Should Casual Return?

[omega zero]

nah, the whole point of the game starting out harder is to separate the wheat from the chaff. it's also the point in the game where the developers have the best idea of what stats you're going to have, so the design becomes far more intricate/difficult to break over your knee.

Then what would be a good solution to discourage low-manning at higher difficulties? Especially early on. For example, is it possible to train Vaike, Miriel, Stahl, Sully, Virion, Sumia and Kellam as actual combat units in addition to MU/Chrom on Lunatic/Lunatic+? It seems to me that you are forced to choose only one or two of them to train in addition to MU/Chrom, from my experience in Lunatic. I can guess you might mention lower/fixed growth rates, but what else? Higher base stats for recruitables on higher difficulties (like hard mode bonuses) is another possibility.

Edit: Well, I guess this is an inconsequential point in FEA because the only map that is not amenable to low manning is Tiki's paralogue. Still, my point about the difficulty curve was in regards to low manning in general. After all, you can't train a multitude of characters if enemies are too strong for them to take on from the beginning of the game.

Edited February 27, 2015 by omega zero

[GrySun]

Then what would be a good solution to discourage low-manning at higher difficulties? Especially early on. For example, is it possible to train Vaike, Miriel, Stahl, Sully, Virion, Sumia and Kellam as actual combat units in addition to MU/Chrom on Lunatic/Lunatic+? It seems to me that you are forced to choose only one or two of them to train in addition to MU/Chrom, from my experience in Lunatic. I can guess you might mention lower/fixed growth rates, but what else? Higher base stats for recruitables on higher difficulties (like hard mode bonuses) is another possibility.

Edit: Well, I guess this is an inconsequential point in FEA because the only map that is not amenable to low manning is Tiki's paralogue. Still, my point about the difficulty curve was in regards to low manning in general. After all, you can't train a multitude of characters if enemies are too strong for them to take on from the beginning of the game.

That's where buying dlc content comes in. Quite a coincidence they got a perfect earlygame grind map for sale, eh?

[Vascela]

I'm DLCless and hard/Lunatic aren't too bad to deal with. Said grinding may be limited, but its still very manageable.

I suppose extreme might not have been the best adjective. With respect to other FE games where you have Arenas, Boss Abuse, and free repeatable fights, it's definitely something more reasonable than paying 4800 per risen (even though you have a large pool of funds, the lower end early leveling doesn't really pay off).

Of course you can also shiny tile farm of spotpass, but that I think I would say that's a bit extreme (from a realtime standpoint).

edit: I'm also not counting the time repeatables for Awakening because that also falls under decent realtime component)

Edited February 28, 2015 by Vascela

[Irysa]

Then what would be a good solution to discourage low-manning at higher difficulties? Especially early on. For example, is it possible to train Vaike, Miriel, Stahl, Sully, Virion, Sumia and Kellam as actual combat units in addition to MU/Chrom on Lunatic/Lunatic+? It seems to me that you are forced to choose only one or two of them to train in addition to MU/Chrom, from my experience in Lunatic. I can guess you might mention lower/fixed growth rates, but what else? Higher base stats for recruitables on higher difficulties (like hard mode bonuses) is another possibility.

You can get away with actively training about 5 or 6 combat units in the first half of fe13 lunatic, then kids sort of end up taking over, but since they rocket ahead you can work in another 4 of them without too much fuss. Although you will have to massively drag out maps and farm reinforcements to get enough exp to do it. Like...it's not honestly too hard to train more units in FE13 since there are some quite lucrative training opportunities present after Chapter 2.

Edited February 28, 2015 by Irysa

[Ownagepuffs]

Then what would be a good solution to discourage low-manning at higher difficulties? Especially early on. For example, is it possible to train Vaike, Miriel, Stahl, Sully, Virion, Sumia and Kellam as actual combat units in addition to MU/Chrom on Lunatic/Lunatic+? It seems to me that you are forced to choose only one or two of them to train in addition to MU/Chrom, from my experience in Lunatic. I can guess you might mention lower/fixed growth rates, but what else? Higher base stats for recruitables on higher difficulties (like hard mode bonuses) is another possibility.

Edit: Well, I guess this is an inconsequential point in FEA because the only map that is not amenable to low manning is Tiki's paralogue. Still, my point about the difficulty curve was in regards to low manning in general. After all, you can't train a multitude of characters if enemies are too strong for them to take on from the beginning of the game.

Galeforce units also make Tiki's chapter low man-able. 2 turning the map is fairly standard procedure.

[omega zero]

You can get away with actively training about 5 or 6 combat units in the first half of fe13 lunatic, then kids sort of end up taking over, but since they rocket ahead you can work in another 4 of them without too much fuss. Although you will have to massively drag out maps and farm reinforcements to get enough exp to do it. Like...it's not honestly too hard to train more units in FE13 since there are some quite lucrative training opportunities present after Chapter 2.

5 or 6 in addition to MU and Chrom or including them? I didn't use the water trick on my Lunatic run, maybe that made a difference.

[Irysa]

including mu and chrom, and without the water trick

kellam is probably a lost cause to attempt to actually train though since his class set is awful, but all the other early units have at least some options I think. (don't mention ricken or donnel)

Edited February 28, 2015 by Irysa

[ErrantDShepherd]

Obviously the question ought to be... Should we have a more punishing and unfairly torturous gameplay mode to balance out the casual and classic modes?

You know... Something like The Oregon Trail where your units are stricken by realistic war based diseases and afflictions like PTSD, possibly causing berzerk status, or dysentery from being in the same camp too long randomly killing off units from your army?

...I think it has some potential. ;)

Edited February 28, 2015 by TheErrantShepherd

[omega zero]

including mu and chrom, and without the water trick

kellam is probably a lost cause to attempt to actually train though since his class set is awful, but all the other early units have at least some options I think. (don't mention ricken or donnel)

Then that makes sense. Though it depends on the context of the game, what is the threshold for low-manning, in terms of army size?

[Ownagepuffs]

~12 units, give or take the units you switch out for kids.

Edit: this is reasonably sized. True low manning in FE13 a 4 man run of Chrom, Lucina, Robin, and Morgan.

Edited February 28, 2015 by Ownagepuffs

[Rukathesoldier]

What is this water trick?

[Ownagepuffs]

Prologue. Chrom and Robin can reach the water, the enemies can't. Robin picks off the 1 range enemies from 2 range for consequence free exp. Can start C1 at like level 7 with Robin.

[iavasechui]

Yes, if only because I need a casual sanity preserver file for the inevitable lunatic + classic bs i will inevitable feel compelled to attempt to beat.