TOUHOU ~ Official Touhou Chat Thread~

[Magical Glace]

I 1cc'd DDC/IN Normal before finishing UFO/EoSD/PCB Easy!

[Kriemhild]

So what's the easiest, most manageable extra for someone at my level.

Or, is it too early to be thinking about extras.

From the Windows games, definitely PCB Extra imo. However, IN Extra is easier to grind due to Spell Practice and the trick-based nature of like, everything except the Rings of Death.

Mokou's stage is just so much memorization...

Some attacks I just can't pull off no matter how many replays I watch.

I'm not even talking about Mokou.

Just the midboss, lol.

Watching replays is nice, but you'll want to actually understand what the player is doing in order to learn how they're capturing stuff. Otherwise, you'll probably remain clueless (like how I still can't replicate Annie's Woo approaches).

As for mid-Keine...

[spoiler=Keine #1]- The diamond bullet pattern changes based on whether you are a human or a youkai. Although the human pattern is easier (imo), I would recommend youkai due to hitbox + precise movements. Whichever you decide on, try to stick to it, because shifting between human and youkai will mix up bullets which can be annoying.

- For diamond bullets, the odd-numbered waves (1st, 3rd, 5th, etc) are identical to each other, and the even-numbered waves (2nd, 4th, etc) are identical to each other. This means you only really need to learn two routes!

- The red arrowheads are aimed. When they are fired, you need to stream in either the left or right. You have to keep moving in that direction until the barrage stops. Try to move slowly but don't dawdle. If you are approaching the edge, you can continue streaming diagonally upwards or directly upwards.

- Odd-numbered waves have a safespot at the center of the absolute bottom. This is right above the "e" in the "Enemy" marker. During Keine's dialogue, you should try to position yourself there.

- There are safespots to the diamond bullets just outside the walls in the center. That is, to the right of the right wall near the center, and to the left of the left wall near the center. Image for reference. I think the safespots for even-numbered waves require a little more precision than odd-numbered waves.

- For youkai characters, note that arrowheads are fired before the diamond bullets finish, so even if you sit at a safespot, you need to move out and start streaming the red arrowheads. This requires you to dodge the diamond bullets as well.

- I'm mentioning the safespots because they are easy to find and are good points of references for you to start your routes on. Even when utilizing safespots, you will still need a lot of practice to execute them with proper timing and positioning. And if you find yourself accustomed to a different route that doesn't involve a safespot, then it's better to ignore the safespot and go with the route you're comfortable with. There are a gazillion routes to this spell, just go with the ones you're most comfortable with. Trying to learn someone else's route can be difficult and is not recommended; you're better off with Spell Practice grinding to find your personal routes.

[spoiler=Keine #2]- Bullets curve in from the bottom. Their trajectories are fixed and you should quickly learn the way they curve to find and anticipate safe openings.

- Unlike #1 and #3, DO NOT STAY AT THE ABSOLUTE BOTTOM. Unless you wanna use the safespot in the bottom-right corner, but the bubbles will kill you then.

- However, don't get too close to Keine either, since your dodging options are limited. Try to stay further away from Keine, and move towards the bottom when you find openings. Staying low allows you to back up in case you can't find good openings quickly at first glance.

- The purple bubbles Keine fires are aimed. While it is certainly possible to just react to them and move, you'll likely find yourself subconsciously memorizing the timing of the bubbles by the time you master the spell, thus making them quite trivial.

- If your ability to find safe openings or to read the bullet curves is awful, you may want to consider bombskipping this...

[spoiler=Keine #3]- Similar to #1, with diamond bullets and aimed oval bullets (instead of arrowheads)

- The diamond bullets are denser (more walls too), but also slower. Therefore, the challenge is more on finding a safe route than on executing it correctly.

- My personal route that I would recommend is to start off near one wall inside the room in the center. Stream to the opposite wall but pace yourself so that you can reach the break between walls by the time you get there, allowing you to continue streaming and leave the room. This image shows where to start, which direction to stream, and which "break between walls" you should pace yourself to be able to slip through. Also, once you leave the room, depending on your streaming pace, you may end up having to stream vertically a bit, which is fine.

