Eirika vs. Ephraim

[Knife]

Eirika's character is pretty boring and uninteresting. She's decent in battle, but needs frequent assistance to kill an enemy in one turn.

Ephraim's character is not much better than Eirika, but he's more of the silent "I do things my way" kind of guy. He can one round a lot of things with the Reginleaf.

[CT075]

*Notes Camtech075 digging a hole for himself*

*Notes Camtech075 lying down in the hole asking to be buried alive*

Hmmmm... Interesting........

:P

*Notes Ephidel asking to get whacked by the shovel and then be buried in the hole with me*

You don't even _have_ the Lancereaver in the first few chapters. And Eirika rapes her Avo against other things with it, particulary against axers (from normal WTA to double WTD AND some AS loss).

Why the hell would I be using the Lancereaver against Axers?! I use the Rapier against Lancers, and it works pretty well. Also, Seth's Iron sword works wonders for her, even with the AS drop. I may have been lucky, but then Joshua died in the Arena. My playstyle revolves around attacking rather than defending so Eirika's dodge gets put to good use there. Also, even though Ephraim has Lances, and has more ATK, Eirika is less prone to Magic attacks. Also, in all of my playthroughs, Eirika has more chance to double the enemy SMs. Ephraim might not be able to double them. Anyway, unpromoted Ephraim is superior to unpromoted Eirika, I'll give you that. But promoted, it's close.

[Mekkah]

Why the hell would I be using the Lancereaver against Axers?!

Axers and lancers are often mixed in with each other, so you don't always have a choice on enemy phase.

I use the Rapier against Lancers, and it works pretty well.

Except Eirika now has shit avo rate and hp/def, so she'll get 2-3HKOed.

For everything else you said, personal experience lol.

[Ephidel]

*Notes Ephidel asking to get whacked by the shovel and then be buried in the hole with me*

If I go down, I'm taking you with me![/Andross]

Why the hell would I be using the Lancereaver against Axers?! I use the Rapier against Lancers, and it works pretty well. Also, Seth's Iron sword works wonders for her, even with the AS drop. I may have been lucky, but then Joshua died in the Arena. My playstyle revolves around attacking rather than defending so Eirika's dodge gets put to good use there. Also, even though Ephraim has Lances, and has more ATK, Eirika is less prone to Magic attacks. Also, in all of my playthroughs, Eirika has more chance to double the enemy SMs. Ephraim might not be able to double them. Anyway, unpromoted Ephraim is superior to unpromoted Eirika, I'll give you that. But promoted, it's close.

No. Neither of them get hit regularly because Sacred Stones is pathetically easy, so I judge it by usefulness. Higher Atk and Def and a better Prf weapon make Ephraim better. Plus, Sieglinde isn't as good as Siegmund for slaying Fomortiis due simply to the Lance Vs Sword Atk difference AND Ephraim's higher Str. The only way you'd choose Eirika is if you liked her, and tbh, I thought she was crap. Ephraim is far more likable and he had Zaalbul Marsh in his route which fills up with strong(ish) monsters. Great for Exp, slightly less predictable than the Tower of Valni, and you'd usually get some neat weapons too.

[CT075]

If I go down, I'm taking you with me![/Andross]

No. Neither of them get hit regularly because Sacred Stones is pathetically easy, so I judge it by usefulness. Higher Atk and Def and a better Prf weapon make Ephraim better. Plus, Sieglinde isn't as good as Siegmund for slaying Fomortiis due simply to the Lance Vs Sword Atk difference AND Ephraim's higher Str. The only way you'd choose Eirika is if you liked her, and tbh, I thought she was crap. Ephraim is far more likable and he had Zaalbul Marsh in his route which fills up with strong(ish) monsters. Great for Exp, slightly less predictable than the Tower of Valni, and you'd usually get some neat weapons too.

^You have a point there.

I prefer characters who are faster, and as Eirika is one of the fastest characters in the game, I think I have a right to use her.

[Destiny Hero]

Ephraim, because he can take out one enemy without getting crippled.

[Mekkah]

So can Ephraim. And if he gets enough Avo supports (A Duessel/B Kyle or something), he actually has more than Eirika since his own affinity gives Avo as well.

[CT075]

Hey, Eirika can dodge attacks! Do I have to say it 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 times!?

[Mr.Shiu and Watch]

Ephraim lance over sword.

[_____]

Really, the only arguement you could make for Eirika that wouldn't be shot down instantly would be her performance in the first few chapters.

[Vykan12]

Not a single stat comparison in 3 pages? This is madness!

