Dating sim?

[Aquakat]

You were just cherry picking a single class design of a very specific game in a series consisting of 12 games.

The closest other designs would probably be the FE8 dancer and the TRS dancer if we count those.

Though, personally I usually don't get upset over a single sexualized design. In cases like that I can justify it as being in.character. Not to mention that dancers aren't fighters.

If it comes to wearing nothing but underwear and a few accessories, Awakening by itself already got the Dark Mage, Sorceress (What is this thing even supposed to be?), Manakete and Tanguel class.

And in addition Awakening features tons of designs which run around with their panties very wide in the open and where even the shortest mini skirt would be an improvement.

On the drop of my head, I can recall the Dancer, Cavalier, Great Knight, Paladin, Falcon Knight and Dark Knight.

Then of course, we got several examples of classes on the level of FE7 Sonia. (Of course, in her case it shows only up in the artwork.)

The Assassin, the Archer, the Thief, Wyvern Knight, Tiki's custom model and Aversa's (totally worse but whatever).

Mind you, I have always been irritated by the obsession of the art direction with bare female legs in the art of Fire Emblem.

But this isn't a binary issue. These things have gotten worse. A lot.

It also ignores that the old games used to have cool shit like female characters using the very same armor as their male comrades. Even without the obligatory addition of breast plates.

I might be missing something, but...

if you're so irritated by it, then why are you on a forum about the game? I've seen nothing but contempt from you about it, so I'm very curious.

[Silver Lightning]

Actually, it's Myhrr. I know this because of the last unique stanza in the Christmas carol "We Three Kings."

Myhrr is mine, its bitter perfume

Breathes a life of gathering gloom

Sorrowing, sighing, bleeding, dying

Sealed in a stone-cold tomb

I've read the lyrics several times before so I could memorize them, as imo, it's a beautiful melody. :D

Anyway, that dancer outfit on that black-haired girl is just the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen. I know dancer outfits are typically a little revealing, but this is just ugh. :/

Er, I know your correct about the object Myhrr, but if its the spelling of the character's name, I do believe it is supposed to be Myrrh; at least, that's how the localization spells this. If that wasn't what the previous comments were referring to, my apologies.

And I've never actually seen Laylea's official art until now.....but I was pretty sure that Leen or at least Sylvia had more on, even though they're dancers (or maybe I'm only remembering Sylvia's depiction in the O-sawa manga....).

[BrightBow]

I might be missing something, but...

if you're so irritated by it, then why are you on a forum about the game? I've seen nothing but contempt from you about it, so I'm very curious.

If it's because the entire board, it's because Fire Emblem is my favorite video game series.

About this sub forum, that's where most of the talking is happening since it is the most actual game. I tried starting a few threads about Tear Ring Saga but nothing is going on there.

Also, I would like to claim that when a person experiences a piece of media that left a strong impression on him/her, there is the desire to talk about it. Whether the impression is good or bad.

And in my case it happens to be extremely bad.

Though I wish this topic was staying on rails. Maybe I am too tired to notice but I could bet that until my above post I was merely talking about characterization matching that of the usual 8/15 Dating Sim cast.

Personality has nothing to do with wardrobe.

Edited September 27, 2013 by BrightBow

[Loki Laufeyson]

Also, the idea that woman should dress "decently" is actually a sexist act. People who defend gender equality believe that a woman can dress the way they want whenever they want. Thinking "those women dress with small clothes, they're sexualised" is a sexist way of thinking, when you don't do the same for the male characters (hello bersekers and sorcerers)

Thank you.

The amount of double standard displayed in this thread makes me angry. "Lets all bitch about the girls while the boys have just as much fan service. Im so going to ignore that though!"

Actually most of the female mounted class models have battle panties it's pretty awful as if the miniskirts weren't bad enough already

Also introduction of the god-awful boob-plate into designs (peg knight armor) The series had such a good run without them it's a massive step back

Also what the fuck is even Nowi's outfit

Tiki's honestly the least of my concerns I'm more concerned about wearing this heavy suit or armor and can't even get some pants to cover my butt?

You are more concerned about the practicality of the outfits/armor than sexualization though. Cuz lets be honest, in real life scenarios, Battle Panties cant happen. But since everyone seems to be so impractical in various different ways in design/class look, i just kinda go "welp."

