What if all the games had cameos from the previous continent?

[Jotari]

So wayback when in Gaiden, the developers decided to just throw the white wings and Camus into the game because why not? It took them twenty years to revisit this idea but they eventually did with Fates. But what if they didn't abandon it? What if it became a trend and every game in the series had  1-4 characters from the previous entry just hanging around for the sake of fanservice? Who do you think would or wouldn't be suitable for such appearances? Just thinking about it off the top of my head, it could have been a good way to make some of the replacement characters in Holy War be a little more noticeable. Like if instead of Hawk we had Merric randomly showing up to defend Manster. Not suggesting they should have done that for all the replacement characters but it could have been an interesting way of handling one or two instead of basically just copy and pasting the subplot of the character they replaced. Anyway I figured it might be a nice idea to theorize about. Would love to hear people's suggestions for characters and reasonable (or inane) explanations as to why they'd be travelling to a different continent.

Edited January 21, 2017 by Jotari

[BalancedPro]

Does Anna count?

[Flee Fleet!]

Well, Anna sort of counts.

 

Hmm, well, if this trend was present in every FE game, that would mean every game would be taking place in the same world as well (they all don't take place in the same world, except for a few, right? Right?)

[Dinar87]

1 hour ago, Jotari said:

So wayback when in Gaiden, the developers decided to just throw the white wings and Camus into the game because why not? It took them twenty years to revisit this idea but they eventually did with Fates. But what if they didn't abandon it? What if it became a trend and every game in the series had  1-4 characters from the previous entry just hanging around for the sake of fanservice? Who do you think would or wouldn't be suitable for such appearances? Just thinking about it off the top of my head, it could have been a good way to make some of the replacement characters in Holy War be a little more noticeable. Like if instead of Hawk we had Merric randomly showing up to defend Manster. Not suggesting they should have done that for all the replacement characters but it could have been an interesting way of handling one or two instead of basically just copy and pasting the subplot of the character they replaced. Anyway I figured it might be a nice idea to theorize about. Would love to hear people's suggestions for characters and reasonable (or inane) explanations as to why they'd be travelling to a different continent.

As long as such characters are optional and don't replace what could've been original characters. I think a way of doing this would be having all the amiibo units from smash be playable in echoes. I'd certainly love to be able to play as Ike in gaiden!!

[NinjaMonkey]

1 hour ago, Jotari said:

It took them twenty years to revisit this idea but they eventually did with Fates.

They did it in Awakening with the Einherjar.

[MCProductions]

I'd be down for this, I love reoccurring characters, so it'd be neat to see it happen more often. 

[ElementKasai]

1 hour ago, Flee Fleet! said:

Hmm, well, if this trend was present in every FE game, that would mean every game would be taking place in the same world as well (they all don't take place in the same world, except for a few, right? Right?)

Akaneia, Valentia, Ylisse, Tellius and Jugdral are in the same world, with Awakening being long after the others. Or at least it's what I thought before playing Before Awakening, which makes canon the different dimensions thing. It's also kind of stupid that Corrin just random goes to Ylisse through the Dragon Gate and the three amigos and Anankos have to use a lot of power and need teleport stones lol.

That said, I think this could really be a trend at least for the non-remake games, but they have to explain every time exactly how, when and why people moved to different continents/dimensions and not just make this a fanservice thing. Or just make clones like the Asugi&co and Anna.

[X-Naut]

FE6's cameo from FE5 is the weapon hit rates.

FE9's cameo from FE8 is the low enemy quality.

[alatartheblue42]

Personally, I'd love to see more cameo/recurring characters. As long as they can provide a reasonable excuse. IMO, Priam kinda counts and would have a good reason since Ike sailed off into the unknown and was never seen again so he could have gone anywhere including into a dimensional rift that would take him to Ylisse's world.

36 minutes ago, ElementKasai said:

It's also kind of stupid that Corrin just random goes to Ylisse through the Dragon Gate and the three amigos and Anankos have to use a lot of power and need teleport stones lol.

Since the characters obviously knew about the Outrealm Gate and whatnot, they probably could have pulled off Owain and others coming over a little better, but at least there was some sort of explanation.

26 minutes ago, ElementKasai said:

Akaneia, Valentia, Ylisse, Tellius and Jugdral are in the same world, with Awakening being long after the others. Or at least it's what I thought before playing Before Awakening, which makes canon the different dimensions thing.

I personally think that the only ones on the same world are Akaneia, Valentia, and Ylisse (being the first two centuries later). Tellius is implied to be on Ylisse's world as well because of Priam and Ragnell, and Jugdral because of the Deadlords and whatnot, but I think they probably would have had to come through the Outrealm Gate, given the scale of disasters on most continents (like Ashunera flooding the rest of her world). Unless the planet is large enough that multiple gods didn't notice each other over countless millennia and the effects of their calamities didn't bother the other continents.

