Manster and Miletos District - what's their deal, in lore?

[CappnRob]

So I was just wondering, what's up with Manster and Miletos in so far as the grand scheme of Judgral is concerned?

We know in G2 they're both just extensions of the Grannvale Empire, but in G1 I'm... not sure. Lenster is for sure allied or at least at peace with Grannvale in much the same way Augustria was pre-Verdane invasion. But the fact its called a "district" where as Augustria is clearly a kingdom with a collection of lords under one crown, Manster and Miletos are.... not clearly anything. Are they a collection of independent lords with city-states under autonomous authority? Are they vassals of Grannvale, but if so why aren't they just a part of Grannvale? Cuan and his father are mentioned to have been the primary authority that keeps Thracia out of Manster due to the Gae Bolg, but Lenster is far from the Thracia/Manster border, to say nothing of the fact its called MANSTER district, not LENSTER district.

So yeah, any hidden lore tidbits out there to shed the light on the Manster/Miletos situation? :Y

[Yojinbo]

Manster plays a big role in Thracia 776. Miletos kind of just ... exists.

[qwernst]

Manster District is similar to the Holy Roman Empire, in that it's a confederation of numerous states serving their Holy Roman Emperor through the Imperial Election. Considering it's called the Manster District, it can be theorized that Manster was the leading state in diplomacy, but with the heavy emphasis on Leonster during the events of Gen 1, King Calf of Leonster was most likely the Elected Leader for the Manster District. It also helps him that his kingdom inherited the Gae Bolg. Giving his kingdom more importance when it came to a Thracian attack. Before Thracia 776 began and after the Yied Massacre, King Calf traveled to Conote and received reinforcements from King Carl, and his top noble Raydrik in hopes of retaking Manster which was recently taken by Thracia.

Raydrik betrayed Calf at the Battle Of River Thracia, and later killed off King Carl. Conote was quickly conquered by Thracia and the Dragon Knights went straight for Leonster. Finn escaped with Leif and Nanna to Alster. Granvalle invades Alster and executes the King of Alster and sends the Princess Miranda to the Lopto Sect as a hostage. Finn brings Leif and Nanna with him as they continue years of hiding. Granvalle pushes into the recently conquered lands and takes all of the former Manster lands, and subjugated Thracia.


Miletos is an ancient nation from before the First Lopto Empire. It is referenced that the nation is very wealthy through trade. It can be theorized that they were a Republic, similar to Venice. They were quickly annexed by Granvalle and the Lopto Sect made this once thriving nation, into a wasteland of near extinction.

Edited December 13, 2016 by qwernst

[X-Naut]

Don't forget about the Sorrow of Miletos, which occurred during the days of the original Loptyr Empire.

It's Loptyr's personal punching bag. It even looks like a bag that's been beaten into submission.

[CappnRob]

So its safe to assume both are, pre-Empire, nonunified collections of city states working together in collaboration then. I know Miletos is a republic, I think. Manster might be too, idk, would have to check the wiki. So they're both just "regions" and not unified nations, hence the monkier "district" for both, with close ties to Grannvale. I wonder if they're protectorates of old Grannvale or not.

I do wonder why if Lenster is the "head" of the nation states why the district is named after Manster though :V

[Etrurian emperor]

Manster District is similar to the Holy Roman Empire, in that it's a confederation of numerous states serving their Holy Roman Emperor through the Imperial Election. Considering it's called the Manster District, it can be theorized that Manster was the leading state in diplomacy, but with the heavy emphasis on Leonster during the events of Gen 1, King Calf of Leonster was most likely the Elected Leader for the Manster District. It also helps him that his kingdom inherited the Gae Bolg. Giving his kingdom more importance when it came to a Thracian attack. Before Thracia 776 began and after the Yied Massacre, King Calf traveled to Conote and received reinforcements from King Carl, and his top noble Raydrik in hopes of retaking Manster which was recently taken by Thracia.

Raydrik betrayed Calf at the Battle Of River Thracia, and later killed off King Carl. Conote was quickly conquered by Thracia and the Dragon Knights went straight for Leonster. Finn escaped with Leif and Nanna to Alster. Granvalle invades Alster and executes the King of Alster and sends the Princess Miranda to the Lopto Sect as a hostage. Finn brings Leif and Nanna with him as they continue years of hiding. Granvalle pushes into the recently conquered lands and takes all of the former Manster lands, and subjugated Thracia.

Miletos is an ancient nation from before the First Lopto Empire. It is referenced that the nation is very wealthy through trade. It can be theorized that they were a Republic, similar to Venice. They were quickly annexed by Granvalle and the Lopto Sect made this once thriving nation, into a wasteland of near extinction.

I always assumed that Grandbell was closer to the holy Roman empire since they have a collection of very powerful dukedoms serve under a king/emperor while still having goals and ambitions of their own. Their elite armies also all have a German sounding name like Rothridders.

