Marisa Kirisame Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 is your read on them entirely based on meta (genuine question I'm not trying to be sarcastic or snarky) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olivier Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 no I think their late day 1 and actions around the Djimmi lynch were very scummy (not scumreading him but saying in the same post they would consolidate on him and preferred him over other potential lynches they were actually scumreading), their big D2 post was bad because I feel their reads/cases are weak in a way that feels like scum struggling to come up with cases, and they're continuing on that today. The meta thing was in response to you saying you feel they're playing to their town meta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemu Kurotsuchi Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Reread this entire day (fuck me), and I don't think Baroness is scum. Firstly, I don't see the Hilda townread coming from scum. Even as scum/scum, it'd just make Hilda look bad when Baroness flipped, and as scum/town, why would Baroness discount an easy mislynch? Also don't see the Cagney kill coming from Baroness (assuming I know who Baroness is); could have mentioned this earlier but I never really thought about it until the reread. Also while frustration at being cased is null, I think the frustration from people misinterpreting his cases is more likely to come from town. I also don't think Sally is a good lynch, though! Their interaction w/the Rumor wagon is really townie, and I don't feel like that's been addressed. There's only one thing that bothers me here and that's her Grim read today; it's really weird to me because at the same time she thinks he doesn't make sense as scum with her #1 read, but continues to kind of push him anyways. If I had to vote between these wagons, I guess I'd vote here because Wally/Cagney/Beppi are town (with the two unknowns being Cala and Sally), and I find it really hard to believe that that wagon was all town considering Scum!Rumor had two votes when it was building up. Also more backflips but in retrospect, it's kind of weird that Grim backed off because he thought Beppi was a power role. Power roles aren't intrinsically townie, so why would you back off your strongest scumread? Also yeah, Baroness was right in that Grim spent more effort townreading than scumreading (I still don't think the player guess thing was scummy, but this is); note that I'm talking about his play in general, not just the reads posts (where having more townreads doesn't really bother me). I don't know where it is but Captain's associative read at the end of Day 2 regarding Grim's interactions w/Rumor is good and @Captain Brineybeard I'm not sure why you dropped it? I don't even think this is a scum move, more a "what were you thinking" kind of thing. Also Captain is probably town considering his progression on Baroness today (not related to Baroness' alignment). Kind of paranoid because I could totally see the Cagney kill coming from him (no flame but that kill genuinely confuses me), but everything else is good. @Cala Maria Why wouldn't Scum!Grim have a scumread on Beppi? I don't see how that affects him regardless of alignment. ##Unvote ##Vote: Grim Matchstick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olivier Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I backed off because in my experience, 95% of the time someone makes some comment like Beppi did implying they're a townie PR, they actually are a town PR and not scum trying to BS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisa Kirisame Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 my phone isn't letting me quote but come on kahl. I hate it when people make remarks @ me like that like I've been useless all game or something. it happened last game too and it's killing me a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemu Kurotsuchi Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 2 minutes ago, Grim Matchstick said: I backed off because in my experience, 95% of the time someone makes some comment like Beppi did implying they're a townie PR, they actually are a town PR and not scum trying to BS. Makes sense, ignore that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemu Kurotsuchi Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 1 minute ago, Cagney Carnation said: my phone isn't letting me quote but come on kahl. I hate it when people make remarks @ me like that like I've been useless all game or something. it happened last game too and it's killing me a little. idt ur useless it's just that you weren't my strongest town read Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olivier Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I don't really have anything to say to the rest of it. I did townread people more than scumread them, but I don't think that's scummy so all I can say is... alright? