Masu Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Users can add to one's reputation/quality points. It won't work the way you described. Can they subtract though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tino Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Can they subtract though? Obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masu Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Obviously. Mmmmmm........I dunno. Technically, its a good idea. But given how some ppl here are/treat certain members here, I foresee abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Spoon Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 A rep system would fail miserably here. I'd rather see a karma system here before a rep system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tino Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Technically, its a good idea. But given how some ppl here are/treat certain members here, I foresee abuse. And abuse will be reprimanded. A rep system would fail miserably here. I'd rather see a karma system here before a rep system. A karma system is the same as a reputation system, except it doesn't allow for reduction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 A long time ago, I suggested a "Thanks" system, where people can thanks a post they like for whatever reason, but it got turned down more or less immediately. It works very well on another forum I sometimes frequent, and I don't see why it couldn't work here. There are no limits on how much you can thank there, because you may find more posts you like than the limit you have been given for the day, which would be a bugger for the post in which deserves the thanks. Also with this method, a thanks count can only rise, which will stop people bawwing when they are in in the negative because they have been a douchebag. If it was to be like this, maybe it should be disabled in forums such as FFtF, because it's spam central there, and people can thank many posts just because they find the post funny. As for usergroups vs post count, I personally find a post count is more interesting than a usergroup title, so I think post count should stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyosua Posted July 8, 2009 Author Share Posted July 8, 2009 I'd say take out user groups and the post system (or, if possible, like Kratos suggestion and do groups based on reputation), but that's just me. And I don't know how IPB is set up, but on vB you can make it so people can't rate the same person over and over again; they can only do so many within a 24-hour period, and they have to give rep to x number of people before they can give rep to the same person again. Also, you don't have to put a comment for positive posts (you can) but you HAVE to put a comment for negative reps, so that people aren't just neg repping people because they're angry. People with more rep power could give more reps, etc. Lastly, you can decide which groups can see who gave them rep (on Mercury Ice only the admin can, though I don't really know why since I never check my rep). If those are options for customization I would definitely put the rep in place, since those safeguard against so-called popularity contests and abuse of negative repping. This is the closest to what we're going to do with the quality points system. You can't + the person more than once per day You get 5 per day They're logged so we can see who's abusing them and punish them accordingly. That's what I was probably going to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masu Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 And abuse will be reprimanded.A karma system is the same as a reputation system, except it doesn't allow for reduction. True. but theer are still ppl here who will do it to get a kick out of it, get warned/suspended, wait till they are out of hot water, and eternally repeat repeat and repeat because they're getting kicks out of it, and I can already think of four names off the top of my head of who would do just that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Spoon Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 (edited) True. but theer are still ppl here who will do it to get a kick out of it, get warned/suspended, wait till they are out of hot water, and eternally repeat repeat and repeat because they're getting kicks out of it, and I can already think of four names off the top of my head of who would do just that. If they were able to keep repeating it like that, THEN we would have an incompetent staff. Edited July 8, 2009 by Miror B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crystal Shards Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 (edited) Rep system sounds like a terrible idea. We would have people abusing it to either +rep buddies or -rep ppl they dont like like:"-rep lyle because hes a faggot." Just an example of what would probably be the most popular -rep reason. Which is abuse, and my guess is that would be dealt with, just like spam, trolling, and flaming are dealt with. It's harassment. Just saying. I don't care either way. Edited July 8, 2009 by Crystal Shards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tino Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 (edited) If they were able to keep repeating it like that, THEN we would have an incompetent staff. Let's not make that the topic here, mmkay? Either way, idiots who feel like abusing the system even when they were already warned for it will simply get suspended and, if they go too far, I guess a permanent ban would be in order. EDIT: By the way, I do think people need to give adequate reasoning even if the increase one's reputation. Edited July 8, 2009 by Tino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mufasa Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Well the main argument behind postcount being removed was the elitism thing. And that's not really relevant anymore. (If it ever was.) There's no elitism here (in regards to postcount anyway. There's plenty of elitist groups: The FESSers, the Pre-FESSers, the mini-Blackens, the staff, Jyo's RL friends, the Masu fanboys, Lyle, etc etc etc) So there's no reason to remove postcount anymore. A rep system could be implimented without removing postcount, correct? The only other thing is the spam argument, but that could be taken care of with some staff crackdown on the members. Just another thing that the members abuse. No matter what you do, no matter how you impliment anything, there will always be abuse of any system. So no matter what, you will always have SOME abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masu Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Well the main argument behind postcount being removed was the elitism thing. And that's not really relevant anymore. (If it ever was.) There's