Choose Your Own Character Anonymafia: D3 - Ends 6/15 at 0000 GMT-6

[Estelle]

Ovan, I can understand having gut vibes against someone who looks like they're trying too hard, the "condensed" version you state makes no sense. Looking too town is scummy? I'm not sure that's a correct representation of what you were going for.

Kind of waffling about Leknaat. I agree with what he's saying about Suzaku, but I don't really like how he's going after every little thing. Answering a yes or no question to "Are these posts scummy?" isn't always possible even later in the game, and asking someone to say definitively which alignment they'd say someone is off a few mostly RVS posts is kind of ;/. You can analyze them, and some posts can be good and some can be bad, which leaves you with kind of a null feeling overall.

[Marisa Kirisame]

to say definitively which alignment they'd say someone is off a few mostly RVS posts is kind of ;/.

Should read as, "To say definitively whether or not he wants to hold that Silent Swordsman is scummy off of his early game content at this point in time". Reads can change as time passes, and I would not expect anyone to immediately determine with accuracy what alignment someone has. Implying I had such expectations is absurd. To push out of RVS, you must be willing to move on the first thing that reaches out to you and slaps you with the scumstick. Twiddling thumbs and waiting for the stage of jests and caprice to eventually pass over is not my style. If Ovan states he has reservations about you, I want to know straight whether he thinks they are indicative of alignment or not. His was the first post that called out to me saying, "I have a read on someone", and reads are what we use to push the game.

[Estelle]

No, I know what you meant. I didn't word myself correctly. But like I said, asking for someone for a read on any person at any given time is not always possible. You can't always have a read past null.

[Elieson]

V-V-V-Votals!:

Leknaat (2): Suzaku Kururugi, Ovan (L-3)

Ovan (2): Tibarn, Silent Swordsman Lv? (L-3)

Silent Swordsman Lv? (2): Madam Flurrie, R2D2 (L-3)

R2D2 (1): Joey Wheeler (L-4)

Joey Wheeler (1): Szeth (L-4)

Suzaku Kururugi (1): Leknaat (L-4)

Szeth (0):

Tibarn. (0):

Madam Flurrie (0):

Voteless Trash:

Approximately 50.5 Hours Remain in Day 1. Hammer is 5 votes

[Refakitty³]

No flavor hunting.

##Unvote

##Vote: Leknaat

Kind of serious. It's about the most suspicious thing that's happened so far, in my opinion.

Pretty much nothing. I hoped I could get some sort of reaction out of him at get the ball rolling, since we might end up stuck in RVS for a long time on account of there only being 9 players.

You sound kind of wishy-washy about whether it was a random pressure vote or you thought he was seriously doing something wrong.

Leknaat's genuinely giving me bad vibes now, with the observation/hypothesis/conjecture thing looking like he's contributing a lot when he's really not. It kind of reminds me of something in an offsite game too. The guy he reminds me of was scum.

R2 took up space in their posts with roleplaying too, why are you only attacking Leknaat for it?

Yeah, I'm not voting you for voting me except I am voting you because of your awkward pressuring(In my eyes).

Clarifying that it's not an OMGUS like that seems way too self-conscious to me.

Kind of waffling about Leknaat. I agree with what he's saying about Suzaku, but I don't really like how he's going after every little thing.

And now you're complaining about Leknaat being active and trying to get us out of RVS. Really, you're tunneling like a boss and we're not even 24 hours into the game. >_>

Also, not only is this an anon game, since the other game was offsite, you're using the meta of someone who is unlikely to be playing in this game. What's the point of comparing him to someone else's posting style?

I think it was pretty clear that he just meant he had seen people do things like that more as scum. And yeah, posting styles vary, but it is safe to say that some things are more consistently done by scum. What those things are is a bit more complicated, but I still feel like your reaction was a bit overeager.

##Unvote: Joey Wheeler

##Vote: Suzaku Kururugi

[Estelle]

Lol, what Szeth? That was literally the only thing I'd said against Leknaat at that point. How exactly was I tunneling? Additionally, I wasn't complaining about Leknaat being too active, I was complaining about him going after nearly everything, which looks overeager.

[Estelle]

Actually, calling me out for being a bit overeager and then attacking me for saying basically the same thing about someone else is pretty hypocritical.

[Cú Chulainn]

Rereading the thread, my biggest scumread has been Suzaku. His early interactions with SS felt fake; I didn't like the righteous indignation over SS's meta list. He had a weird reaction to Leknaat's vote on Ovan; it was a pretty dumb RVS vote, but he called it suspicious. Didn't like his reaction to Leknaat's revote on Ovan even more (btw Leknaat, why did you vote Ovan twice?):

Leknaat's genuinely giving me bad vibes now, with the observation/hypothesis/conjecture thing looking like he's contributing a lot when he's really not. It kind of reminds me of something in an offsite game too. The guy he reminds me of was scum.

