I have fought against the Takugeddon... and I succeeded

[Dr. Tarrasque]

I pulled a Takumi today and leveled him to 30 which obviously ends up with a higher rating than a level 27* Clarine. So I thought, "Hmm, maybe I'll see teams of 620+ rating in the Arena", so I go there.

In the second match of a series of 7, I stumbled upon... the Takugeddon. I paused and thought "what the hell..." as I took the visage all in, all 3 pieces of the complete Trikumi led by a Tactician named Robin, summoned into battle by the summoner named "Tryhard" (I'm assuming it's not the guy in this forum). Slowly but surely, I took down the Trikumi of Speed, the Trikumi of Attack and the Trikumi of Balance. Once the Trikume was finished, I moved forward to the anti-climatic end of Tactician Robin with a Brave Axe to the fucking face because he seriously he can't deal with that.

Alas... a moment of silence for Cain the Bull who sacrificed himself to finish off the Trikumi of Speed.

 

Seriously though, I'm all in for that duplicate clause someone suggested. I won without using a healer and only 1 casualty but this is just sad. How would you react to this and how would you have dealt with it? (3 Takumis and a Robin).

Edited February 12, 2017 by Dr. Tarrasque

[Emerson]

I could deal with 2 Takumis, but definitely not 3.

Lucina can reliably kill 1, then Linde can heal to make sure Lucy can take out the second one as well. Very few units, aside from Green Magic users, can survive even 1 hit from Linde, so anything else is pretty much a goner.

Sacrificing Nowi could allow for Linde to finish off a third Takumi though.

Camilla would just be a distraction or something to bait a Takumi since she only does 2-5 damage per hit for some reason anyways.

Edited February 12, 2017 by Almerson

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

Jesus. That sounds absolutely painful to deal with. I think if you have a team of similarly strong 5*s to work with, you could win against the AI with some planning, but it's just a big "fuck you" to anyone trying to get a good Arena run, because there's no way you're winning without a casualty, unless you have Hector and a healer.

[TheWill]

The duplication clause likely won't (and shouldn't from a business standpoint) happen. It's punishing people for rolling more than one of the same unit. It's frustrating, but really the focus in terms of altering meta focus on introducing new units (for example, archer counters or more accessible blue units) rather than nerfing (or limiting) player usage. 

[Ginkgo]

That would be obnoxious to deal with, but for me, it would be the Robin that would cause a loss. I could pretty easily dispatch the three Takumis, but to take out the Robin without a loss after that would either have to be a Vengence charge or a lucky attack from Azura.

Brb making a team of 3 Robins and one 5* Olivia, just in case.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

1 hour ago, SlipperySlippy said:

The duplication clause likely won't (and shouldn't from a business standpoint) happen. It's punishing people for rolling more than one of the same unit. It's frustrating, but really the focus in terms of altering meta focus on introducing new units (for example, archer counters or more accessible blue units) rather than nerfing (or limiting) player usage. 

You can Limit Break in this game though, so it doesn't really punish you that hard. I understand this is a mobile game, and pretty much all general rules about good games are thrown out the window, but the fact that running multiples of the same dude instead of making one supersoldier of the dude is more viable says a lot about that unit's balance, and I'm sure IS knows this.

I think it's not horrible from a business standpoint. You get people to pull more for more varied units, since they'll actually need to pull more if they get dupes, instead of just filling their team with the dupes.

Edited February 12, 2017 by SatsumaFSoysoy

[TheWill]

3 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

You can Limit Break in this game though, so it doesn't really punish you that hard. I understand this is a mobile game, and pretty much all general rules about good games are thrown out the window, but the fact that running multiples of the same dude instead of making one supersoldier of the dude is more viable says a lot about that unit's balance, and I'm sure IS knows this.

I think it's not horrible from a business standpoint. You get people to pull more for more varied units, since they'll actually need to pull more if they get dupes, instead of just filling their team with the dupes.

Unfortunately, it's a very common practice in mobile gaming. In Final Fantasy Brave Exvius, it's not uncommon to see teams compromised of just Noctis with a Dark Fina - and the rates there are way worse, at 1% + 50% chance in that 1% to get the character you'd want on a banner (similar to a focus unit in a FEH banner). I don't think the issue with punishing individuals for pulling multiple of the same unit can be fixed if you ban duplicates. Particularly, I'd feel bad for pulling a duplicate even though they're rare and supposed to be a good pull (given that you can merge 'em for an extra level, so maybe it's not as bad? But that system honestly is bad and heavily favours whales).

