[World map with locations]

The maps looks really good in this game.

Kind of funny to think that those floating islands are actually underground Nohr and Hoshido.

[A failure to muddy a war. (FATES SPOILERS)]

^Second this. That fanfic sounds interesting to read.

I always thought that since Hoshido was so obviously based on ancient Japan, that IS had bias towards it and made it seem like such a perfect kingdom. FE is a Japanese game after all.

I can think of another game where the game developers were bias toward making their nation look way better than the other nation. But what made it worse was that they used the actual names of real-life countries.

[Character Hate Thread]

You can have a baby with six different middle schoolers

Yeah, at least Awakening had time travel to excuse having children... with children. There's not even a timeskip in Fates. Age differences are fine, but at least make them legal before having kids. Sheesh.

Okay, I have issues with Azura. She's one of my favorite characters, actually, but I really can't take how they make her such a "mysterious person" when I really don't think she is and obviously making her a canon pairing with Kamui. Come on, all three route practically pair them together in the story. It gets disheartening to pair them with other characters when the story practically pairs them together. Other spouses have like no influence/extra dialogue/lines at the end unless they're Aqua.

And Kamui... I don't dislike Kamui's character. But I don't think Kamui makes a good FE lord that's for sure. It would have been more interesting if they did it like in Awakening, and the avatar wasn't the main character. Kamui is almost liked by everyone in the game and there for stu-ness and player worshipping, but other than that, Kamui is a decent character. Though I did dislike Kamui in Conquest. Kamui still did everything Garon ordered even though Kamui kept saying they didn't want to kill innocent people yet still went along with the invasion without doing anything. Again, not exactly a good main character to center the story on.

[Sakura Discussion Thread]

Sakura's my favorite sister of both familes. I thought she was bland at first, but she grew on me. I really like her design and she stands up for herself when needed. Her supports are really good too.

[Fire Emblem: Fates - Complete Story Discussion]

I'm curious what the original draft of the story was. Probably better than what's in the game.

Even if I can see a lot of flaws in Fates' story, I still like it, more than Awakening's at least.

I think the main reason to join Hoshido was Mikoto sacrificing herself to save Kamui, not really the bloodline thing. You can see from the transformation cutscene that Kamui was really angry with her death and good reason to oppose Garon.

But one thing I'm irked about is that the female siblings don't really play a significant role. Yeah, they have cutscenes but the main spotlight is always on the male siblings. They get the weapons that can beat the main villain, they get more dialogue, etc. In the third route, the female siblings hardly have an effect on the story, aside from Sakura and have little dialogue for the majority of the route and in laters chapters, like no dialogue AT ALL ( i think, correct me if i'm wrong), like totally forgotton. Yeah there's a cutscene for them, but that's it. For a story that focuses on the royal families so much, this bugs me.

[Invisible Kingdom getting all the goodies]

It kinda bugs me that the Invisible route has like everything the other routes offer, aside from story perspectives and some maps. Still, as someone who wants the best ending and all the characters, having the Invisible route available makes the other routes seem pointless and incomplete b/c you can you only get half the characters in them.

[How do you feel about how Odin's dressed?]

Nah. fanservice-y designs don't bother me. But tbh, I thought Nyx and Ophelia's designs would get more controversy.

[Felicia's cuteness is a little excessive]

But if you have a problem with her voice, you musn't have seen any Anime, because this kind of voices is freaking everywhere.

I watched lots of anime, hearing the squekiest, high-pitched voices imaginable and didn't mind it. But games, can't stand it in games for some reason. Maybe it's b/c the game don't voice all the dialogue and just hearing Felicia's "Ehhhhh!" and other voices' sounds repeatedly is repetitive.

["The Light That Shines in the Dark" - Nohr Story Discussion]

By this point, I'm convinced the Conquest Path would have worked better with Corrin being an enthusiastic conquerer.

Exactly. When I first heard about the Conquest route, I thought this was what it would be like, that Kamui would slowly turn evil and become a conquerer.

What the route showed instead was Kamui still wanting to stop the invasion but doesn't do a single thing but listen Garon's every whim until almost the very end... Disappointing.