This was super scummy. Leknaat's post was reasonable, and Suzaku wrote off his points. Then he based his scumvibes on meta-ing some random dude in an offsite game, who "used a bunch of numbers" to flesh out their posts. I thought this misrepped Leknaat's post pretty hard.

##Unvote: R2D2

##Vote: Suzaku Kururugi

Also getting scumvibes on Ovan. I didn't like how he cast suspicion on Silent Swordsman, then voted R2D2. His reaction to Silent Swordsman's pressuring here was also weird – it was one huge run-on without much cogency. I thought he was scrambling. And then the vote on Leknaat right after Leknaat voted him was ehhh.

[Refakitty³]

Actually, calling me out for being a bit overeager and then attacking me for saying basically the same thing about someone else is pretty hypocritical.

No, they aren't the same thing. Commenting reasonably on a lot of stuff, and making a mountain out of a molehill in a couple of cases are not the same thing.

Interesting reaction btw.

[Estelle]

Who's making the mountain of the molehill and who's commenting reasonably? I didn't vote Suzaku for the point about him using someone else's meta. I made a comment about it, which I felt it deserved. And as for "commenting reasonably", that's subjective. I felt like him forcing people to have an opinion of one sort or another about every player at any point in the game was pushing it.

Also, Suzaku is at L-1 so yeah.

[Estelle]

Wait, no, I mixed up people, Suzaku's only at L-2.

Anyways, I'll ##Unvote for now while I think of a better target. I don't particularly want to put Suzaku at L-1 for someone to accidentally quickhammer him, and I get what Ovan is saying about Leknaat's vote for him. I think his choice to qualify his Leknaat vote as not an OMGUS vote is fair, as Joey called him out for that even after. Not a fan of the gutread he chose to mention but not pursue, but it's not really big enough of a deal to warrant a vote.

[Kamina]

It seems the anti-roleplay police has arrived and so I will be dropping that style.

Attacking people based on the way they post and not on their content is not only low, it is an easy position to take. Supporting your logic with statements as, "Makes them seem better thought out" implies you suspect there went little thought in my post. All right, ball's in your court: In what way was my vote on Ovan poorly thought out?

If there's virtually nothing to go off of, I'll go for the scummiest thing I can find. That's what I did, do you have a problem with it?

Because people always have gutreads. It doesn't make a difference if they state them or not, I don't think most people read into them anyway. Sometimes it's even a crumb (and considering the player, it could very well be.)

His push on Ovan is kind of bad too, since there was basically 3 players with more than 2 posts at the time.

You sound kind of wishy-washy about whether it was a random pressure vote or you thought he was seriously doing something wrong.

The first post: An RVS vote

The second post: Trying to spark discussion, hoping for a reaction

The third post: Not being able to keep up the reaction test without directly avoiding the question

I already stated about the reaction test here.

R2 took up space in their posts with roleplaying too, why are you only attacking Leknaat for it?

I already answered this. I didn't find it scummy because it was RPing (even though in some cases it really annoys me), I found that Leknaat's reminded me of some scum I played in an offsite game. No, Leknaat isn't using numbers, before anyone yells at me for that, but the general principle is still the same.

You sound like you're defending me in the last part of the post too, which makes you voting for me a little bit more odd.

Bleh, I ran out of time. I'll get back to addressing stuff when I get back.

[Refakitty³]

If there's virtually nothing to go off of, I'll go for the scummiest thing I can find. That's what I did, do you have a problem with it?

Because people always have gutreads. It doesn't make a difference if they state them or not, I don't think most people read into them anyway. Sometimes it's even a crumb (and considering the player, it could very well be.)

His push on Ovan is kind of bad too, since there was basically 3 players with more than 2 posts at the time.

The first post: An RVS vote

The second post: Trying to spark discussion, hoping for a reaction

The third post: Not being able to keep up the reaction test without directly avoiding the question

I already stated about the reaction test here.

I already answered this. I didn't find it scummy because it was RPing (even though in some cases it really annoys me), I found that Leknaat's reminded me of some scum I played in an offsite game. No, Leknaat isn't using numbers, before anyone yells at me for that, but the general principle is still the same.

You sound like you're defending me in the last part of the post too, which makes you voting for me a little bit more odd.

Bleh, I ran out of time. I'll get back to addressing stuff when I get back.

