skills

[whase]

so I was just playing FE10, getting lucky and activating sol, flare and aether a lot. but then I started thinking, the next new FE should have class (mastery) skills too, but more balanced. And since you could need the skills most in the beginning of the game, base class should start with it.

so I started thinking of these skills, they shouldn't do any extra damage, since we have criticals for those. and making an opponent sleep with an arrow makes no sense either. so these were the idea's I had:

myrmidon: fast feet; myrmidons should be all about speed, not something special like armor or horses. their class skill could be +10% speed. it's simple to understand for new players, and it is always useful.

tier 2: you could give this skill a bonus by giving a speed% chance speed goes to cap for 1 battle.

possible tier 3: % up?

soldier: trained eye; supposed to be a balanced class, but like the myrmidon still a balanced unit. like the myrm this class could get a stat up skill. skill +10% would seem fit I think.

tier 2: you could give this skill a bonus by giving a skill% chance skill goes to cap for 1 battle.

possible tier 3: % up?

fighter: muscular; again, comparable to myrm and soldier. but much more focused on killing. strength+10% seems fit here.

tier 2: you could give this skill a bonus by giving a strength% chance strength goes to cap for 1 battle.

possible tier 3: % up?

archer: long range; I had a whole different plan for the archer. I was thinking about a command skill. you could command the archer to stretch its strings more and thus shooting with a range of 2-5, but making you lose 10 uses at once when doing so.

tier 2: you could give this skill a bonus by giving 3 range for free (like marksmen in FE10)

possible tier 3: possibility to 6 range?

armor knight: big shield; armor knights are there for tanking purpose. I think FE8 was doing good by having great shield for generals. though armor knights should be less good, so I'd go for halving damage (fist half damage, then -def/res) with a skill% chance.

tier 2: great shield like in FE8 (negate all damage), but with skill% chance

possible tier 3: breaking weapons? having a weapon that hits great shield lose 5 uses.

cavalier: joust; I really liked canto in FE10, but next to that I think they should have more. I was thinking about jousting after seeing FE10 paladins always run towards their opponent and the suddenly stop to attack. they should have the command skill joust, shoving the enemy 1 space back. it would only be able to hit once, but thanks to canto you can go stand in the new free place. of course impossible with 2 enemies standing after each other.

tier 2: make the shove a possible smite (if 2 places are free behind)

possible tier 3: let's do what IS did when they couldn't think of anything, we give it extra damage!

pegasus knight: up above; the fast flier. since I had the idea of a 3d battlefield, (as in 2 layers, one ground one air for fliers. maybe even more layers to have real mountains?) I would give them the autoskill that makes them able to attack from layer 2 to layer 1 without the use of long-range weapons.

tier 2: we could give them joust (cavalier skill), they are still just winged horses.

possible tier 3: make shove smite

wyvern knight(not draco knight, it should be clear it is a wyvern, not a dragon): great wings; the heavy flier. let's keep the idea of a 3d battlefield. thanks to their huge wings I'd say make them pay no movement cost for changing layer.

tier 2: joust maybe?

possible tier 3: make shove smite

mage: nature's peace; and we've come to the magic users, which will be a little harder to me.(how does magic work?) anima (can still consist of wind, thunder and fire) comes from nature, and is quite balanced in power and accuracy. I was thinking of giving this class that magical sleeping thing marksmen had in FE10. mage tier 1 would only make them sleep for 1 or 2 turns. (skill%)

tier 2: make them sleep for 3 or 4 turns

possible tier 3: sleep for 5 turns

cleric/priest/monk: guidance; instead of attacking opponents, they should focus more on survival. staves would be equipable but would do both magical and physical damage. this class I would give what I like to call the 'nosferatu effect'. all damage done is healed to yourself. but for first tier maybe only half damage restored?

tier 2: full damage restored.

possible tier 3: twice damage restored.

shaman: knowledge; shaman should be all about knowledge for power, or maybe hp for power? make them have the command ability to trade in hp to do more damage. for first tier 1 damage for every 2 hp given.

