Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Ugh. Alright. Fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seph Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Ugh.Alright. Fine. You could have been more enthusiastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Where do you want Chiki placed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seph Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 I was just showing you that funds shouldn't be in a tier list, if there is no such rank. I don't really know, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Well that was a thoughtful moment... As for where to put her...somewhere in lower or upper mid? Best I would say is around the mages. BEST case scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 (edited) I was just showing you that funds shouldn't be in a tier list, if there is no such rank.I am the kind of person that doesn't cling to rankings as the source of tier list criteria anyway.Anyway, the reason we don't want to consider Chiki using more funds than other characters is because it is favortism. Other characters are going to receive very significant results if funds are poured into them as well. Using that free Fire Stone is fine. As for where to put her...somewhere in lower or upper mid? Best I would say is around the mages. BEST case scenario.Don't push your luck. Edited February 15, 2009 by Chainey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seph Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Anyway, the reason we don't want to consider Chiki using more funds than other characters is because it is favortism. Other characters are going to receive very significant results if funds are poured into them as well. Using that free Fire Stone is fine. Now, this really depends on the amount of funds you get. I don't know how much, so depending on that, you should make a conclusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Apparently you get a lot of funds. Even still though, I would like to keep value in being resourceful, for the sake of consistency. But still, Chiki is fine using just the Fire Stone which you obtain without paying, and maybe keeping the Divine Dragon stone. That's likely how I'll judge her position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 In regards to Chainey's response to me, no worries. I'm aware, was why I said best case scenario. It's unrealistic to see her that high, but who knows with how vastly things have been changing around lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seph Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Apparently you get a lot of funds. Even still though, I would like to keep value in being resourceful, for the sake of consistency. Bolded. Also, you should be able to use all those resources, for the sake of efficiency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Right, but when you do use all of those resources, it needs to be spread out over all characters, not just Chiki. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Nick Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 I highly disagree with Bishop tier's new area, actuallly. I feel the entire reason for it even existing was to show that some characters are worse than useless. You can use the bishops for a quick heal or something. What's Sheema gonna do, keep failing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seph Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Right, but when you do use all of those resources, it needs to be spread out over all characters, not just Chiki. If you really do get a lot of funds, why don't you give some to Chiki, too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 I highly disagree with Bishop tier's new area, actuallly. I feel the entire reason for it even existing was to show that some characters are worse than useless.Hmm... I wasn't aware their position on the tier list actually mattered. I'll bring them back up next revision.The reason I moved them was to show a better progression for the characters that come before them. If you really do get a lot of funds, why don't you give some to Chiki, too?Likely because she doesn't need much more than other units. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Nick Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 (edited) Chiki's only use is tanking. Doga's only use is tanking. If Chiki goes up any further, Doga skyrockets. Edited February 15, 2009 by Sweet Tooth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seph Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Just so you know, I wasn't arguing for Chiki going up. Just that funds should be 100% used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Funds will be 100% used... When playing the game. For discussing tier lists though, we can't assume that funds will be used exactly the same way. I'm treating them much like stat boosters in this case. They'll be used, but I'm not going to assume the useage at all for tiers unless they require it to function, then that shows they need external help in getting going that may take away from something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Raven Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 (edited) I feel Funds should only be a minor point against someone at best. It's pretty much a point against everybody except the Bishops lol... so it's an almost mutual penalty. Of course, some have it more than others, but not to the point where it changes anyone's slot. Am I the only one that's for the elimination of the bishop tier? The chapter they come around for is weighted a lot less than every other chapter in the game. And Sheema is honestly an entire tier and a huge gap worse than Est? What makes her that much worse? She has a shitload more base defense and more HP and it takes at least two enemies much like Est. Sheema's recruitment isn't horrific either considering those enemies don't attack you and the only other enemies there are... are somewhat pathetic anyway. If you position people near that area then they can easily roast the kill and have Marth seize. If not... well, you have enough levels on your chars by now anyway. :/ EDIT: There is shit like Dragon Knights, but you've got enough bow users and Shaver mages to take care of them. Edited February 15, 2009 by Nathan Graves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Well, it's no longer as much of a penalty to Chiki anymore since we figured out that she can just use the Firestone that Banutu comes with. And Sheema is honestly an entire tier and a huge gap worse than Est? What makes her that much worse? She has a shitload more base defense and more HP and it takes at least two enemies much like Est. Sheema's recruitment isn't horrific either considering those enemies don't attack you and the only other enemies there are... are somewhat pathetic anyway. If you position people near that area then they can easily roast the kill and have Marth seize. If not... well, you have enough levels on your chars by now anyway. :/Apparently recruiting Sheema and Samson require you to avoid killing the Gra Soldiers, and apparently they get in your way, causing you to waste turn count to get to them.Sheema herself has all of Est's major problems which are join time, terrible base stats, etc, but also has even more flaws than Est does by having only 10 levels to grow and horrible Movement. If you can prove that it's possible to recruit them without wasting extra turns, please tell us. Samson really, really wants out of Fail tier, badly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Nick Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Am I the only one that's for the elimination of the bishop tier? The chapter they come around for is weighted a lot less than every other chapter in the game. Bishop tier isn't so much to establish the bishop's uses as much as it is to cement the fact that Sheema is worse than useless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 (edited) The Gra soldiers ar enot only kept alive to block your way, but forbid you from a decent amount of EXP for people you'll actually be using. You can kill them AFTER recuiting Sheema and Samson, but...Tier list. Efficient play. We aren't gonna twidle our thumbs while we wait to go back and slay the gra soldiers, when we can just kill them for easy exp on the go AND exp for killing both Samson and Sheema. Sheema won't be missed, but Samson's conditions just as unfortunate...Samson is trying like a mad man to bust out of fail tier, but he's...not exactly bringing anything special to the table. Samson, a tale of tragedy. Just clarifying is all. Edited February 15, 2009 by Grandjackal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Raven Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 (edited) So all of a sudden it has become hard to position your chars near them (the rest of the enemies are pathetic and I do believe you can have around 12 chars in the chapter) and recruit Sheema? Especially considering how there's a "surplus of EXP" and also how buffed up your characters are at this point anyway it shouldn't matter much. Samson has pretty good offense/defense as well, he's definitely above bottom and even low tier. For the record, when I played, they didn't get in my way. In fact they barely move and they don't even attack. How is that "getting in your way"? Edited February 15, 2009 by Nathan Graves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 So all of a sudden it has become hard to position your chars near them (the rest of the enemies are pathetic and I do believe you can have around 12 chars in the chapter) and recruit Sheema? Especially considering how there's a "surplus of EXP" and also how buffed up your characters are at this point anyway it shouldn't matter much.Samson has pretty good offense/defense as well, he's definitely above bottom and even low tier. For the record, when I played, they didn't get in my way. In fact they barely move and they don't even attack. How is that "getting in your way"? Quit making me think, leave me to be irrational! Hmph! Anyways, doesn't sound like they are getting out of your way. So they're still in the way. Why deny yourself exp when it's there anyways? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Okay, so the whole "Gra soldiers waste your turn count" was all a farce? Samson is instant Low-Mid tier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 (edited) Okay, so the whole "Gra soldiers waste your turn count" was all a farce?Samson is instant Low-Mid tier. I can see no one here can take a joke when they see one... Yeesh, had someone earlier quote me to identify what I said was a joke -_- Why would I waste my time making a farce on a tier list for? Edited February 15, 2009 by Grandjackal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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