As for this game being a dating sim, not quite. We do have some mild elements of that but it doesnt veer really too far into dating sim territory.

[Thor Odinson]

The berserker thing is honestly a male power fanatasy thing than a sexualisation thing because if they were really trying to sexualise them they would need to have much more attractive faces and have body types closer to Chris Evans and Chris Hemsworth instead of dude on steroids

It's a false equivalency

You also can't equate how women dress in real life to designs that people decide to put on female characters. Women in real life have their own agency. They choose what they want to wear for their own reasons and that's their power to do so. It's their choice to make and none of our place to judge. However, fictional characters don't get to choose their wardrobes. They have to hope for the artist being able to design their outfit in accordance to what they'd wear in character, and sometimes it just doesn't happen. Add on the fact that the majority of the artists in the industry are men, and sometimes even if the artist wants to design a character in a non-sexualised manner, they don't get that say because the higher ups want more skin shown. This is why when I generally complain about designs I complain about the class designs instead of the individual character design, because the kozaki basically got thrown some class designs and was told to design off that, not to mention all the battle panties on the female classes I've talked about do not have an equivalency in their male counterparts (seriously if you're going to make some sexualised designs throw us some Frederick manbutt). It's not about sexy automatically equals bad. Sexualisation is what happens when sexy happens for the sake of sexy with little regard to what the character would actually wear. And that's the problem.

If a female character who happens to know she's got it going on and wants to flaunt her stuff, by all means, design her sexy. It's in character for her and that's more power to her. Conversely, if a character who doesn't particularly care about stuff like that and takes herself seriously as a warrior at the same time, then I expect to see practical-looking battle gear. And practical != unstylish or unfeminine (nor does it have to be one way or the other), either. A good designer should be able to design practical clothing that still look stylish as fuck if the character in question requires both.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Ezio Auditore da Firenze

[Redwall]

Damn it all, Lumi beat me to it

[Loki Laufeyson]

The berserker thing is honestly a male power fanatasy thing than a sexualisation thing because if they were really trying to sexualise them they would need to have much more attractive faces and have body types closer to Chris Evans and Chris Hemsworth instead of dude on steroids

It's a false equivalency

Explain the Sorcerers. They dont look like roid rage. The male alternate costumes in DLC chapters also come to mind.

Yeah thats a thing.

While i agree that we should see more Frederick butt and stuff, there is sexualization of dudes going on...

[Thor Odinson]

Some, but paltry compared to all the battle panties. And that's why I didn't mention the Sorcs of either gender in any of my criticisms (other than I still can't figure out how the femsorc outfit even stays on). They don't bother me other from the aesthetic preference of I really don't like body-stockings or stockings in general. The beach DLC is also intentionally full-on fanservice mode, no holds-barred. Doesn't really make sense to factor it into the discussion of the main game.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Ezio Auditore da Firenze

[Florete]

Am I the only person who never even noticed these "battle panties"?

[RJWalker]

Yes. Okay no, but you're a minority. The battle panties are a VERY valid complaint.

[Loki Laufeyson]

Am I the only person who never even noticed these "battle panties"?

Probably. Wyvern Lord, Dark Knight, Griffon Rider (i think...) have a lot of Battle Panties. One time, i had Fem Avatar as a DK and the cutscenes...wow.

Some, but paltry compared to all the battle panties.

I concede.

[Thor Odinson]

I play GK MU. Every time I finish Grima I'm treated to a face full of butt and not even turning the animation off saves me from that one. No way I don't notice.

I fucking love butts, but there is a time and place for butts and finishing off this evil dragon while wearing a heavy suit of armor is not one of them.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Ezio Auditore da Firenze

[Nobody]

Am I the only person who never even noticed these "battle panties"?

No, you're not. I haven't noticed them either. That said, I play with the animations turned off.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Nobody

[Loki Laufeyson]

I play GK MU. Every time I finish Grima I'm treated to a face full of butt and not even turning the animation off saves me from that one. No way I don't notice.

I fucking love butts, but there is a time and place for butts and finishing off this evil dragon while wearing a heavy suit of armor is not one of them.

lol!!! I cant say ive noticed GK butts. I tried googling but i couldnt find a good shot of GK Fem Butt.

