Final Fantasy 5 Notes by Grandjackal

[grandjackal]

I had already done a thorough run of this game, but I love it so much I just feel a need to grind down till I have the most bare data, to optimize every little minute so that perhaps options the game gives you could be more fleshed out. The game is already extremely solid as it is for all the options it gives you, but it can still be seen what paths at what points in time can give you what results for certain distances into the game. This topic is kinda silly yeah, but I'm not expecting a whole lot of people to flood into this one. ust those that are super interested in optimal runs of FF5.

Details on efficient runs of such an RPG.

-I will be nabbing all treasures. None are super out of the way like FF7, and if they're not useful in the game itself (very rare actually), it's at least extra cash.

-Blue Magic notes, along with Stealing.

-General level range, along with general cash estimates.

-General estimates of AP between significant points. This is mainly to see how flexible one can be in class changing, ability possibilities and so on.

First of, the simplest part: Leading up to First Job Set. This will be brief and simpler really.

-Before Pirate's Grotto, give Lena the Broadsword, and one of the other two her Knife. Lena's fastest, and she one shots with the weapon all the same. This allows a faster clearing of front row so back row enemies can be killed all in the same whole turn, thus saving time and ensuring you don't get hit outside of3 monster encounters. Not that you're in any danger at this point.

-Do not buy weapons in Tule. Most believe you need a lot of Broadswords. Faris's Dagger is strong enough, and monster encounters don't go beyond 3. She one shots just like Broadsword Lena. Galuf and Bartz can gang up on the last, no issue. For the boss, the Broadswords should go to Faris and Bartz, Galuf with the Dagger.

-Sell all your leather. The armor is useless, and is better off being gil. By the time you're done shopping for your magics, you should have around 1100 Gil. Don't bother with Libraand Poisona.

-The team should be straight level 4.

Notes on levels.

Barts level 4

73 HP

19 MP

28 Strength

25 Agility

27 Stamina

25 Magic

Lenna level 4

71 HP

20 MP

25 Strength

26 Agility

25 Stamina

28 Magic

Galuf level 4

75 HP

19 MP

27 Strength

24 Agility

28 Stamina

24 Magic

Faris level 4

72 HP

19 MP

27 Strength

27 Agility

26 Stamina

26 Magic

Bartz is stronger and faster than Galuf in both magic and attack, while Galuf is tankier and has Krile t transfer his power to, who is statistically different from him (though I'll see by how much exactly). But otherwise, both are rather similar.

Faris has the second best magic, is the fastest, and is as strong as Galuf on top of it. Is notably DPS-like. 3rd least durable.

Lenna is overall the most fragile and physically weakest while having the best magic along with second best agility. Clearly is the mage.

Generally Lenna is the mage while Galuf wants to be classes he can make use of now, but also benefit Krile once it's her turn. Usually I have Faris go classes like Knight and hard hitting classes (makes up for her durability, puts best use to her speed and is barely weaker than Bartz while being notably faster) while Bartz is fast classes like Thief-Ninja. However, Faris could also go something like Red Mage which puts use to her second best magic of the party while having still good physical attacks.

I am wanting to rethink some class paths, thus why I'm AP counting, to see what are some other worthwhile transitions. If anyone wants to toss in their thoughts, feel free. I'm all ears.

[Elieson]

Why is this in the pokemon thread again?

[grandjackal]

What the hell? *Looks up* ...How DID this end up in the pokemon section? Must have misclicked.

If a mod is around, could you move this topic please?

[Celice]

Not so much commentary, but I love FFV as well. You know what's actually better than that game though? FFVr. It's a pretty fun remix hack that adds new classes, monsters, items, spells, and abilities. You might have even more fun with this than rerunning the original game.

Edited May 19, 2012 by Celice

[grandjackal]

Thanks to whichever mod did that.

Class Choices

Bartz-Monk: Reasoning for this is to get Counter, which works great with his high Strength stat, then transfer him over to a class with Barehanded so that I can keep Monk offense on a more flexible class.

Lenna-Black Mage: Only bothering with level 3, since Summons immediately trump Black Magic almost on arrival. Otherwise will be riding White Mage until Summoner.

Galuf-Thief: Goes well with his high strength and stamina, since it fixes thief problems, namely being indurable. Will change to Ninja later.

Faris-Knight: Her high speed offsets the Knight's meh speed, and goes well with her high attack. Will stay until Twohanded (Monkeygrip for you oldschool folks).

Canal

Thunder alone deals with Suckers even on full nuke cast. Have everyone else focus on whatever other enemies are there. Galuf COULD steal if there was anything to steal. With Lena and 2 warriors though, one useless cog isn't too hurtful at this time. Bartz level 5 should happen pretty quick. Karlabos has a Potion to steal. Took 3 turns to take down. Could be possible with constant attacking to do in 2, if the Thief is actually strong enough. If not, Thief is a bad idea for this fight. Stealing off it is pointless anyways. Tent get.

AP Estimate: 9

Level Estimate: Bartz level 5, everyone else level 4.

Gil Estimate: 1301

Shipwreck

One Skeleton fight and the rest of the team hit level 5. Black 1, Find Passage and Cover learned. White 1 and Blue Mage's Check would also occur here.

-Tent

Fire one shots Skeletons and Bartz one shots as well. Galuf and Faris can gang up, since again there's nothing to steal. No Skeleton encounter should last longer than a turn. Bartz can also one shot Carlcathurs. Bartz levels, gets Focus.

-990 Gil

Rest of team gains another level. Lots of exp here.

-Phoenix Down

-Potion

Healed up, saved.

Oh as a note, with this setup, team order is this.

