H5 Tier list topic

[Colonel M]

I'll probably end up conceding eventually just so all this shit between them can end... meh. It really is getting tiresome like the Soren hate in the FE9 thread.

You're a bit late. I already conceded since Darros's ability to at least be a long-lasting unit is a bit better than Horus barely passing. Let's just keep Darros > Horus since in the end I will agree to it.

I'll work on the next argument for Nabarl vs. Seems to be the Fuhrer is next?

[Dat Nick]

Let him stay. I enjoy good laughs.

It was at first. Now he's just getting plain annoying.

[Capracanis]

I'll work on the next argument for Nabarl vs. Seems to be the Fuhrer is next?

See, Hitler was an amazing tactitian. A wee-bit nuts but a genius.

I'll probably end up conceding eventually just so all this shit between them can end... meh. It really is getting tiresome like the Soren hate in the FE9 thread.

...that's because Soren's Adept ability can screw you if you don't want to use it. He double hits the enemy and killls them allowing another unit to take its place and attack him and possibly leade to his death. It bites you in the ass even when using someone as a shield so people with only 2-range can touch him. 'Course the fucking computer is smart enough...

Edited July 1, 2009 by Capracanis

[Dat Nick]

...that's because Soren's Adept ability can screw you if you don't want to use it. He double hits the enemy and killls them allowing another unit to take its place and attack him and possibly leade to his death. It bites you in the ass even when using someone as a shield so people with only 2-range can touch him. 'Course the fucking computer is smart enough...

Enemies don't attack Soren on the player phase, and what the hell are you doing letting him get targeted on the enemy phase? By the way, eventually he gets to the point where he doesn't need adept to kill....

Seriously, how the hell do you manage to look dumber with every post you make?

Edited July 1, 2009 by GreenHairedDraco

[Rodykitty]

I'll work on the next argument for Nabarl vs. Seems to be the Fuhrer is next?

Uh... I can't guess who you mean by that nickname. Do you mean Caesar?

[Colonel M]

Uh... I can't guess who you mean by that nickname. Do you mean Caesar?

Caesar, Kaiser, Fuhrer, Mark Antony... whatever you want to call him. Yes, this is my next focus.

[Rodykitty]

Oh yeah. I moved Catria below Navarre.

[Capracanis]

Enemies don't attack Soren on the player phase, and what the hell are you doing letting him get targeted on the enemy phase? By the way, eventually he gets to the point where he doesn't need adept to kill....

Seriously, how the hell do you manage to look dumber with every post you make?

Are you slow or something?

When I talk about enemies atking him and moving I obviously mean on Enemy Turn.

Scenario:

Your Turn: You use a meatshield like Oscar or Gatrie or someone to block the way. Then you use Soren to atk the unit that meatshield is blocking. (Obviously attacking from behind said meatshield, taking advantage of the range) Let's say Soren kills them. Now, move all your other units, smoke a phatty and take a wicked piss--whatever, just end your fucking turn.

Opponents turn: They have a few archers that come and attack Soren. Let's say he can only hit them once but his skill makes him 2x the enemy and kills them. Great. Now he's got 12 Hp left and another enemy is about to hit. Boom! Another Adept and kills the enemy. Great. Now he's got 3 hp left and we've got one more archer on the way. The greatest example of this bulshit can be seen in the chapter in which you recruit Illyana, provided you do like me and make a blockade directly to the left of the point your are protecting from being seized.

Edited July 1, 2009 by Capracanis

[Rodykitty]

If you intend Soren to tank for some unreasonable reason, then unequip his weapon.

That's all you have to do.

[Capracanis]

If you intend Soren to tank for some unreasonable reason, then unequip his weapon.

That's all you have to do.

Not intending him to tank. I'm intending to use him to atack from afar while my tank hits the close-range fighters. The problem is that one all of them are dead, the frigging computer has the rangers attack Soren and kill him, soely because his skill keeps activating, when not wanted, and kills archer after archer allowing him to get killed. I'm just saying that There's a good reason to hate him. I like him once I ttake away his skill at low level. Granted, when he's changed classes and has Luk comming uot of his ass, the skill use usefull for levelling all the other Magic elements.

Why is Catria Bewloe Navarre? I've found in the long-run, that despite her slightly lower HP and slightly lower attack, her defence rate makes up for it...slightly. i'll give you that she joins a little too late to make a difference.

[Colonel M]

Fuck, I made a counting error. C13 would yield ~13 Levels, which would put Nabarl at Level 16. Though, I have a solution to this: once in a little while he can at least kill a boss or two, and at times he performs a bit better than others (C6X and C9 he can use his Swords more commonly). In this case it would equal about 1.4 levels per chapter including 3-13, but there are instances where he could gain an extra level and some leftover CEXP. It's not off by a whole hell of a lot, but I'll leave that to you for decision. There's still Nabarl having the massive chapter lead anyway, so it shouldn't make a major difference.

One thing is Sirius's team had pretty high levels for his units, which can also help accomodate for the slight error. Even so, 20/4 by C18 seems about right, so the levels would decrease a little, but I'm not seeing a major difference and I gave Catria a ton of levels (granted she's Level 5).

Edited July 1, 2009 by Colonel M

[Rodykitty]

Fuck, I made a counting error. C13 would yield 13 Levels, which would put Nabarl at Level 16. Though, I have a solution to this: once in a little while he can at least kill a boss or two, and at times he performs a bit better than others (C6X and C9 he can use his Swords more commonly). In this case it would equal about 1.4 levels per chapter including 3-13, but there are instances where he could gain an extra level or two.