[Refakitty³]

Oops, messed that up.

If there's virtually nothing to go off of, I'll go for the scummiest thing I can find. That's what I did, do you have a problem with it?

Because people always have gutreads. It doesn't make a difference if they state them or not, I don't think most people read into them anyway. Sometimes it's even a crumb (and considering the player, it could very well be.)

I already answered this. I didn't find it scummy because it was RPing (even though in some cases it really annoys me), I found that Leknaat's reminded me of some scum I played in an offsite game. No, Leknaat isn't using numbers, before anyone yells at me for that, but the general principle is still the same.

You sound like you're defending me in the last part of the post too, which makes you voting for me a little bit more odd.

What you consider to be the scummiest thing can still be criticized.

What do you mean by "and considering the player"?

Okay, then. The general principle you're complaining about is what, specifically? Padding the post?

Not defending you, just attacking SS.

[Marisa Kirisame]

If there's virtually nothing to go off of, I'll go for the scummiest thing I can find. That's what I did, do you have a problem with it?

Because people always have gutreads. It doesn't make a difference if they state them or not, I don't think most people read into them anyway. Sometimes it's even a crumb (and considering the player, it could very well be.)

Yes, I have a problem with it. In the face of a number of points of interest, you chose to pursue the one topic that could be averted by simply changing posting style, and the one thing that can not be defended against because "you remind me of scum from another site" is something no one can ever defend against. This is an easy and scummy position to take, especially when R2D2 made a serious-seeming vote, there was chatter from Ovan and Silent, Silent even voting Ovan seriously.

Yet you choose not to comment on that at all until pressed, and instead of analysing content you analyse posting styles. This is scummy. I theorise that scum know full well who are Town and who are Scum, and therefore some can have difficulty spinning content into scumminess, so they cling to other arguments. If you are not scum, I invite you to provide analysis of content and vote me based on that, if you persist that I am scum.

I did not vote Ovan for gutreads. I voted Ovan for saying Silent Swordsman is suspicious but then he isn't and it isn't worth pursuing and he should be reading other people and eventually he'll read Silent Swordsman or some nonsense as that. It's wishy-washy nonsense that serves scum because nebulous stances allow one to quickly adapt to bandwagons saying, "I was always suspicious of them". Whether you were suspicious by gut or logic doesn't matter. You are reading something entirely different.

His push on Ovan is kind of bad too, since there was basically 3 players with more than 2 posts at the time.

If there's virtually nothing to go off of, I'll go for the scummiest thing I can find. That's what I did, do you have a problem with it?

To simply lend some of your words. You're criticising me for making a serious attempt to leave RVS. Scum are served by prolonged RVS. Ipso facto, I truly would like to see your flip, because I grow convinced it will be red.

[Kamina]

Rereading the thread, my biggest scumread has been Suzaku.

Rereading the thread? It took you multiple reads to scumread me? (I'm probably looking way too much into this but bleh)

Rereading the thread, my biggest scumread has been Suzaku. His early interactions with SS felt fake; I didn't like the righteous indignation over SS's meta list. He had a weird reaction to Leknaat's vote on Ovan; it was a pretty dumb RVS vote, but he called it suspicious. Didn't like his reaction to Leknaat's revote on Ovan even more (btw Leknaat, why did you vote Ovan twice?):

A lot of this is just massive generalizing. How am I supposed to defend myself if you're hurling accusations at me without giving reasoning?

This was super scummy. Leknaat's post was reasonable, and Suzaku wrote off his points. Then he based his scumvibes on meta-ing some random dude in an offsite game, who "used a bunch of numbers" to flesh out their posts. I thought this misrepped Leknaat's post pretty hard.

I didn't agree with Leknaat's scumread. How is that misrepping him?

What you consider to be the scummiest thing can still be criticized.

What do you mean by "and considering the player"?

Okay, then. The general principle you're complaining about is what, specifically? Padding the post?

Not defending you, just attacking SS.

Okay.

I've literally heard of one person who likes .hack on this site, so I assumed it was him. As much as I dislike meta, I can't completely disregard the thing.

The style of the post.

Alright.

Yes, I have a problem with it. In the face of a number of points of interest, you chose to pursue the one topic that could be averted by simply changing posting style, and the one thing that can not be defended against because "you remind me of scum from another site" is something no one can ever defend against. This is an easy and scummy position to take, especially when R2D2 made a serious-seeming vote, there was chatter from Ovan and Silent, Silent even voting Ovan seriously.

Just because someone can't defend them against a point doesn't make it any more valid. In some cases (albeit, not this one) it's a pretty sure tell of their alignment.