Galuf

Faris

Lenna

Bartz

Noticing that Galuf does about the same damage as Faris, and that Bartz does near double. Skeletons can drop Daggers, as I'm getting a lot.

-World Map

Bartz can one shot Mindflushers. Bartz gains a levle. Free Elixer get.

-Phoenix Down

-Antidote

-Antidote

Rest of team gained a level before the boss, so about level 6-7 is reasonable before Siren. Siren is an annoying fight of which to end really quick would recommend fighting classes, especially Monk with Focus. Otherwise it's annoying that before she's undead she is immune to magic. Bronze Shield get.

AP Estimate: 20

AP Total: 29

Level Estimate: 7

Gil Estimate: 4131

Analysis of Shipwreck: Theif, Knight and Blue Mage feel like deadweights here. White Mage Cure can at least function on the undead like Fire, Black Mages are charming up till the boss, and the undisputed best class at this point is Monk. Like, everyone being a Monk is the most effective way through this dungeon good. If everyone had Focus, you'd one turn Siren before she could do dumb stuff. However, in the least, leveling up Knight and Black Mage actually amounts to something later. Thief and Blue Mage however, do not. Blue Mage would master Blue! right after the dungeon while being as effective as Thief, but at the same time means you can drop Blue Mage and switch to something else, only going Blue Mage to learn spells (or stay to learn Learning so you don't have to go back at all. However, that might be an even bigger waste of AP since Blue Mage is not worth mastering). Thief offers...Well, nothing. It's not worth mastering over Ninja, and Steal isn't even that worthwhile. I'd say so far, my list for classes thus far would be...

Top

Monk

Black Mage

Mid

White Mage

Knight

Bottom

Blue Mage

Thief

Back to Civilization

First fight of course gets me another Black Mage level along with a Thief level gaining me Flee (forgot about this skill. Will come in handy in Wales) and Black 2. Focus demolishes Tatous and Barehands one shots annoying counterattacking Gatlings. It's honestly getting to the point where you might as well go 3 Monks and a Mage. Fun fact: I did not know Fire made Big Horns flee. Handy information to have, and helps the Black Mage since that counts as a "one shot".

AP Estimate: 3

AP Total: 32

Level Estimate: 7

Gil Estimate: 4489

Kerwen

Rested up, even though I have plenty of Tents to use, and Guard/Cover helps with costs.

-Antidote

-Frost Rod

Love elemental rods in this game. Gives Black Mages an elemental (if inconsistant) physical attack, and makes spells hit even harder. Play the piano at the pub, everyone boos. Bought a Longsword, though if you ran into an Undead Husk you could steal one off them. Selling my Broadswords, the Daggers and the Bronze Shield. Gonna see if I can go longer without buying armor. Accidentally bought a Silk Robe, but with that and the Broadsword is made up with 3 Daggers of money, so the difference is instead just 135 Gil. No spells worth buying.

Expected Gil: 4754

To Dragon Mountain

Got a free Gold Needle off a fight. Getting kinda lucky this run. Tatous can now be taken down by Galuf/Faris thanks to the Longsword. Frost Rod Blizzard does a whopping 240 (either Ice is a weakness, or the Frost Rod kicks ass). Knight and Monk now doing generally the same damage.

AP Count: 3

AP Total: 35

Level Estimate: 7

Gil Estimate: 5168

Dragon Mountain

First fight, Bartz gains a level.

-Phoenix Down

Bartz and Lenna can one shot a Gaelicat. Bartz cannot one shot Rock Slugs, nor does Lena's Blizzard. Everyone gained a level next battle.

-Gold Needle

Faris gains Guard. Headstones are one shotted even by nuke Thunder. I save and Tent, since I have a whole 5. Might as well use them while they're useful.

4 turns and letting Forza happen is inexcusable. Had to even waste a Phoenix Down since he hits like a freight train, and no one was down low enough for Guard to cover. Barehanded gained, along with Power Drink and a Whip. Needed more Focus.

Not gonna bother with Antidote, since the cutscene cures her of it anyways.

AP Count: 13

Total: 48

Level estimate: 8

Gil estimate: 6414

Wales

No spells worth buying at the moment, might as well save buying Haste for when you can actually use it. No new weapons. I buy 3 Kenpo Gis since they actually boost a stat. Knights can wear them for some reason. I rest up and head to the castle.

Expected Gil: 5064

I alert the king, yadda yadda, then I head to the basement. Most people don't go here because of the Jackanapes, but the Thief's Flee ability along with the fact it is ALWAYS first to act in any battle ensures I never have to deal with it (and I don't care about the Brave Sword), so I can get delicious swag here in the basement. This includes...

-Elven Mantle (+1 Magic, evasion boost and Magic Defense? Lenna is happy)

-1000 Gil

-Speed spell

-1000 Gil

Now, time to head for Wales Tower. I'm in no shape able to take on Shiva and her soldiers. Not yet anyways. Woop, actually ran into a Gatling on the way back to the wyvern. What are the chances? With a Longsword Faris can one shot them now.

Expected Gil: 7064

Wales Tower

Lena can one shot Ice Soldiers with Fire, and Bartz can one shot Ricard Mages. Steal from Ricard Mages, it gets you Mage Mashers I believe. You can steal SOME sort of awesome weapon here, I know that. Climb the vine near the king's corpse to get a treasure.

-Silk Robe (Not a major boost, but at least it's free)

-Maiden's Kiss

Wyverns are annoying since you basically need 2 Monks or 2 Knights to kill one, and they come in pairs and can use Breath Wing. Can nab Mythril Knives off them. Everyone gained a level, 2 Potions gained. With a Mythril Knife, Galuf has nearly the same attack as Faris.

