Salad Utensil Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 (edited) Ray is much better than those d00ds. He has constant 1~2 range, invincibility from Nosferatu, is a great support option for a good unit, and he heals. What you get out of leveling him vastly exceeds what you get out of leveling others. It's like Canas in FE 7 except more broken because Nosferatu is purchasable and a good unit wants to support him. @ the last sentence: Pretty much, but banning the arena doesn't sound like a bad idea. CATS is smart. How is this different from Geese? Geese can start with the brave Axe and thus is actually capable of killing things because he now has 2 hits before getting owned rather than missing half the time? At promotion they both have 14 speed and Geese can hide in a mountain and be invincible like Nosferatu Ray (the hit rates look questionable to me but whatever). I mean if funds is apparently so much of a joke that you can buy Ray 13321312 Nosferatus, why not hire Hugh at the max price and he can heal too and actually double (? not sure) when promoted as well. Zeiss has HM bonuses and can provide flying utility can supports Miledy with similar movement too. Zeiss, Hugh, and Geese all have 1-2 range as well. Of course I'm making very generic analytical arguments like you have with Ray, but I having trouble seeing what is making him in high tier (above Tate, Lot and whoever else is in there) and I definitely don't think they should move up, but I'm pointing out that your logic would obligate it. Can you show how he is better than Lot and Tate and that his existence is going to be better than the positive help that Lot and Tate contributes to ranks before Ray even exists? Wouldn't this make all unpromoted units at least higher on the list because of EXP lost from not being allow to use the arena? The aboved mentioned need to go up than. Edited February 3, 2010 by Brighton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salad Utensil Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 (edited) If Nosferatu is so awesome, then why isn't Niime higher? Speaking of which, is anyone else aware of FE5 Olwen? This gimmick that Ray supposedly has that is making him high tier means that if he misses he dies too right, especially in a game that doesn't have the other benefits for the ambush setup has for Olwen? I'm not seeing how this is so good. Edited February 3, 2010 by Brighton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inui Posted February 3, 2010 Author Share Posted February 3, 2010 (edited) How is this different from Geese? Geese can start with the brave Axe and thus is actually capable of killing things because he now has 2 hits before getting owned rather than missing half the time? At promotion they both have 14 speed and Geese can hide in a mountain and be invincible like Nosferatu Ray (the hit rates look questionable to me but whatever). I mean if funds is apparently so much of a joke that you can buy Ray 13321312 Nosferatus, why not hire Hugh at the max price and he can heal too and actually double (? not sure) when promoted as well. Zeiss has HM bonuses and can provide flying utility can supports Miledy with similar movement too. Zeiss, Hugh, and Geese all have 1-2 range as well. Of course I'm making very generic analytical arguments like you have with Ray, but I having trouble seeing what is making him in high tier (above Tate, Lot and whoever else is in there) and I definitely don't think they should move up, but I'm pointing out that your logic would obligate it. Can you show how he is better than Lot and Tate and that his existence is going to be better than the positive help that Lot and Tate contributes to ranks before Ray even exists? Wouldn't this make all unpromoted units at least higher on the list because of EXP lost from not being allow to use the arena? The aboved mentioned need to go up than. Ray doesn't miss half the time. He misses about 1/4 of the time and his support with Lugh improves that situation for him easily. Geese never becomes invincible on the field and Ray doesn't have to limit himself to mountains to be invincible. He never heals. He's never as good for the Experience rank. Hugh doesn't have supports...outside of Ray himself, perhaps. Either way, he joins a bit late to build those up. Hugh has his own flaws outside of supports, costing 10k, Guiding Ring issues, etc. His stats themselves are a tad lackluster and he doesn't have something like a good support or Nosferatu or an early join time to make up for it. Ray has Nosferatu, but Hugh doesn't have something like that. Ray also has a huge Mag stat for healing. When I am not drunk and about to fly to TX, I'll address Ray vs Tate/Lott... Speaking of which, is anyone else aware of FE5 Olwen? This gimmick that Ray supposedly has that is making him high tier means that if he misses he dies too right, especially in a game that doesn't have the other benefits for the ambush setup has for Olwen? I'm not seeing how this is so good. He needs 4-5 hits to die from a Sacaen Nomad. He has 80+ Hit on them. He's not getting hit enough to die even against the most accurate and speedy enemies. He would need to get hit, miss, get hit, get hit, miss, get hit in order to die. You might as well hope to get stuck by lightning. Edited February 3, 2010 by Inui Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salad Utensil Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Ray doesn't miss half the time. He misses about 1/4 of the time and his support with Lugh improves that situation for him easily. Geese never becomes invincible on the field and Ray doesn't have to limit himself to mountains to be invincible. He never heals. He's never as good for the Experience rank. Hugh doesn't have supports...outside of Ray himself, perhaps. Either way, he joins a bit late to build those up. Hugh has his own flaws outside of supports, costing 10k, Guiding Ring issues, etc. His stats themselves are a tad lackluster and he doesn't have something like a good support or Nosferatu or an early join time to make up for it. Ray has Nosferatu, but Hugh doesn't have something like that. Ray also has a huge Mag stat for healing. When I am not drunk and about to fly to TX, I'll address Ray vs Tate/Lott... I admitted in my previous quote that I didn't think that Zeiss, Hugh, Geese should move up, I'm just pointing out that anyone can become decent with the babying that is being provide to Ray. Ray has guiding ring issues too (Clarine, Ellen, Saul, Lugh) and Hugh just happens to appear in the chapter that has a secret shop that sells promotion items, why aren't they promoting at similar times? Also I'd say that Clarine, Ellen, Saul, and Lugh have higher priority for those rings due to either being either at such a high level or helping EXP rank with their bonus after promotion). Why not add OJ to the list of units you can baby to get good results from too? That support you've been giving to Ray with Lugh is questionable as it makes it seem that A) He isn't getting supports with Chad during the period when both are having trouble not dying B)We are support abusing for Ray to get that hit/avoid he need to actually hit/avoid things. How is that different from arena abuse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 Since this is ranks, I must ask how Percival is over Rutgar when Rutgar contributed since day 1 to just about every rank and Percival is not the master of EXP rank anyhow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CATS Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 Tiers not ordered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 Tiers not ordered. ...I guess this is the OP's decision but... why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CATS Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 The idea is to focus on getting units in the proper tiers before trying to order them within tiers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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