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemu Kurotsuchi Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 1 minute ago, Grim Matchstick said: I don't really have anything to say to the rest of it. I did townread people more than scumread them, but I don't think that's scummy so all I can say is... alright? I should probably elaborate on that further. It reads as though your townreads are actively evolving and progressing (not scummy), whereas your scumreads have just been static and haven't really changed at at all; you add to your scumreads rather than reevaluating them, which is scummy because scum doesn't benefit from changing their reads and it's a lot easier to play scum when your reads are static. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but your primary scumreads have been Beppi, Baroness, and Werner. I'll discount Beppi because that was dropped due to role related reasons which are understandable enough. WRT Baroness, you've been casing them since D1 but you haven't really reevaluated your read and especially today, it feels like you've just assumed that the slot is scum. Werner you did change your read on, but it went from "this slot is scum and has a shit case on me" to "I don't think this slot is scum because it doesn't read as scum w/Beppi", which is strange to me for multiple reasons. You can find two slots individually to be scummy even if they don't make sense as scum together; there's no downside to pushing a slot you're bothered by, even if you don't ultimately vote them. Secondly, you didn't push Werner even after you backed off of Beppi which is confusing to me. Das scummy. @Captain Brineybeard @Cagney Carnation @Werner Werman @Baroness Von Bon Bon Want your opinions on Grim's Werner progression, because I just picked up on it and it's really bothering me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estelle Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I SWEAR SF IF YOU KEEP EATING MY POSTS! Gah. Anyway, here's the relevant D1 quotes regarding the last-minute Rumor lynch. On 2/5/2018 at 10:42 AM, Beppi The Clown said: Wait ... really? ... Okay, give me a bit to reread Rumor seriously. On 2/5/2018 at 11:01 AM, Beppi The Clown said: Okay, Kahl, I think I see what you mean about Rumor -- most of their early quote wall didn't really have a lot of scum hunting, it seems like they commented a lot on stuff that had happened but aside from saying it was town didn't really say who they thought was scum. From what I can tell, their main suspect is Matchstick, but it is weird they didn't vote for Matchstick either. Kind of reads a bit ... not lazy, per say, but not as motivated, I guess? Both Rumor and Cagney came in together so I think I read them as a unit, not as two individual players, so my being okay with Cagney kind of extended to Rumor. I suppose I wouldn't have a problem lynching Rumor either, although I'm not 100% sure I'd still lynch them over Djimmi. Let me mull on that a bit longer. I'd like anyone who's here right now to say who they'd prefer to lynch between Rumor and Djimmi. Let's at least agree we're not lynching Werner today, and I'd rather not be lynched today either. That's one tradition that can fuck off. Town post, for obvious reasons. Also absolutely hilarious in hindsight. On 2/5/2018 at 10:59 AM, Baroness Von Bon Bon said: Preview edit: If rumor is voting RVS target still then that probably raises Rumor above Cala in lynch priority until I do my reread of stuff. It's something that we can hold her accountable to, at least. On 2/5/2018 at 11:46 AM, Sally Stageplay said: I commented on them not voting a few times. What's stopping me from voting them is... would scum really be this obvious in avoiding scumhunting? Like, why mention your biggest scumread without voting them? It's weird, but what is the scum intend in it? I also feel like talking about a lot of townreads brings your suspect list down quite a lot, which makes causing misslynches a lot harder later on. Don't know, I feel like what they're doing isn't worse then Djimmy jumping on the Werner wagon and making sure to keep every other option open as much as possible. Maybe I'm just giving scum!Rumor too much credit though... This post goes back-and-forth. I disliked Sally for her self-waffling. On 2/5/2018 at 1:48 PM, Cagney Carnation said: I should re-read Honeybottoms, they didn't stick out to me that much but did they make a vote yet? On 2/5/2018 at 1:50 PM, Cagney Carnation said: oh okay they empty unvoted and haven't actually voted yet. that sucks. To be fair, the flower showed up late. On 2/5/2018 at 11:18 AM, Captain Brineybeard said: busy right now I've briefly skimmed stuff but I'll be around for phase deadlines djimmi is a potential lurkscum candidate but I'd rather not lynch someone who hasn't posted in so long. i just don't have any confidence in it On 2/5/2018 at 1:51 PM, Captain Brineybeard said: Rumor's play is super frustrating but I just don't really understand why as scum they wouldn't just have voted Matchstick by now. Like I can't understand the scum motivation in standing out in that way when a Matchstick vote would have been very consistent with their in-thread reasoning, even if I didn't agree with that reasoning. At the very least, once they started getting voted on the basis of having no non-RVS vote, I would have expected them to vote somebody. This isn't a townread but I don't feel confident enough in this to lynch them either. The other person that wasn't enthusiastic about the lynch. The difference between Brineybeard and Sally is that the former evaluates Honeybottoms based on their actions. The latter