-Silver Armlet (money)

-Ether

Garula is a really annoying boss who you can't kill really fast (then again, I could have like a whole team sporting Focus here), so my main sources of damage were Focus Bartz and Frost Rod Lenna (they were doing approximately the same damage, give or take 20). If Focus Spam doesn't work, another way to go about it is to bring your team to wounded so that Cover works, and have your Knight spam Guard so that your teamis basically invincible to it. It counters everything you do, and does more attacks the madder it gets. About 4 turns seems reasonable if all goes to plan. Used Galuf as my wounder, since he wasn't doing anything close to good damage. Hi Potion get.

Water Crystal jobs received. Well, all but one of course.

AP Count: 13

AP Total: 61

Level estimate: 9

Gil Estimate: 7721

Analysis: The only thing Thief contributes really is 2K Gil, an Elven Mantle and the Speed spell, and that's if you're willing toput up with it sucking this whole time. Now those things are useful outside of Speed, but I'm not too sure how much they really help out. What hurts Thief the most is that there's nothing to actually steal, much less things that are worth stealing. So, if you're willing to sacrifice 30 AP for that, go ahead. Mastering it's not really worth it either since all it does is make things convenient. Thief is a luxury and nothing more.

Knight starts equating to Monk once you get Longswords, and considering that early on you are most efficient with Monks and you get Focus at that time, you could probably transition smoothly to Knights with Focus, then level until Two Handed then bin Knight for Mystic Knight. Counter might not be worth it in the face of Two Handed Mystic Knights. Keep Monk until Longswords, then master it later at Phoenix Tower.

So, Black Mage is probably one of the other classes that speeds things right along early on, and I'm about to hit Black 3. However, was it worth it since I'm about to have Shiva? I mean, White Mage wouldn't have helped much, seeing as it's unable to equip the Frost Rod, which helps greatly with damage. Then again, it might not have been that big a deal had I something more substantial than a Thief on my team. Could say just learn Black1, then stay White until Summoner.

As for the ugly duckling that is the Blue Mage class, it would be around 40 points towards Learning by now. Blugh.

So, now that I have the Water classes, there is quite a bit of potential before me. Summoner is obviously good, Faris is sticking to Mystic Knight once she learns Two Handed, feel like I completely botched Galuf with the Thief class...As for Bartz, while he does have Focus for if he wanted to go Red Mage or Knight, I have to wonder what Barehanded Berserker is like...Why hit once when you can hit twice? In fact, I'mma test that out.

...

Well, that's about 200 damage, ignoring crits when they occur. No need to Focus either. Considering I'm 32 points away from from Two-Handed still, that's pretty good. Could Haste the Berserker who's Barehanded, would be pretty sick DPS.

EDIT: Thanks Celice, but I run an outdated piece of wood. Chances are I can't play a hack even if I wanted to. Besides, I'm not a fan of playing games on the PC. Prefer my handhelds and consoles. Don't ask why, I just do.

Edited May 19, 2012 by grandjackal

[Celice]

EDIT: Thanks Celice, but I run an outdated piece of wood. Chances are I can't play a hack even if I wanted to. Besides, I'm not a fan of playing games on the PC. Prefer my handhelds and consoles. Don't ask why, I just do.

if you have a Wii you can do a quick soft-mod and run an emulator for it on that :p

Edited May 19, 2012 by Celice

[Life]

Couple notes about the early classes:

!Mug is actually pretty good lategame and earlygame point put into the Thief class aren't really wasted. A Ninja using !Mug and 2 weapons steals and still does good damage. Sure, you're gonna drop it for obviously better stuff (!Animals, !Gaia and later !Rapid Fire) but in battles where you also want to steal, you don't have to sacrifice attacking to do so.

I wouldn't neglect !Time but !Time's problem is that it's near useless until Level 4 skills come into play (I believe that would be... end of World 1). AKA Comet.

!Blue is fun but not efficient in this game. It's only saving grace early game is Goblin Punch and you weren't trying to grab it.

Berserker is a class made for boss battles, in my opinion.

Everything else, you've already covered or haven't gotten there yet.

[grandjackal]

Return to Walse, heal up, buy Haste, and head for the castle. I decide I like Bare Hand Berserker so much I switch to it.

Water Tower

Berserker Bartz does indeed one shot enemies here, as does Lenna. This makes it so my gimped Galuf isn't being that big a strain on my team. I swap Lenna to Time Mage with Black Magic and Faris to Mystic Knight. I put Galuf in the back row.

Aaaand, I get my shit pushed in. Ya know, I think I'll just wait to come back here later when I have Ifrit. Faris is still a Knight, and am keeping Lenna a BlackMage for 2 more AP.

To Karnak

Nuke Fire takes care of Wild Nakks pretty simply. Zuus are HYPER annoying, especially with my crappy Galuf being a crappy Thief. Turtles are Blizzarded easy peasy, and Aegirs are one shotted by Bartz. Black 3 and Sprint get. Lenna changed to Time Mage. Ya know, maybe it seems easier with higher levels because I easily recall one shotting Aegirs with greater ease than needing Punch Face Berserker to one shot them. The magic drop in Time Mage is also sorely noticeable since even with the Frost Rod I'm doing less than 100 damage with Blizzard. Bartz levels up.

