TheAssassinMercenary Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 (edited) Shovel Knight and Shantae seem to be the most popular indie game characters on the fighter ballot, and many fans can see both feeling right at home in Smash Bros as DLC. Which do you feel would better represent indie games in Smash Bros? I find this topic fitting, given the Shovel Knight rumors that surfaced today on Nintendo Life. Edited August 27, 2015 by TheAssassinMercenary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deleted35362 Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 shantae didnt start as an indie game series, and shovel knight....nothing wrong his game, but its a game thats made to be a throwback so thats kind of a shame too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 I have a bias towards Shovel Knight since I haven't played Shantae yet. I think that Shovel Knight encapsulates more of what Nintendo is, as far as its influences and what it accomplishes. I haven't yet played Shantae, so I can't really give a complete argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 (edited) I have a bias towards Shovel Knight since I haven't played Shantae yet. I think that Shovel Knight encapsulates more of what Nintendo is, as far as its influences and what it accomplishes. I haven't yet played Shantae, so I can't really give a complete argument. Shovel Knight feels more Capcom to me, Shantae has always been on Nintendo consoles meanwhile since her early debut on the GBC, although Wayforward isn't really indie per say in the traditional sense, Shantae is their lots of love side project, they usually focus on licensed games. Edited August 27, 2015 by Jedi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zera Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Shantae is way more Nintendo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 (edited) Shantae by a mile. Shovel Knight's popularity is all about recency. His game getting an expansion certainly helps, but I still feel he'll fade out of fan's minds by the time the next Smash comes. Shantae is older and closer to Nintendo. shantae didnt start as an indie game series, and shovel knight....nothing wrong his game, but its a game thats made to be a throwback so thats kind of a shame too.WayForward is an independent developer. Shantae has always been indie. Edited August 27, 2015 by Red Fox of Fire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Great Geargia Gateway Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Shantae is Castlevany-ishShovel Knight is like Megaman with the strategic placed enemies and level design. I'll root Shovel Knight, because it sales as a retro-game and that's what it was going for since we miss it. When it came to pixels that are used, I preferred SK, but overall design belongs to Shantae and alot of things look nicer and cuter, e.g. the monkey. The concept of a "Shovel" "Knight" is quite interesting though, especially the sole hero's backstory as it's simple but moralizing. Both have good amount of equipment so, a moveset for both of them is there. But a Melee Megaman Vs. Megaman is a good reason to see SK come in on Smash. Both Megaman and SK do have interesting stage designs and both include smart and quick play. Though Shantae is more favored for a spot in Nintendo because she has more games, sometimes, the levels (creative but...) can get pretty gimmicky, annoying, time consuming for a Metroidvania game. Honestly, I would like both to make it into the roster to keep the rivalry alive. Hair tether? Lol. Shovel Pogo? Nerf Greninja. The creativity is endless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAssassinMercenary Posted August 27, 2015 Author Share Posted August 27, 2015 Both have so much potential in Smash Bros, but I have to say I like Shovel Knight a bit more than Shantae. If they were the only characters left as DLC, I'd be perfectly content. If feel like they would fit into the roster better than Sonic or Pac-Man (Megaman feels more at-home to me). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zera Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Shovel Knight = Megaman + Duck Tales = Capcom + Capcom Shantae = Super Metroid + Zelda II = Nintendo + Nintendo Shovel Knight's games and sales: One game 700K sales. Shantae's games and sales: Three games and ??? sales. Shantae has more games and is more Nintendo. Shantae wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Shovel Knight's developers said their main influences were Megaman, Mario Bros. 3, and Zelda 2. And amount of games means nothing when Shulk is in and only has one game with less sales than Shovel Knight (not including the 3DS rerelease). Granted, he isn't 3rd party, but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zera Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 And amount of games means nothing when Shulk is in and only has one game with less sales than Shovel Knight (not including the 3DS rerelease). Granted, he isn't 3rd party, but still. Then what's this? Besides, Xenoblade would have sold way better Nintendo printed more than ten copies. Shovel Knight's developers said their main influences were Megaman, Mario Bros. 3, and Zelda 2. It sounds to me like Shovel Knight simply claims inspiration from ALL the good 8-bit games to give itself insta-cred. Shantae can use her genie powers to transform into animals, and she can use pirate items, but what would really make Shovel Knight stand out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 (edited) Then what's this? Besides, Xenoblade would have sold way better Nintendo printed more than ten copies. It sounds to me like Shovel Knight simply claims inspiration from ALL the good 8-bit games to give itself insta-cred. Shantae can use her genie powers to transform into animals, and she can use pirate items, but what would really make Shovel Knight stand out? That would be an inaccurate source. VGcharts has no credibility Also transformations are out of the picture due to 3DS limitations. Pirate weapons however... Yeah. Edited August 27, 2015 by Jedi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 It sounds to me like Shovel Knight simply claims inspiration from ALL the good 8-bit games to give itself insta-cred. Well, they said Zelda II inspired the shovel bounce (even if it's more like Duck Tales), as well as the towns and setting. Mario 3 was an influence on the world map and some of the level structure and Megaman is an obvious influence on the boss and level design with a bit of Mario and Castlevania for good measure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zera Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Well, they said Zelda II inspired the shovel bounce (even if it's more like Duck Tales), as well as the towns and setting. Mario 3 was an influence on the world map and some of the level structure and Megaman is an obvious influence on the