Am I a horrible person (spoilers)?

[cloudropis]

I admit, I spoiled myself good chuncks of the game when it came out in america, like chap 9 and 10 and who is the final boss (don't spoil its motivations or origins, I just know its name and... sembiances.

Chap 9 and 10 were defined as heartfelt moments and I saw many cried.. But how come? I felt almost nothing, especially in chap 9, I expected it to be disappointing because such plot twists after 9 chapters looked a bit silly, especially seeing how Fire Emblem handles cutscenes and story progression (AKA there is not much of it bar at the end of the chapter).

Emmeryn's death was... pretty meh. We didn't know a lot about her and was a bit stereotypical. The game TELLS us she's a great ruler, but doesn't SHOW us. And she doesn't appear in many cutscenes before either, so her sacrifice seems... really meh. I usually take the "try to save every person and hope for a deus ex machina to fix everything" route in choices like at the end of chap 9, but this time I really didn't feel anything for her, so I chose to not hand over the Fire Emblem, albeit I checked beforehand the consequences because I know of a certain spotpass chapter.

When I heard about Mustafa I thought "jeez, he must be an excellent character to make people actually cry", but is really a character introduced and doomed in the same chapter so heartfelt? The whole "good person bad faction" thing is handled horribly, this time the game SHOWS us but it does that in a BAD way. Oh look, "please surrender so we don't kill you" cutscene! K. "Your sister was pretty cool, I'm sorry for her". Well.. Okay. "I really don't wanna do this but I'm sticking with you to the end, boss!" cutscene. Oh please, was I supposed to empathize with Mustafa this way? You want to keep the Camus archetype in the game, good, but not shove it down our throats this way! At least make him appear some chapters before! OR MAKE THE WHOLE TWO CHAPTERS HAPPEN AFTER BARELY A THIRD OF THE GAME! Maybe I was disappointed because, as I heard of it, it seemed Eltshan second coming, but it's definitely not. Awesome music BTW, it sure helps a lot, I certainly liked Mustafa better then Emm for that. If only I could actually care about the involved characters, those could have been really great moments.

So, am I a horrible children-eater or not? Or I'm not alone, at least?

[Ace Tactician]

Well, I didn't even cry after chapter 9 and not even during chapter 10. I did FemaleAvatarxChrom, sort of felt the emotions in the end of Chapter 13 reunion scene, but, I chose yes to accept Lucina's judgement and didn't cry there either.

So, count me in since I spoiled myself also.

Edited April 24, 2013 by Ace Tactician

[Interceptor]

This is SpartaFire Emblem, not Shakespeare. The story is not great. It is not bad. Some of the cutscenes are pretty neat. This is enough.

[Klokinator]

Oh the whole thing with chrom's sister was kinda pathetic. Took me a minute to realize what everyone was talking about because I never spoiled anything. Even though I played the game with zero spoilers to the end, I still didn't find it moving or anything. I like some of the funny supports, but the characters are all personality niches and nothing more. There's the guy who eats a lot (And that's him. He eats a lot, there's nothing else folks.) there's the guy who hates women, there's the pretty girl, there's the ugly girl, there's an annoying chick, there's a few kawaii desu characters, there's a shy chick, it's all NICHES. Chrom is probably the most developed, followed by avatar and maaaaaybe Lissa, maybe. Everyone else though is just Personality trait + Hair color = genericharacter.

The story itself doesn't really even have any twists. I didn't care about Chrom's sister in the slightest because she wasn't interesting, I didn't care about the whole backstabbing part of the game because it felt contrived and fake, and the choices have no impact on the game aside from the very last one which is basically "Happy or sad ending, CHOOSE". I only like the game because as far as gameplay goes, it's ridiculously fun to mess around and there's unlimited replay value, as well as some of the supports being pretty funny.

[Faye]

I cry easily, so Emmeryn's death really brought out the waterworks. Everytime I play this game. Indeed, the first part of the game should have lasted longer, Walmart is a lolfest compared to how wonderful a villain Gangrel is.

[SPSEliwoodGabriel]

I pressed start when the event popped up for Emmeryn, because either way, she was going to fall. Actually, I did that with all the choice moments except the last one , and even then, I skipped straight to the credits. I already knew what was going on.

And if you've been checking out my Magical Adventures, you'd know how I'd react towards Emmeryn's big scene. Still love her, thought. She's AWESOME.

