TOUHOU ~ Official Touhou Chat Thread~

[Kriemhild]

The key to clearing MoF: BOMB SPAMMAGE

Also, Glaceon, that's a really nice avatar + sig combination. Where is the character from?

[Magical Glace]

The key to clearing MoF: BOMB SPAMMAGEAlso, Glaceon, that's a really nice avatar + sig combination. Where is the character from?

Dragon Quest VI.

I'm honestly not fond of MoF Bombs. I dislike how they lower Power, and don't deal damage.

[Scarlet]

I'm honestly not fond of MoF Bombs. I dislike how they lower Power, and don't deal damage.

@Bolded: what

MoF bombs are quite certainly amongst the stronger bombs in the series! Their screen-wide damage isn't very impressive at all, but if you take care to actually hit your target with the circle itself, you'll one-shot pretty much any boss spell with it, especially as Marisa. You also get quite a lot of invincibility if you bomb normally (deathbombing in MoF cuts the invincibility frames in half for some reason).

[Magical Glace]

@Bolded: what

MoF bombs are quite certainly amongst the stronger bombs in the series! Their screen-wide damage isn't very impressive at all, but if you take care to actually hit your target with the circle itself, you'll one-shot pretty much any boss spell with it, especially as Marisa. You also get quite a lot of invincibility if you bomb normally (deathbombing in MoF cuts the invincibility frames in half for some reason).

They do?

Never noticed.

Will try later I guess.

[Balcerzak]

Meanwhile, I continue to SUCK

I watched the replay and I have to concur with Proto. While you were doing perfect until stage 5, your deaths there were all in places where I'd normally be bombing (big fairy spam, Gray Thamauturgy, big fairy spam). You even refused to bomb when you noticed yourself being boxed into the lowerleft hand corner in the 2nd nonspell (after Guest Daystars). While it's better not to get boxed in (which may be easier slightly higher in the screen, or just taking advantage of upcoming gaps by watching the flow ahead of where it's going to be). Your first bomb was on Star Ritual, and that was a fine place for it.

Your instage death in stage 6 was unfortunate, and you probably should have bombed for the rotating fairy dude's appearance, I know I do, that would have left things a lot cleaner on screen, and simplified the dodging there I think.

Kanako:

Divine Festival can be tricky, I don't blame you for dying there.

You let yourself get boxed in again on the nonspell similar to sanaes after the Pea Soup (or whatever) card and before the Hunting Ritual Card. Be more active in seeking out safe spots rather than letting them come to you.

It looked like you had the right idea on Hunting Ritual, but weren't quick enough, and when you saw it wasn't working you should have bombed. You died twice to this spell, and that really set you in a hard spot.

An excellent deathbomb in the next nonspell was quickly followed up by an actual death. I honestly find that nonspell easier on Normal, because you have lines of the big green bullets, making their trajectories known in advance, rather than just single big green bullets, that could be fired anywhere, but maybe that's just me. Sometimes having additional bullets on your screen helps me get steered in the direction I need to be going.

Edited December 2, 2014 by Balcerzak

[Magical Glace]

Yeah, sometimes I forget the bomb key is there.

I also really miss having Killer Doll *Shrug*

[Kriemhild]

Yeah, sometimes I forget the bomb key is there.

This is an indication that MoF really isn't the game for you. Anybody that says MoF is easy to clear (which includes myself btw) are basing their opinion on the ability to bomb spam, at least to a significant extent.

This also goes for PCB too, at least for me; you get to spam a lot of bombs when SakuyaA has 4 bombs/life and you get a lot of Extends.

If you don't like actively bombing to tough moments, I would suggest playing different Touhou games. My recommendation would be IN, because you often get a really long Last Spell window. As long as you fire a Last Spell every time you get hit, you get to avoid wasted deaths without having to actively bomb before you get hit or rely on amazing deathbombing skills.

SA is a game that discourages bomb dependency, but it's also like, really difficult. SA Easy isn't that bad though, so you can try it out and see how it's like.

TD gives you plenty of bombs, but the bullet patterns are also the easiest in Windows Touhou, so you'll probably do fine even without bombing or abusing Trance. You get very few lives though, so you really don't want to screw up too much.

UFO lets you decide which resources you want to rack up. Summoning red UFOs nets you a LOT of extra lives (you can literally cap your total lives by the end of Stage 3), while still having only 2 bombs per life, making it a very good choice for players that die a lot without bombing.