[Felicia's cuteness is a little excessive]

I actually like Felicia. Only gripe I have with her is her squeaky and high-pitch voice. The clumsy gimmick is ok but overdone. Jakob is better in design, voice, and supports.

And comparing Awakening to Fates children, I have mixed opinions. I'm pretty fond of some of them, others not so much.

But Morgan > Kanna for sure.

Though I still like Kanna, but I like Morgan better.

["The Light That Shines in the Dark" - Nohr Story Discussion]

It's relevant because it explains why Kamui believes that Marx wouldn't turn against Garon until he was ready to expose that it wasn't really Garon with solid proof, rather than making such a big accusation without any proof. The only thing that Marx does before seeing that it wasn't Garon at all was agreeing to open a door that was supposed to remain locked. Even so, Marx warns that he'd consider Kamui an enemy and turn the army against him if it turned out to be a lie.

I see this as a good reason but if this is true, I feel that this was poorly executed in the story.

[Player worshipping]

Tag the spoilers.

I agree though. He has even less of a reason to forgive Kamui after all that had transpired since you destroy his army and unambiguously kill his retainers. He didn't like you before, so why would he forgive you after that? It feels like a cheap way of not making the player feel too bad over what they have just done.

I've said it numerous times before, but Kamui pretends he's going to execute her after their battle for no reason, and she forgives him without ever bringing that up again. It's a very minor thing, but one that bothers me nonetheless.

Yeah, one of my major gripes about the Nohr route.

It's pretty bad at times. I know they are trying to establish some connections in a short amount of time but even the opening scene has you waking up to see HALF the castle staff at your bedside. Waking up is a big deal when it's Kamui-sama! After that Kamui gets to meet all his siblings who dote on him (particularly his sisters) as though he's the most precious child in the world. There is some justification for this because it's Kamui's big day to leave the castle. You could handwave it if the player worship stopped there but it doesn't.

Later when the conflict escalates, Kamui becomes the center of attention again. I can see his family being heartbroken by his choice but treating it with more weight than the entirety of the war is a little absurd. It's a big thing for Kamui but I don't see why it should be such a strong motivation for the other main characters to fight. Special snowflake dragon chosen by a holy sword or not, I don't think Kamui should be the effective leader of the army when one, he's practically a foreigner (Hoshido route) and two, he has two older siblings (and a younger sibling with more combat experience). To the game's credit, they do seem to try to subvert the universal love for Kamui with your little brothers but even that fades away.

Let's not even get into the My Castle stuff for what that says about how unconditionally everyone in his army loves him...

Does the player worship make me dislike the story or character? I wouldn't say it makes it super unlikable but I feel there was wasted potential. Kamui is put into a horrible position because of his family situation but his character could have been even more tragic if he wasn't so loved by nearly everyone in the story. Imagine if the attention for Kamui in the story was about securing him as a tool and it was just a few individuals who genuinely loved him for who he is?

How is Aqua treated in the Nohr route? I feel like she was given an appropriate amount of attention in Hoshido (ie not too much).

Wasted potential indeed. Feels like there's more emphasis on fanservice than good, realistic story-telling and character development.

I'm curious about how Aqua's treated in the Nohr route too. One issue I have with picking sides between Nohr and Hoshido was that no one gave a crap about Aqua, just Kamui. She was in the same situation as Kamui. And you don't see the Nohr/Hoshido siblings fighting for her. Just, wth? It's like the whole Fates world tends to revolve around Kamui or something.

[The Lifespan Question (Third Route Spoilers)]

[spoiler=The hypothetical lifespans of several characters]

So, we know that Corrin's father is the dragon Ananakos, and that Azura's father is an as yet unnamed dark dragon.

Would it be reasonable to assume that both these characters being half dragons, that they could live far longer than normal humans, barring of course, death in battle or Azura dissolving into water? Perhaps not as long as the Manaketes of Akaneia millennia long lifespans, but surely a few centuries wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility.

Would these long lifespans also be passed down to their children, Kanna/Shigure/etc, as well?

