If FE4 was released internationally, what would be end of CH. 5's impact on gaming?

[amadeuscho]

(spoilers ahead)

Do you think FE4 would have had a major impact on gaming due to the events of Battle of Belhalla at the end of Chapter 5? I don't know of any game within the 16 bit and 8 bit eras that basically killed of the many of its leading protagonists (including the main one).

Although FE isn't that big a series, I still think it could have been held up high due to the fact that FE4 would also be on lists as one of the SNES's best games. The death of Aeris was a landmark moment for gaming, and I think this event could have been too.

What does everyone else think?

Edited August 27, 2013 by jaytalks

[Tables]

I don't think it'd have had a particularly huge impact. Most likely, the story would have gotten mangled during translation (making Diedre and Arvis cousins to avoid incest, most likely, among other things), but asides from that, I think the games relative obscurity would have prevented it being as impactful as, say, FF games were.

Edited August 27, 2013 by Tables

[Integrity]

I assume by "gaming" you mean the industry at large?

FE4 would probably have essentially nil impact.

[Nobody]

It would have bombed really hard, we wouldn't have gotten FE7 and FE would be locked in Japan forever.

[NinjaMonkey]

It would have bombed really hard, we wouldn't have gotten FE7 and FE would be locked in Japan forever.

And you are basing that on, what, exactly?

[Klokinator]

Considering the terribly boring badly paced nature of its gameplay and the horribly bloated maps I'd say it wouldn't have been all that popular. The story's probably good but that gameplay sucks ass.

[Nobody]

The only reason FE7 was so popular in the west was because marth and roy were on SSBM, which gave the game free publicity, thats actually the reason nintendo decided to localize it. And lets be honesty, Fe4 isnt exactly a game with mainstream appeal, especially when compared to fe7. The maps are too big for the average player.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

"FE4 has incest so it has deep story and gameplay!"

Is this the ussual overrated Jugdral arguments again?

[ZemZem]

The only mentions of Eldigan/Raquesis were from that one village chick in C2 (BUT DERP IT WAS A RUMOR) and in Ares and Nanna's lover conversation in the final chapter, but that was rather subtle (correct me if I'm wrong), and that seems to be the main driving point for many fans in regards to FE4 incest.

Edited August 27, 2013 by ZMeister

[Integrity]

I'm pretty sure the referenced was Arvis/Deirdre, ZM. You know, the story stuff.

[amadeuscho]

I'm not sure about its popularity and that really wasn't what I was asking about it. The game could have been made easier as just about every other Fire Emblem title has been made. And for sure the incest stuff would have been cut out, so I don't think that's what anyone would have been discussing. And for those saying that FE7 was only popular because Marth and Roy, FE8 sold well too.

In terms how it would have been critically received well. I have no doubt it would have ranked well on top SNES lists. You just have to look at how it does on Super Famicom lists in Japan.

I was just specifically referring to the plot point where all the protagonists essentially die or have their fates become unknown, especially Sigurd. If I was playing that as a kid, I think that would have been a remarkable moment for me. I don't recall any other game essentially killing off most of the protagonists with no way of bringing them back.

[ZemZem]

I'm pretty sure the referenced was Arvis/Deirdre, ZM. You know, the story stuff.

Welp, my mistake.

[Integrity]

In terms how it would have been critically received well. I have no doubt it would have ranked well on top SNES lists. You just have to look at how it does on Super Famicom lists in Japan.

Vastly different cultures. Things we (westerners) love and things they love don't always overlap.

that really wasn't what I was asking about it.

What were you asking, though? What kind of impact do you think FE4 would have slash have had on the market at large? I define impact in this case as influence on future generations (huh huh get it fe4 etc), and I don't think FE4's international release would have changed much of anything even in the incredibly niche SRPG market, let alone in the industry overall.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

"In terms how it would have been critically received well. I have no doubt it would have ranked well on top SNES lists. You just have to look at how it does on Super Famicom lists in Japan."

I am pretty sure back in the day FE4 got relatively low(er) score on Famitsu

Its not as huge as FE3, but nothing is

"I don't recall any other game essentially killing off most of the protagonists with no way of bringing them back."

This one is actually arguable >_>

Edited August 27, 2013 by JSND

[NinjaMonkey]

And lets be honesty, Fe4 isnt exactly a game with mainstream appeal, especially when compared to fe7. The maps are too big for the average player.

So how does that mean that FE would be "locked in Japan forever"?

[Integrity]

So how does that mean that FE would be "locked in Japan forever"?

If IS's first foray with FE into a Western market had been a flop, there's reason to doubt that they'd have tried to localize a sequel. That's just common business sense. :P

EDIT: Before any knickers are twisted into bunches, by "flop" I mean if it had lacked enough mainstream appeal to sell well enough to justify the cost of sending more FEs overseas. I don't mean it was terrible, and I don't mean "what if the translation ruined it." Pure money.

