(Spoilers) If only the final cutscene hadn't been there

[Dark Sage]

Killing off the Avatar you may have developed an attachment to through the entire game isn't already memorable?

You what game has an ending that I loved? FFX (before FFX-2 existed, mind you). I can't watch the final cutscene to that game without crying. And that's what I was reminded of when the Avatar sacrificed himself to prevent a threat from ever harming the world again but having to say goodbye to all those people you've developed "bonds" with. It's not an explicitly joyous message, but it's bittersweet and far more moving and powerful, I think.

And then the Avatar showed up again and I got reminded of FFX-2 instead of just FFX, and while the bookend got to me, I was NOT pleased.

On the other hand, FFX's ending had the most ridiculous high five ever recorded

[Faye]

I was actually very happy we came back after we sacrificed our lives to Grima. After all, I don't want to leave my shota husbands Licht and Henri all alone by themsleves, oh oh oh... Plus I'm a sucker for cheesy, out-of-nowhere happy endings. 8D; Every story needs a happy ending.

[Ema Skye]

Yeah. Totally agreeing with you.

This game's story had so much potential, but they just decided to kill it after Ch.11. =/

Edited July 5, 2013 by Dinfinitysignfina

[Prometheus]

Yeah. Totally agreeing with you.

This game's story had so much potential, but they just decided to kill it after Ch.11. =/

I disagree there. I think it ramped up very well from chapters 21-26. It's just the ending cutscene that killed it for me.

[amadeuscho]

When my unit chose to risk sacrificing himself to destroy Grima permanently, I was pleased with the ambiguous way they seemed to be handling the outcome. MU is missing and possibly dead, leaving the rest of the group to mourn, search, and hope for his return. This was good - it meant that the sacrifice was significant and it was up to me, as the player, to decide for myself whether MU would ever be found or if he even survived at all.

And then the character endings roll. So far, so good. After all is said and done, however, a brief cutscene occurs in which Chrom and Lissa find MU asleep/unconscious in a field, just like the beginning of the game. In seconds, all ambiguity was gone. They told me what happened to my avatar. They outright stated that his sacrifice had no consequences because of some love and friendship magic and that he would go on to live a happy life (or as happy a life as one could have with Tharja, anyway).

Why? Just why? Wasn't the non-sacrifice ending (allowing Chrom to deal the killing blow) in place for the crowd that wants definite happy endings and closure? Isn't the entire point of having an avatar that the player gets to choose what they are like, what choices they make, and what happens to them?

I usually pick this ending because it seems like a bigger decision and works well with the finality of the boss. But the cutscene works for me because the way it was shot is exactly like the beginning of the game. The game comes full circle, which is always nice.

I think Intelligent Systems wanted you to know you survived. If this was last FE game ever, that would leave a bad feeling for the series.

[Sublime Manic]

I was actually very happy we came back after we sacrificed our lives to Grima. After all, I don't want to leave my shota husbands Licht and Henri all alone by themsleves, oh oh oh... Plus I'm a sucker for cheesy, out-of-nowhere happy endings. 8D; Every story needs a happy ending.

Completely disagree. And this is why I prefer the endings in FE11/12. A lot of the best narratives ever made do not include happy endings. I actually rather prefer endings that aren't so happy.

[Faye]

Completely disagree. And this is why I prefer the endings in FE11/12. A lot of the best narratives ever made do not include happy endings. I actually rather prefer endings that aren't so happy.

Hm, I won't deny that. 8U; But still, for the game that could have been the last in the series, the happy endings are nice.

[Prometheus]

Completely disagree. And this is why I prefer the endings in FE11/12. A lot of the best narratives ever made do not include happy endings. I actually rather prefer endings that aren't so happy.

Indeed. Happy endings tend to undermine or trivialize the sacrifices made to achieve said ending. Bittersweet is generally the way to go. The feeling of overall victory with a sense that something or someone of value was lost along the way tends to leave a powerful impression.

[Integrity]

Sounds like a lotta cool opinions. I'm personally almost always more satisfied by straight happy endings, and the likes of (f'example since it was brought up) FE11 and FE12 just left me feeling sour.

EDIT: Especially the whole bullshit "i cultivated this guy through the whole game and the ending just sort of tells me that he committed suicide or something after the war" (fuck you wolf)

Edited July 5, 2013 by Integrity

[shadowofchaos]

Indeed. Happy endings tend to undermine or trivialize the sacrifices made to achieve said ending. Bittersweet is generally the way to go. The feeling of overall victory with a sense that something or someone of value was lost along the way tends to leave a powerful impression.

I guess it's just the idealistic part of me, I guess...

"I don't care how grim it looks... I'll find a third option...!"

And like many people have said multiple times... if anything this was supposed to be their last game. If they're gonna end it all, they're not going to end on a "we lost even though we won." They'd go with "we won in this reality, no matter how stupid it is. That the note we'll end on."

Life is depressing sometimes. You're being realistic about this and want that incorporated in the ending and execution. They were probably thinking of people like me when it came to their decisions of the ending. Leaving people the agonizing feeling they had during the credits, is not something they were going to do with the last game they were supposed to make.

[Integrity]

"I don't care how grim it looks... I'll find a third option...!"

Expanding on this: Dragon Age: Origins. Hooray, I can

die or literally beget satanchrist

accidentally spoiling that ending took away the rest of my drive to make it through the Deep Roads again and I've still never finished DA:O.

(this is what we call subjectivity)

[Sublime Manic]

Sounds like a lotta cool opinions.

