cheetah7071 Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Yeah, he was doubled with MU constantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westbrick Posted June 14, 2012 Author Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) Oh. Well then. Did you usually have Krom doubled behind MU or was he able to hold his own? I forgot to take into account the ability to raise him like that. What cheetah ended up with is exactly what I ended up with: only Krom and MU got any real experience, MU was maxed out, and Krom was "pretty good." Although his Krom actually seems quite a bit better, I still managed to get through Lunatic without too much trouble. Speed potion's necessary, and using a strength potion on Krom is a pretty good idea as well. Out of curiosity, what did your final team look like for regular Lunatic? Because it seems to me, if enemies have capped stats and absurd skills, most of your team is going to need to be equally deadly IE maxed stats anyway, so that video doesn't look entirely out of the question. But it seems at the very least you would needed a max stats Krom in addition to a sorcerer if you planning on abusing resire, because if you get to the final with just a maxed out sorc MU, you are SOL. Since I doubt Krom can solo the other half of most maps, this will likely encourage you to train additional units for a defensive formation. And from that you have... an entirely normal playthrough using a handful of strong units.Yes, resire forms an incredibly strong defensive pivot for the team, but given how difficult early chapters have been, I'm guessing it's something you'll be grateful for. The above post is pure conjecture, since I don't actually have the game. "Training other units" simply doesn't work in Lunatic, since the enemies are prohibitively strong. Like cheetah, I only fielded Krom and MU past Ch.13, once Nosferatu became purchasable. Edited June 14, 2012 by Westbrick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 "Training other units" simply doesn't work in Lunatic, since the enemies are prohibitively strong. Like cheetah, I only fielded Krom and MU past Ch.13, once Nosferatu became purchasable. Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but if this is true, what on earth is your plan for beating Lunatic +? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othin Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 I've been training a full team on my Lunatic run without Nosferatu. Starting condition is hugely important here: characters that can't keep up through a quick promotion just fall behind. Of course, Frederick and Libera don't need promotions at all, and are fantastic because of that. Granted, I haven't yet beaten Ch14 after spending much of today on it. So I can't really claim to have made any progress into the Nosferatu-available half of the game without it, either. I got really close at one point, but I screwed up my formation when I tried to have MU use Rainbow Cry and couldn't rearrange my defensive line. I do think Rainbow Cry will help once he learns it in this map and can get to situations where he can use it more practically to help characters competently fight the enemies for once. Also, getting that skill means I can make him a Dark Knight afterward, and the mobility will help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No. 3 Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 There is a reliable way to beat Chapter 2 on Lunatic, but on Lunatic+ you'll need retries to get past unlucky skill combinations. Make sure at the start of the map Frederick is already carrying the Bronze Sword and at least an Elixir (a Vulnerary would be good too) - i.e. you traded them in the previous chapters. There is some leeway for trading on the first turn, but preferably you want him to be already carrying everything he needs. Most important thing is to kill the Mercenary to the north in one turn. If Frederick has gained at least two points in STR, he can OHKO it by doubling with Vake. Otherwise, double with Krom/MU and hope for a Dual Attack. For AI purposes, make sure you attack from the right of the Mercenary. Then move Liz as far to the left as you can. This will put her in the range of the Barbarian. Evacuate all your other units to the left as well, blocking the Barbarian's path to Liz with units that can survive one round against it. In the best case scenario, the single Barbarian will charge down to your units at the bottom left, while the rest will go after Frederick. If Frederick survives the first enemy phase (this is where the resetting is on Lunatic+), usually you're set. Finish off the Barbarian on the bottom left with the units you moved there. Move Frederick up to the fortress (or the forest if his path is blocked), switch to the Bronze Sword, and heal up. From now on Frederick will be dispatching enemies with counterattacks and healing up on the player turn. You can bait some of them with the bottom units to try and spread out the EXP, but only do it one at a time. The top half of the map all moves at once, so you'll have to charge in with Frederick and slowly pull back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheetah7071 Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 What cheetah ended up with is exactly what I ended up with: only Krom and MU got any real experience, MU was maxed out, and Krom was "pretty good." Although his Krom actually seems quite a bit better, I still managed to get through Lunatic without too much trouble. Speed potion's necessary, and using a strength potion on Krom is a pretty good idea as well. I poured all my late game promotion items into Krom, thinking that the final boss strategy might be to get him to beklow half then reset until aether procs. That didn't end up working, but it's not like anyone else needed the stat boosters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westbrick Posted June 14, 2012 Author Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) ~Chapter 2: Everyone's Dead Edition~ Guess what? Everyone's dead. ...Well, okay, not quite everyone. Krom, Mia, Frederick, Soiree (Freddy's double partner), and Liz all survived, and Vyke would have made it out had it not been for a late-round miss. I tried dozens of times, but neither the wall-off nor the right-side strategies did much for me, so I ended up executing Operation Sacrificial Lamb. To great success minus the unprecedented casualties! To honor my fallen comrades, I decided to try something novel: good ol' fashioned boss abuse. See that, Lunatic+? I can cheat too, you asshole. Took me over 100 extra turns, but I managed to whittle away his ranged axe weapon. But of course, the weaponless bandit was too stubborn to make his way back to a fortress tile; in fact, once his weapon ran out, he was totally stationary. So I blew over a hundred turns just to get Krom about 75 extra experience. How appropriate. I hate this game. TOTAL TURN COUNT Prologue -> 27 [7 restarts] Chapter 1 -> 7 [38 restarts] Chapter 2 -> 118 [62 restarts] Edited June 14, 2012 by Westbrick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westbrick Posted June 21, 2012 Author Share Posted June 21, 2012 ~Chapter 3: lol Counter~ Quick pre-chapter update: I decided that it was unfair, even on Lunatic+, to have any kind of boss abuse. Thankfully, I saved a copied Lunatic+ file from Chapter 2, so I went back and completed that nightmare again. Surprisingly, once you know you're going down the sacrificial lamb