talks about Honeybottoms in terms of what scum would do. I think the former approach is town, and the latter is scum. I'm going to go back one more time and see if I can find any more quotes. Posting this now, because I'm going to be pissed if this post goes poof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estelle Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I changed my mind on Grim every time he posted, up until that Honeybottoms unvote. I can try to think about it again, but I'm pretty sure I'll figure out whether he's scum or not based on a coin flip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olivier Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I explained pretty clearly that I backed off Werner because of a meta read. The Baroness point is like... every time they do something, I still think it's scummy? How is it scummy that I didn't back off all 3 of my scumreads from d1/early day 2? I guess I don't understand what you mean by reevaluate. They've done things I think are very scummy and nothing they've said or done is really swaying my opinion, especially since I think most other slots are townier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estelle Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 OH, I misread. Man, I suck. My take is that Grim over here decided to ignore the anonymous part of the game and meta'd me. This play style belongs to one of two people. I'm going to guess it means that he reread over the night, which doesn't say much about his alignment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemu Kurotsuchi Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Actually that's a good point regarding Sally. That waffling post looks really bad in retrospect, especially the "maybe I'm giving Scum!Rumor too much credit thing). 2 minutes ago, Grim Matchstick said: I explained pretty clearly that I backed off Werner because of a meta read. The Baroness point is like... every time they do something, I still think it's scummy? How is it scummy that I didn't back off all 3 of my scumreads from d1/early day 2? I guess I don't understand what you mean by reevaluate. They've done things I think are very scummy and nothing they've said or done is really swaying my opinion, especially since I think most other slots are townier. Fuck me, I'm an idiot. You actually mentioned the meta thing in the same post I was reading and I didn't catch that. Maybe I'm biased because I disagree w/you, but it just read as weird to me that every time Baroness made a post, you were instantly like "das scum" compared to like Captain/Werner/Cagney trying to determine if it was scummy or not. I don't think you consistently scumreading Baroness is bad, moreso how you're just tunneling on the slot without really ever rethinking things (even if your conclusion is ultimately that Baroness is still scum). Additionally, assuming you are this confident that Baroness is scum, you're moreso just sitting on that opinion rather than trying to convince others that Baroness is scum. This reads as scum to me because the scum MO is to just sit on a good case whereas town are trying to get their main read lynched. Why are mine/Cagney's townreads wrong for example? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olivier Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I've been posting about it and responding to people about it, but it'd probably be fair to say that I've been pretty passive this game. That's probably a result of outside factors affecting my mood, a lot of the time I will check on the thread after sleeping in way past noon, see a bunch of posts, and just kind of... meh. I should probably be pressing people more on what I'm scumreading Baroness for since I don't really feel like anyone has responded to the stuff I'm casing them on but eh Also Baroness's top 2 scumreads are me and someone who I think is pretty clearly town on associations/play (Cala) and tbh I can't think of anyone else who feels scummier at this point. Like, I was entertaining the thought of you being scum but I just don't feel it. It's possible it's Hilda/Sally but we have enough mislynches to cover that so I don't feel particularly assed to determine which of them is town. This is pretty careless but this game also isn't top priority for me rn (in fact I considered subbing out at a couple points but yeah) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estelle Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I missed a couple. On 2/5/2018 at 2:25 PM, Sally Stageplay said: I said I'm inclined to lynch her, mostly out of frustration. If I actually wanted to lynch them today I'd be voting them. Also, I get you're finding me hypocritical, but how exactly is that scum tell? If I was scum, would I really be dumb enough to point out how my sort of actions are scummy when someone else does it? Eh. Honeybottoms was being evasive. On 2/5/2018 at 2:38 PM, Baroness Von Bon Bon said: I would just much rather prefer if we are to lynch someone it be one of the people we are already talking about for lynching. I don't want to lynch Beppi/Werner, but would consolidate if I absolutely had to if everyone else started voting them. I would much rather lynch Djinni or Rumor > the two of them. One is an inactive that has done nothing, could be scum that chose to not play cause they got scum. Rumor is a null read in my eyes so I don't have too much of an opinion on them either way. This is why in my previous post that you dislike, I comment about voting Djinni. I heavily dislike people who are all for turboing and I personally feel that it has scum-intent behind it. So yeah, I dislike you now. At least this is a clear read on Honeybottoms, at the end of D1. 