[RJWalker]

I felt no sadness. Her idiotic decisions that put a lot more people than just herself in great danger out of some misplaced sense of 'nobleness and pacifism' finally came back to bit her in the ass.

Oh and Eldigan (Eltshan) was an even bigger idiot. The only good instances of the Camus archetype were Linus, Loyd, Selena and maybe Ishtar. Camus gets a pass to because I was spoiled and already knew about his role in the BS bonus chapters which gave him more screentime.

Tradegy without happiness shown before hand isn't tradegy.

Edited April 24, 2013 by Ranger Jack Walker

[Peckingbird]

Overall the game wasn't that moving, the huge push for emotion at certain points was almost irritating...

However I couldn't help but feel excited when a certain Don of a charecter waltzes in towards the end.

[arvilino]

Hmm personally I like Mustafa more than Camus. The characters with similar roles to Camus have a bad rap of overshadowing their entire forces when it comes to sympathetic enemy characters. Mustafa on the otherhand is just a representative to show that a great number the Plegians actually are reasonable and touched by Emm's speech and actions, if Mustafa was more like Camus he'd overshadow the meaning of the chapter and you'd feel sorry for that really nice and just General and not his troops who he's leading into a conflict that both sides don't truly want.

[cloudropis]

And the story being so subpar so far makes me crackle about the rest of the game... Jeez, by Chap 10 we have 4-5 villains to antagonize us, I'm fearing pretty bad pacing.

@Ranger Jack Walker are you referring to his

overattachment to knight's creed?

I know Fire Emblem isn't known for well written story... But it did better then this. At least characters are funny in supports, and this time we can all enjoy them at once.

[Airship Canon]

I... was kinda ticked off about Ch9/10 honestly.

It was only sad because it invoked memories of Ch4 from FE4.

But in all honesty I was really irked about it. That little arc was handled as tactically well as "Operation: Ouka" (AKA "Operation Cherry Blossom" or "The Original Hive Infilitration".) AKA: Tacticially STUPID.

What's Operation Ouka?

[spoiler=Long Winded Explanation of a Dumb Military Operation from a VN]

Alright, firstly, Operation Ouka is literally the final arc of Muv Luv Alternative- what's That? A VN. It's pretty damn good, and is solid conclusive proof that Westbrick is dumb as his name, aka, a Brick, for his "Cutesy characters and fanservice don't mix with serious settings!OMG!HERRRDURR!" (They mix better than Nuns and Warfare)... But that's beside the point. In short Muv Luv centers around an invaded Earth. BETA, which are alien "lifeforms" (actually they're Mining Bots) have forced humanity to near extinction, forcing the creation of a Superweapon known as the 00-Unit... which turns out to be a girl named Kagami Sumika. Well, the BETA are tactically stupid- they're as smart as... FEA Lunatic AI, really, but can adapt to strategies, so the same strategy used doesn't work more than once, forcing constant tweaking. The 00 Unit can communicate with them, and is used to formulate a direct attack plan... unfortunately, because she can communicate with them, and is a Supercomputer preloaded with every bit of tactical data humanity ever has... the BETA get smart. Which forces Ouka, or the attack on the Original Hive, which will make the BETA stupid by destroying their "supercomputer" aka "Superior". To carry this out, they drop the 00 Unit, who can operate another superweapon, the XG-70d, in said machine into the Primary Hive (a BETA base as it were)... which contains millions of BETA. The problem is that due to some dumb reasons Sumika wanted to Solo this (at least she gets talked out of that)... but what makes it really dumb, is that she ORDERS AWAY THE US SUPPORT BY TRICKING THEM. (And another scene has the main cast throw away more allies for dumb reasons too.) Yeah, brilliant. The XG-70 may be godly, but it's got limited usage time, and limited ammo. Instead of making use of allies, they act brilliantly, and get rid of them. She also ensured her own death by instead of disabling the captured reactor, having it killed... End result of the tactical errors? EVERYONE BUT THE MAIN CHARACTER AND A BIT OF THE SUPPORTING CAST (None of the mains besides the absolute main) DIES.

...No, Ch9 is worse than Ouka. At least with Ouka, the biggest error was justified (because while the plan called for stupidity, no plans survive contact with the enemy, and the stupidity got met with laser fire (AKA the Support was blown up).