AP Count: 3

Total: 64

Estimated Levels: 9-10

Estimated Gil: Around 8.5K

Karnak

First item you buy gets you arrested, and I make sure to get a Mythril Sword while it's still cheap for Faris. I'll buy a Mythril Hammer only to check the damage. If it's less or around the same damage as Barehanded it's a waste, since Barehanded doesn't have acc issues AND has a greater chance for crits. I buy the Ra spells and Raise (I can at least cheapskate it and switch to White Mage outside of battle, heal up, then change back if I REALLY need to. Got two people not using MP anyways). I also buy a Thunder Rod for the hell of it, since it'll come in handy later. I actually buy a Mythril Plate, a Shield and a Silver Plate since now it's getting to the point where enemies are three shotting me. Though...Seeing the difference in armor since my Kenpo Gis, it's just a +4 boost in defense. That's not huge. The Mythril Shield at least gives me 25% evasion and similar defense. I feel weird going this far and barely feeling hte need to get armor. Ok, so let's test the Hammer damage.

*270 damage*

DAYAMN. Ok, that's 70 damage more than usual, but has acc issues and Bare Handed has increased crit. Could argue it with Two Handed, but Mystic Knight is arguably better with it since there's speed and (Sees the next attack only does like 162) yeah, I didn't know the damage was inconsistant as well. Not worth 1K.

Good thing I saved before buying. Just that Mythril Sword, a Thunder Rod and maybe MAYBE a Mythril Shield is good enough. Then, buy Ra and Raise spells.

The Fire Ship

I'm so glad the Ninja class is this soon after the Water classes.

Blizzara's a hell of a spell. Even a nuke off a Time Mage destroys a field of enemies with the Frost Rod equipped.

-Elixer

-Mythril Glove

Oh lol, forgot to rest up at the inn. Half my team's like dead.

So, problem with the Berserker. Speed. Even if it's just 2 Crew Dusts, I get Flashed unless I basically do Lena Blizzard on the back, and then the others take care of the front. Defeaters are easily killed, and as for Motor Bots, Lenna can one shot with Thunder Rod Thunder. Everyone levels up.

-Elixer

-Phoenix Down

Lenna learned Time1. After that level, Bartz is starting to do around 300 damage with Barehand Berserker. Poltergeists are annoying, simply put. They're immune to thunder and absorb ice.

-Green Beret. This is your one gift, Galuf.

-Thief's Gloves. It's weird that he now has similar defense to my warriors with these things.

-Moonring Blade. All these gifts, yet I'm just gonna make you a Ninja anyways. At least you're now in the back row like you've been wanting this whole time.

Level happens eventually after the save point.

-Elixer

LiquidFlame is a huge joke. If all goes well, you could one turn it after breaking the Frost Rod. If you miss attacks it's no biggie, one more Blizzara kills.

Now for the fun part...

Karnak Castle Up in Smoke

28 AP from Fire Ship.

All treasures gotten, about 3 minutes to spare. I KNOW I've done faster. To explain encounters, since this part of the game stresses you kill enemies as efficiently as possible to get everything you can out of it.

Cur Nakks-Can be killed by basically any physical or magical attack. Pick them off easy.

Cur Nakks and Sorcerer-Fighters snipe the Nakks and have Lenna microwave the Sorc. I took the option of letting Bartz punch face because Time Mages lack MP. Might waste more time since Sorcs can cast Confuse, which not only wastes time casting alone, but could hit Bartz and interrupt the plan.

2 Sorcs-Lenna kills one, two warriors gang up on the other.

Seargant and Cur Nakks: Take care of the dogs, and the coward runs.

Gigas: Steal Elixer off it, then Double Hand hit along with a Rod boosted Ra spell. This keeps it from stalling or counterhitting with Aero constantly. Also if you're bothering with Blue Magic, you can learn Aera off them. Hope you're lucky though cause your chances are pretty meh.

Gigas/Sorc/Nakk: Snipe Sorc with Ra spell, Moonring the Nakk, Double Hander and Berserker kill the Gigas.

Iron Claw battle: Treat like a normal Sargeant fight, but with an Iron Claw. Perhaps where the Berserker shines since he nearly one shots Iron Claw, and the others kill the dogs easy.

You can get a CRAPTON of Elixers in this portion for Magic Pots later, allowing you mastery of classes more reliably along with having a few left over perhaps. Lots of gold and goodies to be found here, among them Shurikens, Elixers, a Ribbon, Main Gauche, Elven Mantle, a Flaem Scroll, and Esuna. Also, steal from the Sorcs when you can. The Ninja enjoys free Mage Mashers, and can at times even give Gaia Gear.

AP Estimate: 42

Total: 131

Level Estimation: 13

Gil Estimation: 19.5K

Nearly have the Berserker leveled, have level 3 Time, Steal, Spellblade already level 2, have Two Handed...Good times. So, 131 AP is a lot. Let's have some analysis.

Analysis

Berserker I'm kind of on the fence on. When it does damage, it does damage. It's about as strong, perhaps even a bit more than Two Handed (outside of Spellblade hitting weakness). However, it's slow. Berserker I think would benefit more in fights that are longer, and where it can reap the benefits of Haste. Outside of that, it's only a class to master for the stat boost it gives, since if I recall it's the best in...Something. Not sure what, either Stamina or Strength.

Time Mage is a smooth transition off of the Black Mage, but lacks quite a bit of MP (had to waste an Ether in all that mess), which requires you to be a bit smarter with your targetting so you don't waste a lot on Ra spells outside of when you need them (and is also a kinda-benefit the Berserker gives since it just hits like a truck). Considering summons are coming soon, it's best to have Time Magic ready so that you can team it with Summoner.

Mystic Knight is always solid. Love it's speed, love it's abilities.

I could imagine someone slipping Thief into Karnak Castle since it gives a butt ton of AP, it only needs so much to get the ability one wants, and Moonring Blade is really good for this portion to snipe nakks hiding in the back. That, and it nabs you extra Elixers without killing turns. Super cool.

