2 1/2 hours in (not sure what to think)

[eclipse]

I can't tell if some of these people like or don't like awakening. A bunch of people seem to be saying "well the plot sucks, the characters suck, the gameplay sucks... and that's why I love it!"

I'm. . .satisfied with it. The novelty wears off pretty quickly, but a little bit of creativity makes the game more interesting. My current run consists of (eventually four) characters from FE13; the rest are DLC/Spotpass characters. My goal is to beat the game using the ghosts of lords past! Granted, it's not THAT hard, but the idea amuses me.

I can find plenty of issues with the game. Doesn't mean I have to despise it!

[Airship Canon]

Reinforcements, even ambushes, are fine with me (of course, I don't mind resetting) with two exceptions: Lunatic+ (where you can't scout for Counter in advance and must leave all your units unequipped when they show up, this is worse before you get lots of bows) and FP1, where goons with Mire will pop up and OHKO the children before you can do anything.

As someone who likes all of two difficulties [Hard and Lunatic+] I'm going to say that Slambushes aren't that much of a problem on either. Outside of Chapter 20 [which is more or less a race to kill the boss before the goons arrive] I've never had issues with slambush counter. And that's not luck. That's simply being nowhere near the spawn points, which isn't that hard.

Mire misses like crazy, and it doesn't 1-shot unless you didn't train the parents which is kinda your fault.

[RJWalker]

The plot and characters are terrible in my opinion. So terrible that I think FE11 had better characters and a plot. While it's true that FE11 has many characters with zero lines of dialouge aside from death quotes, there are quite a few characters that recieve just the right amount of characterization to make them interesting. Or at least, interesting enough to make me use my imagination to expand their characters. On the other hand, FE13 overloads me with badly written characters that are incredibly one dimensional. All they have is a single personality archetype that defines pretty much everything they say and do.

This wouldn't be so bad or even noteworthy if the characters were minor. Many games from different genres have characters with a single personality quirk that defines them but the big difference is that those characters are usually little more than devices to further gameplay. Games such as Dota 2 or any fighting game are filled with theese because in those types of games, the main focus is gameplay. They have these very basic personalities so that the characters are more than just a name and a face. But when a game like FE13 comes along with so many support conversations for each character and still fails to go beyond those simple archetypes, it's quite disappointing. It tells me that the writers really did think that what they did with the characters was enough.

A single character's support conversations with every possible partner add up over 15,000 words in FE13. With over 30 characters and that's not even counting the dialogue during the story and DLCs. FE11 probably has 15,000 words IN TOTAL. And yet, FE11 provides enough character and plot to make me care while FE13 only manages to do the opposite.

[Tribute]

Once again, fire emblem IS ABOUT GAMEPLAY.

Also, again way too much stock in a character not being "one dimensional"

[minervyx]

Opinion, opinion, opinion... I myself love the characters and the fact your characters are flimsy at the beginning makes you play more strategically.

Not everyone likes Game of Thrones, Harry Potter... And those are critically acclaimed series. Perhaps this game simply isn't your cup of tea, rather than being fundamentally bad.

Personally I think the story isn't an Oscar-winning script, but it entertains me. One flaw it has IMO is that everything happens too fast. One minute Emmeryn dies, the next you're already knocking at Gangrel's door to kill him. There's a lack of intermission text in there. Then again, people would complain that it has too much text if it had more text, so...

Of course, it's all opinion. I'm not trying to force anything down anyone's throats.

Yeah, things do happen WAY too fast. For example, my character and Chrom get married in chapter 12 and it feels forced, and way too soon. "I just met you a few days ago, and this is crazy, but we won some battles together, so marry me maybe?"

Yet 3 hours in should usually be enough time for me to gain interest into a game's world. And it wasn't here. I still have to understand that 3 hours isn't as much time for an RPG, than in other genres. So I'll give it more time.

"Yes, compared to AW, you give up the tactical strategy." Have you played Lunatic? The Apotheosis Secret path? Lunatic+? Yeah, I don't think so. Tell me that you lose the tactical strategy after that.

I should clarify. I'm not saying it's too easy or I'm too smart for it.

I just feel that the mechanics are a bit imbalanced (though far from totally haywire).

Well in some instances the units aren't so disposable, but the developers hoped that you would care enough about the characters to want them to live or you're a perfectionist who hates letting characters die.

But on the higher difficulties I find it is a slightly better game. But I would advise that you don't judge the series on this game alone.

I should make this clear: I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT THE SERIES. I'M JUST TALKING ABOUT AWAKENING.

Some people have been referencing other games, and I haven't played them, so I can't comment on them.

Initially I played as a perfectionist, but having to repeat a mission 3 times because a character or two died just really became a drag after a while.