I don't see how saying "I agree" to most of these things would have helped advance the game, do you? I prefer not to restate things that others have posted without good reason (pursuing a case or whatnot) so I didn't address it. It's as useless as babbling about your townreads, while it's not inertly scummy, it doesn't help much at all.

Yet you choose not to comment on that at all until pressed, and instead of analysing content you analyse posting styles. This is scummy. I theorise that scum know full well who are Town and who are Scum, and therefore some can have difficulty spinning content into scumminess, so they cling to other arguments. If you are not scum, I invite you to provide analysis of content and vote me based on that, if you persist that I am scum.

I can and will press my scumreads, regardless of whether or not people find me scummy for them. You're making a pretty big leap in logic in the second part, since very little had gone on that I percieved as scummy. I will focus on what I regard as scummy behavior.

I did not vote Ovan for gutreads. I voted Ovan for saying Silent Swordsman is suspicious but then he isn't and it isn't worth pursuing and he should be reading other people and eventually he'll read Silent Swordsman or some nonsense as that. It's wishy-washy nonsense that serves scum because nebulous stances allow one to quickly adapt to bandwagons saying, "I was always suspicious of them". Whether you were suspicious by gut or logic doesn't matter. You are reading something entirely different.

Looks like I remembered that part wrong then. My bad.

If there's virtually nothing to go off of, I'll go for the scummiest thing I can find. That's what I did, do you have a problem with it?

To simply lend some of your words. You're criticising me for making a serious attempt to leave RVS. Scum are served by prolonged RVS. Ipso facto, I truly would like to see your flip, because I grow convinced it will be red.

And you're criticising me for an attempt to leave RVS also. Why would scum bother being active during the RVS phase and pursuing weak votes (yes, even I know my reasoning isn't the strongest) that others could easily percieve as being scummy? I wanted to hurry the game along out of RVS, which is exactly where scum wants it to stay.

Also, the italics reminds me of Mancer in Pokemon Adventures, where he was so sure that JB was scum. If I die, the rest of you better remember this.

Getting kind of irritated, give me a little while to recollect my thoughts.

[Estelle]

I actually think that for the most part, when someone pushes for a lynch really hard and uses wording like "I am 100% sure this person is scum", they're normally town, regardless of what the lynch flips as. Mafia can push hard for a townie's lynch to WIFOM, but generally they don't want to take the risk of tying themelves to a mislynch that much. Leknaat's push against Suzaku makes me feel better about him, actually.

Suzaku, the thing is, you might have disagreed with Leknaat's assessment of Ovan, but you didn't attack Leknaat for that. You attacked him for the manner in which he presented his points, because you felt it was padding his content. When I asked you about your feelings about the content itself, you said it was neutral. What you attacked him for, padding his content, wasn't really true, because there was content there. And as for the "style" of his posts, how is that different from RPing?

And because I think I know who you're talking about with the numbers thing, IIRC, he wasn't scummy for using the numbers to pad his content. It was that the way in which he used the numbers made no sense, he chose arbitrarily how scummy one thing was in comparison to another, instead of scumreads, he just had a large amount of weak suspicions, and because his points were inconsistent. None of those are the case with Leknaat here, and I repeat, you're trying to justify your vote with a completely out of place analogy.

[Sham]

Just to clarify wrt to what I said about Silent swordsman. I don't think he's scum and any bad vibes I had about him that were gut weren't thingsthat I myself actually though would make him scum so I didn'y pursue it.

I still heavily dislike Leknaat and his push against me. And I still felt like he was looking for something that he shouldn't have been looking for at that point in the game.

I would like a few specific people with barely anyposts to come post more when they get the chance, specifically R2D2. And I'm personally not liking Szeth's posts at the moment. I see them there but I don't really feel much from them I guess?

I don't feel goot about Suzaku either at the moment but I would prefer a Leknaat lynch at the moment over him. To me it heavily looks like one is scum and the other is town. I might be a little biased though so that's not helpful. I do think the worst thing Suzaku did though was his reaction to Leknaat's post/vote against me when he seemed to partially misrep him.

Also I feel that Joey and Szeth have only really posted about Suzaku. What are your thoughts on other players?

[Marisa Kirisame]

I'll allow the lieutenant a break and wait for his further thoughts. Speaking of, the lurkers had best get out of the woodwork before I will begin advocating a Lynch All Lurkers policy. In a small game it is beneficial for scum to sneak in the shadows and let vocal townies win them the game.

I still heavily dislike Leknaat and his push against me. And I still felt like he was looking for something that he shouldn't have been looking for at that point in the game.