tier 2: 1 damage for 1 hp given.

possible tier 3: 2 damage for 1 hp given.

troubadour: high heels; the healers on a horse should, I think, promote to mage fighters. I think it would be a nice idea, with an eye on the 3d battlefield, to give magic extra range when standing on higher layers. troubadour could, because of sitting on a horse, get 1 range extra standard. now you could heal on 2 squares distance and then canto even further then ever(but maybe make staff counter impossible?)

tier 2: nothing new, except for being able to use anima at standard 3 range

possible tier 3: maybe 2 extra range? I guess a bit unfair~

Manakete: dragon; I am for the return of the manakete. but I think they should be FE10 dragon style, instead of only changing for 1 battle, stay changed until form can't be held any longer. the dragonstone would make its return in the way of a laguz stone. it can restore 5 (out of 20) uses every map not employed, and can wear down to 0 uses but won't break (manakete won't restore transformation points for itself). I also think as dragon it should take 4 spaces to fit in, and thus being unable to transform in narrow paths. about the skill, isn't a manakete already powerful enough? no? let's give it the skill to break down (cracked)walls without costing any extra transform points.

tier 2: think about this; a manakete warrior. having the skill it can use swords when untransformed, but no blades or sacred weapons.

possible tier 3: new skill: pray, pray for 5 turns in a row and gain 2 more dragonstone uses.

dancer: dance; restore 1 ally its movement

tier 2: restore 2 units their movement

possible tier 3: restore 4 units their movement

thief: steal; thieves are for thievery, not for fighting, keep that in mind. pick, always. and steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having 4 speed more (or more) then opponent and 2 more str than weapon wt.

tier 2: steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having 1 speed more (or more) then opponent and same str as weapon wt or more. and pass when speed 4 more than enemy.

possible tier 3: steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having speed OR skill more then opponent and same str as weapon wt or more. and pass when speed 1 more than enemy. steal equipped weapon when having skill and speed both 5 more than opponent

did I forget any important classes?

anything way too unbalanced?

please let me know, thanks for reading ;)

EDIT: oh wait, also please tell me what you think about it :)

Edited July 5, 2010 by Bartje

[Griulf]

Myrmidon: fast feet; myrmidons should be all about speed, not something special like armor or horses. Their class only needs 2 more speed to double. it's simple to understand for new players, and it is always useful.

tier 2: Doubles all units with the same or less speed.

possible tier 3: Doubles the Myrms hits. Can be stacked with Normal doubling and brave weapons.

Soldier: Shield bash; supposed to be a balanced class, but like the myrmidon still a balanced unit. Stuns for 1 turn

tier 2: Stuns for two turnn

possible tier 3: Stuns for 3 turns

Fighter: Muscular; again, comparable to myrm and soldier. but much more focused on killing. Skill=% for ignoring strengthX2

tier 2: Skill=% for strengthX3

possible tier 3: Skill=% for strengthX4?

Archer: Range; 1-2 range.

tier 2: 1 extra range

possible tier 3: 2 extra range

armor knight: big shield; armor knights are there for tanking purpose. I think FE8 was doing good by having great shield for generals. though armor knights should be less good, so I'd go for halving damage (fist half damage, then -def/res) with a skill% chance.

tier 2: great shield like in FE8 (negate all damage), but with skill% chance

possible tier 3: breaking weapons? having a weapon that hits great shield lose 5 uses.

cavalier: joust; I really liked canto in FE10, but next to that I think they should have more. I was thinking about jousting after seeing FE10 paladins always run towards their opponent and the suddenly stop to attack. they should have the command skill joust, shoving the enemy 1 space back. it would only be able to hit once, but thanks to canto you can go stand in the new free place. of course impossible with 2 enemies standing after each other.

tier 2: make the shove a possible smite (if 2 places are free behind)

possible tier 3: let's do what IS did when they couldn't think of anything, we give it extra damage!