I am insulted. If you find units disposable, then I suggest you reset every time someone on your side dies.

And they haven't seen those flaws because they are so negligible it's trivial. The characters aren't that bad, this isn't FE11.

And from a gameplay standpoint, this entry has so much content that it doesn't get old quickly.

I did reset upon death many times before (believe me, I'm not stupid lol). It hurts the fun and makes it feel artificial after a while.

And by the way, I don't think this game suffers from any SERIOUS flaws. It moreso just doesn't have enough uniqueness or huge strengths in its favor to make me say this is more than just another good (but not great) game.

FE13 has disposable characters...?

Well, no, the game wants you to treat your characters like human. But the gameplay feels like it requires you to use them as meatshields. You need to move to pursue the enemy, and as you do, your characters are vulnerable. So, Frederic in the front, the warriors in the middle and the mages in the back.

Basically you're being a pretentious prick whos actively looking for things to not like with the mind set going into this you wont like it.

The story is an excuse for the game, not the other way around.(FWIW I consider awakening's above average for what it is and even outside of games character depth is way too overhyped). If you don't like the gameplay, its probably not for you, its just like anything else really. This isn't some indie steam game full of QTEs just to remind you its a game not a movie (cough heavy rain).

As for your thing about expendabilty, I don't really know what to say.Outside of recruits and your new units the chapter you them [basically Ch 1-3] if your units are dying in one hit you probably aren't as good as you think. Stop sending mages and pegasus classes into axe bandits with luna idk.

TLDR; Congratulations you didn't want to like the game and you don't.

I spend $40 on it (and I rarely pay full price for a game). I wanted to LOVE it. Maybe I still can.

Your argument feels similar to the Zelda story argument. If I say that the "rescue the princess and kill ganondorf" plot is getting really old and we should have an actual story, people automatically assume that I want the game to become littered with giant cutscenes like Metal Gear Solid 4. Rather than just make a story like Link's Awakening or Majora's Mask.

Seems to me, mate, you havent played FE before. FE has the fundamental idea that when your characters die, its for good. The end, good bye. Thats why this game is unique because Casual Mode exists. Casual Mode makes it so if a unit falls in battle, they will return by the end of the chapter. This is NOT standard to FE.

Also, in my opinion, this is not a game you play for its plot. Its plot is relatively shallow, but the character interactions/supports are pretty interesting. Plus pairing up people and all the combinations therein along with the skill options/reclassing give this game massive replayability. The DLC is fun too because many goodies to be had in there. The game is getting high ratings because of how fun the mechanics are and the sheer amount of content. Main Campaign, Spotpass paralogues, second gen character paralogues, DLC, Spotpass teams, etc.

The game's mediocre plot does not really take away from the game's actual mechanics you know....

Yes, I've known all about the series tradition of perma-death.

Pairing up and blocking/guarding does feel rewarding, I'll give you that. As for the DLC, I'll pay for it if I beat it and love it, but I shouldn't have to buy DLC in order to love a game.

You said it yourself. The plot is shallow and mediocre. I would easily trade the refined mechanics of Advanced Wars for a brilliant story with memorable characters. I just didn't get that here (or at least yet: I'm only 3 hours in. that's like what, 10% of the game?)

It's probably just not your cup of tea, because the majority of people really like Awakening, especially people that have never played Fire Emblem before. Not sure where you're getting the flat characters thing from, if you've been actively paying attention to support conversations.

I'd say you should step the difficulty up to hard since you seem to think normal's too easy, but if your units are dying in two hits, you're doing something wrong, and I'm not so sure you're actually ready for hard. If you're playing the game like an Advance Wars game, that might explain the difficulty you're having. As much as they may seem to be disposable, your units are most definitely not.

As someone who's played FE and Advance Wars, FE definitely still has tactical gameplay. It's a different sort-- more about keeping what units you have alive than it is gathering resources and creating more units-- but it's tactical gameplay nonetheless. Unfortunately, Awakening takes some of the more fascinating tactical parts of the game out of it with grinding for exp and gold being very easy. In most Fire Emblems, you have to manage which characters you use carefully, and in some cases even which characters you decide to bring to battle-- also being forced to choose from the small pool you've actually trained while you're at it.

Yes, FE is a grind-fest. I should've clarified that I'm not saying the game is too simplistic for my intellectual level at all. It has provided me with enough challenge. It's just whether the mechanics are deep and engaging. Call of Duty, for example; the online multiplayer is far from easy; I just don't find the mechanics to be that great.