Also the chances of getting three Takumi's and a Robin are a lot more expensive than pulling for a bunch of varied units since there are quite a few viable options right now, even outside of focus units. They'll likely have already pulled a lot of varied units, 5* and 4*'s looking for multiple Takumi. Of course that's an extreme example. 

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

1 minute ago, SlipperySlippy said:

Unfortunately, it's a very common practice in mobile gaming. In Final Fantasy Brave Exvius, it's not uncommon to see teams compromised of just Noctis with a Dark Fina - and the rates there are way worse, at 1% + 50% chance in that 1% to get the character you'd want on a banner (similar to a focus unit in a FEH banner). I don't think the issue with punishing individuals for pulling multiple of the same unit can be fixed if you ban duplicates. Particularly, I'd feel bad for pulling a duplicate even though they're rare and supposed to be a good pull (given that you can merge 'em for an extra level, so maybe it's not as bad? But that system honestly is bad and heavily favours whales).

Also the chances of getting three Takumi's and a Robin are a lot more expensive than pulling for a bunch of varied units since there are quite a few viable options right now, even outside of focus units. They'll likely have already pulled a lot of varied units, 5* and 4*'s looking for multiple Takumi. Of course that's an extreme example. 

Good point about pulling with focus on Takumi and Robin, hadn't thought about that. That definitely affects our chances of getting dupes clause.

[TheWill]

Just now, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

Good point about pulling with focus on Takumi and Robin, hadn't thought about that. That definitely affects our chances of getting dupes clause.

Whilst I don't expect it, it's definitely not impossible. Most changes occur in mobile games purely do to people whining. I personally would whine about the awakening cost from 4* to 5*, haha. I think the meta will change though to hit Takumi. Hopefully, at least, because my Camilla can't do anything to him and he one-shots my Tiki, too.

[Rezzy]

Yeah, this has happened more than once.  I'm the one who advocated for the duplicate clause.

How do you get enough Stamina to be able to get all your units to 40 so quickly?  I've been playing as much as Stamina will allow and only have one 40 so far.

[Alpha Wolves]

@Rezzy Where is your Robin/Henry/Celicia in this match? You never go into Adv. Arena without Robin/Henry/Celicia in your party. The team I have can easily deal with 3 or 4 Takumi, but the problem is, it CAN'T deal with them without lossing someone on the team. And therein lies the problem: You loss points for every one of your team that is killed.

[Rezzy]

1 minute ago, Alpha Wolves said:

@Rezzy Where is your Robin/Henry/Celicia in this match? You never go into Adv. Arena without Robin/Henry/Celicia in your party. The team I have can easily deal with 3 or 4 Takumi, but the problem is, it CAN'T deal with them without lossing someone on the team. And therein lies the problem: You loss points for every one of your team that is killed.

I don't have Henry.  I did not have Robin or Cecilia until recently.  I've been raising up a 3* Robin to 4*, maybe 5*, if we get more Feathers.  It's not like Pokemon, where you can pretty much get any Pokemon you want to use.  You have to be somewhat lucky with your Pulls.

[carefreejules]

A+ for the name

Getting all your units to level 40 isn't that hard - it's just a lot of rinsing and repeating because my five star Marth, Robin, Camilla, and Takumi are all level 40. I just grinded the hell out of the the training tower on the level before the one at the very top. My castle is upgraded fully too. 

[Rezzy]

29 minutes ago, carefreejules said:

A+ for the name

Getting all your units to level 40 isn't that hard - it's just a lot of rinsing and repeating because my five star Marth, Robin, Camilla, and Takumi are all level 40. I just grinded the hell out of the the training tower on the level before the one at the very top. My castle is upgraded fully too. 

How do you keep from running out of Stamina?  I've got 5 Units at 37+ right now.  The last few levels take forever.

[Fly_or_Die]

6 minutes ago, Rezzy said:

How do you keep from running out of Stamina?  I've got 5 Units at 37+ right now.  The last few levels take forever.

Max upgraded castle + mostly repeating training tower with not much story, I'm guessing. But yes, the last few levels do take forever.

