So when exactly is it best to promote and use seals?

[Madcap]

So I'm on chapter 8 and have finally got some seals to use, but I don't know when I should use them. From what I understand, you keep leveling up so there's no point in waiting until level 20. However, if I do it too soon will I miss out on certain skills? Are skills always learned at a certain level or is it different depending on the unit? Thanks

[I don't play for turns]

So I'm on chapter 8 and have finally got some seals to use, but I don't know when I should use them. From what I understand, you keep leveling up so there's no point in waiting until level 20. However, if I do it too soon will I miss out on certain skills? Are skills always learned at a certain level or is it different depending on the unit? Thanks

If these are unpromoted, then you can't miss out on skills. Skills are gained at levels 1 and 10 for unpromoted classes, and 5 and 15 for promoted dudes if you're planning to use Freddy. For your unpromoted units, you definitely want to change/promote them ASAP.

[spoon98]

all skills for tier one units are 1 and 10 (so you will always get those before you can promote) tier twos are 5 and 15(so you can miss those for those with no tier and have 30 lvs( manakete, dancer, etc)they get them at 1 and 15 once again you can miss that. Also internal level here is the formula and caps for it

Internal Level = Internal Level + Level/2 <br style="color: rgb(58, 58, 58); font-family: arial, helvetica, sans-serif;">Max of 20 in Normal, 30 in Hard, and 50 in Lunatic.

that i believe determines how much your exp cap gain is if someone else might be able to explain it better.

Edited February 10, 2013 by spoon98

[Othin]

For unpromoted, as soon as you can. For promoted, probably after learning your LV15 skill.

[Iridium]

If you were to use a second seal from a level-30 Manakete/Taguel/etc into a promoted class, would that affect the internal level like a class change (+30/2) or a promotion (+20)?

[Othin]

If you were to use a second seal from a level-30 Manakete/Taguel/etc into a promoted class, would that affect the internal level like a class change (+30/2) or a promotion (+20)?

Panne as a (Taguel 30 --> Wyvern Lord 1) is a LV21 unit with 15 internal levels, and therefore gains Exp as a LV36 unit.

[CinderSkye]

Use Second Seals ASAP on pre-promotes unless the character doesn't have another class you want to use.

The *first* time a character is getting a Master Seal used on them, though, wait until they're level 20. Internally for the purposes of XP and everything else, a first-time promoted unit is viewed as (Level+20) regardless of when it promoted, so you might as well milk the extra growth time. IMO very few of the level 5 promote skills are worth the loss in growth speed.

[Madcap]

Ok thanks for the advice. By the way, where can I go to see which classes can switch to what?

[spoon98]

Ok thanks for the advice. By the way, where can I go to see which classes can switch to what?

you can go here http://serenesforest.net/fe13/class_set.html for every characters or you can use a seal on them and it shows choices

[SilentSentinel]

If you have a unit that is past a certain level, can they get back to first tier classes? Like if I had a level 20 Dark Flier and wanted to reclass all the way back to Merc for Armsthrift, could I still do that?

[CinderSkye]

Yes.

Base Classes can reclass to other base classes at level 10 and higher.

Promoted Classes can reclass to base classes at level 1.

Promoted Classes can reclass to any class available to that character at level 10 and higher.

[Iridium]

If you have a unit that is past a certain level, can they get back to first tier classes? Like if I had a level 20 Dark Flier and wanted to reclass all the way back to Merc for Armsthrift, could I still do that?

Yes. A level 10 promoted unit (or a level 30 special unit) will be able to reclass to any class they have had access to at any point.

Edited February 11, 2013 by Iridium

[Madcap]

Just a couple more questions. Who is most important to use a master seal on first? Is Chrom a good choice? And, for MU is it better to make him a Grandmaster or to change his class to something else like a knight?

[Samias]

Use a master seal on whoever you like. Chrom IS a good pick considering he always needs to be deployed, but whoever you're using the most is the person you should promote so they can keep getting better faster. Or you can use a seal on a healer so they are no longer helpless.

Second question, Grandmaster is a GREAT class and Rally Spectrum is a GREAT skill, but once you get the skills you should feel free to reclass into whatever you like.

[Othin]

MU is pretty much always the best first promotion pick because of higher Exp gains, fast access to Rally Spectrum, the best skill in the game, and just being the more powerful unit overall.

[geozeldadude]

Use Second Seals ASAP on pre-promotes unless the character doesn't have another class you want to use.

