Which weight system would you like in the next game?

[GrySun]

Awakening tried things without weapon weight and I guess it was okay. But I myself would want to see weapon weight return. You'd have to do more than just compare your speed and the enemy speed and you're good to go.

There are three weight options the fire emblem series used(from what I know), and that's :

1. Fe4 weight -> Speed - Weight = Attack Speed, no other fancy things. This means that your speed is never the same as it shows as it is always reduced by the weight of your weapon.

2. GBA weight -> Speed - (Weight - Constitution) = Attack Speed. This one is quite interesting. Units with higher con can safely weild very powerful weapons with next to no speed reduction. Mages and pegasi will almost always have reduction. What makes the system great is that con increases after promotion, making the unit even more good once it promotes.

3. Tellius weight -> Speed - (Weight - Strenght) = Attack Speed. This one is probably the easiest to get behind. At start it will provide slight speed reduction to some of your units, but by mid-end game everyone's strenght will be big enough to safely wield most if not all weapons. The only people majorly screwed by this are mages and healers, which are quite weak in these games.

4. Some other I've missed?

I personally loved the con system from the GBA games the most. It made promotion much more relevant too.

Edited February 26, 2015 by GrySun

[kingddd]

Awakening was not the only game to try without weapon weight. FE12 also removed this feature. So you can add that into the poll.

[NekoKnight]

Gosh, I wish I understood the correlation between weapon weight and constitution when I was playing the GBA titles. I always though the lower the constitution the better because of Rescue. I guess that system sounds the most interesting to me. With the FE4 system the fast units will always be fast but if you add constitution to the mix, you can control which weapons each class uses the best.

[Vascela]

I would be very interested in the return of constitution. Mainly because I think it helps with weapon choices, but also I want to see how it could interact with pair up (albeit not really important to the topic question).

Steels and Tomes would be much more interesting to me. Because it was a selling point to wield Elfire with no AS loss.

[MisterIceTeaPeach]

The weapon weight is still a controversial topic.

I'm absolute against the con-rule from the GBA-series, because it disadvantages female classes and classes with low con like mages, bishops.

At least the weight of the weapons has to be reduced dramatically.

Lyon with 5 AS was just a joke.

The strength-rule in Tellius was better.

In FE9 most units except for mages like Soren or Rhys could reach the strength during the game to use all their weapons without AS penalty.

In FE10 it didn't play a role except for the earlygame in part 1 and in part 2 for Nephenee.

In FE11 it was very problematique for all mages, because they couldn't grow in strength at all.

I like the weapon weight and the strength-rule would be fine for me.

Though personally I'd like to see a neutral stat as buffer for the weapon weight. I think the skill stat could work for that.

Edited February 26, 2015 by Mister IceTeaPeach

[Topazd]

Altogether I prefer the FE1/3/4/TRS system (speed - weapon wt = as) since it will stay relevant throughout the game. In the case that con were to be implemented, I'd be in favor of its FE5 incarnation, to give the units lacking in con some chance of attaining it.

BrightBow made a really good post regarding the subject a while back, but I can't remember in which thread (+ am too lazy to search) and thus can't refer to it. Regardless, to condense what he said: there's much more that you need to do with weapons besides adding weight if you seek to diversify them.

[X-Naut]

Personally I prefer the Con system the most, but I think it could be better implemented with a few changes.

1. Every class has a defined Con scale (i.e. minimum is their base, maximum is five above the base).

2. Characters gain points Con as they level up after achieving set amounts of level-ups, not a growth rate. This would give each character their own personal Con curve while allowing the AS buffer to develop.

3. Sensible weight values, obviously.

The general trend is that the main weapons will never weigh you down where common, but things like early Silvers will give a minor penalty. Heavy weapons such as the Blade tree will be more effective in the hands of some classes than others. You could argue the defined Con scale per class takes some of the uniqueness out of units, but you can do that to other stats by rigging level-ups, and my proposed system doesn't allow for Con rigging. It also gives Body Rings/Statue Frags a bit more use to help characters whose Con naturally lags. Issues with mounted units' Aid dropping could be addressed by giving each mounted class a fixed Aid value.

[sorenwind]

To be honest I feel skill should play a larger part in handling heavier weapon penalties. IMO a heavier weapon requires more skill in addition to strength/con to be able to be used effectively

Perhaps a speed penalty with strength and a damage/accuracy penalty tied in with skill?

[NinjaMonkey]

Awakening's no weapon weight system, please.

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

i'd atleast prefer the strength system.

i would love the con system, except alot of your units are below the average for their class.

Guy having a -3 con from his classes's base, will having a -2 con base too.

meanwhile Matthew has a plus 1 con base and legult has a whomping +3 base. but they aren't fighting anyways

Edited February 26, 2015 by HF Makalov Fanboy Kai

[Firestone]

I was going to vote GBA weight system, but it really screwed over smaller units sometimes, especially pegasus knights (-4 as on iron lance? why IS why?). Tellius weight would really screw mages over too. I'm fine with the gba system of smaller faster units can wield hevier weapons (eg. mages and peg knights), but not being able to wield iron weapons or thunder tomes without -3 spd is just pure BS. That's why i feel con should return, but as a stat with a growth rate eg. generic tiny loli mage has a base con of 3 and a con growth of 15%. After growing some con and promoting she now has 8 con and can wield stronger magic with low attack speed loss. I believe this is similar to the system in FE5 IIRC, but i never played that game so i can't be sure.

