Ilyana

[Jaybee]

Compared to most other magic units, it sucks balls.

[aizengard]

I know this guy, so I think I can translate this for everyone.

What he meant to say is that the Sages in Radiant Dawn are more balanced in terms of gameplay compared to previous games. Whereas in other Fire Emblem games you could send a Sage to the frontlines and not worry about them dying, this time around they're more vulnerable to attack and should be kept a little further away, letting the tougher characters soak up the damage. Basically saying that Sages were overpowered before and needed a little nerfing. At least that's what I think he was trying to say.

I kind of agree with him, but I do have to admit that the Gatrie/Ilyana speed comparison blew my mind...

thank u. that was what i was trying to say.

also big deal if they have bad speed growths.

if they can still kill then there good.

[PuffPuff]

Let's see...

At LV20/20/10 she will likely cap in Def upon which Soren cannot. Sure she grows less speed, but she grows more defense to make up for it! She gets even better with the transfer data.

[The Envoy of the Beginning]

thank u. that was what i was trying to say.

also big deal if they have bad speed growths.

if they can still kill then there good.

Who gives a fuck about killing if they can't even do it well?

Staff utility? Sages get it late. Bishops suck in this game, except Laura. Micaiah is another story though.

Edited July 7, 2009 by Luster Warrior

[Mikethfc]

I avoid her like the plague, due to her crappy growths (seriously, her magic growth is near-identical to her strength growth). Also, thunder magic is much heavier in this game than in PoR, so she'll probably never double anything past 1-3.

Which doesn't matter because her strength growth caps within the first five levels of tier 3 if you could attack with staves on your turn she would be a lot better because of the ;arge crit staves gives her but the resolve + adept helps her battlewise and blossom is good when shes nearing lvl 20

[Sain_FEH]

Ilyana can become marginally better if you help her out with a data transfer from Radiant Dawn to boost her MAG and SKL. While she comes overleveled when you get her in the DB, by the time those levels balance out, that extra +2 really helps her out.

The unfortunate thing is her awful, awful speed. The second time I played through (with data transfer) I used her throughout just because she was there so much and gave me a unit that I could help bolster my force with when necessary. I was going to take her to Endgame with me but didn't have enough slots - and that was really only because I supported her with Zihark and didn't want to separate them because I think they should be together forever, heh.

But yeah, generally, not that great. But, like a lot of units, I'm willing to look past their shortcomings just because I like them. It's the reason why I'll field Fiona or Ilyana over Shinon every time (face it, he's a douche).

[aizengard]

Who gives a fuck about killing if they can't even do it well?

Staff utility? Sages get it late. Bishops suck in this game, except Laura. Micaiah is another story though.

Laura sucks just so u know

[_____]

Yeah, BLS, Laura is no better than Rhys. The only reason people consider her as the better unit is because she's the only healer in the Dawn Brigade.

Edited July 11, 2009 by Ninji

[Nestling]

thank u. that was what i was trying to say.

also big deal if they have bad speed growths.

if they can still kill then there good.

Where does she appear on the tierlist? Pretty low. I think even WENDY is higher than her (DEF is better than no DEF.)

[Thunder Mage Ilyana]

I avoid her like the plague, due to her crappy growths (seriously, her magic growth is near-identical to her strength growth). Also, thunder magic is much heavier in this game than in PoR, so she'll probably never double anything past 1-3.

illyana won't have much trouble carrying thunder magic. by the time i leveled her up to 21 as a mage she already had maxed out strength. and by the time she got to level 5 as a sage she maxed out her strength again. the only tome i see that she would have trouble using would be bolting because of it's low hit rate. as for her speed just give her speedwings. the other characters will be fine without them.

[Nestling]

illyana won't have much trouble carrying thunder magic. by the time i leveled her up to 21 as a mage she already had maxed out strength. and by the time she got to level 5 as a sage she maxed out her strength again. the only tome i see that she would have trouble using would be bolting because of it's low hit rate. as for her speed just give her speedwings. the other characters will be fine without them.

Micaiah would appreciate them too.

[Zkirsche]

But yeah, generally, not that great. But, like a lot of units, I'm willing to look past their shortcomings just because I like them. It's the reason why I'll field Fiona or Ilyana over Shinon every time (face it, he's a douche).

Being a douche > having very little lines. Shinon has more personality and back story than trash like Fiona, which, IMO, makes him teh superier character any day.

Laura is no better than Rhys.

Laura actually has speed once you level her up seriously. Rhys doesn't. Laura is needed more in the low-def DB than Rhys is needed in the high-def GM's.

Laura is better, and more useful, than Rhys is.

Edited July 11, 2009 by kirsche

[Narga_Rocks]

Being a douche > having very little lines. Shinon has more personality and back story than trash like Fiona, which, IMO, makes him teh superier character any day.

Well, superior character depends on how you define it. He's certainly more flushed out, and if we define superior as how well his personality is created and how well the game pulls it off and stuff, then he'd be the superior character. However, that doesn't mean he's likeable, and thus when given a choice some people might not want to deal with him. Which I think was Arteris's point.

Though Fiona could have the best back story and the most well developed personality and be the nicest/coolest/funniest/whatever character ever and I still wouldn't use her. At least not on NM or HM.

