H5 Tier list topic

[_____]

Why should the Boots be assumed on Marth? Being the best recipent of something doesn't mean you always get it if plenty of other people want it [see the FE4 Leg Ring thing] and you don't often use your full move in this game so it's much, much, much less of a benefit.

You just contradicted yourself. Everyone wants the boots but it's not much of a benefit to anyone but Marth? What the hell?

[Rodykitty]

Even though Marth doesn't always get it, I anticipate most people throwing things like "It's more efficient to give it to Marth than everyone else, therefore it is a waste to give it to, say, a General." and crap like that. It's still undeniable that he's the best user of it, just seeing if it actually affects his tier position by just a slot or two.

This is really weeding out the issue before it actually happens.

And Marth is lucky to be as high as he is. He's pretty lackluster without Rapier utility I hate to say.

[_____]

And Marth is lucky to be as high as he is. He's pretty lackluster without Rapier utility I hate to say.

But is Wendell's limited utility (yeah, he has D staves, but even someone like Roshea could have that in a few chapters) really enough to make him > Marth? Marth's pretty useful throughout the entire game. If he didn't have the Rapier, I wouldn't be arguing this, but since the game is 90% Cavs and Knights, it plays a huge role.

[Dat Nick]

You just contradicted yourself. Everyone wants the boots but it's not much of a benefit to anyone but Marth? What the hell?

I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt and ASSUMING he's the best recipient of it. And no, people DO want it. Jake is probably the best example. More attack range is always a plus for him and he has more of a reason top use his full move every turn [We bunch our units together generally, so Jake goes from lagging behind the team to keeping up with them] and even WITH the boots some things can still be out of his range. Marth will almost NEVER use his full move of SEVEN spaces until the chapter either is or approaching done. Does this even save more than two turns throughout the ENTIRE game [Honestly, how much of a difference does 7/9 move make when you have no excuse not to be close to the throne, anyway]? You'd save more having Jake Pacyderm stuff he wouldn't reach with 4 move.

I'd much rather use the boots to help me complete the chapter as opposed to getting Marth to the throne a turn faster once in a blue moon.

Oh, and HeroZag wouldn't mind more enemy phase exposure, either.

Edited October 9, 2009 by Athena's Chest

[Blackbird]

I think Boots might be more important on NM where you can rush across the map with little danger of dying. I'm not sure Boots should be factored into the tier list, though. It's one of those items that anyone benefits from using. Like the Speedwing; pretty much everyone can benefit from it (except Shiida, lols). Maybe there might be an argument there if one person made use of it significantly better than any other character.

I can appreciate the Ballistician mention though. There is something to be said for helping them keep up with the party.

Marth, on the other hand, is occasionally required to run across the entire map to pick up chests. 20x comes to mind; the chests are all over the place. In this scenario, you have three options:

1) Warp Marth around to get to the chests faster. High opportunity cost, you could use that Warp elsewhere, or to skip chapters.

2) Bring keys or Thieves. Keys cost money (not a big investment, but it's there.) and Thieves hog valuable slots that can be used for units that are leveling support or are generally more useful.

3) Give Marth Boots. At least he gets across the map faster.

I'm not saying it's conclusive. There are other options. But there's merit in it.

[Rodykitty]

I should ask more questions like this as I read other tier topics. We'll keep finding ways to turn Jake into a swiss army knife.

[Dat Nick]

You know how I said in the rankings topic that Gordon should drop because Curate-Sage healbotting isn't anything special because everybody else can do it and it's the only thing he's good at and he sucks at life for all other purposes?

[Rodykitty]

There are other characters who heal botting is their only purpose, which Gordon wins since he has more availability heal botting.

That and there's the whole early utility thing going for him.

[Dat Nick]

Still, above Riff is a bit of a head-scratcher. He's no better at dedicated healing than Riff is [probably worse due to lower staff rank] and Riff is forced for two chapters that Gordin's chip damage sucks in. Unless we're placing that much value on C1, his only chapter of real usefulness as an archer.

[Blackbird]

The only real advantage I can perceive for Curate!Gordin over any other staff user you could use (generic or otherwise) is an existant Def growth. I don't think he builds enough HPs for it to be meaningful, though. It's really too bad Gordin couldn't be an Armor, he might actually be good at it =P.

Edited October 9, 2009 by Blackbird

[Rodykitty]

Riff > Gordon.

[Progenitus]

Someone fill me in on Arran > Est. I don't see how Arran is better. His bases are slightly better but he levels slower (I don't know how slowly; I haven't looked at the exp formula) and loses growths, and Est still gets to look forward to promoting. And recruiting Arran means you lose Samson (granted, Samson sucks anyway).

(someone PM me if this gets responded to, I might have forgotten that I asked this...)

Edited October 14, 2009 by 8========================D

[Rodykitty]

I think the only reason Arran wins was due to Sniper weapon levels or something, otherwise he's worse overall.

Edited October 14, 2009 by FE3 Player

[OrangeCrush980]

You guys forgot to put Sedgar and Xane on the list.

[dondon151]

They're Zagaro and Chainey.

[Mekkah]

He's trolling.

[Dat Nick]

We know this because Stephen_Glass says this all the damned time.

[Rodykitty]

Sedgar & Xane added to the list.

[Dat Nick]

Oh, I didn't even see Smash's post until now.

Someone fill me in on Arran > Est. I don't see how Arran is better. His bases are slightly better but he levels slower (I don't know how slowly; I haven't looked at the exp formula) and loses growths, and Est still gets to look forward to promoting. And recruiting Arran means you lose Samson (granted, Samson sucks anyway).

To elaborate, Est has major difficulty levelling without the triangle attack. Said triangle attack has been called into question several times (One because it requires Palla to be a class she doesn't want to be, she badly wants Sniper for the spd, and two because enemies are in such large groups even if you kill something another shmuck will just one shot Est back)

And Samson doesn't just suck, he really sucks, so I say him blocking out Samson is literally a non issue.

[Zakaerys]

Oh, I didn't even see Smash's post until now.

Someone fill me in on Arran > Est. I don't see how Arran is better. His bases are slightly better but he levels slower (I don't know how slowly; I haven't looked at the exp formula) and loses growths, and Est still gets to look forward to promoting. And recruiting Arran means you lose Samson (granted, Samson sucks anyway).

To elaborate, Est has major difficulty levelling without the triangle attack. Said triangle attack has been called into question several times (One because it requires Palla to be a class she doesn't want to be, she badly wants Sniper for the spd, and two because enemies are in such large groups even if you kill something another shmuck will just one shot Est back)

And Samson doesn't just suck, he really sucks, so I say him blocking out Samson is literally a non issue.

It doesn't require Palla to be a 1-Range class, she can still take part in the TA even when she's an archer, she just cannot initiate it. So I don't see either how that's an issue. Catria & Est initiating it shouldn't put anyone at a disadvantage.

[Rodykitty]

Somebody needs to make a video showing Triangle Attack in action in a practical manner.

[Dat Nick]

That doesn't answer the second portion at all.

and two because enemies are in such large groups even if you kill something another shmuck will just one shot Est back)

[Zakaerys]

How is Arran doing better?

[Dr. Tarrasque]

How is Arran doing better?

They're both pretty much shit but C17 and C17x's enemies are easier than C18 and on so he's got like 2 chapters where he's not as shitty as Est. Time to build a Bow rank and do some chip damage.

[Dat Nick]

How is Arran doing better?

He doesn't get one shotted by everything on the map and doesn't require two unit slots catering just for his purpose. He just hides behind your guys and longbow chips.