EoSD is almost as easy as TD, but there are still some parts that would be a bit tough, and you'll likely want to bomb to them. You also don't get a lot of lives though (still more than TD).

DDC will let you quickly rack up A LOT of bombs if you like auto-collecting, but their actual use depends on the shot type. Half the shot types have 0-damage bombs, but they have other cool stuff instead. You can probably get through DDC without bombing too much, as long as you auto-collect enough to get a lot of lives. Plus, once you rack up a lot of bombs, you might actually feel like using them for a change.

Based on reluctance to rely on non-death bombs, I would rank the Touhou games as IN > TD > SA > UFO > EoSD > DDC > PCB > MoF

Edited December 3, 2014 by Railgun

[Pull My Devil Trigger]

UFO is infinitely harder than mof without bombs :v

Only really challenging thing in mof easy is kanako while ufo is hell except for murasa

stage 1 never counts when it comes to easy mode at least

[Balcerzak]

Yeah, sometimes I forget the bomb key is there.

I also really miss having Killer Doll *Shrug*

...speaking of Killer Doll, is it just me, or are Sakuya's "hard version" spells (specifically Jack the Ludo Bile and ZA WARUDO) actually easier than her normal spells? Illusionary Misdirection might be a little harder, but I attribute my death to that to a derp moment, and I'll have to re-evaluate on future runs. I didn't actually get to Killer Doll, but considering how much of a bitch Marionette is, I'll probably just bomb it anyway.

replay

[Scarlet]

Anybody that says MoF is easy to clear (which includes myself btw) are basing their opinion on the ability to bomb spam, at least to a significant extent.

Yeah, MoF patterns without bomb spam are definitely on the hard side. As far as boss battles are concerned, MoF Lunatic probably has the most insane patterns in the series, so you'll have a very bad time trying to clear it without bombs.

My recommendation would be IN, because you often get a really long Last Spell window. As long as you fire a Last Spell every time you get hit, you get to avoid wasted deaths without having to actively bomb before you get hit or rely on amazing deathbombing skills.

Only the Border Team really constantly has long Last Spell windows; outside of Spellcards, other teams sometimes get literally one frame to do something if they get hit.

Also, Last Spells consume two bombs rather than one, so it's still a waste when compared to bombing normally.

EoSD is almost as easy as TD, but there are still some parts that would be a bit tough, and you'll likely want to bomb to them. You also don't get a lot of lives though (still more than TD).

While I agree overall, Stage 5 and Stage 6 have some quite ridiculous bullet spam in the stage parts. I don't think trying EoSD if you're not good at bombing is a good idea.

[Scarlet]

...speaking of Killer Doll, is it just me, or are Sakuya's "hard version" spells (specifically Jack the Ludo Bile and ZA WARUDO) actually easier than her normal spells? Illusionary Misdirection might be a little harder, but I attribute my death to that to a derp moment, and I'll have to re-evaluate on future runs. I didn't actually get to Killer Doll, but considering how much of a bitch Marionette is, I'll probably just bomb it anyway.

Depends on your playstyle; they certainly have more bullets, but I at least wouldn't call them objectively harder than the Normal Mode versions. In fact, Sakuya is the only Lunatic Stage 5 boss I usually manage to capture all spellcards of lol. (The non-spells are a bitch, though.)

Sakuya's Stage 5 Midboss Spell is quite definitely easier on Hard and even Lunatic than on Normal though, haha.

[Junk]

I find EOSD really hard. Very random and fast bullets. Probably why I stopped playing it.

Started playing ufo again and while the first half of the game is still crap and honestly may be the worst game i've ever played second half of the game is honestly god tier. Easily up there with MOF. Actually feels like the patterns are fair. Extra stage is also god tier. I really love ufo romance(I used a score dat to cheat my way to unlock extra btw). Man if only the ufo gimmick didn't exist this game would be above pcb.

Byakuren is also surprisingly easy on easy mode at least(again score dat) and really her only card is probably milky way.

Edited December 3, 2014 by Junk

[Magical Glace]

Actually, even without deathbombs... I still find MoF and PCB easy to be much easier than SA, etc.

PCB's biggest issue is the Prismrivers and to a lesser extent Youmu, and Killer Doll is probably my favorite bomb ever. I don't forget it's there, and I'm less reluctant since it doesn't reduce Power like MoF bombs.

