Radiant Dawn HM 0% growths

[Interceptor]

Yeah, it's dead-easy to have ol' Skrimmers use a Stone on Turn 1 and put his RES at 18 to Nolan's 20. I'll try it out later.

[Integrity]

I can perform some testing in 4-E-3 against the dragons, but that's all I have atm.

[dondon151]

Well, I want to figure out if Provoke works against staff users in addition to normal attacks.

@Int: try using bigger res gaps and see if there is a cutoff, if it won't bother you too much.

[Interceptor]

Well, the results are unfortunately not very promising. Provoke appears to have no effect at all.

If I transform Skrimir (for 18 RES to Nolan's 20), now the Elsleep Bishop will target Sothe, who has 15 RES. If I bring out Laura, who has 13 RES, the Bishop ignores her and still goes for Sothe. If I trade Laura for Haar, who has 13 RES as well, he is now public enemy #1 for Elsleep. Adding in Danved -- who has 12 RES -- didn't change anything, not even when I moved Haar as far back as possible. Replaced Danved with Leonardo (7 RES), the Bishop still targets Haar. I finally brought out Eddie, who has 1 RES. Now they targeted him.

I did a few trials with each, the result never changed. So, from this limited information, it looks like the lowest RES will generally get targeted, physicals seem to get prioritized over magic users for some reason, and I have no explanation for the Haar thing, your guess is as good as mine.

[Narga_Rocks]

I did a few trials with each, the result never changed. So, from this limited information, it looks like the lowest RES will generally get targeted, physicals seem to get prioritized over magic users for some reason, and I have no explanation for the Haar thing, your guess is as good as mine.

They look at levels, too, I'm sure. Without massive res gaps (see Eddie) they will generally go for a tier 3 unit rather than tier 2/1 units. And they'll go after level 20+ transformed laguz before level 15 or whatever.

With this theory, they'd go after skrimir rather than a laguz (also transformed) who is like 2 or 4 res lower but with a level in the teens.

I don't think it works all the time, though, but in general it seems like they go after the high-leveled easy targets.

(Sothe and Haar I assume were both tier 3 (well, Sothe must be). Danved I'd assume was still tier 2. Leo tier 1. Ed tier 1, but with such abysmal res they decide to target him anyway. Not certain if they had 100% hit on Ed but not Haar. That might explain it. Highest leveled reasonably easy unit to sleep, unless they have 100% on something. But that requires them not having 100% on Leo, which I find unlikely.)

Edited July 20, 2010 by Narga_Rocks

[Interceptor]

Correct on all counts with respect to tiers. I guess that also explains the Laura thing. Unfortunately, I didn't send a lot of other good units to this army, and I'm not sure that I have the BEXP to force someone up.

[Narga_Rocks]

Correct on all counts with respect to tiers. I guess that also explains the Laura thing. Unfortunately, I didn't send a lot of other good units to this army, and I'm not sure that I have the BEXP to force someone up.

4-4 status staves should work the same way, though, right? You have good units there I'm sure.

Aside from Muarim, I've always actually wondered why your LEA suicide idea would actually work. Tormod and Vika should be so low-leveled that the enemy would ignore them completely for sleep (low priority target). Even Muarim is effectively only 20/18, actually (though he can pack a lot of damage in one hit so they might go after him anyway). Why doesn't the 4-4 sleep staff guy target your tier 3 units?

[Interceptor]

4-4 status staves should work the same way, though, right? You have good units there I'm sure.

True enough, I might try to push through the desert and find out later.

Aside from Muarim, I've always actually wondered why your LEA suicide idea would actually work. Tormod and Vika should be so low-leveled that the enemy would ignore them completely for sleep (low priority target). Even Muarim is effectively only 20/18, actually (though he can pack a lot of damage in one hit so they might go after him anyway). Why doesn't the 4-4 sleep staff guy target your tier 3 units?

It's because nobody but the LEA was anywhere near the Bishops when I did it. Although, I am not sure that with the current 4-4 clear speed that I'm capable of, that it's actually possible to have Ike avoid getting targeted. I pretty much push him and Mia towards Oliver as fast as possible now, which puts them in range of the Bishop before the LEA would have a chance to drain all of the staff's charges.

[Narga_Rocks]

It's because nobody but the LEA was anywhere near the Bishops when I did it. Although, I am not sure that with the current 4-4 clear speed that I'm capable of, that it's actually possible to have Ike avoid getting targeted. I pretty much push him and Mia towards Oliver as fast as possible now, which puts them in range of the Bishop before the LEA would have a chance to drain all of the staff's charges.

