: Magic +5 when equipped with a Tome
[Mage Knight]Ignis: Adds (Magic)/2 to Strength when dealing physical damage and (Strength)/2 to Magic when dealing magical damage. Skill%
[Mage Knight]Lifetaker: User recovers 50% HP after they defeat an enemy during the user's Turn
[Tactician]Veteran: Experience gain x 1.5 when paired up
[Tactician]Solidarity: Critical and Critical Avoid +15 to adjacent allies.
[Grandmaster]Fear: Afflicts enemy with the Fear status making them unable to move (but still attack) for a turn. Skill*2%
[Grandmaster]Rally Spectrum: All Stats +2 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[Priest]Miracle: Damage received is reduced by 50% (Luck%)
[Priest]Healer: Restores an extra 7 HP when healing allies
[War Monk]Rally Luck: Luck +4 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[War Monk]Renewal: Recover 30% HP at the start of the user's Turn
[saint]Staff Mastery: All staves have +1 range.
[saint]Divine Favor: Enemies will choose other targets if available.
[Troubadour]Resistance +2: Resistance +2
[Troubadour]Healing Touch: Restores status condition of units adjacent to the user at the beginning of the next turn. User is immune to status conditions.
[Valkyrie]Rally Resistance: Resistance +2 to all allies within a 3 tile radius.
[Valkyrie]Battle Revival: When paired up, will restore herself or ally to full health if either is ko'ed once per battle.
[Dancer]Luck +4: Luck +4
[Dancer]Special Dance: Strength, Magic, Defense and Resistance +2 for one Turn for the unit who receives the user's Dance
[Taguel]Cornered: Critical hit +5 for each adjacent enemy.
[Taguel]Horseslayer: Deals 1.5 damage to (mounted) units.
[Manakete]Magic Scale: Return damage when hit by a magic attack. Skill*2%
[Manakete]Wyrmsbane: Deals effective damage to (dragon) units.
By the Goddess, that took forever to type and format...
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Hey folks, forum newbie here.
I've actually been thinking of a greatly revamped version of the Awakening class/skill system but I'm not sure what board would be appropriate to post it. Would here be okay?
As far as this thread topic is concerned, I think branching promotions should remain a series mainstay and be based on a setup like FE8. Sacred Stones allowed the player to customize their army while maintaining the identitiy of each unit. If my character has a wyvern, I damn well want them to keep it. I think excessive reclassing really cheapens the value of your characters so second-seals should be rare until endgame, or perhaps your second playthrough. I like the idea of each base class having a unique promotion in addition to a shared promotion.
What do you want to see return in If that wasn't in Awakening?
in Fire Emblem Fates
Posted
Sure, but I wonder why people bring up PoR supports as something they wanted back in the base Awakening game when Awakening already does a better job at it..