What was I looking for that I should not have been looking for? Also: We've progressed beyond that. Please update your reads; There's been a lot of content from me and if I am scum, I am sure you can find some updated reason to argue why I am scum. There has been zero content analysis from you and considering you have made a clear distinction between Suzaku and I, that becomes unforgivable.

I don't feel goot about Suzaku either at the moment but I would prefer a Leknaat lynch at the moment over him. To me it heavily looks like one is scum and the other is town.

Are you lining up the lynches? If either Suzaku or me is scum, would you lynch the other of us if either flips green?

Mea culpa is not a valid excuse for confirmation bias, especially if you have no grounds for it. Please answer my question above, in addition to: How is my "awkward pressuring" scum minded, i.e. why does it make sense that I would follow my course of action as scum?

[Sham]

I'll allow the lieutenant a break and wait for his further thoughts. Speaking of, the lurkers had best get out of the woodwork before I will begin advocating a Lynch All Lurkers policy. In a small game it is beneficial for scum to sneak in the shadows and let vocal townies win them the game.

What was I looking for that I should not have been looking for? A STRONG STANCE. Something that a lot of players wouldn't have had on page 2 in a game with 9 people when over half the players had only like 1-2 posts. Also: We've progressed beyond that. Please update your reads; There's been a lot of content from me and if I am scum, I am sure you can find some updated reason to argue why I am scum. There has been zero content analysis from you and considering you have made a clear distinction between Suzaku and I, that becomes unforgivable. True enough and I'll get to doing that in a bit. However I have stated the main thing from both of you that annoyed me. Yours was your reasoning for pushing me, his was his awkward misrep of you.

I don't feel goot about Suzaku either at the moment but I would prefer a Leknaat lynch at the moment over him. To me it heavily looks like one is scum and the other is town.

Are you lining up the lynches? If either Suzaku or me is scum, would you lynch the other of us if either flips green? No I wouldn't start trying to lynch the other should one flip town. However I would defintely be looking at the person who was still alive very closely. Is that wrong?

Mea culpa is not a valid excuse for confirmation bias, especially if you have no grounds for it. Please answer my question above, in addition to: How is my "awkward pressuring" scum minded, i.e. why does it make sense that I would follow my course of action as scum? I feel like the way you pressured me could be something that scum would do so as to have an easy way to place their vote on someone, and an easy way to look active/helpful.

[Estelle]

Ovan- Why R2D2 over Tibarn or Madame Flurrie? And why do you think that Suzaku and Leknaat have to be oppositely aligned? I don't think that they're scumbuddies, but them both being town is a possibility, and I don't see a reason you offer for why they're oppositely aligned other than that you think they're both scummy, which is not really an interaction between them. Also, considering that IIRC both Joey and Szeth attacked you in addition to Suzaku (and Szeth also attacked me), saying that they're only talking about Suzaku is kind of a misrep. Additionally, while I don't really like some of what Leknaat said about you, I dislike how you're saying that Leknaat's way of pressuring you is an easy way of seeming active and helpful. It can be, maybe, but is it in this case? No, Leknaat has been active even disregarding anything he's said about you.

My opinion of you was improving, but I dislike your most recent posts so back to this it is, since I don't want to put Suzaku at L-1 yet. ##Vote: Ovan

[Kamina]

Can you elaborate on your last part of your reply Ovan? I don't really understand what you're trying to say there.

Now I'm a little calmer, I feel better about Leknaat. Not completely at ease, but still a little better. His points on Ovan are definitely good ones, especially lining up lynches part, which sprang to my mind as well.

Also, I'm not really fond of Joey's last post. He jumped onto my wagon pretty quickly when it was building momentum, and a lot of the statements he made about me were very generalized. He says I misrepped the post, when really I didn't. I didn't think the vote was particularly valid at the time, or scummy. He's also been awol for 24 hours (albeit I think some have been gone longer) so he needs to get in here and give reads. Same with half of the game, sadly.

##Unvote

##Vote: Joey Wheeler

Not liking Flurrie for just dropping their RVS vote and leaving either.

This feels like Volcanic 9p. Also my neighbor sucks.

[Kamina]

Elaborating on my Leknaat read: I don't really see my old points as valid now that I've backed off for a bit and come back. I still have some lingering feelings, but they're not strong enough to make me pursue them, and I think they're more due to me just being irritable rather than Leknaat's behavior itself.

[Estelle]

This feels like Volcanic 9p. Also my neighbor sucks.

Volcanic was 14p, and is that a claim?

[Kamina]

Volcanic with 9 players. Take the second part as you will.