route, it's not too terribly difficult, and I got through on my fifth try. And managed to keep Vyke alive, to boot! Anyway, moving on to Chapter 3. I had very high hopes for this chapter. Relatively small map, divided into two distinct halves (and you can attack the upper half at your leisure), and most importantly, you recruit Callum aka a walking +5 defensive boost. Unfortunately, it seems like the real brunt force of Lunatic+ has just started up. Chapter 3 marks the introduction of three new skills in Counter, Holy Shield, and Great Shield. The latter two reduce damage done by magic and physical attacks, respectively, by half, which is frustrating but not particularly difficult to overcome. It's Counter that's the real problem. For those who don't know what Counter does: if any unit deals a non-lethal blow to any enemy unit with Counter at one range, that damage is then automatically returned to the attacker. What this translates into is Frederick, doubled with Callum, getting 28 damage done to him by attacking a defenseless archer with a Silver lance. Yeah... this is going to take a while. Although Ch.3 is clearly a "restart 'til the skills line up" kind of chapter, I still haven't found a way to reliably take down both the left and right battalions. Strategies and prayers welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Mercenary Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 If I read right, you lost Miriel and Viole? The best way to counter Counter is with 2+ range so it doesn't backfire, meaning MU's magic and any other thing that's ranged that you have would be good. Bait them with an unequipped or weak but defensive character, then use 2-range and finish off with anyone else. I don't recall, but can you access shops by this point (after ch. 2) or just unit selection? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westbrick Posted June 21, 2012 Author Share Posted June 21, 2012 Unfortunately, each enemy battalion is comprised of two archers, a knight, and a soldier, and the biggest problem is the archers; even were Viole or Miriel alive, they wouldn't be able to contribute much before biting the dust. And no, shops don't open up until after Chapter 4 IIRC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othin Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Can't you get to shops after Ch3? Either way, not much help here. And I thought one of the teams had just one Archer. But that's still one too many even without Counter to make them impossible to fight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Mercenary Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 A best-case scenario seems to be archers without Counter or a Shield. Attack the 3 characters closest to you on the left side and hope the archer out of your reach (the one guarding the passage to the gate) can't kill anyone.* Then use the 2nd turn to finish the archer and arrange a formation against the right side. That is assuming there are 4 enemies on the left side in the same formations as normal Lunatic. *If it's the same formation, the only way to reach is by doubling MU to Frederick (selected at top left), move him to 2-range of the archer, switch with MU and attack. The archer probably has 12+ speed so it's easier said than done, but this is just a blindfolded suggestion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arvilino Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 What I did was depending on how the skills line up, you get Cullum to Frederick while at the same time getting Krom across to in range of the Knight on the right hand side if it doesn't have Luna or Counter, then having Vake double with him. Frederick!Cullum moves so that he gets attacked by every enemy on the Left hand side on turn 1 with Frederick wielding wielding the Javelin, attacking the Soldier first which took off more than half of it's health(if it doesn't have great shield+) so even if it had counter it can't activate. Everyone else should position themselves so they can attack and finish off the enemies on the left on turn 2(might be tough if you're missing Viole and Miriel). Best case scenario is Krom is able to kill the Knight on Turn 1 enemy phase and the left hand side is cleared by the end of the turn 2 player phase. Next is another tough part, depending on how many enemies remaining on the right side(4 if Krom Crits the knight or Vake Dual attacked it both times) have Counter and/or Luna I had Frederick!(Cullum or Sumia) to charge unequipped(with the remaining Elixer and a Vulneary) past the enemies in a way that you lure a couple to the right side and a couple(one at a time) to the left and have everyone else deal with one. The rest isn't too difficult once you've dealt with those first two groups of enemies, just watch out for the Hammer Fighter since it may have absolute hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No. 3 Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) Have Krom talk to Callum and Double with him after talking. Move Callum next to Frederick and pass him a Javelin and Krom. Attack either the archer/soldier in the left group using the Javelin. Keep everyone else out of range but as close as possible so they can mop up the remaining enemies on the second turn. The casualties you suffered in the last chapter are probably going to bite you in the arse hard, here. With no casualties you have just enough firepower to clean up all the enemies on the left side. Next you need to intercept the enemies on the right, position Frederick so he's just in range (he should be able to take on an archer + another unit), and repeat, pulling back each turn. You should be able to weaken the enemies enough to finish them off with a concerted attack by the time they chase you to the left side. If you're having trouble with insufficient firepower because of the casualties, it might be helpful to get creative with partner swaps. For example, Liz can't attack, but if you move her next to Frederick and pull Krom off him, switch and attack, it's as if she got a turn to attack. Also worth a mention - an amusing alternative strategy is to not talk to Callum and instead use him as an invisible shield that you can pass through but the enemies can't. Though you'll probably get sandwiched anyway, and getting the Javelin on the first turn is much more important. Edited June 21, 2012 by No. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othin Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) Do the enemies ignore Callum or something? That's interesting, but doesn't seem too practical. Edited June 21, 2012 by Othin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No. 3 Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Yeah, they don't notice attack him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othin Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Ahh Callum, the stealth master. ...Do they notice him after you recruit him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No. 3 Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 They'll attack him as normal if you recruit him. And it's definitely an intentional joke, since enemies attack every other neutral unit in the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ike of Paris Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 This sounds hellish. Has anyone ever beaten this mode without losing anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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