Draftplay Strategy Discussion (and related)

[PKL]

Talking from experience, I've gotten the Whip in 9 turns. I had a bad Eirika so rushing it wasnt really an option either. Trust me, Chapter 9 is so slow with a not promoted Vanessa, that you will regret it. It makes a huge difference in firepower, whether its 9 str or whatever, since she can actually survive an EP with a javelin equipped. + the move helps.

[Espinosa]

I had to give my Dracoshield to survive C8 so Vanessa currently has 11 defence unpromoted. I think she can already survive some blows. Still 7 strength at 11/0 sadly, but 19 speed means she can double with Steel Lance (and Killer Lance for faster enemy types).

Lute, meanwhile, had more luck with her level-ups, and as of 10/0 has 14 mag, 15 spd... Wow. I think dropping her in the forest south might not be a bad idea for C9 - she can really dodgetank and this is by far the best 1-2 range on my team. Kinda regret not taking that extra turn for the Guiding Ring because she might as well start building staff rank with those combat stats.

Part of me agrees that promoted Vanessa makes a difference short-term but part of me also wants to test the opposite and see what happens. Let's see how much a 6-turn of C8 punishes me later. C14 will probably go much slower unless I somehow have a Paladin Amelia, and even then not having an extra 8-move unit will slow me down.

Silver Lance access also kinda compensates for Vanessa's low strength (if promoted).

[PKL]

Exactly @ the Silver Lance access. I suggest testing both ways out and see what happens. Your combat will suck for a good while with unpromoted fliers lol.

Edited July 8, 2013 by PKL

[charlie_]

forget warping 10/1 lute would probably be your most solid combat unit at this point

[Espinosa]

She pretty much already is... I could even robe her so that she can engage more enemies in the southern portion of the map because all her durability comes from high avoid (well, that and 10 res to tank the shaman guys who are more likely to connect). Stacking resources on Vanessa isn't a bad idea but Vanessa is 1.5 behind her average strength stat, which isn't a whole lot, but when you're LTCing you want higher stats not lower. Eirika still remains fragile with 22/6/5 defences so I think I'll be double-warping C16 because I doubt she'll be able to take a hit.

Amelia is joining with a Speedwings next chapter... I think she might as well eat it after her Tower training, because upon some thinking I found out nobody is particularly slow in an all-female run!

[Hawk King]

I just realized how few female units there are in this game.

Looking at my drafts with Nessie, I was able to 7 turn Chapter 8 while obtaining the whip, but that was with a GK!Gilliam. With Garcia It was a 9 turn.

If it takes too many turns to break the wall, you can fly around it over the water. If you can get Nessie to bring Lute along with her, a 9 or 10 turn clear seems possible. 11 turns is a worst case scenario. Either way the whip is worth the turns.

The Chapter 5 Guiding ring is never worth the turn imo. You have plenty or time to reach A staff rank with the Chapter 10 Guiding ring.

Make sure Lute goes Sage. The extra warp range can potentially save 2 turns, and you only need 3 mounts for LTCing. Plus, Sage is better in the dessert.

You only need one 8 move unit and two 7 move units for Chapter 14. Getting Amelia to Paladin shouldn't be a concern.

[Espinosa]

FE8 is actually the perfect FE game for an all female run, I think. You have a female lord, and the girls just keep joining, though not exactly in abundance. Compared with HHM or FE6, you have a big cast to work with.

I dunno if I'm mathfailing but assuming somebody from the west (Eph and his cavs; not sure how realistic it is to assume they can travel all the way north as I normally 5-turn this map) can open the chest once Vanessa opens the door, I can 8-turn the map with the whip. But I completely forgot that there's water there! It's not a bad idea to try it out, because I think an 8-move flier can really change stuff, especially with 23+ atk with a Silver Lance.

Sage's mag cap allows for +3 warp range in an ideal world, and I think Lute's not unlikely to get there so the point of move could be sacrificed (I went with Sage for Artur on my last Ephraim route full party LTC too). Natasha's already at C staves, but I have a feeling she might never get to promote until she starts using Warp.

[General Horace]

natasha is a really underwhelming warper

she just can't get exp, and unlike moulder who you can at least feed levels in monsterland once he promotes, she's likely going to miss that and be a sad panda.

[Espinosa]

Yeah, Natasha has a pretty big disadvantage compared to Moulder. Still an essential character on this run because healing actually matters for units besides the healer himself.

I'm still back to re-figuring out C8 but it seems to me I can obtain the whip within 7 turns? The strat integrates all of Ephraim, Kyle and Forde pushing north as quickly as possible (not too hard actually) because they have the Chest Key and there's no way to pass it to the other side quickly. Didn't expect such an outcome - just 1 turn spent to obtain the whip.

Vanessa got a str level up too! Lute got less lucky this time around (though still blessed all around).

[Hawk King]

But it's supposed to be ladies only! Haha.

Im curious to see what kind of TCs you can get with Nessie and Tana. Specifically Chapters 9 and 12.

[PKL]

Hmm, I might draft Kyle for that whenever I get Nessie if I do another FE8 draft. If kyle and eph can help get the whip that early, thats amazing.

[ZemZem]

Kyle and Vanessa together is a really good combination.

[Espinosa]

C8 7-turned as expected. Vanessa brought the Door Key, and Eph's cavalry opened the chest with the whip. I had to rely on Ephraim to 2HKO the enemies in the way (choking my points) while Kyle and Forde just rescuedropped him in front of themselves every turn after turn 3 or so. With just one of Kyle/Forde, it's harder to pull off, but you always have the Killer Lance so that's an option.