No incest in this game. Unless you count family through marriage/adoption as incest. I think they would live longer. But the thought of Kamui outliving their spouse/siblings/friends kinda seems sad.

[Media Create: Fates sold more than Awakening (Sales for Week 2 Up)]

I want both paths to do excellent--and I'm glad that they sold out!--but in the long run, I would like Nohr to do better than Hoshido for the simple reason that I think they're using it to gauge which direction they're going to take the series. Nohr's complicated storyline, darker themes and diversified and challenging gameplay make it reminiscent of the Tellius games, which are considered by a lot of vets, including myself, to be some of the best in the series. Unfortunately Tellius also were some of the worst-selling games for several reasons--the console they were on being one of them. It seems that they have changed a lot of these problems in Nohr's development, so hopefully they can see that people DO actually want games like it.

That being said, the biggest draw to this game was choice for me. The Avatar's choices determining the fate of several characters (who are all lovable in my opinion), and the writer guts you emotionally no matter which path you take. We love to feel emotionally conflicted. We love to be shocked. It's one of the keys to Game of Thrones' success and I believe it's a key for Fates', too.

I doubt Nohr would sell more. Many of the new FE fans played Awakening as their first FE game and would probably like the easier game Hoshido provides. And this is Japan's sales we're talking about. I think there would be a bias toward the Japanese-themed classes, as they weren't any in prior FE games( I think). Nohr seems to be mostly traditional FE classes.

[Hoshido character hate *may contain spoilers]

Eeeh? I actually like the Hoshido designs over the Nohr designs. You gotta admit, some of the Nohr designs are kinda silly-looking. Hi Camilla and Charlotte. I'm not sure whether that places me in the majority or minority, since a lot of people on here prefer the Nohr side of things... ^^;

Yeah, I prefer the Hoshido designs.

Speaking generally (very generally) the hoshidan personalities are a bit... bland. Especially when comparing the siblings to each other. There are exceptions of course, but just generally the characters don't have a ton of depth to them in Hoshido.

As much as I like Hoshido, I have to agree with this. There are exceptions, but generally the characters are bland b/c the supports are well... bland. I was expecting more from Hoshido support convos, but I thought Nohr's supports were way more interesting/creative. I was really disappointed with the Hoshido's siblings supports with Kamui.

So, it's pretty much like this... Design: Hoshido>Nohr, Supports: Hoshido<Nohr

The Hoshido siblings' supports don't really talk about Kamui's time in Nohr was like. I haven't seen Ryoma's but I'm guessing it doesn't either. I still like the Hoshido siblings more than Nohr's, mostly b/c of personalities, not supports.

And I find all the hate towards Takumi is overhyped.

Takumi doesn't treat Kamui for a good reason. Kamui was raised in an enemy nation and would probably still be loyal to Nohr despite their Hoshido heritage. That's not an unreasonable reaction, it's realistic. I would be more turned off by the fact if all siblings reacted to Kamui returning with open arms. That's not realistic.

[Felicia Discussion Topic]

I like Felicia, but I'm not a fan of her high-pitched voice. I like Jakob better. I think his design is great. Though the maid/butler/ninja classes are among my favorite classes despite being new to the series. Who doesn't love badass maids/butlers and ninjas?

[Camilla x Zero. I don't even (spoiler)]

Have you tried to track down other games? It's as hard to find emulators and roms as it is to find sunshine in California. Basically, don't judge the whole series because you started on one of the worst entries. (Though I do concede that a single support line isn't usually enough to develop a character; you'd have to get supports with multiple characters to learn much about them.)

Also, the support. One word summary of my thoughts: nope.

This. Yeah, you can support more characters in Awakening and Fates, but I found the quality of the support convos better in older games. The characters were less one-dimensional and conversations weren't so... generic.

[Soleil/M!Kamui's Supports are almost offensive]

Okay, definitely worse support I saw so far. Localization better change this. But for now, not pairing these two together.

[To censor or not to sensor. (Localization for North America)]

Yup, it will be T-rated. They're not going to make it M-rated. Another reason is b/c of profit. I doubt that a M-rated FE game will be as profitable as a T-rated game.

[Question for those who have beaten ( one of ) the games: How does Fates compare to Awakening?]