[Kriemhild]

Also, while I definitely agree that Remilia Solo is the best for IN Extra, I would not recommend using her for a first Ex Clear attempt, unless you're already good with using her. Since your Easy 1cc was with Border Team (iirc), I would suggest sticking with Border Team, which is also the best for a first EX Clear.

Let us know if there are any other parts in IN Ex that you're having trouble with. Me and Annie kinda mastered almost everything in it.

[Magical Glace]

Almost because neither of us can Rings of Death and I can't Fujiyama Volcano

[Magical Glace]

Yeah, I'm going with border team.

The farthest I've gotten so far is Mokou's third attack.

I'm still having a ton of trouble with the midboss though.

Tips and tricks:

Last Fairy before Mokou: Border Team has a safespot in the lower left hand corner

By Mokou's third attack, do you mean Non 2 or Flaw of Forgiving Shrine, if the latter, head to the left edge and move on top of familiars as they come.

Fire Bird Flying Phoenix: Start in one corner, let her fire two phoenixes, move to the other.

[Magical Glace]

Stage 1: focusing above PoC lets you autocollect below full power you know

Wriggle: Perfect Cleared. No mistakes.

Stage 2: Again, focusing above PoC lets you autocollect below full power

Mystia: Pefect clear, but consider going human for the non before Ill-Starred Dive, to kill familiars.

Stage 3: Missed a lot of Autocollect opportunities. I'm starting to fear for the 1100 extend... Mid Keine handled well at least.

Keine: Yukari for the first non? Then you got hit, ouch. try going Reimu for this so you can kill her familiars and lessen your load. Buretsu Crisis done well, but then you died again to the second non. At least try to Last spell should you get hit... Both Sword and Legend of Gensokyo (or whatever the Easy/Normal version is) capped nicely.

Stage 4: Dammit, why didn't you bomb there? Oh well... Still a lot of missed PoC opportunities, even during Marisa (now I'm doubting the 800 extend). Milky Way capped, nice. Unfocused for part of the Stardust Reverie circle, no idea why, but okay, you capped anyway.

Marisa: Last non bombed, beyond that, perfect clear. Unfocused Master spark is weird though, Ran does more damage.

Stage 5: perfect, cool.

Reisen: Visionary Tuning death? Well okay... just look for bigger safe areas. Invisible Full Moon, Get up close and personal with Reisen when her eyes flash, then slowly back down.

Stage 6: Where did that first death come from? Also, MORE MISSED AUTOCOLLECTOTUNITIES. I'm not doubting the 800 extend anymore, but come on. Mid Eirin's Non went okay... then you died twice to Galaxy in a Pot. I don't like it either, but really, you should have bombed if you're that bad at it.

Kaguya: ...Unfocused Dragon's Necklace? Wut. Then you died. Ow. Second non capped, whee. Pulled some risky stuff for Budda's Stone Bowl, namely you went through lasers. Still capped. Non 3 is evil, don't blame you for bombing there. An Easy Fire Rat Robe capture that isn't no-horizantal? Never thought I'd see the day, since it's easier like that imo. Non 4 was going well, then you rammed a blue bullet and died, which is weird, because there weren't any red bullets around. Then Bombed. Cowrie Shell was bombed, and you did get into a couple precarious situations with the lasers. As for Rainbow Danmaku, I have absolutely no idea why you bombed there, you were doing fine, you probably could have capped.

No one cares about Last spells so I'm not going to bother

[Magical Glace]

Overall most of those deaths were pretty much just silly. Aside from some weird approaches (what even was that Dragon Necklace) you were overall fine

[Magical Glace]

kedama mooks: go Reimu. Everything else: Yukari

[Magical Glace]

Xu Fu is easy

Absolute bottom, Blue cards can't hit you there (ignore their sprites they LIE), reds wait to hit you. stream along and you'll be fine

[Magical Glace]

http://replays.gensokyo.org/download.php?id=37337

The best Border Run I have uploaded.

Hollow Giant "Woo" is tricky, but there's a lot of ways to do it. I settle with a misdirection approach.

[Kriemhild]

Also, if you have it, could you please post a Reimu/Yukari clear of Mokou's stage, glace.

Not Glace, but having another replay might be useful: http://replays.gensokyo.org/download.php?id=37785

My approaches for some spells (Flying Phoenix, Woo, Volcano, etc) were different from hers though...