3 minutes ago, Grim Matchstick said: (in fact I considered subbing out at a couple points but yeah) Please don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olivier Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I'm not going to at this point, it was mostly during D1 when my personal life decided to shit on me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C. C. Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 sigh idk anymore with Baroness. the line between frustrated scum and frustrated town is pretty thin and although I don't really think his scumreads are good I feel like he wouldn't be townreading me in this situation. scum being frustrated that he was getting PoEd down wouldn't be removing a possible lynch target when for most people I'm higher on the scumlist than Grim and definitely Cala? i feel like scum Baroness would have pushed me or Sally more today, over Cala/Grim. He voted Sally in the end but that makes sense as a not-me-over-me town vote. I feel like scum Baroness would have tried actually attacking her more, whereas the open not-me-over-me admission is more honest? idk i'm not going to defend him too much more and ultimately if he gets lynched it'll be okay but I'm just not feeling good about it. already said why I don't want to lynch Sally rn. her vote on Rumor d2 would be a very weird and roundabout bus. would like her to say why she no longer felt her D1 reason for thinking she was town was good though. not sure she has. i thought Grim had pretty suspicious Rumor interactions but like there's nothing else I find suspicious in his play at all and there were parts where I just felt his tone was super town. I can't justify a vote here purely on Rumor interactions when one half (Rumor not voting Grim) is not something he really had control over in any way and would still be pretty weird even if they were buddies, and the other part (half-defending half-waffling on Rumor) is also something I kind of did. for me he's lower on the list than Baroness/Sally/Hilda, but probably higher than Kahl I guess. ##Unvote, ##Vote: Hilda kind of frustrated that I'm at this point but I am I guess. IMO I feel like she's basically just been putting off content and promising it'll come later and not delivering which is a pretty newbscummy move when you're not really under pressure. her periods of greatest activity have come with someone pressuring her (Beppi D1, Cala D2). I'll be around sporadically tomorrow but not for phase end Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisa Kirisame Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I'd rather lynch someone we're going to get more associations on then turbo someone who's been inactive again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisa Kirisame Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 than* god damn it brineybeard do you really think Hilda is our only option for a lynch right now and that they are scum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisa Kirisame Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 stuff like this is what makes me think brineybeard is town though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C. C. Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I guess someone has to be scum with Hilda since I said no to Baroness, Sally, and Grim there. honestly I don't really know. If Hilda flips scum I'd probably pick Baroness and if she flips town then Sally + Grim. @cagney- idk okay. let me wash the dishes and take a dump and maybe I'll feel more confident about someone else. i think the interactions with hilda are more than with djimmi though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemu Kurotsuchi Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 @Captain Brineybeard Who would you rather lynch between Sally/Baroness? Might just sheep you because Grim's response was pretty genuine (I'm not confident because he basically admitted to doing the bad thing I said he was doing, but at the same time, I can get being unmotivated w/this game and if Baroness was casing me, I'd probably be in a similar position?). No associative reads kind of blows, though. If Hilda flipped scum, I'd look into Grim/Sally, and if Hilda flipped town, it'd make me paranoid about you/Cala, but I don't think I'd vote there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisa Kirisame Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 to be honest though I'm not as confident in my Hilda townread after all. I'm really only confident in werner, briney, and to a lesser extent kahl. that's about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisa Kirisame Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 well and baroness. I'm feeling like baroness is probably town. that's still about it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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