Though seriously, I don't think anyone mentioned routes. Considering both characters are above average when available, it goes something like this:

Eph route Ephraim > Eph route Eirika

Eir route Eirika > Eir route Ephraim

So the only comparison with any purpose is Eph route Ephraim vs Eir route Eirika. But even then, Eirika has about a 6 chapter lead on Ephraim, so if Ephraim is to win, he has to win by quite a lot when he's around.

Upon route split:

Ephraim lv 8/0 (C Forde, C Kyle, iron lance): 26 hp, 18 Mt, 11 skl, 13 spd, 8 def, 3 res, 10 luck, 12 crit, 122 hit, 15 cev, 43 avo

Eirika lv 11/0 (B Seth, iron sword): 22 hp, 15 Mt, 13 skl, 14 spd, 8 def, 6 res, 10 luck, 11 crit, 131 hit, 15 cev, 43 avo

Ephraim leads slightly in durability (4 hp > 3 res) and in offence (3 MT > 1 spd) while everything else is more or less tied. Though, Ephraim also has a much better prf weapon than Eirika, and probably more uses left. Marginal win for Ephraim.

Jumping to promotion:

Ephraim lv 20/1 (A Forde, B Kyle, steel lance): 40 hp, 33 Mt, 21 skl, 17 spd, 16 def, 12 res, 16 luck, 30 crit, 163 hit, 28 cev, 67 avo

Eirika lv 20/1 (A Seth, B Tana, steel sword): 33 hp, 26 Mt, 21 skl, 17 spd, 16 def, 16 res, 16 luck, 27 crit, 145 hit, 28 cev, 57 avo

Now Ephraim is winning by quite a lot. He has a huge 7 Mt attack lead, and they share the same speed, which means Ephraim’s doing a whopping 14 damage more than Eirika when both double, which is rather often. He also leads durability with 7 hp and 10 avo > 4 res.

Now, to lazily look into the future, compare their growth rates:

Eirika: 70% hp, 40% str, 60% skl, 60% spd, 60% lck, 30% def, 30% res

Ephraim: 80% hp, 55% str, 45% spd, 50% lck, 35% def, 25% res

Difference (+ for Ephraim, - for Eirika): +10% hp, +15% str, -15% skl, -10% spd, -10% lck, +5% def, -5% res

What this tells us is that Ephraim will continue winning hp, strength and def, whereas Eirika will continue winning res. She does have other leads, but they won’t take much effect. For instance, a 10% speed lead just means that she’ll win speed by 1 in 10 levels, and both are doubling everything as it is. She also has a 30% avo growth lead, but Ephraim’s already ahead by 10, so she’ll never be able to close that gap.

Finally, I want to put more attention on supports. Eirika has a no brainer A support with Seth, but filling her B is quite an ordeal. Saleh, L’Arachel and Innes are all pretty bad (or at least worse than Ephraim’s supports), which leaves Tana, Forde and Ephraim. The Ephraim support is rather late considering it will only start like halfway through the desert chapter, and Forde has Kyle, Ephraim and Franz he could support earlier. So Eirika really is relying on that B Tana to fill in her support set, and Tana is really only an upper mid unit at best.

Ephraim, on the other hand, has Kyle, Forde, Duessel and Tana, all of which are lightning fast supports with good 2 way benefits. Clearly Ephraim having 4 viable support options > Eirika having 2, maybe 3, and Ephraim wins support speed regardless.

So yeah, I think there is overwhelming evidence of Eph route Ephraim > Eir route Eirika.

[Mekkah]

But even then, Eirika has about a 6 chapter lead on Ephraim, so if Ephraim is to win, he has to win by quite a lot when he's around.

2-3 earlygame chapters together are about as big and meaningful as one midgame one though, due to their massive lack of enemies.

Saleh, L’Arachel and Innes are all pretty bad

Eir route Saleh bad? He isn't an all-star but he is perfectly viable. Takes up no resources, and his prepromotedness added to 1~2 range and the suckiness of monsters allow him to be a great contributor for the chapters to come. Then when he begins to dwindle he can pick up Excalibur/Ivadli, either of which is bound to be free, and rape. And he always has high staff level utility.

Just wanted to put those things out there. Also, Ephraim being able to throw Javelins is huge.