no elitism here (in regards to postcount anyway. There's plenty of elitist groups: The FESSers, the Pre-FESSers, the mini-Blackens, the staff, Jyo's RL friends, the Masu fanboys, Lyle, etc etc etc) So there's no reason to remove postcount anymore.A rep system could be implimented without removing postcount, correct? The only other thing is the spam argument, but that could be taken care of with some staff crackdown on the members. Just another thing that the members abuse. No matter what you do, no matter how you impliment anything, there will always be abuse of any system. So no matter what, you will always have SOME abuse. This may be true, but "MASU FANBOYS"? Also i dont think elitism is a problem atm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinken Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Not sure of my opinion on post count, but I still think it's a largely useless factoid. I personally see usergroups and don't really think differently about those with a higher (or lower, although that's not possible) rank. It does nothing to tell me anything about the quality of their posts. As for rep systems, at least here I think it would either be abused by people who vote just for popularity or by people who just rep well-known users. I'm trying to look at this from an objective standpoint and I don't really see an upside to its implementation here personally. Sure, you can mod abuse, but if basically every single rep given out is out of popularity, I don't see why it should even be implemented. I may have a history of being at odds with the staff's opinion, but I'm just sharing my personal thoughts here and I'm trying my best to remove any subjective biases I may have. I'm not really sure of what to suggest here though, other than looking over a user's posts to determine if they're a helpful poster or not. The reason this is different from looking at a rep is that rep is a combination of subjective opinions and a mini popularity contest. All it would say to me is "a lot of people like what this guy says, but that doesn't necessarily mean his posts are quality or helpful simply from his high rep". In the end, to best determine a poster's helpfulness, the most accurate method for every individual to tell is to look over the posts. I'm not really sure how you would implement that as a system. I probably haven't said much of anything constructive, so I'll quit rambling, but rep is the system I feel most ill at ease with personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crystal Shards Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 EDIT: By the way, I do think people need to give adequate reasoning even if the increase one's reputation. Agreed. Though unless there's a significant benefit from having a high reputation it's not as bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 I've seen reputation systems used on other sites, and they ultimately cause the same problems post counts do. It's just another way for members to express biases or some kind of elitism. No postcounts, no reputation system. You guys are making this much, much more difficult than it should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defeatist Elitist Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Rep system sounds like a terrible idea. We would have people abusing it to either +rep buddies or -rep ppl they dont like like:"-rep lyle because hes a faggot." Just an example of what would probably be the most popular -rep reason. I don't see the problem here, officer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masu Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 I don't see the problem here, officer. I rest my case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyosua Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 I've seen reputation systems used on other sites, and they ultimately cause the same problems post counts do. It's just another way for members to express biases or some kind of elitism.No postcounts, no reputation system. You guys are making this much, much more difficult than it should be. No postcount, no reputation system, absolute and total equality. Exactly what we want, that way, our greatest contributors will be completely unrecognized in any format. </sarcasm> There's a reason I didn't post that in here as one of the suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crystal Shards Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 No postcount, no reputation system, absolute and total equality. Exactly what we want, that way, our greatest contributors will be completely unrecognized in any format.</sarcasm> There's a reason I didn't post that in here as one of the suggestions. Depends on how you define great. Post count is quantity, not quality or popularity; reputation could be popularity, not necessarily quantity OR quality; and usergroups could be any but not necessarily all of the three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyosua Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 An attempt gone wrong is just that; an attempt. To not try anything at all is giving up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crystal Shards Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 (edited) An attempt gone wrong is just that; an attempt. To not try anything at all is giving up. Taking everything away is just as valid a consideration as adding something new, though. Just saying. I don't like the idea, but it's not a stupid suggestion. Edited July 9, 2009 by Crystal Shards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyosua Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 I'm not saying it's stupid, I'm saying it's antithetical to what we want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Tarrasque Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 (edited) It wouldn't hurt to least try and see how the staff handle those that abuse it and even though it's abusable and there are idiots out there who make stupid assumption based on rep, there's also others able to make good judgment based on what they see for themselves and not what idiots are blinded by. For example, if a user has high rep, it would only make sense that you look into whether or not that user has actually earned it before making any fair judgment. If an idiot makes quick assumptions based on a person's rep, he's likely to make it apparent and the sooner you're aware of this, the better. At least try it. Edited July 9, 2009 by Sirius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyosua Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 I would rather try something, and have it fail, than have people say "It's a great idea in theory, but it's most likely not going to work, so don't even bother". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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