That's why I used Haar (also tier 3 but not going to 4-E so no relevant exp loss). However, I suppose Haar is simply too useful for 4-P and 4-3. Titania is also (probably) useful helping along the bottom in 4-4 so I'm not sure where you'd get another tier 3 unit that doesn't care about exp gains.

My Haar plan worked since he was tier 3 (just like Ike) and had less res (Ike was Ike (T) so he had a fair amount of res. Otherwise just pure water for it I guess). So did your Ike get slept in your playthrough? I forget what you said about 4-4 and don't feel like digging in case the answer isn't there.

[Fenrir]

Could another factor in this be the distance from the staff users? if Unit A can reach and ORKO staff user, and Unit B can either not reach or not ORKO the staff user then it might target unit A.

Maybe someone could do some hacking to find out how provoke actually works(and since shade likely mirrors it you can figure them both out)

[Interceptor]

That's why I used Haar (also tier 3 but not going to 4-E so no relevant exp loss). However, I suppose Haar is simply too useful for 4-P and 4-3. Titania is also (probably) useful helping along the bottom in 4-4 so I'm not sure where you'd get another tier 3 unit that doesn't care about exp gains.

My Haar plan worked since he was tier 3 (just like Ike) and had less res (Ike was Ike (T) so he had a fair amount of res. Otherwise just pure water for it I guess). So did your Ike get slept in your playthrough? I forget what you said about 4-4 and don't feel like digging in case the answer isn't there.

I was already scraping the bottom of the barrel just to get enough people to Rout the map, I didn't have so much as a single scrub to spare for the Greil army. The Pope is going to have a lot of fun on that map.

Ike did get slept, but that's what Mist was for. Climb a ledge, pony poofs under her butt, Canto healer (still with 7 MV.... ;_;) to the rescue.

Could another factor in this be the distance from the staff users? if Unit A can reach and ORKO staff user, and Unit B can either not reach or not ORKO the staff user then it might target unit A.

That's an interesting theory, though in one trial Haar was literally 30 tiles away from the Elsleep Bishop (which is as far as you can be away and still be on the map), and still got targeted. I thought that distance had some impact on it (since clearly distance factors into the accuracy for other status staves when players use them), but 12 RES Danved could not get targeted no matter how far forward he was in relation to Haar.

[dondon151]

Updated to include 3-11. I thought 3-12 would be a cakewalk, but crowned Tauroneo is far from invincible and Jill is very limited in her dropping options. I think that instead of dropping Tauroneo under the cliff as planned, I'll probably just scoot him over to the RHS of the map and have him walk down the incline. The LHS of the map can hold as long as I eliminate the FKs (no problem with Leo and Nolan) and keep the snipers healthy.

[dondon151]

Log updated to include 3-12. Hopefully I'll get the remainder of part 3 done tonight.

[dondon151]

3-13 included. Just 3-E left! Sol informed me that when choosing units to separate into armies, you don't get to shuffle skills around, so feel free to recommend skill reallocations for 3-E. Here is a rough idea of how I might distribute important resources:

Silver Army
Units:      Items/skills:
Naesala     Pass
Skrimir     Savior
Haar        Paragon
Tanith      Resolve
Sigrun      Wrath
Marcia      Smite
Sanaki      Speedwings
Micaiah
Laura
Sothe

Greil Army
Units:      Items/skills:
Janaff      Adept x3
Ulki        Paragon
Nailah      Resolve
Volug       Wrath
Titania     Pass
Oscar       Boots
Ike         Unlock
Boyd        Torch
Rolf
Mist
Rhys
Heather

Hawk Army
Units:      Items/skills:
Tibarn      Beastfoe
Ranulf      Paragon
Elincia     Laguz Stone
Shinon      Rescue
Tauroneo
Pelleas
Lucia
Mia

Chances are I'm not going to play part 4 until much later. Once I finish 3-E, I'll tally the total turncount, start over and record the strategies.

(Can you say "triangle attack?" Yes, you know that I am grasping at straws to get all the offense that I can get.)

Edited July 30, 2010 by dondon151

[dondon151]

Part 3 is complete. I will try to edit the .iso some more and start recording tomorrow. I'm not going to do a preliminary run of part 4 because there are a couple of mistakes that need to be rectified (listed below) and the HP and str level ups are starting to be detrimental to the integrity of the playthrough.