[CT075]

Sigh. At least 18% of the people reading this voted for Eirika. Knoll isn't that great, worse than Saleh when trained. Innes is fine, and L'Arachel is great! She makes a great Valkyrie, and is an okay Mage Knight! L'Arachel is also a decent support, as least as good as Tana. Tana is kind of harder to train, but if you use L'Arachel instead of Vulneraries, she promotes quite fast. If you use her to heal Eirika in the chapter when you get Rennac, she levels up pretty consistently, countering the fact that Ephraim has a better Prf weapon, kind of. Reginleif is quite good, and Rapier isn't too great, but you get two Rapiers. You only get one Reginleif.

Edited January 25, 2009 by Camtech075

[Florete]

^You get a second Reginleif on Ephraim's route.

And am I the only one that thinks Ephraim/L'Arachel/Eirika support triangle (with the twins at A most likely) is amazing?

[Ϲharlie]

And am I the only one that thinks Ephraim/L'Arachel/Eirika support triangle (with the twins at A most likely) is amazing?

I've never even bothered with it.

[_____]

Sigh. At least 18% of the people reading this voted for Eirika. Knoll isn't that great, worse than Saleh when trained. Innes is fine, and L'Arachel is great! She makes a great Valkyrie, and is an okay Mage Knight! L'Arachel is also a decent support, as least as good as Tana. Tana is kind of harder to train, but if you use L'Arachel instead of Vulneraries, she promotes quite fast. If you use her to heal Eirika in the chapter when you get Rennac, she levels up pretty consistently, countering the fact that Ephraim has a better Prf weapon, kind of. Reginleif is quite good, and Rapier isn't too great, but you get two Rapiers. You only get one Reginleif.

What does Knoll have to do with anything? At all?

Innes sucks, since he's an archer who's only good during early Eirika route chapters. L'Arachel comes really late, and underleveled. She'd require a lot of staff abuse to even be close to promoting, and you've already got 2 healers who're better than her (Moulder and Natasha). In other words, she sucks.

Also, as Fox said, you get a second Reginleif.

^You get a second Reginleif on Ephraim's route.

And am I the only one that thinks Ephraim/L'Arachel/Eirika support triangle (with the twins at A most likely) is amazing?

L'Arachel comes pretty late for a game with only 20 chapters, and the twins aren't together long enough for an A support to build up.

[Florete]

L'Arachel comes pretty late for a game with only 20 chapters, and the twins aren't together long enough for an A support to build up.

Although I can't remember what they are, the bonuses are pretty great and support triangles as a whole are very nice to have. I personally find it to be worth it.

[_____]

Although I can't remember what they are, the bonuses are pretty great and support triangles as a whole are very nice to have. I personally find it to be worth it.

It's LightXFireXLight.

On a normal playthrough, you probably won't get an A support with Ephraim and Eirika until very late. Like, last chapter late. L'Arachel is even slower, and she doesn't have the earlygame playtime together that the others do. She can only get a support with one of them at best.

If you're just playing around, I'm sure it's pretty good.

[Florete]

If you're just playing around, I'm sure it's pretty good.

Considering this game is easy and has no ranks, that's what I do almost every time. It never hurts me to wait 60 turns on a chapter, so I do it if it's worth it.

Note: I'm not debating you, I'm just explaining how I do things.

[_____]

I know. I was just pointing that out.

[Ephidel]

Sigh. At least 18% of the people reading this voted for Eirika. Knoll isn't that great, worse than Saleh when trained. Innes is fine, and L'Arachel is great! She makes a great Valkyrie, and is an okay Mage Knight! L'Arachel is also a decent support, as least as good as Tana. Tana is kind of harder to train, but if you use L'Arachel instead of Vulneraries, she promotes quite fast. If you use her to heal Eirika in the chapter when you get Rennac, she levels up pretty consistently, countering the fact that Ephraim has a better Prf weapon, kind of. Reginleif is quite good, and Rapier isn't too great, but you get two Rapiers. You only get one Reginleif.

Summary : Camtech075 just likes Eirika more, tough shit.

If you don't like it, you can suck on his Rapier![/thread]

[CT075]

^ Shut up!

Although I do think she's kind of cute, as well as being win...

[Ephidel]

^ Shut up!

Although I do think she's kind of cute, as well as being win...

You're secret is safe with me!

;)

[dondon151]

L'Arachel comes pretty late for a game with only 20 chapters, and the twins aren't together long enough for an A support to build up.

Yeah, I was going to say that it would be like RutgerxDieckxClarine except 10 chapters later with worse units. And maybe worse support bonuses.

[The Envoy of the Beginning]

Ephraim beats Eirika in almost every way imaginable. I mean you're comparing Ephraim, a great lord, to the lamest one in the whole series.