pegasus knight: up above; the fast flier. since I had the idea of a 3d battlefield, (as in 2 layers, one ground one air for fliers. maybe even more layers to have real mountains?) I would give them the autoskill that makes them able to attack from layer 2 to layer 1 without the use of long-range weapons.

tier 2: we could give them joust (cavalier skill), they are still just winged horses.

possible tier 3: make shove smite

wyvern knight(not draco knight, it should be clear it is a wyvern, not a dragon): great wings; the heavy flier. let's keep the idea of a 3d battlefield. thanks to their huge wings I'd say make them pay no movement cost for changing layer.

tier 2: joust maybe?

possible tier 3: make shove smite

mage: nature's peace; and we've come to the magic users, which will be a little harder to me.(how does magic work?) anima (can still consist of wind, thunder and fire) comes from nature, and is quite balanced in power and accuracy. I was thinking of giving this class that magical sleeping thing marksmen had in FE10. mage tier 1 would only make them sleep for 1 or 2 turns. (skill%)

tier 2: make them sleep for 3 or 4 turns

possible tier 3: sleep for 5 turns

cleric/priest:

monk: Guidence; Can heal allies with half Mag + half MT

tier 2: Half Mag + Mt

possible tier 3: Mag + MT

shaman: knowledge; shaman should be all about knowledge for power, or maybe hp for power? make them have the command ability to trade in hp to do more damage. for first tier 1 damage for every 2 hp given.

tier 2: 1 damage for 1 hp given.

possible tier 3: 2 damage for 1 hp given.

troubadour: high heels; the healers on a horse should, I think, promote to mage fighters. I think it would be a nice idea, with an eye on the 3d battlefield, to give magic extra range when standing on higher layers. troubadour could, because of sitting on a horse, get 1 range extra standard. now you could heal on 2 squares distance and then canto even further then ever(but maybe make staff counter impossible?)

tier 2: nothing new, except for being able to use anima at standard 3 range

possible tier 3: maybe 2 extra range? I guess a bit unfair~

Manakete: dragon; I am for the return of the manakete. but I think they should be FE10 dragon style, instead of only changing for 1 battle, stay changed until form can't be held any longer. the dragonstone would make its return in the way of a laguz stone. it can restore 5 (out of 20) uses every map not employed, and can wear down to 0 uses but won't break (manakete won't restore transformation points for itself). I also think as dragon it should take 4 spaces to fit in, and thus being unable to transform in narrow paths. about the skill, isn't a manakete already powerful enough? no? let's give it the skill to break down (cracked)walls without costing any extra transform points.

tier 2: think about this; a manakete warrior. having the skill it can use swords when untransformed, but no blades or sacred weapons.

possible tier 3: new skill: pray, pray for 5 turns in a row and gain 2 more dragonstone uses.

dancer: dance; restore 1 ally its movement

tier 2: restore 2 units their movement

possible tier 3: restore 4 units their movement

thief: steal; thieves are for thievery, not for fighting, keep that in mind. pick, always. and steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having 4 speed more (or more) then opponent and 2 more str than weapon wt.

tier 2: steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having 1 speed more (or more) then opponent and same str as weapon wt or more. and pass when speed 4 more than enemy.

possible tier 3: steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having speed OR skill more then opponent and same str as weapon wt or more. and pass when speed 1 more than enemy. steal equipped weapon when having skill and speed both 5 more than opponent

Some changes.

[Renall]

There should be an actual Joust activated skill that works like the Champions in Heroes of Might & Magic 3: The more MOV you used up before attacking, the more bonus damage you deal, say 5-10% per square moved before attacking. Canto units only, adding a tactical element to the extra movement; do you want to keep some movement to get in a better position for enemy phase, or just go balls-out and bum-rush somebody with an 80% damage modifier?

[dondon151]

Way to make mounted units more broken, eh?

[Rewjeo]

Well, a horse was a huge advantage in real medieval war, so yeah, why not? Especially if there was to be more customization so you choose who gets the horse.

