HeoandReo Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 (edited) In fact, let's go all out, shall we? I will not factor in rally skills, as we want our build to be independent of other unit pairs. (You could also stack tons of demoiselle if you feel like it.) Consider Morgan for simplicity (to guarantee we can get all the skills we want), as well as Lucina with Female avatar (+Spd, -Skl) as her mother. Morgan and Lucina must have at least a B support. Swordmaster!Morgan's skills: - Lucky Seven (+20 Avo) - Quick Burn (+15 Avo... ...during the first turn, at least) - Avoid +10 (+10 Avo. Prescience would be more effective in theory, but most of the action happens in Enemy Phase, so...) - Any Breaker (+50 Avo) - Limit Break (Doesn't add Avo by itself, but increases the stat caps, which results in +20 Avo indirectly) Swordmaster!Lucina's skills - Charm (+5 Avo) - Demoiselle (+10 Avo) - Dual Support+ (+15 Avo from support) (Two other skills. Pick what you like) Swordmaster!Morgan's stats: - 62 Spd (93 Avo) - 59 Luck (29 Avo) Boni from Lucina: - 10 Spd (15 Avo) - 8 Luck (4 Avo) This would result in... ...266 avoid against the weapon type you're breaking, without terrain, weapon triangle or rallies factored in, if I didn't screw up my math. I don't think even Lunatic lategame enemies could plausibly hit this. We have to go deeper. I hope you don't mind, but I might use that as a base to see how much we can get if we stack on rallies and stuff like that. I might first increase it to the maximum support level, to get the highest avoid bonus. (You only need to get to Level 10 support rank to do that, so if he has A Lucina, he can C rank with anyone else and still reap the benefits.) -Always rounds down, for conservative estimates Morgan Stats 62 speed, 59 luck Avoid(unpaired) = [(62*3) + 59] / 2 = 122 Pair-up Swordmaster Lucina(A): 10 speed, 5 luck Modified Avoid: [(72*3) + 64] / 2 = 140 Also, just for the hell of it, I'm gonna give him a Balmung for 5 more speed. Modified Avoid: [(77*3) + 64] / 2 = 147 And this is without skills. I'm gonna put on rallies next because I was going to put it after the skills, but it was too much trouble recalculating the avoid stat afterward. Rally Speed/Spectrum/Heart/Luck: 10 speed, 14 luck (rest are irrelevant) Tonics: 2 speed, 2 luck Modified Avoid: [(89*3) + 82] / 2 = 174 If we take what you're suggesting... Morgan's Skills Lucky 7: 20 Quick Burn: 15 Breaker: 50 Limit Break: ~20 Avoid+10/Outdoor/Indoor/Patience/Prescience/whatever: 10 -Total: 115 + 174 = 289 Lucina's Skills Charm: 5 Demoiselle: 10 Dual Support + A Support + C support someone else(maybe Avatar): 20 -Total: 289 + 35 = 324 Wow, now that is pretty insane. Just keep in mind that that's not even the highest we could go. We could do a third generation Morgan optimized for speed/luck, and could shuffle around characters so that we somehow end up with a Swordmaster partner with Dual Support+ and/or Demoiselle. (Donnel!Kjelle and any Gregor daughter could do that, off the top of my head and someone else could be put in Charm duty.) Even if you take off a breaker, (which I might if I were you, breakers are a little situational) you still have a pretty solid 274 avoid, around 267 if you're using something other than Balmung, and 262 if it's just Morgan and Lucina. Just to compare it against some random enemy with, I dunno, 75 skill and luck wielding a Brave Bow, they'll only get to about 225 hit assuming the Brave Bow isn't forged. Breaker-less or rally-less might be enough for most situations. Hawkeye tears it to pieces of course, but you just have to be careful not to get hit by enemies with it. Edited June 17, 2013 by HeoandReo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluues Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 You are correct in thinking 10 avoid is a bit deal thats another 1 in 10 less chance of being hit for each avoid skill plus however much you stack in speed and luck. I was thinking of doing an avoid stack myself. it seems super viable, however if your going for a more risk based strategy like avoid you may as well go with a vantage crit spam, killing anyone before they even attack seems as good as never being hit, especially on street pass teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluues Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 We have to go deeper. I hope you don't mind, but I might use that as a base to see how much we can get if we stack on rallies and stuff like that. I might first increase it to the maximum support level, to get the highest avoid bonus. (You only need to get to Level 10 support rank to do that, so if he has A Lucina, he can C rank with anyone else and still reap the benefits.) -Always rounds down, for conservative estimates Morgan Stats 62 speed, 59 luck Avoid(unpaired) = [(62*3) + 59] / 2 = 122 Pair-up Swordmaster Lucina(A): 10 speed, 5 luck Modified Avoid: [(72*3) + 64] / 2 = 140 Also, just for the hell of it, I'm gonna give him a Balmung for 5 more speed. Modified Avoid: [(77*3) + 64] / 2 = 147 And this is without skills. I'm gonna put on rallies next because I was going to put it after the skills, but it was too much trouble recalculating the avoid stat afterward. Rally Speed/Spectrum/Heart/Luck: 10 speed, 14 luck (rest are irrelevant) Tonics: 2 speed, 2 luck Modified Avoid: [(89*3) + 82] / 2 = 174 If we take what you're suggesting... Morgan's Skills Lucky 7: 20 Quick Burn: 15 Breaker: 50 Limit Break: ~20 Avoid+10/Outdoor/Indoor/Patience/Prescience/whatever: 10 -Total: 115 + 174 = 289 Lucina's Skills Charm: 5 Demoiselle: 10 Dual Support + A Support + C support someone else(maybe Avatar): 20 -Total: 289 + 35 = 324 Wow, now that is pretty insane. Just keep in mind that that's not even the highest we could go. We could do a third generation Morgan optimized for speed/luck, and could shuffle around characters so that we somehow end up with a Swordmaster partner with Dual Support+ and/or Demoiselle. (Donnel!Kjelle and any Gregor daughter could do that, off the top of my head and someone else could be put in Charm duty.) Even if you take off a breaker, (which I might if I were you, breakers are a little situational) you still have a pretty solid 274 avoid, around 267 if you're using something other than Balmung, and 262 if it's just Morgan and Lucina. Just to compare it against some random enemy with, I dunno, 75 skill and luck wielding a Brave Bow, they'll only get to about 225 hit assuming the Brave Bow isn't forged. Breaker-less or rally-less might be enough for most situations. Hawkeye tears it to pieces of course, but you just have to be careful not to get hit by enemies with it. as far as street pass or general game goes its not like that many teams have more than 1 or 2 hawk-eye units so if you focus them down your left with as unhittable unit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 (You could also stack tons of demoiselle if you feel like it.) Not actually having much to do with the avoid stacking discussion, per say... but... I thought "aura" type boosting skills like Charm, Demoiselle, and... the hell was it in English... Solidarity (?) doesn't stack with the same skill? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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