Emm's "death"(*) could've EASILY been evaded with, I dunno, "Hey, Flavia, Basilio, Your country sells RESCUE STAVES, which any of our hurdurr staffbots can use, can we get a few?". Nope. The rescue op was centered around Pegasus Knights instead. Range? A Rescue can hit a target at Evans from Jungby. That's pretty damn far. A few hundred feet is nothing.

What? A few unpromoted Risen Archers? A Problem? Reeaallly?

[spoiler=*]

Emm... did she survive? Or was she resurrected? The game never elaborates on what exactly occurs. However, you get a Fortify for clearing her chapter.... and Fortify IS Valkyrie. Guess what? Valkyrie is a rez staff... Gameplay wise, Valkyrie is unnecessary, due to mechanics. All other Holy Weapons were nerfed due to age... It's entirely possible that Emm didn't live, it just so happened that someone bearing Valkyrie saw the events unfold and unlike hurrdurr Chrom's army, used a staff about it, but due to age-nerf, Valkyrie.. didn't exactly bring her back fully.

Me? The Plegians reminded me of Ch4 of FE4.

KILL. THEM. ALL.

"Please Spare My Men...."

NOPE, THEY'RE ALREADY DEAD. I'll never, never, never, LTC Ch 10. Why? 1. It's a Sin to Waste EXP. 2. Gotta kill 'em all.

[RJWalker]

What's worse is that she shouldn't have been captured in the first place. I mean, why does she go back anyway? Good soldiers sacrificed their lives to get her to safety and she throws it away out of some misplaced sense of nobleness. It goes ac well as you'd think it does.

In fact, not only do i not feel sad, but I feel relieved. Good riddance, I say. Her idiocy would only have gotten moree people killed.

[Book of Ereshkigal]

I kinda wish they cut out the Valm ark and put more focus on Gangrel and Emmeryns pasts. And the whole past conflict between Ylisse and Plegia in general. It seems like it could have been interesting but they forget about it after killing Gangrel and it really isn't brought up again.

And don't get me started on Chrom ignoring Plegia afterwards. Not saying he had to run the place himself, he should have at least put someone remotely trustworthy in power, instead of just leaving and letting Validar (and they even recognized him as the assassin! How did they not at least scout out plegias new king?! They were just at war, of course there would be negative sentiments, and those who held a grudge would want power...) waltz in and use Grimas religion to trick the peeps of Plegia. Gee, now that I think about it... Validar is kinda like Hitler in that regard?.

While, from what I saw, I liked Emm and had sympathy for her, she was killed off before I really got into caring about her. It's not the paralogue that brings her back that bothers me, TBH. She needed more time to show herself. Show that she is a great ruler, don't tell. And her just going back to Ylisse for 'moral support' is pretty idiotic... Though, if she was using herself as bait(Which IDK WTF she was doing) it backfired anyway as Chrom tried to rescue her.

It feels like an Elbert situation. I didn't care about Elbert, and he did something stupid. While Emm did get a bit more sympathy, since she actually shows up before she dies, it just wasn't enough screentime.

TL;DR: I liked the ideas the game had, but the wrong story points were dropped, and new ones introduced that were also just bland.

I mean, I still liked the game, but I just like nitpicking XD

Edited April 24, 2013 by L95

[Airship Canon]

What's worse is that she shouldn't have been captured in the first place. I mean, why does she go back anyway? Good soldiers sacrificed their lives to get her to safety and she throws it away out of some misplaced sense of nobleness. It goes ac well as you'd think it does.

In fact, not only do i not feel sad, but I feel relieved. Good riddance, I say. Her idiocy would only have gotten moree people killed.

At least she gets called out on her stupidity with that.

MU doesn't. MU's plan was dumb as bricks.

[Tao]

What's worse is that she shouldn't have been captured in the first place. I mean, why does she go back anyway? Good soldiers sacrificed their lives to get her to safety and she throws it away out of some misplaced sense of nobleness. It goes ac well as you'd think it does.

In fact, not only do i not feel sad, but I feel relieved. Good riddance, I say. Her idiocy would only have gotten moree people killed.

Totally agree. I never really liked her nor did I ever really find her to be 'pretty' or 'beautiful'. She looks awkward, at least to me. But I have different tastes anyway.

And don't get me started on Chrom ignoring Plegia afterwards. Not saying he had to run the place himself, he should have at least put someone remotely trustworthy in power, instead of just leaving and letting Validar (and they even recognized him as the assassin! How did they not at least scout out plegias new king?! They were just at war, of course there would be negative sentiments, and those who held a grudge would want power...) waltz in and use Grimas religion to trick the peeps of Plegia. Gee, now that I think about it... Validar is kinda like Hitler in that regard?.