Edited August 27, 2013 by Integrity

[CT075]

i am about 95% certain that fe4 being localised wouldn't have had any impact at all because it's fire emblem

nobody cares about fire emblem

[amadeuscho]

"In terms how it would have been critically received well. I have no doubt it would have ranked well on top SNES lists. You just have to look at how it does on Super Famicom lists in Japan."

I am pretty sure back in the day FE4 got relatively low(er) score on Famitsu

Its not as huge as FE3, but nothing is

"I don't recall any other game essentially killing off most of the protagonists with no way of bringing them back."

This one is actually arguable >_>

The bottom point was the reason I started the thread. I should have made that more clear.

In terms of game impact, I would look beyond sales. Look at how Earthbound did (and was received) but with time its influence and tone is undeniable. I'm saying that the death of the main characters in chapter 5 would have had an impact on gaming.

One bad release doesn't ban a series forever. Just look at FE 11 and then how we got FE 13 still. Dragon Quest stop being released in the US with the SNES, but eventually made it back. The Tales series is another example. You also have to consider the fact that FE7 was designed specifically for Western audiences.

The release of SSBM with Roy and Marth could have still led to another international release, especially if a game was specifically designed for Western audiences (like FE7 was)

[Integrity]

One bad release doesn't ban a series forever.

No no no, the *first* release being bad tends to discourage future releases. That's a MASSIVE difference from one bad release.

Also, didn't FE11 sell well?

Look at how Earthbound did (and was received) but with time its influence and tone is undeniable.

I've never played Earthbound, could you actually tell me how grandly it influenced future gaming?

[Nobody]

I'm not sure about its popularity and that really wasn't what I was asking about it. The game could have been made easier as just about every other Fire Emblem title has been made. And for sure the incest stuff would have been cut out, so I don't think that's what anyone would have been discussing. And for those saying that FE7 was only popular because Marth and Roy, FE8 sold well too.

Fe8 was successful because people already knew about the series. As simple as that.

And, as Integrity said, if fe4 had bombed, IS wouldn't have any monetary reason to localize FE7

Edited August 27, 2013 by Nobody

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

FE11 sells 250k in US

And I am pretty sure even SF has a topic that stated that SD does very well in the market, but I can't find it >_>

I don't know where people get the idea that FE11 is a "bad release"

Its not

EDIT: The closest the series got to a "bad release' was FE9 and FE10

Edited August 27, 2013 by JSND

[amadeuscho]

Fe8 was successful because people already knew about the series. As simple as that.

And, as Integrity said, if fe4 had bombed, IS wouldn't have any monetary reason to localize FE7

IS does not make monetary decisions. It's the larger company of Nintendo. So if Nintendo saw renewed interest for a series due to a few character in Smash (who would not have been featured in FE4), it's perfectly reasonable they could give the series another chance. Namco flips back and forth all the time with the Tales series.

But I think I'll change the topic title because I really wanted to talk about the Battle of Belhalla.

[Integrity]

IS does not make monetary decisions. It's the larger company of Nintendo.

Okay, go back to his post and cut/paste IS with Nintendo. If Nintendo doesn't see a market, Nintendo won't release for a market.

EDIT: I'm not saying it's a guaranteed thing that had FE4 been released and flopped, we'd have no more FE. I'm saying that's a logical conclusion, certainly not the only possibility.

Also could you go back and answer my thing about Earthbound pls?

Edited August 27, 2013 by Integrity

[Nobody]

Well, was FF6 released before or after FE4? Because they did basically the same thing, with the villain winning the first half of the game. Except in FF6 you discover later that every usable character survived.

[amadeuscho]

Vastly different cultures. Things we (westerners) love and things they love don't always overlap.

What were you asking, though? What kind of impact do you think FE4 would have slash have had on the market at large? I define impact in this case as influence on future generations (huh huh get it fe4 etc), and I don't think FE4's international release would have changed much of anything even in the incredibly niche SRPG market, let alone in the industry overall.

I was asking about killing all the main characters.

No no no, the *first* release being bad tends to discourage future releases. That's a MASSIVE difference from one bad release.

Also, didn't FE11 sell well?

I've never played Earthbound, could you actually tell me how grandly it influenced future gaming?

I think it's humor and approach were definitely influential. It's a parody of the RPG genre, because it does not use a steampunk or medieval setting. And things like status' effect were being turned stoned, but rather things like loneliness. As far as classic games go, it is very well remember for its humor and parody elements as well as gameplay.

Well, was FF6 released before or after FE4? Because they did basically the same thing, with the villain winning the first half of the game. Except in FF6 you discover later that every usable character survived.

It was released after, but the except part is the big difference. It's not basically the same thing because Sigurd (your main protagonist) actually dies. There is no prior game I know of where the main protagonist fails in such a public way (along with the rest of the group).