The gameplay is usually pretty darn fantastic, although some map gimmicks are simply not fun and are only there to artificially make the game more difficult, but that's just my opinion. Still, there's a lot of variety at least, and that's nice.

However, even though they said they'd focus on the story, I'm really not impressed, particularly not by the Nohr route which I consider pretty darn bad and unsatisfying. They're clearly betting everything on the third path, saving most of the mysteries and the best features for that route, so I think the "if" here is a pretty bad title, honestly. Yeah, what "if" you chose the path that's pretty much going to be the correct one? - At least, that's the impression I got from playing Hoshido and Nohr.

I'm not the best to talk about characters, both because of my poor Japanese and the fact that I actually liked a lot of characters from Awakening. Still, there are a few ones I definitely like, and a few I definitely can't stand, unlike in Awakening where the I just didn't mind the worst characters there; here I actively dislike some, but that might change with the English version and it's all so subjective anyway.

Kamui is also a worse character than Robin. He's pretty much just as bland, but while Robin at least had tactics to fall back on which explained why they were in charge of the army, Kamui leads everyone for the lulz. I guess he's got that fancy sword, but it's a thin excuse to say the least, especially once your route's older brother joins the party.

Music and graphics are better though, and like I said I really like the map variety for the most part, so those are definite improvements.

All this. I liked Robin waaaayy better than Kamui, that's for sure. I don't think Robin is bland though. It's hard to compare them since Kamui is super naive b/c of a sheltered royal life while the other is a rational tactician but at least Robin had way more character development IMO.

["The Light That Shines in the Dark" - Nohr Story Discussion]

As much as I like some of Nohr's characters, I thought the Nohr route had horrible story writing. I thought Kamui would rebel against Garon sooner, not near the end when Kamui commited so many atrocities already. I understand that Kamui is sheltered, but their naive ideals caused so many mistakes/conflicts that could have been avoided in the Nohr route. Kamui is definitely more likable in the Hoshido route than the Nohr route. I agree with the 'Hoshido siblings forgiving him' part. Like wth? They barely even know Kamui, why would they forgive him so easily? It's so gary/mary stu-ish that Kamui isn't going to be held accountable for his actions by the Hoshido siblings when Kamui practically invaded Hoshido knowing that Garon is evil but chose not to rebel until it was too late, and Kamui is still considered some "hero" that is the "light that shines in the darkness" even though they done squat to fufill that role for the majority of the route.

I have hope for the third route but seeing how Nohr turned out, I'm not so sure anymore.

I also agree on why the Awakening characters picked Nohr... Doesn't make sense for them to pick Nohr b/c Garon is clearly evil.

[Hoshido Chapter-by-Chapter Story Summary [Spoilers]]

Thanks for the chapter summaries! Very much appreciated for your hard work.

Love it, still slightly confused as to why Marx/Xander was so headstrong in fighting compared to his siblings.

Is it due to his position as the first heir to the throne, and his undying loyalty to his father/country? He seems to be more focused about that than any of his siblings.

Also in earlier chapters when Kamui and CO. are discussing 'fighting' Garon and Marx, is that killing the both of them? I was under the impression they were going to kill Garon, but Marx? Leon even warns Kamui of both their strength and I don't think he'd be okay with Marx dying, so maybe I'm misinterpreting it.

Yeah. Marx is his brother. Leon shouldn't be okay with his death. I was expected a bigger reaction to that. But I only read the summary so I'm really sure how Leon reacted.

[[SPOILER] Skinship and Supportconversations...(Video and Translations!)]

Here's the link to Xander and Ryouma's C-A Supports

http://pastebin.com/8QvNFsvb

[Rey's FE:if Translation Playthrough]

Much appreciated for translating but no need to rush yourself. Translating can get very stressful.

[God tier characters, both routes]

Some good units seemed to be the royal siblings, Effie, Azura (if you reclass her), and potentially the children (depending on your supports).

I'm pretty disappointed in Setsuna's growth rates though... not as much as Rinka's, but still. They can get nerfed pretty badly if you don't get lucky with the RNG goddess.