[Thor Odinson]

I don't particularly feel like booting up the 3ds and my good camera atm so have the artbook drawing

http://images.wikia.com/fireemblem/images/3/39/Great_Knight_Female.jpg

But I guess if I get any less lazy I may just take a picture of my MU offing Grima with all her butt-in-face glory

[General Banzai]

Am I the only person who never even noticed these "battle panties"?

I never noticed

unrelated:

as someone has been part of this fandom for seven years, up until awakening's release the people playing FE were overwhelmingly male, since then there has been a huge influx of female players. Awakening was very heavily geared toward a female audience in a way no FE beforehand was. This isn't simply through "male sexualization" but rather a whole host of game design practices that got implemented here that really tore Awakening away from the stats-n-tats formula of the series beforehand

I highly doubt the drawing in of chicks to the audience wasn't some unforeseen outcome on the part of IS as it coincides heavily with a broader Ninty gameplan that they've implemented since 2006 or so, we've already seen that Nintendo bigwigs had a big hand in the development process of FE13 from the interviews and what the lead designers have hinted about their heads being on the chopping block

They deliberately planned this game to appeal to a wider audience including females and thus to claim that they just went a route of female sexualization is ridonk, especially when combined with a flippant handwaving of male sexualization as "male power fantasy"

[Florete]

I didn't see any on GK Lucina, her armor largely covered it. Didn't see any on Griffon Aversa because of the Griffon's wings. Did see it on Wyvern Lord Panne.

I don't want to say it's not a valid point to make, but it makes me wonder how so many people even noticed this in the first place. I only noticed it when I was specifically looking for it, and I always play with animations on.

[Loki Laufeyson]

I don't particularly feel like booting up the 3ds and my good camera atm so have the artbook drawing

http://images.wikia.com/fireemblem/images/3/39/Great_Knight_Female.jpg

But I guess if I get any less lazy I may just take a picture of my MU offing Grima with all her butt-in-face glory

Oh i did see that pic but i thought the white part was part of the armor. O_o

but it makes me wonder how so many people even noticed this in the first place.

I noticed during crit animations and sometimes im goofy and try make some animations look like a Zack Snyder movie by using the slow down button, for shits and giggles. I didnt go looking for Battle Panties.

[Thor Odinson]

If Berserkers are meant to be sexualised they did a piss job at it because it's hardly any attractive at all

Look at magazines geared towards men and women and look at the dudes on the covers

The ridic buff versions are generally on stuff like Men's Fitness and Men's health while the same guy on a magazine geared towards women looks like a regular guy

He even has clothes on

http://freethoughtblogs.com/lousycanuck/files/2013/08/tumblr_mr6g6w4krK1r2tsi5o1_1280-545x726.jpg
http://freethoughtblogs.com/lousycanuck/files/2013/08/tumblr_mr6g6w4krK1r2tsi5o2_1280-545x726.jpg

for comparison

(The person in question is Hugh Jackman)

It's a male power fantasy because people think men /want/ to see themselves as big and powerful (now do they actually depends on the individual in question) and berserkers were never meant to appeal to women

Now does the game have things that do appeal to women? Certainly. I'm not denying that at all, and I don't think the game is 100% awful just because it has problematic elements in it (or why would I play it and enjoy it). But it's certainly not in the character design department, that's for sure.

If that's their best shot at manservice they'll have to step up their game at it

=========================

anyway at the battlepanties thing

Considering THIS is what I look at pretty much every time I beat the game yeah damn right I notice

Edited September 28, 2013 by Ezio Auditore da Firenze

[RJWalker]

To deny that female sexualization exists in Awakening is pretty ignorant.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Ranger Jack Walker

[General Banzai]

To deny that female sexualization exists in Awakening is pretty ignorant.

to get offended as if female sexualization hasn't been an integral part of human culture since the dawn of time is pretty pointless

[Anathema]

eh, my only real problem with battle panties is that they are so unfitting with the rest of the armor that they do the opposite of what the game peeps wanted them to accomplish, which is making the characters look attractive.

i mean does anyone actually find that hot?

[Thor Odinson]

I'm on principle annoyed that a lack of pants has become pretty much the indication of femaleness, fanservice or not

[General Banzai]

I'm on principle annoyed that a lack of pants has become pretty much the indication of femaleness, fanservice or not

venus d'urbino had no pants either

[Thor Odinson]

and that means anything because