The *first* time a character is getting a Master Seal used on them, though, wait until they're level 20. Internally for the purposes of XP and everything else, a first-time promoted unit is viewed as (Level+20) regardless of when it promoted, so you might as well milk the extra growth time. IMO very few of the level 5 promote skills are worth the loss in growth speed.

is levelling up an unpromoted class to level 10, using a second seal, and then levelling to level 10 again and then using a master seal equivalent to levelling up to level 20 and then using a master seal, though? i would've thought that would have given you 15 internal levels instead of 20, but it sounds like promotions automatically make your internal level 20.

also, in the panne example if panne went from level 30 taguel -> wyvern lord level 20 and then reclassed assassin, how many internal levels would she have? (15 + 20) / 2 = 18? so she would be treated as being 18 + 21 = level 39?

Edited February 11, 2013 by geozeldadude

[Othin]

Promotions don't affect internal level.

Say you have Vaike as a LV10 Fighter. If you promote him to Warrior, he'll have no internal levels; he'll just be a LV21 unit. This is the same no matter what level you promote him at. Meanwhile, if you reclass him to Barbarian, he'll have 5 internal levels as a LV1 unit, and therefore gain Exp as a LV6 unit. Or more, if you level him up past 10.

Basically, the game doesn't care what levels you had before a Master Seal, just a Second Seal.

[geozeldadude]

Promotions don't affect internal level.

Say you have Vaike as a LV10 Fighter. If you promote him to Warrior, he'll have no internal levels; he'll just be a LV21 unit. This is the same no matter what level you promote him at. Meanwhile, if you reclass him to Barbarian, he'll have 5 internal levels as a LV1 unit, and therefore gain Exp as a LV6 unit. Or more, if you level him up past 10.

Basically, the game doesn't care what levels you had before a Master Seal, just a Second Seal.

i think i get what you're saying for the case where an unpromoted unit changes to another unpromoted class, or a promoted unit changes to an unpromoted class. but what happens when a promoted unit changes to a promoted class?

[Othin]

i think i get what you're saying for the case where an unpromoted unit changes to another unpromoted class, or a promoted unit changes to an unpromoted class. but what happens when a promoted unit changes to a promoted class?

Let's say you have Vaike as a LV20 Warrior. Being promoted, it counts as LV40. So when he reclasses to Berserker, he'll get 20 internal levels. This on top of being a LV1 Berserker, which counts as LV21, means he'll count as a LV41 unit.

Meanwhile, if you have him go from a LV20 Warrior to a LV1 Barbarian, he'll still have those 20 internal levels but only 1 class level instead of 21, so he'll count as a LV21 unit.

[geozeldadude]

Let's say you have Vaike as a LV20 Warrior. Being promoted, it counts as LV40. So when he reclasses to Berserker, he'll get 20 internal levels. This on top of being a LV1 Berserker, which counts as LV21, means he'll count as a LV41 unit.

Meanwhile, if you have him go from a LV20 Warrior to a LV1 Barbarian, he'll still have those 20 internal levels but only 1 class level instead of 21, so he'll count as a LV21 unit.

so if vaike was a lev10 warrior (= level 30) and he reclassed to berserker, would he get 10 internal levels or, as someone said above, 30/2 = 15? the former would make him effectively level 31 which would make sense, whereas the latter would actually make him level 36 which doesn't make sense to me at all.

since the max internal level is 20 (on normal), it sounds like you can reclass to a promoted class over and over again to improve your skills and stats, but once you hit 20/20 you hit the max penalty for earning experience but being at a high level, if that makes any sense.

[Othin]

30/2=15, yes. He'll be counted as a LV36 unit.

You're right that it's somewhat arbitrary and doesn't line up with the actual number of levels a unit has gained. But that's not that strange. Promoting Vaike from a LV10 fighter to a Warrior, he jumps from counting as LV10 to counting as LV21, and that's a mechanism that exists in some form in almost the entire series. So it's really just another level of class change.

[geozeldadude]

30/2=15, yes. He'll be counted as a LV36 unit.

You're right that it's somewhat arbitrary and doesn't line up with the actual number of levels a unit has gained. But that's not that strange. Promoting Vaike from a LV10 fighter to a Warrior, he jumps from counting as LV10 to counting as LV21, and that's a mechanism that exists in some form in almost the entire series. So it's really just another level of class change.

thanks for the replies. you make a good analogy. so like an early promotion you get increased stats but will earn less experience than you would have, but in this case you get more skills and different growths and will also earn less experience. so kind of a built-in penalty in both cases. but the penalty of not earning EXP as quickly is fairly small, and in the case of getting to 20/20 it sounds like you don't really get any penalty. which kind of makes me want to hold off on experimenting with class changes since i'm so used to always getting to 20/20, but next PT i may experiment more with changing class at level 10 unpromoted and level 15 promoted.