[Renall]

Way to make mounted units more broken, eh?

What if they're more like FE10 mounted units?

[Phoenix Wright]

Anything I don't reply to I agree with.

myrmidon: fast feet; myrmidons should be all about speed, not something special like armor or horses. their class skill could be +10% speed. it's simple to understand for new players, and it is always useful.

tier 2: you could give this skill a bonus by giving a speed% chance speed goes to cap for 1 battle.

possible tier 3: % up?

What would IS have to do to make it up in STR? SPD is useless with no STR.

fighter: muscular; again, comparable to myrm and soldier. but much more focused on killing. strength+10% seems fit here.

tier 2: you could give this skill a bonus by giving a strength% chance strength goes to cap for 1 battle.

possible tier 3: % up?

What about their bad SPD and usually bad DEF growths?

archer: long range; I had a whole different plan for the archer. I was thinking about a command skill. you could command the archer to stretch its strings more and thus shooting with a range of 2-5, but making you lose 10 uses at once when doing so.

tier 2: you could give this skill a bonus by giving 3 range for free (like marksmen in FE10)

possible tier 3: possibility to 6 range?

10 uses? That's way too many. How about three at best?

pegasus knight: up above; the fast flier. since I had the idea of a 3d battlefield, (as in 2 layers, one ground one air for fliers. maybe even more layers to have real mountains?) I would give them the autoskill that makes them able to attack from layer 2 to layer 1 without the use of long-range weapons.

tier 2: we could give them joust (cavalier skill), they are still just winged horses.

possible tier 3: make shove smite

I personally don't like the layer idea unless Javelin gets a higher Hit, and more uses.

wyvern knight(not draco knight, it should be clear it is a wyvern, not a dragon): great wings; the heavy flier. let's keep the idea of a 3d battlefield. thanks to their huge wings I'd say make them pay no movement cost for changing layer.

tier 2: joust maybe?

possible tier 3: make shove smite

What would be the use of only limiting one flying class (Pegasus Knights) from going in between layers?

mage: nature's peace; and we've come to the magic users, which will be a little harder to me.(how does magic work?) anima (can still consist of wind, thunder and fire) comes from nature, and is quite balanced in power and accuracy. I was thinking of giving this class that magical sleeping thing marksmen had in FE10. mage tier 1 would only make them sleep for 1 or 2 turns. (skill%)

tier 2: make them sleep for 3 or 4 turns

possible tier 3: sleep for 5 turns

The only enemies I can imagine living longer than 2 turns are bosses. Honestly, if an enemy is in the range and gets put to sleep by a mage, then the enemy already has a larger chance of dying faster. I've never encountered an enemy lasting longer than even two turns with missing included. Putting an enemy to sleep at close range isn't as useful for the player.

cleric/priest/monk: guidance; instead of attacking opponents, they should focus more on survival. staves would be equipable but would do both magical and physical damage. this class I would give what I like to call the 'nosferatu effect'. all damage done is healed to yourself. but for first tier maybe only half damage restored?

tier 2: full damage restored.

possible tier 3: twice damage restored.

Monk/Light Mage: no. Also, the staves would have to have crazy Mt. in order to restore any HP. Not to mention no one tries to get their healer damaged.

shaman: knowledge; shaman should be all about knowledge for power, or maybe hp for power? make them have the command ability to trade in hp to do more damage. for first tier 1 damage for every 2 hp given.

tier 2: 1 damage for 1 hp given.

possible tier 3: 2 damage for 1 hp given.