boss and level design with a bit of Mario and Castlevania for good measure. So basically Shovel Knight has no original ideas. He will make an excellent fighter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Except for the tons of creative platforming obstacles and enemies, the use of money, the way progression in the game works, the story and graphics, no, I guess there's nothing original at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnell Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 From someone who has not played either series, I have to say Shantae, though it's close. Sakurai is clearly focusing on legacy when it comes to 3rd party characters, so I'm inclined to think that the character with the longer history with Nintendo would fit better amongst Mega Man, Pac-Man, etc. Shantae goes way back with Nintendo, and even if she has never been as popular as Shovel Knight currently is, she's always had a loyal fanbase. Shovel Knight is the new popular indie on the block, and I would be fine with him in Smash, but I think there's something to be said for Shantae's longstanding loyalty to Nintendo (ironically up until right now). Either fighter could be really fun to actually play, so I have no concerns about movesets or anything. Shantae's huge variety of abilities makes her seem a little more original than SK's more basic disjointed-weapon combat, but I actually prefer playing characters with swords, so I have no qualms either way. Unfortunately, Shantae's transformation mechanic might be difficult for the 3DS to handle. Hopefully they could find a way to make it work, though, like making it so she changes shape only during her attacks. Pac-Man transforms into his classic form like this for several attacks with no problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 From someone who has not played either series, I have to say Shantae, though it's close. Sakurai is clearly focusing on legacy when it comes to 3rd party characters, so I'm inclined to think that the character with the longer history with Nintendo would fit better amongst Mega Man, Pac-Man, etc. Shantae goes way back with Nintendo, and even if she has never been as popular as Shovel Knight currently is, she's always had a loyal fanbase. Shovel Knight is the new popular indie on the block, and I would be fine with him in Smash, but I think there's something to be said for Shantae's longstanding loyalty to Nintendo (ironically up until right now). Either fighter could be really fun to actually play, so I have no concerns about movesets or anything. Shantae's huge variety of abilities makes her seem a little more original than SK's more basic disjointed-weapon combat, but I actually prefer playing characters with swords, so I have no qualms either way. Unfortunately, Shantae's transformation mechanic might be difficult for the 3DS to handle. Hopefully they could find a way to make it work, though, like making it so she changes shape only during her attacks. Pac-Man transforms into his classic form like this for several attacks with no problems. Honestly I didn't even miss the transformations in Pirates Curse, in Shantae 1 and Risky's Revenge they were neat ideas, but it kinda wrecked the flow at times, when in Pirates Curse you just had gadgets to build off each other. Although Half Genie Hero is going back to the Transformation system so, I guess they want to be more traditional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Shovel Knight's got a ton of fun subweapons to fill up his custom moves, so I don't think Shovel Knight's moveset will lack uniqueness. Truth be told, I think Shantae would probably be just as fun a character to play, I just have Shovel bias. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zera Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Except for the tons of creative platforming obstacles and enemies, the use of money, the way progression in the game works, the story and graphics, no, I guess there's nothing original at all. There's a problem - none of that stuff pertains to Shovel Knight himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 (edited) Neither do any of his influences, so what exactly are you getting at? Edited August 27, 2015 by Knight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zera Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 He has no unique moves. That's what I'm getting at. Also, Villager already has a shovel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondworld Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Also, Villager already has a shovel.I fail to see how villager having this one shovel attack is relevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 I assume you know very little of the game. He's got a multitude of subweapons, some unique, some basic, plus he'd use his shovel in more ways than Villager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zera Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Let me rephrase that. What would make his fighting style unique in Smash Bros? I mean, anyone can use a weapon and whack people with it, that's extremely basic. Let's look at SSB4's newcomers - Rosalina and Luma: Fights with a defensive puppeteer style and has a godly u-air. Bowser Jr.: Has two separate hurboxes that take different damage and is the only character where every last attack is disjointed. Greninja: A cool character who's even more ninja-like than Sheik. Robin: Has a variety of weapons with limited uses. Palutena: Has amazing reach with smash attacks and lots of unique custom moves. Villager: The ultimate camper. Can plant trees and steal projectiles. Little Mac: Incredibly strong on the ground, incredibly weak in the air. Wii Fit Trainer: Has many double hitboxes on attacks. Shulk: Can use Monado Arts to change his entire style. Duck Hunt: Combines projectiles for amazing zoning. Mega Man: Has a massive, versatile range of projectiles. Pac-Man: Has versatile special moves, but all of them can be turned against him. Ryu: Complicates the controls, destroying the original purpose of Super Smash Bros. As you can see, every newcomer brings something new to the table. What would Shovel Knight bring? I haven't played his game yet, so I don't know about all his purchasable spells and abilities. Give me a short phrase or sentence describing his fighting style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAssassinMercenary Posted August 27, 2015 Author Share Posted August 27, 2015 I feel that Shovel Knight would, in essence, combine the moves of several other characters to create his own fighting style. His relics could be some of his specials, (Dust Knuckles, Chaos Sphere, Propeller Dagger, etc.), all of which I could see functioning very similar to other character's attacks. His a-attacks can mostly revolve around his shovel, obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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