 

My only idea for a cameo character ATM would be one of the manaketes/dragons like Fae, Nils, Nowi, etc since they live practically forever and usually have a canon disappearance at the end of their games.

[CappnRob]

This was actually pretty common throughout the series. FE4 had cameos of FE1/3 NPCs, namely Anna and Jake, but you only meet them if you're doing a substitute run of G2. Jake even comments on how Linda's name sounds familiar (referencing to Linde in FE1/3). Then of course they reappear in FE7 as well.

[NekoKnight]

I think it's fine to have one "suspiciously similar person" like Anna show up in multiple worlds but otherwise, characters shouldn't make appear in settings they don't belong in. Outside of Stan Lee or Hitchcock style random cameos, worlds shouldn't be casually tied together.

I do like it when we see shared characters for direct sequels (Markus in FE 6&7) or shared worlds/time periods, however.

[Jotari]

10 hours ago, Balanced Ace said:

Does Anna count?

Anna goes above and beyond mere mortal standards of cameos.

8 hours ago, NinjaMonkey said:

They did it in Awakening with the Einherjar.

Not really the same thing at all. They were replicas of the original character and weren't properly implemented units. I'm talking full on proper characters appearing in another title with a minor (but canon) presence in the story. Like Owain, Ingo and Severa in Fates.

3 hours ago, NekoKnight said:

I think it's fine to have one "suspiciously similar person" like Anna show up in multiple worlds but otherwise, characters shouldn't make appear in settings they don't belong in. Outside of Stan Lee or Hitchcock style random cameos, worlds shouldn't be casually tied together.

I do like it when we see shared characters for direct sequels (Markus in FE 6&7) or shared worlds/time periods, however.

You have the thread backwards. I want to hypothesise what we could have seen if they didn't make the new instalments different worlds and kept up the standard they set with Gaiden.

[Slumber]

8 hours ago, ElementKasai said:

Akaneia, Valentia, Ylisse, Tellius and Jugdral are in the same world, with Awakening being long after the others. Or at least it's what I thought before playing Before Awakening, which makes canon the different dimensions thing. It's also kind of stupid that Corrin just random goes to Ylisse through the Dragon Gate and the three amigos and Anankos have to use a lot of power and need teleport stones lol.

That said, I think this could really be a trend at least for the non-remake games, but they have to explain every time exactly how, when and why people moved to different continents/dimensions and not just make this a fanservice thing. Or just make clones like the Asugi&co and Anna.

Isn't the Jugdral world a fictional world in Awakening? The implications of Tellius being part of the same world as Ylisse/Valentia/Akaneia, but in the far distant past, are definitely there, but I always thought the Jugdral characters were referred to as "Legends", with Geneaology specifically being a story book. Kind of like the tales of King Arthur for them.

Yeah, this would mean you could recruit and fight fictional characters, but the Dragon Gate was a weird plot element, anyway. As of right now, I'd be fine with Tellius, Ylisse, Valentia and Akaneia being one world, and Jugdral, Magvel and Elibe being their own unique worlds, too.

[Jotari]

19 minutes ago, Slumber said:

Isn't the Jugdral world a fictional world in Awakening? The implications of Tellius being part of the same world as Ylisse/Valentia/Akaneia, but in the far distant past, are definitely there, but I always thought the Jugdral characters were referred to as "Legends", with Geneaology specifically being a story book. Kind of like the tales of King Arthur for them.

Yeah, this would mean you could recruit and fight fictional characters, but the Dragon Gate was a weird plot element, anyway. As of right now, I'd be fine with Tellius, Ylisse, Valentia and Akaneia being one world, and Jugdral, Magvel and Elibe being their own unique worlds, too.

The Holy Weapons and Deadlords seem to hit pretty hard for fictional things.

[Slumber]

13 minutes ago, Jotari said:

The Holy Weapons and Deadlords seem to hit pretty hard for fictional things.

I always thought the Deadlords were just a very overt reference, rather than an implication that Jugdral was a part of the same world as Ylisse. I mean, they don't even function even remotely similar in the games, especially since the Deadlords in Jugdral were mind-controlled slaves for the Lopto Sect. Nevermind that there are multiples of each Deadlords in Awakening, and the Deadlords in Jugdral are specifically the most powerful heroes that have either died or taken by the Lopto.

The functions of the Holy Weapons are also very different in the IR DLC than they are in Jugdral. You could just attribute this to the mechanics of FE4/5 vs. Awakening, but it still seems like a weird piece to hinge the idea that they're the same world on.

And again, it's hard to determine if everything involved with the Dragon Gate and the DLC is actually "canon"(Using the world loosely here) to Awakening.