Stuff that needs fixing or reminding:

Sothe must have 2 uses left on Beast Killer after 1-4

Try to steal the Shine Barrier from Wystan in 1-5

Transfer Resolve to GMs with Ilyana instead of forged Thunder

Get adjacents with Marcia and Haar in 2-P (for C support in 4-P)

Get Rolf to A bows (15 attacks with Rolf's Bow, or get the 2-3 Arms Scroll)

Apply BEXP 1 chapter sooner to Ranulf for access to Rend by 4-2

Get the Brave Bow in 3-6 and transfer to GMs with Zihark's recruitment

Don't let Ranulf untransform in 3-7 (more WEXP to S strike)

Try to get (Ike, Haar) to A by 3-11 by using more carries

Assign Paragon to Mist instead of Sigrun in 3-11, and spam Recover

Try to find more coins (deploy Heather in 3-4, 3-7, 3-8, 3-10 if possible)

Also, it turns out that since Leanne isn't level 15 (quite far from it), she doesn't have the capacity to equip Celerity. So I have a free Celerity to redistribute for part 4. Any suggestions?

Edited July 30, 2010 by dondon151

[Interceptor]

Rafiel comes to mind, though he needs some levels as well. That will allow you to give the Boots to someone else, perhaps.

Also, what's wrong with hitting Rolf with an Arms Scroll? I mean, that's what they are for. Worst case, make sure that you get one of the Discipline skills (probably 1-3 is easier than 2-2).

[Integrity]

Maybe could give it to Greil's Army for a quicker clear in 4-3 to avoid most of those reinforcements that bog down?

The Hawk Army doesn't really need it since there's no adverse effects to taking an extra turn in 4-2 and 4-5 is a base!Tibarn blitz, Celerity or no unless you can give it to Elincia to shave a turn off. I hadn't considered that.

The Silver Army, I suppose, could use it maybe.

Edited July 30, 2010 by Integrity

[dondon151]

Rafiel comes to mind, though he needs some levels as well. That will allow you to give the Boots to someone else, perhaps.

The original plan was Boots + Celerity for 4-E. That might be overkill, though. But who do you think the Boots will be good on? My original plan was to have Celerity Leanne and Boots Rafiel for 2 7-move herons pre 4-E; switching the order could be fine here, but that just means that I lose the Boots for 4-E, which doesn't seem like a huge loss to me.

Also, what's wrong with hitting Rolf with an Arms Scroll? I mean, that's what they are for. Worst case, make sure that you get one of the Discipline skills (probably 1-3 is easier than 2-2).

I do know that although I landed Geoffrey on the Arms Scroll spot in 2-3, he didn't get it, so I'll make sure to get that one next time.

Maybe could give it to Greil's Army for a quicker clear in 4-3 to avoid most of those reinforcements that bog down?

Well, I already have 4 9 move units in this map, none of which experience indoor movement penalties, and 2 of which experience no gap crossing penalties. I will bring 1, maybe both, copies of Pass as well.

The Hawk Army doesn't really need it since there's no adverse effects to taking an extra turn in 4-2 and 4-5 is a base!Tibarn blitz, Celerity or no unless you can give it to Elincia to shave a turn off. I hadn't considered that.

I'm sure the Rescue staff coupled with shoving should be sufficient for all of my movement needs on 4-5.

Edited July 30, 2010 by dondon151

[Interceptor]

The original plan was Boots + Celerity for 4-E. That might be overkill, though. But who do you think the Boots will be good on? My original plan was to have Celerity Leanne and Boots Rafiel for 2 7-move herons pre 4-E; switching the order could be fine here, but that just means that I lose the Boots for 4-E, which doesn't seem like a huge loss to me.

I didn't really need a high-MV Rafiel in Endgame, but I kinda phoned it in on 4-E-1 other than the Turn 1 Sleep Staff Assassination, and I did not have to rely so heavily on the royals, so YMMV. Generally I had enough scrubs available to Smite him wherever he needed to be, it's not like the Boots/Celerity give him Canto or anything.

I am not sure who the best Boots person might be, but maybe it gives that Tauroneo + Luna 3-13 strategy some extra legs that it didn't have before, for your real run, if it lets you shift some other resources away that you can use later.

I do know that although I landed Geoffrey on the Arms Scroll spot in 2-3, he didn't get it, so I'll make sure to get that one next time.

He has a 44% chance to do it, and you only have to sit through one Enemy Phase to get the chance, since he makes it there by Player Phase Turn 2. It's better than a kick in the balls.