Weapon triangle as a percentage

[Boomhauer007]

Was randomly thinking about the weapon triangle, and how it could be brought back. I think it's fair to say that a the flat +/- 15/20 mattered early game and then stopped mattering later on. I was just brainstorming stuff and thought something like +/- 15/20% could be much more impactful in the late game. Not sure if it'd make more sense applied to hit before or after avoid calcs, but ideally it scales with the numbers as they get bigger which is obviously the biggest issue with the flat numbers. Thoughts?

Side note, I think it'd be neat if fists and bows were simultaneously weak to each other. Fists disadvantaged at range, bows disadvantaged from 1 tile.

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

Personally I like keeping it an arithmetic system, rather than geometric (percentage-based). One way to make the triangle more impactful lategame is to do what the DS games did - the higher your weapon rank is, the greater weapon triangle advantage you get. Here's an example of how this could play out:

Spoiler

 

E rank: +10 hit/avo

D rank: +10 hit/avo, +1 att/prt

C rank: +20 hit/avo, +1 att/prt

B rank: +20 hit/avo, +2 att/prt

A rank: +30 hit/avo, +2 att/prt

S rank: +30 hit/avo, +3 att/prt

 

The trouble with this system, admittedly, is that then you have to remember a table (or just that you get +10 hit/avo at "odd" ranks, and +1 att/prt at "even" ones). Still prefer it to a percentage system (stuff like dividing enemy Avo by 1.2 sounds not fun, and I say that as a math major).

10 minutes ago, Boomhauer007 said:

Side note, I think it'd be neat if fists and bows were simultaneously weak to each other. Fists disadvantaged at range, bows disadvantaged from 1 tile.

That could be cool, and would be a way to integrate bows and fists into the "weapon advantage" system without needlessly folding magic in (or, in a game with dark/light/anima, letting them have their own triangle).

[Classic]

If you want a percentage modifier in your weapon triangle having it apply to damage (before DEF), similar to effective dmg, seems more practical than having it apply to hit/avo honestly.

[whase]

Weapon triangle is something I have  struggled with a lot for my Fire Emblem Dungeons and Dragons system. In the first version I gave a flat +3 hit/avoid (both roll a d20 and add value, highest value gives result) and +1 damage on advantage, which made for a large impact earlygame but was practically ignored in the lategame. I changed it into a system where weapon rank decided the height of the bonus, but it was too much to remember and became a mess.

Right now I'm using the actual DnD rules of advantage for the weapon triangle. whoever has the advantage gets to roll 2 d20 and use the roll that suits them best. Maybe someone who is better at math can tell what this actually means in %, but I find it works well in keeping the triangle important throughout the game.

[X-Naut]

I don't really agree that +/- 15/20 stops being impactful later on, it depends on how much hit/avo scale with stats and what options there are to inflate them.

That being said I would like to see them try percentage-based hit mods as a means to counter hit/avo inflation. Those flat +Hit/Avo bonuses might look small on their own, but they add up. But having some of them be percentage-based? The impact scales to whatever the hit rate was to begin with, so already low hit chances are bottoming out at negligible to zero so easily. Granted I'm mainly thinking of terrain with this in mind.

On 2/6/2020 at 12:29 PM, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Personally I like keeping it an arithmetic system, rather than geometric (percentage-based). One way to make the triangle more impactful lategame is to do what the DS games did - the higher your weapon rank is, the greater weapon triangle advantage you get.

...

The trouble with this system, admittedly, is that then you have to remember a table (or just that you get +10 hit/avo at "odd" ranks, and +1 att/prt at "even" ones). Still prefer it to a percentage system (stuff like dividing enemy Avo by 1.2 sounds not fun, and I say that as a math major).

Yeah I'm not really a fan of rank-based triangle mods or even rank-based bonuses tbh, it's a lot more little numbers to keep track of.