Basically this. Like, Integrity said, it's ultimately subjective material that some people are going to respond positively to and others aren't. Comes down to what one values in a narrative and preferences and such.

Although I will comment on how a lot of people are saying that because Awakening was going to be the last game in the series it needed to end on a happy note. For the final entry in a series, I'd especially prefer a bittersweet approach, because if you knew you were playing the last entry in a series that is bittersweet. Not that it matters anymore since Awakening raked in the money, honey.

[Prometheus]

Basically this. Like, Integrity said, it's ultimately subjective material that some people are going to respond positively to and others aren't. Comes down to what one values in a narrative and preferences and such.

Although I will comment on how a lot of people are saying that because Awakening was going to be the last game in the series it needed to end on a happy note. For the final entry in a series, I'd especially prefer a bittersweet approach, because if you knew you were playing the last entry in a series that is bittersweet. Not that it matters anymore since Awakening raked in the money, honey.

Everyone keeps saying that Awakening was intended to be the last title. What's the story here? Was Shadow Dragon so bad that it failed to produce a sufficient profit.

Edited July 5, 2013 by Prometheus

[shadowofchaos]

Everyone keeps saying that Awakening was intended to be the last title. What's the story here? Was Shadow Dragon so bad that it failed to produce a sufficient profit.

Developer interview. They were saying that if they didn't sell at least 250,000 copies of Awakening in Japan, they were gonna cut the entire series from production.

[T.W.]

Does anyone else think that the resurrection of the Avatar is similar to pulling the final needle in Mother 3? The theory behind the hidden credits and finding out the characters survived was based on watching the credits. If you cared enough about the characters, you watched the credits and saw the Mother 3 characters/Avatar survived. If you didn't care enough, the Nowhere Islands/Avatar didn't return because you didn't care enough about the characters to find out what happened. Any thoughts?

[Dandragon]

Developer interview. They were saying that if they didn't sell at least 250,000 copies of Awakening in Japan, they were gonna cut the entire series from production.

Well, how many copies have they sold in total?

[Prometheus]

Well, how many copies have they sold in total?

Roughly 500k in Japan, vgchartz is correct.

[Ein]

I could somewhat stomach a lot of dumb stuff of the game but when the Avatar apparently holds back when shoving a lightning dagger through Chrom's stomach because he remembered the prologue I was really done with the game.

The Avatar almost getting possessed by Grima afterwords just made it worse. Then they get saved by the power of friendship which apparently wasn't enough previously. Actually, does the Avatar's spouse and children say anything different during the very last chapter when he gets teleported away.

[Prometheus]

I could somewhat stomach a lot of dumb stuff of the game but when the Avatar apparently holds back when shoving a lightning dagger through Chrom's stomach because he remembered the prologue I was really done with the game.

The Avatar almost getting possessed by Grima afterwords just made it worse. Then they get saved by the power of friendship which apparently wasn't enough previously. Actually, does the Avatar's spouse and children say anything different during the very last chapter when he gets teleported away.

The story had a lot of bad moments. The lightning dagger, which might not have been him holding back so much as not striking vitals, the power of friendship tripe, and the entirety of the unnecessary Valm arc could be viewed as weakpoints of the story. Overall, though, I feel like the story was one of the better Fire Emblem ones. It's not quite on the level of PoR or RD, but I'd put it leagues above the other handheld titles.

[Airship Canon]

Yeah, I know I got inb4'd because people know how much I hate that stinger... and MU's ending in general, so I'm not going into full rant mode. (I'll leave that for GameFAQs and Tumblr)

But yeah I agree with the whole "ruins the moment" thing-- but it's not that it takes away ambiguity. No, no stinger would make it pretty obvious: MU died. Which then, suddenly, there's a lot of weight now added to that choice. With it there, MU living thru the sacrifice, it's have your cake and eat it too- basically you can choose to take a happy ending now, but risk Grima -potentially- coming back hundreds/thousands of years later, or you can let everyone cry for a moment, kill that big guy and come back and take a happy ending there. That's not a choice- it's too onesided.The rest of the choices leading up to it not meaning anything, but the final one having meaning-- that's definitely stylistic, and something that fits the whole "fighting fate" theme of the game. But for it to have meaning but no weight is incredibly dumb.

One could argue that there's still no choice in it without the stinger, but they'd be quite wrong. There might not be a choice for them, but for others, who knows? I, for one, am not fond of the idea of an absolute cost with a theoretical reward, so I wouldn't be picking MU's ending any time soon, but I know there are others who disagree.

[Constable Reggie]

I really liked Mega Man Zero 4's ending.

Its ending carried weight, in my opinion, because a real sacrifice was made, even though I'm sure they would retcon the hell out of if they wanted to make a MMZ5.

Edit: Just wanted to add that the image after the credits was the nail in the feelings coffin for me.

This. The ending picture with Zero's shattered helmet half-buried in the sand is an incredibly powerful and memorable one. I felt gyped when the post-ending scene for Awakening happened.

[Zera]

Considering this could've been the last Fire Emblem game, I think they wanted to ensure (insure?) that they ended on a happy note.

Personally, I like that final cutscene, because bonds of friendship and all that jazz and, really, no matter what you think or say, I doubt anyone truly wants to die, even if it is for a good cause. Granted, I think I'd like it better if it were more dependent on how many supports you had, but, again, IS probably wanted to end the series on a high note, if it ended up being the final game for Fire Emblem.

I like your idea, that would've been perfect!