From how I saw it the kingdoms in the Lenster district were allied but ultimately independent from one another which would make them very similar to the Lycian league from Elibe. Manster, Lenster and Conote all have kings which means that they all hold the same rank in theory, something Grandbell and the Holy Roman empire wouldn't have.

The relation with Grandbell and Lenster is that Lenster has a marriage alliance with the house of Chalphy which may or may not extend to the rest of Grandbell. I don't recall hearing about them being anything like vassals.

Italy seems a good comparison for Milatos and its capitol even looks like a Greek/Roman palace. Interestingly it may also to be a region of love and shopping. I recall Leif saying that Cuan and Ethlin spend some romantic time there and I believe Julius also planned to buy a dress for Ishthar when visiting Hilda there.

Edited December 13, 2016 by Etrurian emperor

[CappnRob]

Miletos is a Greek derived name, so that makes since. (Derived from Miletus)

Manster being something like the Lycian League makes sense, except I'd imagine they're less united than Lycia is (as Lycia had an implicit sense of nationhood and the nobles were all marquess and not kings).

Granvall is very HRE-ish, hell, Barhara is even called the holy capital, lol. The lords of each state have their own ambitions but are sworn to the throne of Barhara.

[qwernst]

I always thought Granvalle was more of a feudal kingdom like Medieval France, especially during the Hundred Years War period. I can see Granvalle being HRE too.

[Etrurian emperor]

I always thought Granvalle was more of a feudal kingdom like Medieval France, especially during the Hundred Years War period. I can see Granvalle being HRE too.

I personally saw Augustia as the France to Granbell's germany but that's probably more due to the more fancy name and implied rivalry with Grandbell/Germany.

The Augustrian regions are all head by kings who serve the king of Augustria and ifs official name is ''Dominion of lords''. I'm not sure what real country would be similar to that.

[qwernst]

I personally saw Augustia as the France to Granbell's germany but that's probably more due to the more fancy name and implied rivalry with Grandbell/Germany.

The Augustrian regions are all head by kings who serve the king of Augustria and ifs official name is ''Dominion of lords''. I'm not sure what real country would be similar to that.

We might have to play more Crusader Kings 2 to get more info.

[Etrurian emperor]

We might have to play more Crusader Kings 2 to get more info.

Oh god no! The game has everything I ever wanted out of a total war campaign but its completely terrifying to play as a result. I need a middle ground!

[CappnRob]

Augustria simply struck me as a less powerful Grannvale tbh. Both of them are nations of lords serving under a superior lord, it just seems Grannvale is the vaster, larger, more powerful one with a stronger crusader lineage. They seem to be mix-matching the French and German themes: Augustria certainly SOUNDS more French and Granvalle is where most of the blatantly Nordic borrowed crusader nations are from. Grannvalle however totally outshines Augustria in terms of apparent power and ability, which is kind of the opposite of France and the HRE: France being a central powerhouse for most of European history and the HRE mostly tripping over its own ass most of the time. Augustria seems to ultimately be a weird mix of a league of equal nations under the authority of an even greater king than their own, idk.

[Cymbalina's Revenge]

Augustria simply struck me as a less powerful Grannvale tbh. Both of them are nations of lords serving under a superior lord, it just seems Grannvale is the vaster, larger, more powerful one with a stronger crusader lineage. They seem to be mix-matching the French and German themes: Augustria certainly SOUNDS more French and Granvalle is where most of the blatantly Nordic borrowed crusader nations are from. Grannvalle however totally outshines Augustria in terms of apparent power and ability, which is kind of the opposite of France and the HRE: France being a central powerhouse for most of European history and the HRE mostly tripping over its own ass most of the time. Augustria seems to ultimately be a weird mix of a league of equal nations under the authority of an even greater king than their own, idk.

France went through periods of having fairly weak kings who lacked the wealth and power of the lords of Burgundy, Brittany, Anjou, Normandy, Aquitaine, etc. The idea of a lot of very powerful Lords under a nominal king who perceives them all as a threat fits quite a few situations out of French history. But a "kings under a High King" model happened in quite a few places over the centuries, not to mention it's a big part of Irish lore, so it's fine that Agustria and Grannvale have parallels to France and the HRE but don't map 100%.

[Tetragrammaton]

I'm not sure about Ancient Greek, but in some movies about the Trojan War, I can see that Achilles and Odysseus are prince and king under the king Agamemnon.

Agamemnon can give order to execute either of them.

I think that's how Augustria works.

[CappnRob]

France went through periods of having fairly weak kings who lacked the wealth and power of the lords of Burgundy, Brittany, Anjou, Normandy, Aquitaine, etc. The idea of a lot of very powerful Lords under a nominal king who perceives them all as a threat fits quite a few situations out of French history. But a "kings under a High King" model happened in quite a few places over the centuries, not to mention it's a big part of Irish lore, so it's fine that Agustria and Grannvale have parallels to France and the HRE but don't map 100%.

Irish lore is the second major influence in FE4 next to Nordic so that would make sense, too. And that's also true about the weak French kings ruling over ambitious lords as well.