I'm not sure if Chrom would have enough time to scout worth candidates for Plegia. Maybe he feels Plegia might be able to choose their own new ruler? I mean, it WAS Chrom's army that pretty much wiped them out of one. Even if they were provoking Ylisse and all. They also recognized Validar only after he came into the throne. Doubt he knew Validar would be the new candidate. Pluuuus.... hasn't Plegia always been worshipping Grima? Not sure if you can say it as tricking them, but more like using them as sacrifice / Grima-feed.

Anyway, I didn't feel a thing at the end of Chapter 9 or 10, or any chapters really. I guess Chapter 21? or whatever chapter it was that Lucina figured out it was the Avatar who would kill Chrom in the future was touching, but it still didn't make me cry. Even if I always go Chrom/Avatar(F). It touched my heart, yes, but no tears. This game hasn't really made me cried, and I'm a pretty big crybaby. It made me laugh or touched me, though.

Edited April 25, 2013 by Cordelia

[Book of Ereshkigal]

I'm not sure if Chrom would have enough time to scout worth candidates for Plegia. Maybe he feels Plegia might be able to choose their own new ruler? I mean, it WAS Chrom's army that pretty much wiped them out of one. Even if they were provoking Ylisse and all. They also recognized Validar only after he came into the throne. Doubt he knew Validar would be the new candidate. Pluuuus.... hasn't Plegia always been worshipping Grima? Not sure if you can say it as tricking them, but more like using them as sacrifice / Grima-feed.

Pretty sure the whole grima worship thing was a political thing, as not even Gangrel was a true worshiper. Pretty sure the citizens were forced into it. And right after a war it is fairly easy for a religious movement to take root.

"MU: You once worshipped Grima, correct? As a member of the Grimleal?

Gangrel: Pah, those wrinkled old warts with their dusty tomes? I was Grimleal in name only. Course, it was the faith of the realm, so I knew most of its rituals.

MU: Religion can be a powerful tool for uniting people behind a single cause. I wager Aversa used it to convince your subjects to take up arms?

Gangrel: ...Perhaps. But in the end, I'd say she used me as much as anyone.

MU: And what did the people of Plegia really think of the faith?

Gangrel: Think? Ha! They DIDN'T think! Between my iron-fisted rule and Aversa's inquisitions, they had no choice about it. ... But as I said, it was a cruel time."

But still, not even checking in to see who took power in the country you just beat the crap out of is foolish. Just a quick visit to the kings coronation, or whatever.

The fact that Chrom literally seems to have ignored Plegia for two years is silly, like I said. A quick check in(Or a spy) and monitoring of what they were doing would have probably prevented a lot of issues(They may have figured out earlier about the whole dupe Avatar running around, and why Plegia could only supply ships...). And why didn't Walhart come up earlier? Gangrel seemed to know what he(Walhart) was up to. (as Gangrel started the war to unify the continent...)

Edited April 25, 2013 by L95

[Silver Lightning]

Well, I guess I'll be the odd one out here...

I dunno, I thought Emmeryn's death was sad, not necessarily because we got to know her or because she's the best character ever, but because of the sadness it brought to the people who did know and love her. Seeing characters I like and care about that got development like Chrom and Lissa be in such mourning touched me even if the actual death didn't as much. The end chapter 21 scene with Lucina affected me more than any other scene in the FE series simply because it hit me on a personal level, even if I wasn't the one actually repeating the dialogue.

I guess things affect people differently....

[1234567890]

Mutsufa was like this:

Mutsufa: Guys i don't want to kill you.

Basillio: Too bad lol.

Mutsufa: But Emmeryn-

Chrom: SHUT UP I HATE YOU AAAAAAAAAAAAAH sniff cry wah wah whyyyyyyy

Mutsufa: Okay, fine then. I will kill you because I am a nice person!

and then:

Soldier: I don't want to kill these guys.

Mutsufa: I don't either. Go run away

Soldier: Oh but you want to kill them so I will kill them.

Mutsufa: Good boy!

and also:

Mutsufa: What? Thieves? What despicable human beings, plundering our beautiful battlefield and fleeing! We will kill those horrible creatures because I hate them! But first we must kill the Ylissiens because I forgot what I said earlier. Ylissiens are horrible people and they deserve to diiiiiie even more then those random stupid thieves. We can kill those thieves later even though we'll be dead later because I'm literally asking to die lol.