There's no doubt that even if you were to go Monk early on then transition to Knight, you WILL have Doublehand by the end of Karnak. So, this pretty much solidifies Monk first, since you're going to typically stick with Mystic Knight for a long time. Great ability to learn, and mastering it gives you a speed boost in Freelancer.

As for AP counting, you'd be about 20 away from Counter on the Monk class. I'd get off Monk until Phoenix Tower from there, seeing as mastering makes all the HP boost passives automatic in Freelancer.

You'd be closer to Valiance with Thief, but really, just get Steal and drop it until Phoenix Tower if you REALLY want the convenience it's passives give.

Black and White magic if you've completely dedicated to them would be about 20 into Level 5. Not bad, but you're not even close to level 5 spells. A bit wasteful really.

You could actually have mastered Learning by now. Why you still a Blue Mage? It's not even a class worth mastering, and Learning is an ability of convenience. Besides, only around this point can you actually start to learn worthwhile Blue spells.

You'dhave about 70 AP for Water classes, so...Let's check.

Berserker would...Be 70 towards Berserk. It's skills are not the reason to use this class. It has greater charms.

Mystic Knight would be 10 towards level 3 Spellblade. Not quite Ra spells on other classes.

10 towards Level 4 Time. Could pretty much go straight to Summoner by that point, come back later for the ability to use Quick.

20 towards level 3 Summons. Should tide you over till Golem and stuff.

10 towards level 3 Red. That's pretty good range, considering that after that it's on the way to Doublecast. So close to dropping it until Phoenix Tower already, and almost to the everuseful Ra spells. Could perhaps even wait for Red 3 for when you go Ninja so you don't even have to bother with Scrolls...Who am I kidding, Scrolls are ten times better.

So, now I have Geomancer, Ninja and Geomancer. One is utility, one is combat awesomeness, and the last a gimmick. However, it's also a gimmick that can possibly get me White Wind, which is a VERY good spell.

EDIT: Would like to thank you all for the comments so far, and thank you Celice for the suggestion but...Again, I'm just not an emulation guy, even if it is a hack. Sorry dude.

As for Life Admiral, early on it doesn't really matter for the Thief. Mug is not worth the wait, and you can just get Steal from basically all of Karnak (since by then you got Frost Nukes and Fisticuffs Berserker). Steal's not even worth much, since it doesn't even pay off till later.

Time Mage abilities themselves suck, BUT since they can equip Rods, they are a smooth transition from Black Mage, AND you're going to be using Time Magic eventually so might as well get points now so you can put best use to Summons now while worryng about the real Time magics later.

Edited May 19, 2012 by grandjackal

[grandjackal]

I go back to Karnak, pick up the newly freed Flame Rod (thus the reason I didn't buy one, that and it's useless on the Fire Ship), reclass Galuf to Ninja, equp him with the Main Gauche and Elven Mantle for awesome evasion. I sell a Dagger, a Longsword and 3 Mage Mashers along with the Mythril Knife and Silver Armlet. I visit Cid who's getting drunk off his ss, I rest up and head for the Library of the Ancients.

To the Library

Level gained. Nothing really to mention, other than you can steal Mythril Armor off a Mythril Dragon, which is always a nice amount of coin.

AP Amount: 4

Total: 135

Level estimate: 14

Gil Estmate: 21.8K

Library of the Ancients

No bother with a tent, the Library offers a healing vase. Equipped Flame Rod. The way encounters work here are weird. Basically encounters are like normal, but you fight enemies one at a time so you don't know what kind of encounter it actually is. There are 4 types (that I'm aware of). A demon like enemy, half a devil's head, a green spider and a shaman with a huge African tribal mask. Those with the tribal mask give a lot of AP, and you can steal Hi Potions off them. Damage-wise, Berserker with Barehanded and Dual Wielding Ninja are doing about the same along with the Two Handed Sorc (who can do more with elemental weakness hitting stuff). Basically the Ninja and Berserker seem weakest here, but can still gang up to kill, and really considering it's one at a time, it hardly feels troublesome. This portion is easy.

Note you can get plenty of Blue Magics here as well. Aera off the gothic demons, Level 5 Death from the demon head, Moon Flute and something else from the shaman.

-Ether

Galuf learned Smoke.

Ifrit is another joke. Two Blizzaras and two Blizzara Spellblades, and he's down. Can steal a Phoenix Down off him. Flame Scroll get. Ifrit get. Reclassing Lena to Summoner.

-Phoenix Down

Ya know, there's something magical about Berserker Bare Handed critting with both hits and doing 960 damage. That's like Spellblade hitting a weakness with Two Handed. Just to show you how good it is.

Can steal a Mallet off of Byblos. Which is to say, you shouldn't bother. Really, just a Flame Scroll and Ifrit a couple times does him in. Could probably make it even faster if you just broke the Flame Rod and then threw a Flame Scroll. I mean, Flame Rods aren't exactly expensive. Seriously, they're buyable Aga spells. Spellblade 2 get. Iron Draft get.

AP Count: 25

Total: 160

Levels: 14

Gil: 22.6K

Back to Karnak

Bartz learned Berserk.

AP Count: 4

Total: 164

Levels: 14

Gil: 23.4K

To Crescent Island

Sea Ibises cannot stand to the might of Ifrit. Summon1 Obtained.