[Magical Glace]

EXCELLENT

/me Sits down to watch

[Magical Glace]

[spoiler=Analysis]PreKeine: Could have streamed slower for the opening to kill the familiar fairies faster. Second set of red/blue line fairies didn't start at the side, but the sets after that did. No Miss, No bombs.

Keine: Start closer to the middle for even waves of Anceint History. Moved around a bit for the first wave, but did fine there. Returning Bridge capped, whee. Same for Next History of Phantasm, though with a different but still effective route than mine... actually, that route might be better than mine (not that I'll change my habitual route).

PostKeine: Tackle the first set of line fairies in the other direction, to create an oppertunity to autocollect the point items. Purple oval route wow, that was safe as heaven, I'll have to try that. Last Fairy safespotted, though without Ran deploy. Doesn't matter because you got the extend anyway.

Iwakasa's Moon Curse: Really silly last spell early failing to slip through the bullet wall. ... then you did it again. Okay.... Not much I can say here beyond spell practice to get better at the walls.

Fire Bird -Flying Phoenix-: Misdirection approach, could have afforded to start higher, but otherwise captured nicely.

Flaw of Forgiving Shrine: Safe Zoned nicely.

Non 4: Wasn't expecting that, but can't really give much advice here beyond be careful.

Xu Fu: Kinda wobbly, but standard capture

Honest Man's Death: You're moving WAY too much. You got hit twice here. Stay near the bottom center, predicting the lasers and moving very little to avoid them.

Non 6: I can barely pull off this thing. So good job capturing it.

Woo: ...What are you doing? You seem to be trying to combine Proto's approach with mine. Pick one, and stick to it.

Non 7: You're so much better at these nons than I am crai.

Phoenix Tail: Can I just say the skill based stuff is easier for you than the trick based stuff? Okay? You are better at the skill based stuff.

RINGS OF DEATH: One last spell but beyond that you dodged reall well. Worth noting this is the third fastest attack in the series (after Gengetsu's timeout and Remilia's Fitful Nightmare), and easily the hardest attack in IN. So yeah. That's really impressive.

Fujiyama Volcano: I hate this thing, I want it to die, you did way better than I usually do.

Possessed by Phoenix: Spell practice grind the circle, try to get as perfect at it as you can. If you're hit and last spell, don't stop the circle. Phase 3 and 4 are easy, so expected cap is expected.

Hourai Doll: Oh god...

Here's the thing. You want to move in a small (clockwise) circle to start, then gradually increase the size when the yellow bullets begin. You dealt with a lot of arrowheads, and screwed up the circle a lot. Spell Practice should help a lot here.

Overall: The trick based attacks gave you a lot more bane than the nons. Because of that... you'd probably be better at Ran or Nue, possibly Raiko. But overall, execellent job.

[ZemZem]

Never mind.

I beat Mokou.

http://replays.gensokyo.org/download.php?id=37787

ayyyy gj

move up to normal already bro

and use default lives!

(and get a skype)

[Magical Glace]

I still don't get your beef with skype

I think you'll beat Ran before I do tbh

[Pull My Devil Trigger]

I still don't get your beef with skype

lol

[Magical Glace]

UFO takes getting used to

b/c dumb mechanic

[Junk]

yeah i'd say from UFO and up the games just haven't been nearly as good IMO.

[ZemZem]

PCB is the only great one from the earlier ones.

IN isn't that good and EoSD is RNG up the ass.

[Junk]

PCB is the only great one from the earlier ones.

IN isn't that good and EoSD is RNG up the man i should play this game more i think i'd find it better than all the other ones now and might actually play this one.

[Magical Glace]

I started with PCB, and IN is my favorite game.

Don't like EoSD though.

That said, I mainly play Extra nowadays and rarely play the main portion of the games, because I have such an "Extra" mindset when I play. Trying to do the main games is hard for me, compared to Extras. I can't get past stage 4 in TD Normal for example.

[ZemZem]

Yes. Everyone should play PCB more.

It's fun. Very fun.

[Magical Glace]

IN > PCB > EoSD >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PoFV

[ZemZem]

lol why are you counting PoFV

it's a good game by itself, like GFW and DS

[Magical Glace]

Because PoFV cheats