MoF is doable until Kanako quite easily, so long as I can hold my focus. On Monday, I lost 3 lives to a Sanae spell I can usually capture because a family member was talking to me and kissing me good-night.

[Magical Glace]

http://replays.gensokyo.org/download.php?id=35430

...That damn last spell.

Please tell me she doesn't have a spell like resurrection butterfly after that

[Scarlet]

Please tell me she doesn't have a spell like resurrection butterfly after that

No worries, Yuyuko is the only one who ever did that.

(Well, technically, Eirin and Kaguya do it, too, but you can fail their Last Words and still be considered to have 1cc'd the game.)

[Magical Glace]

No worries, Yuyuko is the only one who ever did that.

(Well, technically, Eirin and Kaguya do it, too, but you can fail their Last Words and still be considered to have 1cc'd the game.)

Okay yay I don't mind Resurrection Butterfly, it isn't hard, but I don't want a chance to die after managing THAT

[Kriemhild]

Oh, wow, I just checked that replay, and your dodging skills are actually really good. Now, if only you could just bomb instead of dying so much...

Also, if it makes you feel any better (likely not), the Mountain of Faith spell is even tougher on Easy than it is on Normal.

[Magical Glace]

Oh, wow, I just checked that replay, and your dodging skills are actually really good. Now, if only you could just bomb instead of dying so much...Also, if it makes you feel any better (likely not), the Mountain of Faith spell is even tougher on Easy than it is on Normal.

That's reassuring...

I do try.

By the way, are bombs nerfed during that spell specifically? Or did I 'run out' of bombs given by bomb pieces?

[Pull My Devil Trigger]

Bombs are nerfed hard during MoF

Their are of effect gets extremely tiny

Only use them in it if you know you're gonna die

Also I disagree normal mpde version is harder

[Magical Glace]

Bombs are nerfed hard during MoF

Their are of effect gets extremely tiny

Only use them in it if you know you're gonna dieAlso I disagree normal mpde version is harder

That's what I was wondering.

[Kriemhild]

Well, final bosses generally become invincible when you bomb during their final spells. Kanako's Mountain of Faith spell is no exception. Not only is she immune to bomb damage, but even your normal shots won't have any effect during a bomb. Furthermore, as Tonton pointed out, their area of effect becomes really small. Considering that you still lose Power from bombing, it would be preferable to avoid bombing as much as possible during this spell, which is the exact opposite of how you should deal with any other troublesome spell in MoF Story Mode.

That being said, bombing > dying even during the Mountain of Faith spell. Especially in MoF where you gain 3.20 Power when you die even if you had 0 Power before dying. Since the bullet patterns aren't always extremely intense, it's worth bombing when they DO become ridiculous while relying on the less intense moments to dish out damage through your normal shot.

Also, in case this is the first time you're facing a boss final spell, her HP is reeeeeeeaaaaally huge during Mountain of Faith, much more so than any other spell in Story Mode. And the spell gets tougher with time, so you'll want to finish her off quickly.

[Fera]

eosd lunatic is actually fun

except remilia

remi plsgo

[Magical Glace]

Well, final bosses generally become invincible when you bomb during their final spells. Kanako's Mountain of Faith spell is no exception. Not only is she immune to bomb damage, but even your normal shots won't have any effect during a bomb. Furthermore, as Tonton pointed out, their area of effect becomes really small. Considering that you still lose Power from bombing, it would be preferable to avoid bombing as much as possible during this spell, which is the exact opposite of how you should deal with any other troublesome spell in MoF Story Mode.That being said, bombing > dying even during the Mountain of Faith spell. Especially in MoF where you gain 3.20 Power when you die even if you had 0 Power before dying. Since the bullet patterns aren't always extremely intense, it's worth bombing when they DO become ridiculous while relying on the less intense moments to dish out damage through your normal shot.Also, in case this is the first time you're facing a boss final spell, her HP is reeeeeeeaaaaally huge during Mountain of Faith, much more so than any other spell in Story Mode. And the spell gets tougher with time, so you'll want to finish her off quickly.

I don't remember Yuyuko (the only other final boss I can reach) being invincible to bombs in her last spell not named Resurrection Butterfly... Even on normal, so it was quite a surprise to me.

I'll keep it in mind next attempt.

[Pull My Devil Trigger]

you also thought mof bombs didn't deal damage :v

or insignificant damage i forgot

[Magical Glace]

you also thought mof bombs didn't deal damage :v

or insignificant damage i forgot

I never noticed.