With the exception of 5x and 8, male units haven't made a single action in this run. After all, it's impossible to keep them away from combat in C8 (first the Archer aggros, then you get the cav reinforcements).

Here are my stats at the end of C8:

edit: slight typo; Vanessa has 21 HP not 29. Though she probably wants the Robe anyway?

8 strength is a bit too low I guess, with no Energy Ring to fix that for a while. Silver Lance (will reach soon if I promote right now)/Killer Lance do give her an acceptable level of offence but I can't help but fear promoting her early will make her suck after a few chapters unless she keeps proccing strength from here.

You can tell Lute had a lot of fun in C8.

Any idea how many turns recruiting Marisa could take? I'm making it a point to recruit every single female unit.

Also still thinking about the best promotion for Lute. I can see how mount + extra move could be useful in some situations, like the C11 rout. The desert makes a Sage appealing, even though I do have two fliers for that map who can carry somebody to do the fighting (this is why Seth is the best performing unit even in the desert). The difference in maximum warp range is pretty huge, but it's hard to say if it shaves off more turns than MK's extra move does. It's just one point though, probably not worth it... Finally, I guess light magic is a way to get some easier crits in a hard situation.

Edited July 9, 2013 by Espinosa

[ZemZem]

Recruiting Marisa would cost you quite a bit of turns that she doesn't make up for in the process. You can typically three or four turn C10, but recruiting Marisa would require you to recruit Innes, who would recruit Gerik, who then would have to go to the bottom of the map to get Marisa.

I suppose Tana would go get Innes, and then ferry Gerik to Marisa, or something. But Tana's pretty fragile then, and she couldn't assist Eirika and Vanessa.

[General Horace]

if you use Gerik she's recruitable somewhat quickly, since you have two fliers you can get her to aggro early too

she's still useless and turncosting though

Edited July 9, 2013 by General Horace

[Espinosa]

Marisa's offence with the Shamshir doesn't look too shabby, and in a team as small as mine it's never bad to have an additional combat unit. She could probably go Assassin and I can see how Silencer could be useful in some situations. But yeah, it's definitely a bad idea if Marisa starts eating up, say, Tana's or Amelia's experience, preventing them from reaching a high level of competence early.

edit: the costing turns thing isn't an issue because I'm recruiting every girl period. And even then you never know how quickly Tana and Gerik reach her. Vanessa and Eirika will probably 3-turn; we'll see. I'm too used to having Seth for this map.

An extra 6-move unit to kill eggs in C18 is always good too.

Edited July 9, 2013 by Espinosa

[Hawk King]

Wow, Nessie is only at LV 10? In my last draft, I had her at LV 17 or 18 after Chapter 8.

Chapter 10 can actually be 2 turned with a tough Eirika and a critical hit if you sacrifice Tana.

Mounted Lute wont make a difference in Chapter 12 since your flyers can cross the mountains faster. Besides, you want her glued to Tethys so she can get her staff rank up. Speaking of which, youre gonna want to kill the Chapter 10 boss ASAP so Lute can promote and get a jump on building her staff rank while youre recruiting Marisa.

[Espinosa]

Her str took forever to grow so I couldn't exactly throw her into a bunch of enemies and expect her level to snowball via ORKOing. With +3 str or so over average, I imagine she could've really absorbed a lot of exp. The difference might also have something to do with how many other units drafted and the number of turns taken (you can look at the OP for that). I don't know.

Work on C9 looks tough, promoted Vanessa (ORKOs a whopping ONE archer) or not. I think I might leave the Dracoshield village alone and let it get destroyed because Tana can't reach it like she normally does (not enough units in the north) and Vanessa is really needed because 39 avo alone does not Lute a durable fighter make. She one-round KOs even the Mercs after getting one speed proc though, but taking damage is a problem. Sage!Lute would be so much more self-sufficient here.

[Hawk King]

Typical Nessie strategies involve her making a B-line for the draco village and then doubling back to the boss for a 9 turn clear and 85% of the enemies being killed by her.

With your low STR though, thats not gonna work.

Try exploring a strategy where she gets a couple LV ups and then promotes mid-chapter. The lack of stats might come back to bite you in the ass otherwise.

[charlie_]

Too late and kind of not relevant because you're doing girls only, but eh. A sethless 3 turn of Chapter 5 is possible, if you shuffle Vanessa an extra square forward turn 1 (done with Colm and Franz) so she can canto away from Saar after dropping Eirika. It's pretty dangerous though, but I managed to get Joshua and the lower two villages while doing it.

[Espinosa]

Good discovery but yeah, only girls can touch other girls in this run.

[Espinosa]

Quick question: does Myrrh really need 18 str to 4HKO Lyon (1 crit) - or - 12 str to 6HKO (2 crits, probably not happening without rigging). I don't think Myrrh is capable of surviving an enemy phase to 2RKO.

The best way to ORKO would probably be using a high-levelled WK with a decent Pierce chance. Or something like a good Garm wielder (tough to find in a full party run).

I guess nothing can really sponge Naglfars casually, though.

[Hawk King]

Myrhh needs 19 STR to 4HKO Lyon. She is 1 damage short with 18 STR iirc.

[General Horace]

Lyon's defence fluctuates, but I'm too lazy to actually look up the more common number.