I do pay attention to the support conversations. They add a bit, but feel forced and contrived. They need extrinsic motivation to get you to do it.

characters become more interesting by the time you reach A supports between a handful of them. well, most do. though i'd argue this game has a rather awkward, possibly even bland story, the characters themselves are rather interesting.

i guess the awkwardness and weak story dampens the characters a bit, but i guess in such a large cast (since you need a large army, and replacements for fallen warriors) there's less time to focus on characters.

this game has some of the least interesting maps of any fire emblem game, honestly. play sacred stones or something if you want a bit more variation.

yes, the level design of this game is horrible. corridors, and open fields. that's mostly it (so far, in the 3 hours that i've played)

um elaborate on this if you wouldn't mind? because i honestly have no idea where you pulled that from.

well, in the first 3 hours, progressing through the levels was at numerous times fueled by the idea of women being in danger and by the time emmeryn was martyred, it just got old. to be fair, there are numerous strong female characters in here like Panne and Sully to name two.

[minervyx]

I guess the root of it is some levels feel like its completely intended you'll have to reset a bunch while you learn reinforcement patterns. Reinforcements being able to jump you before you can respond on turn 3 is kind of retarded. In a way I get it a little bit, its assumed by now you should be wary of a fort or stairs. But reinforcements randomly popping out of the side and killing you seems counterintuitive. IE Laurents level, which encourages exploring for the secrets, but then with no telegraph or hint you just get jumped by 5 berserkers, the hell is that lol

Reinforcement does tolerate grinding, which I don't find too bad. And I can't criticize a game for having learned patterns because aren't ALL games like that? It feels no different than re-playing the train level in Uncharted 2 and memorizing when the plane is about to strike you. Not a big problem in my eyes.

No one is saying that. We're only having reasonable opinions.

The plot is probably the least important part of the game, though. I've played my fair share of great games with mediocre plots. Heck, Pokémon itself, the plot is always the same cliched crap yet people like the games for their gameplay.

For a character building game!?!?!? I know Mass Effect 2's plot was horrible, but it made up for it with excellent character building. Whereas FEA doesn't.

I can't tell if some of these people like or don't like awakening. A bunch of people seem to be saying "well the plot sucks, the characters suck, the gameplay sucks... and that's why I love it!"

HAHAHA!! LMAO!! So true!!!!

"Why are the gameplay mechanics so imbalanced"

"Well, it's a story-character game. It's not a tactical game like AW"

"So, why is the story weak, and most of the characters one-notes"

"No, I play it for the gameplay"

So, FEA wants to be jack of both trades, but master of neither.

---

Also

It's worth nothing that I don't think the game is mediocre or bad. It's a GOOD game. Just not a great one.

So, instead of it being like a 9 out of 10, it's more like a 6 or 7 (from the 3 hours I've played; assuming things don't change)

[eclipse]

If you're looking for an epic story with amazing characters, you'll have better luck with the Tales series. Grinding shouldn't be necessary to beat the game, no matter what mode you're playing. If your characters are constantly dying, then use the resources on this site to figure out how much damage the enemy will do BEFORE doing things like diving an archer with some high-level Dark Flier (okay, I'm guilty of this, but it was DLC Celica, and it was on Chapter 16 Hard).

EDIT: Don't double-post.

Edited December 22, 2013 by eclipse

[minervyx]

So.

Weak characters. Weak story. Weak map and level design.

Why haven't any of the critics (or many of the fans mentioned this?!?). This seemingly-perfect game is riddled with issues.

I feel like Fire Emblem Awakening is Grand Theft Auto IV all over again.

(Edit: I don't see a deletion or merging feature on the forum)

Edited December 22, 2013 by minervyx

[eclipse]

So.

Weak characters. Weak story. Weak map and level design.

Why haven't any of the critics (or many of the fans mentioned this?!?). This seemingly-perfect game is riddled with issues.

I feel like Fire Emblem Awakening is Grand Theft Auto IV all over again.

If you have nothing constructive to say, then I will lock this topic. Your issues with the game are clear enough, and I feel that nothing good can come from continuing this.

[Airship Canon]

So.

Weak characters. Weak story. Weak map and level design.

Why haven't any of the critics (or many of the fans mentioned this?!?). This seemingly-perfect game is riddled with issues.

I feel like Fire Emblem Awakening is Grand Theft Auto IV all over again.

(Edit: I don't see a deletion or merging feature on the forum)

Simple: because most people disagree.

Take it away Totalbiscuit.

I don't think I need to say anymore.

[RJWalker]

Once again, fire emblem IS ABOUT GAMEPLAY.

Also, again way too much stock in a character not being "one dimensional"

That's a really pathetic excuse. And also untrue.

Try harder.

[eclipse]

The match I was watching has finished, and I see no indication from TC that he objects to this. Good night!