AP Count: 2

Total: 166

Figure I'll call it in for tonight, but one thing about the Crescent Isles is that there is a weapon that I really really want, but chances are I won't get. The Death Scythe. Berserkers drop it very rarily, but I have had it once. I know of it's power. This weapon is mighty, and does not care about the gimmicky defense of the boss of the flying ruins of Ronka, nor of the wall changing boss of World 3. It is Hulk Smash made into weapon form.

Wish me luck guys.

...

Oh, also you can get Dark Spark here for you Blue Mage users.

[Life]

Imma do my own quick run to see if I can justify your findings.

[grandjackal]

Would be great to have another set of results. Note that these are estimates, since random encounters can be a fickle thing. Bought 2 Plumed Hats since they were pretty cheap. No encounters towards the Black Chocobo (DAMMIT, no Death Scythe), and get the two new additional classes. Ranger I plan in incorperating eventually, but I'm not sure where. Now I have the Black Chocobo. Story at Library, heal up with vase, head for desert.

To the Desert

Everyone's gained a level, 2 AP.

AP Count: 2

Total: 168

Level Estimates: 15

Gil Estimates: 23.5K

Shifting Sands

Not having Aqua Breath for the Sandworm is something I actually miss dearly because it does a TON of damage to an otherwise annoying boss. Also, the Berserker being Berserk does not help any here. In fact, the Berserker is more harmful than help here, so for this fight, don't bother. I go back to Monk for this fight with Bartz. If I had Aqua Breath, this fight is over in like two turns. I decide to throw a Shuriken at it for a quick 1K damage, since it has a bizarrely good amount of defense. The Moonring Blade for some reason ignores this defense, so outside of Ifrit, Galuf does the most damage here. About 3 turns without Aqua Breath. With the Shuriken and Aqua Breath, I think you could actually one turn this fight. Perhaps I should have flown to Bartz's town and picked up some Water Scrolls before heading down here.

Basically takes about 2-3 people to take down a Sand Bear, and Ifrit slow-cooks the entire area. Galuf learned Image. Antidote get.

AP Count: 8

Total: 176

Level: 15

Gil: 24.3K

Towards the Ruins

Bio Soldiers by nature take two turns to take down since physically speaking they are quite tough, and they counter with a full team Bio cast, which is nasty. Can steal a Battle Axe off them too, but it's weaker than Barehanded. Ifrit continues to be awesome. Ifrit can kill any and all Bombs.

AP Count: 6

Total: 182

Level: 15

Gil: 25.6K

Chase a ghost, blow up ruins, rest up, get Mini along with two Shurikens, get Airship. Weeeee. So, lots to do now that I have an Airship. Well first, an easy fight where I spam Thunder Rod Thundara and throw a Thunder Scroll and use Thundara Blade, you get the gist of it. Now had I bought a Thunder Bow at Crescent, that would actually do damage similar to the Berserker since I'm hitting weakness and be building towards X Attack. However, I'm dumb, and totally forgot. However, just a Lightning Scroll and Thunder Rod Thundara kill it. Easy peasy. 5 AP and a Frost Bow.

APCount: 5

Total: 187

I return to Crescent, buy the remaining elemental Bows and switch Bartz to Ranger. I sell some extra stuff I happened to have, but your Gil should be generally around 20K. As the game goes on, it'll be harder to give an accurate gil count, since random drops and all that. Especially me, as I've been getting pretty lucky this entire run. Learned Mighty March, and got the piano. Now for sme extra treasures and such. *Lands at Tycoon, ends up in a random encounter as soonas I touch ground* What the hell? Uhh, ok.

AP Count: 1

Total: 188

Tycoon Castle

Just here to pick up the treasures here.

-Ether

-Elixer

-Phoenix Down

-Maiden's Kiss

-Cottage

-Ether

-Phoenix Down

-Elixer

-Diamond Bell

-Shuriken

-Ashura

Quite a bit. Now for Bartz's home town for another song and supplies.

Lix

Learned Alluring Air. I buy a Green Beret for Bartz. I buy 30 of each Scroll (See? It's good to save cash), and head on out. Now, I gotta go fix this money problem, so it's time to go through an auxillery dungeon and recruit new summons. Going for Shiva first.

Walse Water Tower

We pretty much one shot things at this point. Would like to note that Flame Bow hitting weakness did around 600 damage, which is more than Double Hand Mystic Knight or Dual Wield Ninja. A single Flame Scroll and Bartz shooting her in the face does the trick. Free Frost Rod too. Shiva get! One last one and I can ditch Black Magic for good. Learned Summon2. By the way, you can totally learn Pond's Chorus here if you're using Blue Magic.

AP Count: 10

Total: 198

Level: 15

Gil: 2.4K

Now for Ramuh. Well actually, I'mma take a break.

[grandjackal]

I'm doing a seperate run to test out some of my thoughts on improvement.

-Two monks is absolutely awesome as I suspected.

-I think going back to the Grotto after the Wind Crystal for the treasure is A OK, since there's treasure there.

-Goblin Punch is actually more effective on Karlabos than Bolt. In fact, 2 Blue Mages and 2 Monks one turns it.

-Black Mage is a necessity for the Shipwrecks. One shots Skeletons with nuke Fire, and one shots Undead Husks with Thunder.

-While at the Grotto, get Vampire. Prepare your Blue Mages by getting them as low health as possible to Vampire Siren. With those cheapshots and at least one Monk, you can kill her before she turns undead. Otherwise, 2 Monks and 1 Blue Mage works, just be sure you have your 4th person in the front row for that additional damage.

-I made a complete mistake, thinking Blue Mage's level 3 Skill was Learning, when in fact it's level 2 skill is Learning, level 3 being Blue!. So yeah, around the time you complete the Shipwrecks, you can totally have Learning for the sake of convenience.