Edited January 22, 2017 by Slumber

[Jotari]

9 minutes ago, Slumber said:

I always thought the Deadlords were just a very overt reference, rather than an implication that Jugdral was a part of the same world as Ylisse. I mean, they don't even function even remotely similar in the games, especially since the Deadlords in Jugdral were mind-controlled slaves for the Lopto Sect. Nevermind that there are multiples of each Deadlords in Awakening, and the Deadlords in Jugdral are specifically the most powerful heroes that have either died or taken by the Lopto.

The functions of the Holy Weapons are also very different in the IR DLC than they are in Jugdral. You could just attribute this to the mechanics of FE4/5 vs. Awakening, but it still seems like a weird piece to hinge the idea that they're the same world on.

And again, it's hard to determine if everything involved with the Dragon Gate and the DLC is actually "canon"(Using the world loosely here) to Awakening.

The Deadlords show up in the story. Of course while I'm at it I should bring up the much more overt reference to Naga in the backstory of Jugdral.

Edited January 22, 2017 by Jotari

[Slumber]

26 minutes ago, Jotari said:

The Deadlords show up in the story. Of course while I'm at it I should bring up the much more overt reference to Naga in the backstory of Jugdral.

I completely forgot about the Deadlords in the story. But again, the function of the Deadlords in Awakening are much different than the functions of the Deadlords in 4/5. The ones in 4/5 are specifically slaves who are controlled by the Lopto. Plus, the ones who share the names of the Deadlords from 4/5 are destroyed in 4, along with the Lopto Sect, destroying the Deadlords for good.

Given that it's never explained who or what the Deadlords are in Awakening, it seems unlikely that they're anything other than a reference. If they stopped and said "Oh man, it's the Deadlords! The stories in the Genealogy are true!", it would confirm it for me. But they don't, and they keep referring to the Jugdral stories as fables.

And going back to my King Arthur comparison, the tales in King Arthur reference real life places and real life history. It could be likely that the Jugdral stories in Awakening were built off of things that happened in "the real world", which would be why Naga is referenced in the intro to FE4.

If there was ever a solid moment in the story of Awakening that linked Jugdral to Ylisse like they did with Akaneia/Valentia, I would concede that they're likely in the same world. But all of the events in Jugdral are referred to as fables, and the few things that seem like it'd be a solid connection are never acknowledged by the characters in the game. At least with Priam, there's an acknowledgement of a "Hero of Radiance" by Priam and the characters, which would suggest that Ike and Tellius existed in the same world in a looooooooong distant past, but no such thing is done with Jugdral. You encounter the Deadlords, and nothing is said about it. And that's about where the references to Jugdral begin and end outside of the Dragon Gate.

Edited January 22, 2017 by Slumber

[CappnRob]

Well there's the fact that according to Kaga's notes, the dragons that gifted the crusaders with their divine blood came from Akaneia, there is a distinct connection between it and Judgral, and therefore between Judgral and Ylisse.

[Jotari]

8 hours ago, Slumber said:

I completely forgot about the Deadlords in the story. But again, the function of the Deadlords in Awakening are much different than the functions of the Deadlords in 4/5. The ones in 4/5 are specifically slaves who are controlled by the Lopto. Plus, the ones who share the names of the Deadlords from 4/5 are destroyed in 4, along with the Lopto Sect, destroying the Deadlords for good.

Given that it's never explained who or what the Deadlords are in Awakening, it seems unlikely that they're anything other than a reference. If they stopped and said "Oh man, it's the Deadlords! The stories in the Genealogy are true!", it would confirm it for me. But they don't, and they keep referring to the Jugdral stories as fables.

And going back to my King Arthur comparison, the tales in King Arthur reference real life places and real life history. It could be likely that the Jugdral stories in Awakening were built off of things that happened in "the real world", which would be why Naga is referenced in the intro to FE4.

If there was ever a solid moment in the story of Awakening that linked Jugdral to Ylisse like they did with Akaneia/Valentia, I would concede that they're likely in the same world. But all of the events in Jugdral are referred to as fables, and the few things that seem like it'd be a solid connection are never acknowledged by the characters in the game. At least with Priam, there's an acknowledgement of a "Hero of Radiance" by Priam and the characters, which would suggest that Ike and Tellius existed in the same world in a looooooooong distant past, but no such thing is done with Jugdral. You encounter the Deadlords, and nothing is said about it. And that's about where the references to Jugdral begin and end outside of the Dragon Gate.

I find the Deadlords in Awakening to be identical in function to the ones in Jugdral. They're both dead warriors resurrected to serve the bidding of someone wielding dark magic. Of course it might be that they're similar in only the same way Manatees are people that can transform into dragons in all continuities but the fact that they're wielding Jugdral's holy weapons is an obvious reference. That solid connection your looking for is in Jugdral itself as I (and now CappnRob in more detail) have already mentioned.

Edited January 22, 2017 by Jotari