How would that make you sadder then Emmeryn dying?

[euklyd]

Hah.

[spoiler=Spotpass Characters - Paralogue 20]I spoiled myself on who the Spotpass characters were, so when Ch. 9 comes along, I was all like "Oh, OK, someone's gonna rescue her."

Then the Risen Archers show up.
"OK, you give up the Emblem, save her, and take it back."
Then she makes her own choice.
"Wait what. What are you doing? Why the hell are you committing suicide? I'm supposed to recruit you! Goddamn it."

Oh, there are eagles flying around, and they're gonna swoop in like they did in The Hobbit! That must be it!

Nope. Craaaap.

Well, I guess I'll be the odd one out here...

I dunno, I thought Emmeryn's death was sad, not necessarily because we got to know her or because she's the best character ever, but because of the sadness it brought to the people who did know and love her. Seeing characters I like and care about that got development like Chrom and Lissa be in such mourning touched me even if the actual death didn't as much. The end chapter 21 scene with Lucina affected me more than any other scene in the FE series simply because it hit me on a personal level, even if I wasn't the one actually repeating the dialogue.

I guess things affect people differently....

This. This is also so true. I was all for her not being a suicidal moron who makes things so much harder for everyone else and moving the plot along, but I didn't want the sadness that her death would cause other people. That's no fun.

Mutsufa was like this:

Mutsufa: Guys i don't want to kill you.

Basillio: Too bad lol.

Mutsufa: But Emmeryn-

Chrom: SHUT UP I HATE YOU AAAAAAAAAAAAAH sniff cry wah wah whyyyyyyy

Mutsufa: Okay, fine then. I will kill you because I am a nice person!

and then:

Soldier: I don't want to kill these guys.

Mutsufa: I don't either. Go run away

Soldier: Oh but you want to kill them so I will kill them.

Mutsufa: Good boy!

and also:

Mutsufa: What? Thieves? What despicable human beings, plundering our beautiful battlefield and fleeing! We will kill those horrible creatures because I hate them! But first we must kill the Ylissiens because I forgot what I said earlier. Ylissiens are horrible people and they deserve to diiiiiie even more then those random stupid thieves. We can kill those thieves later even though we'll be dead later because I'm literally asking to die lol.

How would that make you sadder then Emmeryn dying?

I think your last three quotes are rather misrepresenting things. It was more like, "I don't want to kill you guys, but if I just let you go then Gangrel will, y'know, murder my family."

It's an important difference, you know.

Edited April 25, 2013 by Euklyd

[WyvernSurfer]

I did feel something with Emmeryn's sacrifice but mostly because I knew what she represented and what she sacrificed herself for. I never got the comments about it like "Only time I cried in a video game".

[HijackThis]

Chapter 9/10? No tears. Saw this coming.

Chapter 21? No tears there either. I said yes. I think it's actually kind of badass for the Avatar to say to his own wife, "Fine. Do it. Just... please do everything you can to be happy after I'm gone, OK dear?"

The ending? Ironically, that's the one place where I did tear up. Picked the "sad" ending simply because I wanted to rub it in that smug bastard's face. Yeah, I know he comes back, but putting Chrom, Lucina, & Morgan (especially Lucina, who's already seen enough death) through that shit was painful, even if the game didn't do much to acknowledge their pain. I still tear up a bit when I do the last chapter again regardless of the fact that I know he lives, simply because dude, you're leaving your wife and daughter to suffer alone. And given that this is coming from someone who laughed during scenes in films he really shouldn't have, that's saying something.

Just my two cents.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Speaking of Camus, im pretty sure many will agree with me that particular Camus from chapter 18 is the worst Camus in the series.....

[cloudropis]

Hey hey, calm down, too much spoilers, I still wanna enjoy what I didn't spoil to myself already :P

I watched chap 9's scene again, and it occured to me this time that the artistic direction is sublime: I love how the music totally stops when she makes the final step.

Heck, why did they screw this so much?! If only the whole thing happened 5 chapters later (with another villain altogether)...

[Airship Canon]

Speaking of Camus, im pretty sure many will agree with me that particular Camus from chapter 18 is the worst Camus in the series.....

Yeah, that guy is... an idiot.