=/

*undoes the change*

I had a gut feeling 20/4 was a bit much.

[Capracanis]

You're averaging out the levels people are gaining per chapter, right? Are you keeping in mind that in both Port Warren as well as the Battle in the Lea you find Horsemen which yeild a fairly high ammount of exp?

EDIT: If so keep in mind the horsemen will give about anywhere from 1/3 to 7/10th of a level for each kill.

Edited July 1, 2009 by Capracanis

[Colonel M]

=/

*undoes the change*

I had a gut feeling 20/4 was a bit much.

Tbh so did I. Sorry, I think when I was counting on my hands I somehow thought 12=17. >_>;

I'll re-evaluate it shortly.

[Rodykitty]

No. I would rather not do anything other than keep it simple. Those Horsemen are a source of favortism, and like all forms of favortism should be a decision made by the player and not the tier list.

[dondon151]

Guys, please try not to respond.

I agree with BB, this is getting really annoying, and you're encouraging him to pollute this topic with useless posts that detract from relevant discussions.

[Dat Nick]

When I talk about enemies atking him and moving I obviously mean on Enemy Turn.

The enemy phase. Exactly.

What the hell are you doing letting Soren getting attacked on the enemy phase in the first place?

By the way, you shouldn't accuse other people of being slow when you've been doing nothing but make yourself look like a dumbass in every single post you've made her.

[Capracanis]

No. I would rather not do anything other than keep it simple. Those Horsemen are a source of favortism, and like all forms of favortism should be a decision made by the player and not the tier list.

I understand that you can completely bypass them by Warping, which is fine if you don't wanna get raped. But that being said, How the hell is this tier list working? Is it based on potential or base-states/survivalrate/usefulness?

[Rodykitty]

No, they're not being bypassed. We'll just assume they're used to keep levels even.

But that being said, How the hell is this tier list working? Is it based on potential or base-states/survivalrate/usefulness?

It's based on overall usefulness, with a combination of base stats and characters gaining level ups based on their performance rather than being spoonfed.

[Dat Nick]

Yeah. Dondon's right, to hell with this, this kid's on my ignore list, and I say everybody else should do the same. Capracanis: The second worst thing to come out of Canada. Number one: Degrassi.

Those Horsemen are a source of favortism, and like all forms of favortism should be a decision made by the player and not the tier list.

SOMEONE has to kill the horsmen, so it's not like you can pretend they don't exist.

[Capracanis]

By the way, you shouldn't accuse other people of being slow when you've been doing nothing but make yourself look like a dumbass in every single post you've made her.

Let me break that down so you slow people can understand.

you've been doing nothing but make yourself look like a dumbass in every single post you've made her.

look like a dumbass

in every single post you've made her

Oh, the irony. Who is 'her'? Is she cute?

Tell me, when you were a child and the little white bus would pick you up for school, did your parents ever make you wear a fucking helmet?

Let him stay. I enjoy good laughs.

You're welcome.

[Dat Nick]

Oh, the only things he attacks in my posts are the typing errors after I flat out raped him logically. How amusing.

This is why you don't give retards internet access.

...Sorry about that, but I'm just about at my breaking point here. Last thing I'll say to him. Promise.

This is just off the top of my head, but I'd have no objections at all to Nabarl>Caesar.

[Capracanis]

This is just off the top of my head, but I'd have no objections at all to Nabarl>Caesar.

I agree...As useless as I find Nabarl to be as anything other that Swdmstr, Caeser's reclassing along with growth rates suck ass. He's doomed to be a Merc if you want any kills. The only thing remotely near useful is him as a Hunter.

Edited July 1, 2009 by Capracanis

[Rodykitty]

Caeser's reclassing along with growth rates suck ass.

False. Caesar has rocking growths in several classes, especially Fighter. The only reason he's (probably) going down is because of join time and being under leveled essentially nerfing his potential awesome. Edited July 1, 2009 by Chainey

[Colonel M]

Looking back at this post by Sirius:

Here's what I've had by the end of C10:

Lena = lvl 20

Marth = Lvl 8.76

Shiida = Lvl 5.96

Cain = Lvl 13.59

Abel = Lvl 14.49

Ogma = Lvl 14.74

Barst = Lvl 15.07

Wolf = Lvl 6.02

Sedgar/Zagaro = Lvl 6.31

Merric = Lvl 14.84 (he had more time as Mage than he should've)

Marth didn't get much level ups since his durability stays the same for the most part an a Forged Rapier would be the offense he needs. Sheeda was temporary use... screw having many units that need Master Seal on your team. Catria was added to this team later and she had to wait a bit for promotion as well.

Never did I end up obtaining a Master Seal where some1 wasn't ready to use it and I often found that I ended up having 3 units waiting for promotion and had to wait a few chapters to get it.

Unless you're making teams with so many units for whatever reason, you won't have trouble getting units to lvl 20 by C14.

So maybe it's not a terrible stretch for Nabarl to be at those levels. Some had a little more than +1 Levels, so I dunno...

I promise I'll re-evaluate it again though because I see it possible that Nabarl would beat Catria anyway, since she seems to end up like a similair Nabarl except can double once in a while but has some lesser durability in the latter chapters. How many levels would we be boosting Catria though? If she wants to be 20/1 by C20, she needs roughly 2.1 Levels per chapter, and don't forget that she'll slow down in levels once she closes in toward Level 20.

I'm not taking Sirius's word as "100% correct", but it appears to be somewhat in the realistic zone for a small team.

Edited July 1, 2009 by Colonel M