So the opposite of the Nosferatu effect? I don't think my HP is something I'd like to pay just for a little more damage. I don't like Micaiah's Sacrifice skill either.

troubadour: high heels; the healers on a horse should, I think, promote to mage fighters. I think it would be a nice idea, with an eye on the 3d battlefield, to give magic extra range when standing on higher layers. troubadour could, because of sitting on a horse, get 1 range extra standard. now you could heal on 2 squares distance and then canto even further then ever(but maybe make staff counter impossible?)

tier 2: nothing new, except for being able to use anima at standard 3 range

possible tier 3: maybe 2 extra range? I guess a bit unfair~

No extra range. At one-range heal x1.5 normally healed (with any healing staff that isn't Recover), at two-range heal normally, and at three-range heal x.85 normally healed. Round down to the nearest whole number.

dancer: dance; restore 1 ally its movement

tier 2: restore 2 units their movement

possible tier 3: restore 4 units their movement

Rafiel/Reyson (can't remember which) already made it pretty broken. I don't want that again. How about at tier 2 they get two movements, thus allowing two different (and the units must be different) units to get another "turn." At tier 3 heal 10HP (only once every three turns).

thief: steal; thieves are for thievery, not for fighting, keep that in mind. pick, always. and steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having 4 speed more (or more) then opponent and 2 more str than weapon wt.

tier 2: steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having 1 speed more (or more) then opponent and same str as weapon wt or more. and pass when speed 4 more than enemy.

possible tier 3: steal (unequipped weapons and items)when having speed OR skill more then opponent and same str as weapon wt or more. and pass when speed 1 more than enemy. steal equipped weapon when having skill and speed both 5 more than opponent

Then we'll have to give all thieves at least a +5% boost to their STR, since they have bad growths. No use in the skill if they'll never be able to use it. The class growth of tier three will not include the +5% boost.

How about 6 more SPD for tier 2 and 4 more SPD than tier 3?

Edited July 10, 2010 by MGS: Metal Gear Solid

[whase]

myrm: What would IS have to do to make it up in STR? SPD is useless with no STR.

the class isn't supposed to focus on str at all, it's not like they're supposed to take on any armor knights anyways.(unless armorslayer)

fighter: What about their bad SPD and usually bad DEF growths?

it is not my aim no make characters superb, and again, it's not the aim of the class (don't forget enemy will have these skills too)

archer: 10 uses? That's way too many. How about three at best?

three sounds too little, they really should have to think before firing at long range. 5 at least.

pegasus knights: I personally don't like the layer idea unless Javelin gets a higher Hit, and more uses.

could be arranged, not too much though or fliers and archers lose their edge~

wyvern knights: What would be the use of only limiting one flying class (Pegasus Knights) from going in between layers?

Peggie knights just have to pay one movement cost for changing layers, where wyverns, thanks to larger wings, don't.

mage: The only enemies I can imagine living longer than 2 turns are bosses. Honestly, if an enemy is in the range and gets put to sleep by a mage, then the enemy already has a larger chance of dying faster. I've never encountered an enemy lasting longer than even two turns with missing included. Putting an enemy to sleep at close range isn't as useful for the player.

unless going against high resistance enemies~

when not one rounding they could give easy exp to weaker units?

Monk/Light Mage: no. Also, the staves would have to have crazy Mt. in order to restore any HP. Not to mention no one tries to get their healer damaged.

like you say, they shouldn't get damaged anyways. and if they were, that 1 damage they might heal could save their life. maybe the only half damage healed is slightly too much~

shaman: So the opposite of the Nosferatu effect? I don't think my HP is something I'd like to pay just for a little more damage. I don't like Micaiah's Sacrifice skill either.

your opinion, when one damage away from one rounding an enemy I would do it...

Then we'll have to give all thieves at least a +5% boost to their STR, since they have bad growths. No use in the skill if they'll never be able to use it. The class growth of tier three will not include the +5% boost.

How about 6 more SPD for tier 2 and 4 more SPD than tier 3?

strength is not a thief's aim, the strength will be mostly what will keep them from stealing. they should keep some weakness.

[Renall]

What about skills that would permit a character to use 1/2 some non-standard stat for calculations in another? For instance, Thieves don't get much STR, but some kind of skill that lets them use 1/2 their SKL as if it were STR for damage purposes only?

Would work better in a game with a skill tree system, mind you, but it's a thought.