On the subject, I'm still convinced "no duplicates" is necessary for the arena. If you want to run 4 Takumis, troll the AI in the training tower with them. Allowing duplicates just gets us these repeat teams, and then the arena becomes a bunch of dumb luck. People might be tempted to run "all _____" teams if there's only a small handful of counters to said unit.

In any case, there's no way I'd be able to beat Takumi x 3. Robin can kill 1, maybe 2 with "help" (read: sacrifice) from another unit. Not sure I'd make it to 3.

[lysander]

I still just want a "no more than two units of the same colour on a single team" clause. There is no legitimate reason for 3 or 4 of the same colour, as the only reasons that exist would be exploiting poor balance.

[Rezzy]

16 minutes ago, lysander said:

I still just want a "no more than two units of the same colour on a single team" clause. There is no legitimate reason for 3 or 4 of the same colour, as the only reasons that exist would be exploiting poor balance.

There's still a lot of variety between a given color type.  With just Reds, you could have an Infantry Sword Unit, a Sword Armor, a Sword Cavalry, a Sword Flyer, Red Manakete, and a Red Mage.  Some people might get really lucky with Color type in their Pulls.  I had nothing but Green and Colorless units starting out.

[carefreejules]

Well, if I run out of stamina, I just wait until it's full again. When you've played gatcha games before, the waiting game is a lot more bearable and less of a hindrance. 

But in general, I personally really really like grinding in Fire Emblem. There's something super relaxing and therapeutic about it so I don't mind if it takes a long time to level up. I enjoy the slow grind lmao.

Edited February 12, 2017 by carefreejules

[dapperlemur]

14 hours ago, Dr. Tarrasque said:

How would you react to this and how would you have dealt with it? (3 Takumis and a Robin).

Curl up in a ball and cry while tightly hugging Marth to my chest.

[Rezzy]

This shit is getting annoying.  I've noticed many people are doing "Trick Takumi" teams, where it's three Takumis and one other unit, with the other unit being the lead unit on the selection screen, which is just dishonest.  Why don't they just show us the whole team, so we at least have a fighting chance?  You have to do all Advanced to rank anymore, anyway.  At least this way, we can get the feathers, when we know it's a cheese team.

I can't wait until me counters get to level 40.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

17 minutes ago, Rezzy said:

This shit is getting annoying.  I've noticed many people are doing "Trick Takumi" teams, where it's three Takumis and one other unit, with the other unit being the lead unit on the selection screen, which is just dishonest.  Why don't they just show us the whole team, so we at least have a fighting chance?  You have to do all Advanced to rank anymore, anyway.  At least this way, we can get the feathers, when we know it's a cheese team.

I can't wait until me counters get to level 40.

Man, you must be really unlucky to be running into so many multi-Takumi teams lol. I've only met like two or so.

Edited February 15, 2017 by SatsumaFSoysoy

[Rezzy]

23 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

Man, you must be really unlucky to be running into so many multi-Takumi teams lol.

Have you not yet encountered a Takumi orgy?

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

25 minutes ago, Rezzy said:

Have you not yet encountered a Takumi orgy?

Two at most. It was not fun. I think one of them was Limit Break though.

[Rezzy]

12 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

Two at most. It was not fun. I think one of them was Limit Break though.

I have beaten several two-Takumi teams.  It's hard, but I can do it.  I've not yet been successful against a 3 Takumi team.

[Sire]

I haven't encountered the Takumi Apocalypse yet, although that may be because...

1. I am not running a full Level 40 Team (While Ryoma, Cain, and Camilla are 5* & 40, Sakura is just a 4* and not yet 40. || Also, Cain's total stat pool is fairly low.)
2. I do not always run max level arena runs. Instead, I'll try to level up an alternative team using the Arena system. I mainly do this because of all of the Arena quests.
3. I have not merged any 5* characters.

I managed to get 2000 feathers for my Arena Ranking (Rank 5001-10000 ||| Last I checked I was around 6k rank), so I am content with my current team and runs. I could try to be in the top 5000, but I'm sure I'll start running into all sorts of nonsense then.

I'll handle my Lucinas, Lyns, Tikis, Robins, and the single Takumi. I may not win all the time (curse Lyn and her Hone Speed combined with Young Tiki), but as long as I get a good rank, I am content and can do other Arena runs besides competing for high scores.