Still testing Goblin Punch. Pretty fun ability, seeing as it ignores Rows, and bypasses stuff like Gatling counters, which actually helps conserve MP from having to hit it with magic. Perhaps I was wrong about the Blue Mage. I mean, it's still kinda eh, but it beats Thief by a longshot. It's kind of a cheesy class really.

EDIT: In fact at level 7, Goblin Punch one shots Gatlings. That is...Delicious.

Lol, it even works on the Dragon Mountain boss, letting me kill her before her minion is summoned. Goblin Punch is hilarious.

EDIT: Pond's Chorus is also a great ability. Saves time and effort on the Garula since now you don't have to have a Knight Guarding all the time and can Focus instead, AND can be used on Shiva's Ice Commanders. Used along with Vampire and Sylph from a Summoner, you can get Shiva before heading for Karnak. Takes longer than coming back to get it then...But a lot of things in the future are weak to Ice, and gives you an excuse to not buy Ra spells.

Edited May 20, 2012 by grandjackal

[Life]

And suddenly, Blue Mage just got relevant.

[grandjackal]

Well in fairness, I didn't know how hilarious Goblin Punch was.

Anyways, one last thing I wanna see with this other run, namely what Karnak gives to the Red Mage.

Hmmm...Almost to level 2 Red, not bad. Nearly got Berserk from Berserker too.

You can also get Aero 100% of the time, and Aera seems reliable since there are a lot of Gigas and they aren't exactly shy about using Aera. Death Claw is VERY situational though. Almost all the way to Summon3, which means you could fairly switch to Time Mage without issue, get points in that class.

It's kinda funny how playing like this makes White Mage look useless.

Will presume my original run soon. Just wanted to test out some Blue Mage stuff. Was not disappointed.

[grandjackal]

Fighting Ramuh

I hate that Ramuh is a random encounter, especially with the other encounter being Mini Dragons. Get a level up just by hunting the old fart. Bartz learned Animals. Though breaking a rod, throwing a couple Shurikensand some auxillery attacks, two turning him makes the fight relatively painless. Ramuh get.

AP Count: 9

Total: 207

Level: 16

Gil: 3.9K to 4K

Forgot to get Toad while I was here. Get Romeo's Ballad.

Now for one last errand.

Jachol Cave

First encounter is a fleeing Skull Eater, which is very sweet. Learned Spellblade3. This place is basically a huge AP depot with the risk of wasting phoenix downs due to Skull Eaters basically one shotting everyone on the team before eventually fleeing. Learned First Strike.

-Tent

-Shuriken

-Blitz Whip

Learned Summon3.

AP Count: 39

Total: 246

Level: 16

Gil: 4.5K

Return Trip Out

Just putting this up cause I'm a bit scatterbrain. Surprised that all the Skulleaters ran. My luck is absurd this runthrough. Bartz learned Aim. Then second Skull Eater I burn through like 4 in one. What goes up must come down I suppose.

Make that 7 overall. So much for my luck. It's what I get for bragging.

AP Count: 17

Total: 263

That was a tiny dungeon and look. 56 AP.

Jachol

Rest up. Buy a Coral Sword. Sell some junk. Be on my way.

Gil: 2.4K

The ruins rise. Time to get Adamantite. Doesn't take much to kill the Adamantoise. Oddly enough, Frost Rod Shiva did less damage than Focus Frost Bow or Blizzara Double Hand Coral Sword. 2 turns.

5 AP

Total: 268

Assault on the Flying Fortress

Lightning Scrolls and Ramuh make the turrets a 1 turn kill. As for the Soul Cannon, Lightning Scroll+Ramuh kills the Launcher, Thundara Blade does a whopping 1.6K, and a Focus Thunder Bow does 1K, which is the same as a scroll or Ramuh. Ranger is pretty good when sniping weaknesses, especially with Focus. Faris learned Spellblade4. Dark Matter and Hi Potion get along with a couple Iron Drafts.

AP Count: 17

Total: 285

Ronka Ruins

I never did like this place. Mainly because Ronka Knights are highly annoying, and I keep forgetting which path is treasure first before the crystal. Of course, my first encounter is a back attack of a Ronka Knight and a Ra Mage, getting my ass Blizzarad. As a note, I have to ask. Is there a way to get White Wind without use of a Beastmaster? Cause...I'd really enjoy not using that awful class.

-Gold Armor

Ramuh pretty much wipes out any other minor problems, but otherwise a lot of enemies here are tough to one shot, as the game starts ramping up enemy toughness from here. It's gonna get harder to avoid taking damage. Level up of team, Mythril Shield dropped.

-Elixer

Ooh, a drop of a Dark Bow? Me likey. Enemies here don't have weaknesses, so the +5 attack boost is welcome.

First Savepoint.

AP Count: 10

Total: 295

-Phoenix Down

-Golden Shield

Second Save

AP Count: 7

Total: 302

Learned Summon4.

-Hi Potion

-5000 Gil

-Shuriken

-Ancient Sword

-Moonring Blade (Ninja now in back row)

-Power Armlet (Given to Bartz)

Level gained.

Second Savepoint, Third Save

AP Count: 11

Total: 313

-Cottage

-Ether

Archeoaevis is an entirely annoying fight. Basically find an element he doesn't absorb and stick with it till it dies. Your normal fighters should just stick to attacking or Focusing (for the record, Focus Bartz with Power Armlet and Dark Bow was doing around 800 damage, where normal damage is around 5). After it revives, just punch it's face until it dies. Shouldn't take more than 2 turns on that form. The first as far as I can tell is completely up in the air. Hero Cocktail given.

Exdeath is baaaack.