Laura actually has speed once you level her up seriously. Rhys doesn't. Laura is needed more in the low-def DB than Rhys is needed in the high-def GM's.

Laura is better, and more useful, than Rhys is.

Yeah, the idea that Laura is "no better than Rhys" seems pretty nuts.

[_____]

Laura actually has speed once you level her up seriously. Rhys doesn't. Laura is needed more in the low-def DB than Rhys is needed in the high-def GM's.

Fun fact: 20/3 Laura, the same as Rhys at his base level, has basically the same stats as Rhys, the main exception being Speed, where she has 3 more than him. This, however, is irrelevant, as Laura is still getting doubled and one rounded by everything.

Keep in mind that this assuming that Laura even promotes at level 20 in Part 3, which is ludicrous.

Laura is better, and more useful, than Rhys is.

More useful? Obviously.

Better, statistically speaking? Just barely, and, even then, the leads are superfluous.

Yeah, the idea that Laura is "no better than Rhys" seems pretty nuts.

Based on raw statistics and not how useful each character is relative to their team, it isn't.

Edited July 11, 2009 by Ninji

[Zkirsche]

The speed lead matters later on.

[_____]

The speed lead matters later on.

How so? 23 is a pitiful speed cap, doubling the most common enemy on the map, the level 16 Tiger, I admit, but not doubling anything in 4-whatever. Again, this is assuming that Laura reaches 20/11 within Part 3, which is ridiculous.

I never said that Rhys > Laura, especially when considering Utility.

It should also be noted that Laura is ORKO'd (OHKO'd, in fact) by every enemy in Part 3, even when we put her at 20/11 so her speed caps.

[Florete]

It should also be noted that Laura is ORKO'd (OHKO'd, in fact) by every enemy in Part 3, even when we put her at 20/11 so her speed caps.

Did I read this right? Obviously Laura is never reaching 20/11 before part 4, but where are you getting her bieng OHKOd by every part 3 enemy at that level? Only the 41 atk Tigers can (borderline) OHKO her and nothing will double.

[Zkirsche]

How so? 23 is a pitiful speed cap, doubling the most common enemy on the map, the level 16 Tiger, I admit, but not doubling anything in 4-whatever. Again, this is assuming that Laura reaches 20/11 within Part 3, which is ridiculous.

The female Saint cap is 31, and Laura reaches that easily.

Unless we're just talking about when they're both bishops.

[_____]

Did I read this right? Obviously Laura is never reaching 20/11 before part 4, but where are you getting her bieng OHKOd by every part 3 enemy at that level? Only the 41 atk Tigers can (borderline) OHKO her and nothing will double.

...

Wow, how the hell did I mess that up? I read the HP stat as the ATK. Ignore that comment.

Guh, I need to stop making these mistakes.

The female Saint cap is 31, and Laura reaches that easily.

Unless we're just talking about when they're both bishops.

Yes, I am talking about when they are Bishops; thus "Part 3".

[Zkirsche]

Yes, I am talking about when they are Bishops; thus "Part 3".

I believe all you said was that Laura was no better than Rhys, nothing to do with part 4 >_>

Whatever, you were wrong anyway.

[_____]

I believe all you said was that Laura was no better than Rhys, nothing to do with part 4 >_>

In the past few posts, I've been constantly mentioning Part 3. If anyone is at fault, it's you for not reading my posts correctly.

Whatever, you were wrong anyway.

How so? I said Laura was no better than Rhys, statistically.

Any lead Laura has over Rhys is superfluous, as they are both ORKO'd and they both can only contribute chip damage, at best.

They are both combat failures, and, as I illustrated, even a severly overleveled Laura is no better than Rhys.

[Zkirsche]

In the past few posts, I've been constantly mentioning Part 3. If anyone is at fault, it's you for not reading my posts correctly.

You completely changed the topic, just because you make a point about each of their part 3's doesn't change the fact that what we were originally discussing was whether Laura is better statistically than Rhys.

How so? I said Laura was no better than Rhys, statistically.

Any lead Laura has over Rhys is superfluous, as they are both ORKO'd and they both can only contribute chip damage, at best.

They are both combat failures, and, as I illustrated, even a severly overleveled Laura is no better than Rhys.

Did I read this right? Obviously Laura is never reaching 20/11 before part 4, but where are you getting her bieng OHKOd by every part 3 enemy at that level? Only the 41 atk Tigers can (borderline) OHKO her and nothing will double.

[Wulfspade]

I love how Laura and Rhys discussion hijacked the Illyana topic. lol

[NinjaMonkey]

Did I read this right? Obviously Laura is never reaching 20/11 before part 4, but where are you getting her bieng OHKOd by every part 3 enemy at that level? Only the 41 atk Tigers can (borderline) OHKO her and nothing will double.

And just how do you get her to promote, without stuffing all your BEXP into her? (I can only manage to get her to level 10 of her first tier - and that's when I'm busy boss abusing Vika.)

[Florete]

And just how do you get her to promote, without stuffing all your BEXP into her? (I can only manage to get her to level 10 of her first tier - and that's when I'm busy boss abusing Vika.)

......

Did I read this right? Obviously Laura is never reaching 20/11 before part 4, but where are you getting her bieng OHKOd by every part 3 enemy at that level? Only the 41 atk Tigers can (borderline) OHKO her and nothing will double.