Hey, I've gotten this far without actually ever touching White Magic. How crazy is that?

AP Count: 12

Total: 325

Level: 18

Gil: 15.4K

Time to break, but now that I have all the jobs aside from Mime and the GBA jobs (which lets face it are useless), I suppose there are some numbers to crunch.

Wind AP Maximum Estimate: 325

Water AP Maximum Estimate: 257

Fire AP Maximum Estimate: 184

So, let's see what pure dedication could get us, shall we?

For Wind: You'd nearly be one class level away from mastering the Knight class, though really nothing is worth staying on it past Two Handed. You'd be 20 into the last skill of Monk, and though there are plenty of better skills it offers to choose from, it DOES offer you HP to add on. With Thief you'd nearly have Mug. Hope you enjoyed that crap class all of world 1. You'd be 40 into the last White and Black Mage skills, and you'd nearly have mastered Blue Mage.

For Water: Well, you'd be a good amount towards mastering Berserker, and be close to working on the last Spellblade level, same with Time Mage as well. Would actually be working on the final skill of Summoner. Would be about 90 points towards Doublecast with Red Mage.

For Fire: Would have 60 points left before Throw for Ninja. 30 points towards Catch with Beastmaster. Could actually have Geomancer mastered, which is surprisingly interesting. Would be close to learning Equip Bows off Ranger. Could also have Bard mastered.

Some thoughts on this? Well namely, there's nothing really to think about with the Wind classes, since they're all pretty self explanitory. As for Spellblades, you could pretty much move on by the time you get Earth Crystal jobs, since level 6 Spells are a good ways away, and you can always master Mystic Knight later. Red Mage mastering Red magic by then is cool since then you could transfer to Time Mage and work with Blue or Red magic at your leisure while having the boost of rods, and Time at your disposal, making you an awesome support while still maintaining excellent magic offense. Beastmaster would have learned Control by the time you even get out of Karnak Castle. Geomancer being mastered quick is not really notable, seeing as you're better off entering that class later when there is actually bad terrain like in Exdeath's Castle. Mastering Bard is also interesting, since you do have some songs around the time you get the class. I dunno what good the class would do, but having Sing wouldn't be bad, if only for Requiem at the Undead Dragon's Valley.

Present thoughts on the latest execution of classes. Once more, the Summoner has proven to be invaluable, along with the Ninja. The Ranger has also proven itself on equal terms as others, even when it comes to sniping weaknesses thanks to it's three elemental bows. Strange thing I noticed about bows. If the target is closer, you have a greater chance to crit, but the further back are harder to hit and you miss more often. A Focus crit is very impressive damage, and helped with Archeoaevis. Ranger you could say is a deceivingly good class. As for Mystic Knight, I dunno...It's shinedat moments, and at others just seems kinda hohum. Like it's great on Soul Cannon Shiva, Ifrit and the like, but otherwise it just seems like a third wheel fighter.

Future Thoughts: I WANT to use Dragoons, but I know they're awful. Like...nothing about them seems worth it. Lancet seems fun, but that's about it. Why Jump when you can just...Punch? Hell, I'd think it's just an inferior Ranger who can just use Focus. Maybe once I get X-Fight. If anyone has thoughts on this, I'd sure like to hear them.

Hmmm....Mystic Knight into Dancer...Spellblade Swords Dance...

[grandjackal]

Was testing out several ways to start the game because I have a problem. Anywho, the show must go on!

From here for world 1, the rest of it is basically just a series of bossfights before we warp off to world 2.

Purobolos is a puzzle of timing. Now you could do something like have 3 summoners or a summoner/ninja/samurai and throw a scroll, summon and throw a Zeninage, or you could just have 2 fighters fight the ring of them (one front one back) while one summons. At worst, it's a turn lost.

Titan is annoying, mainly because it's Earthshaker in this kind of run simply will kill all but your tough character. However, it only takes 2 turns. Just hit it and kill it quick so it can't do too much damage before Earth Shaker. Titan get.

2 Titans kills the Manticore. I had Animals on my Ranger for hopes of Nightengale in case it did something silly like 2 Aqua Breaths in a row (and I didn't have Sylph. If I can tell you all a hint here, get Sylph).

AP Count: 16

Total: 341

And that's all the AP in world 1! Time to reuinite with Galuf!

WORLD 2

Time to camp up and get abducted. However, my Ranger Bartz doesn't go down without a fight. It doesn't use Hurricane, and I manage to take it down one on one, scoring me an extra point for Bartz, along with a free Ether. But the fake chest has gas, and now I'm Exdeath's prisoner.

Galuf's Heroic Rescue

Ninja Galuf is perfect here, one scroll and random encounters are a joke. Gilgamesh is a joke. Exdeath needs better security. Galuf gets an extra AP point through that ordeal.

Escape

AP Count: 2

Total: 343

Outside Exdeath's Castle

Strapparers are weird encounters. Keeping Animals out because Bee Swarm can actually be helpful in tandem with Summons.

Battle on the Big Bridge

Thunder Bow can one shot Little Chariots, as can Faris and Galuf, so oddly enough the summoner of my team is the weak link (though not really). Everyone gains a level.

Gilgamesh is Old'd by Ancient Sword, so this fight is pretty simplistic. You also of course have Titan. Even after he ges super saiyan, he's a joke thanks to Old. Stole a Hero Cocktail from him. Neo Garula and it's Murrows get Thunder Scrolled, and it's simply dealt with Aim and Faris. But, we cannot outrun the barrier. We are flung basically to the middle of nowhere.

AP Count: 5

Total: 348

Taking a break here. Not a lot to say other than Ninja is awesome.