[sirmola]

fe5 uses the gba system exept that con (which is called bld in that game) has a growth rate and only affects physical weapons. magic uses as=speed -weapon weight.

[lonelyVoxel]

I dunno which system works best, but I'd much rather be allowed to double with +4 AS as it was in GBA FE Iirc instead of +5 AS

[DualMix]

If they could change the GBA weight system up a bit, I would love to have that back. It's the best one in my opinion, except for the obvious flaws with certain classes.

Plus it's a bit of personal bias cause I love the GBA games.

Edited February 26, 2015 by DualMix

[Varidan]

While I liked the Tellius idea, mages needing strenght made no sense to me. I mean yea sure, tomes can be heavy, but you dont have to actually swing it like that heavy hammer. Plus the long range tomes require more str than just about any other weapon to double with? Damn, the mages sure are doing some heavy lifting...

That being said, i dont feel they should need str to double, magic would make more sense. Granted, mages tend to scale magic faster than most physical classes scale str (at least the ones that matter, like myrmidons), but it still would be a nice step to take to help mages out a bit.

Anyways yea, i liked Tellius, with the changes to casters i mentioned. If they keep forging how they did in Awakening, it could lead to more strategic forging options. Do I want to fully maximize MT and hit, and go for the 1 hit kill with Edward using Leonardo/Micaiah with chipping damage? Or do I tweak weight and crit, so he can double and possibly crit more?

One final note, i feel like if weight is going to affect doubling, it should also affect avoid...

[arvilino]

Either Awakening/New Mystery's no weight or a whole new one where not all weapons have a speed penalty(e.g. Iron/Steel/Silver Sword/Lance/Axe/Bow will not penalize any wielder) but weapons with special effects(Nosferatu, Siege Tomes, Longbow) or more powerful alternatives(Blades) would have a fixed but uniform penalty to whoevers wiedling it. Kind of like FE4 but less insane.

I don't think the GBA system will ever work well for all classes with so many different character types and con stats, and I think systems where characters eventually grow(or start) with the strength or build to no longer receive any penalty defeats the purpose of having the system and just widens the gap between strong and weak units.

Edited February 26, 2015 by arvilino

[Star and Moon]

I have no idea what weight does so I can easily say I wouldn't mind not having.

[The Protagonist]

Ideally, GBA weight, but some fixed ways to gain con being more common would be nice.

[Julius Nepos]

I like weight: it adds to weapon diversity.

I prefer GBA weight, though I would like to see it tweaked a bit.

(S)NES weight is too hard, offering no compensation for the weight penalty. Its advantage is that the penalty is uniform.

I don't prefer Tellius/SD weight. It's the people who need a boost to attack the most (namely those with low strength) who are punished the most for using stronger weapons, while the people who don't need the boost that much (almost) completely grow out of the weight penalty. It's also unfair to magic users.

[The Protagonist]

I like weight because it adds character and weapon diversity, things that were irritatingly absent from FE13.

GBA weight generally worked out pretty well, being relevant but not TOO relevant, but sometimes it just really failed with Tomes.

Tellius weight suffers from decreasing relevance at a rate that's much too high, with weight being pointless for almost any physical character after part 2 of RD. Tellius weight also totally screws over casters, perhaps worse than before.

SNES weight was pretty awful. Swords and Wind magic are grossly overpowered in FE4, and axes are borderline useless. If not for Lex being almost perfectly-suited to the first half of the game and having a Brave Axe, he'd probably have been awful, too.

No weight doesn't really introduce any problems, but it eliminates one aspect of the game and just dumbs down character-weapon selection.

[ckc22]

I've never understood the games that essentially penalize mages/pegasi - low con/str classes. Really the mage with a book or the peg carrying a little lance gets an AS reduction but the general with an axe doesn't? Puhlease.

New system that is fairly balanced across classes or no weight system.

[Magical Glace]

Either no weight, or Julian's suggestion of using Skl as a buffer.

I don't want girls and mages screwed over. I don't mind weight so long as that is not a problem.

[NekoKnight]

I think people shying away from the con system are presuming the weight of characters will be 'realistic' based on class or gender. The game devs can give whatever values to characters they want. The problems with the system were because how it was implemented, not the system itself.

[Zasplach]

I know lots of veterans of the GBA have fond memories of the con system, I share those sentiments, but as some have said; it really was just a system that harmed mages and pegasus riders. I know the system could be improved upon, but con really was only relevant in the first half of the game, after your character's cons have grown high enough, it really didn't matter anymore.

I know Fe4's weapon system was also poorly executed. Axes were much too heavy and swords much too light, but at the very least the attack speed in Genealogy (as=sp-weapon weight), was always relevant and made weapon selection an important decision in every individual round of combat. I think with some reasonable tweaks, it would be the most accessible system for Fire Emblem:If or whatever its name will be.

[Florete]

I know lots of veterans of the GBA have fond memories of the con system, I share those sentiments, but as some have said; it really was just a system that harmed mages and pegasus riders. I know the system could be improved upon, but con really was only relevant in the first half of the game, after your character's cons have grown high enough, it really didn't matter anymore.

Con doesn't grow except on promotion.

Con is not a bad system. I mean, okay, I'm one of those supposed "veterans" in that I started with 7 and 8, but the con system was one thing about them I didn't like back then, and I only started to appreciate the system a few years ago when I realized the system itself is good, but the execution has typically been flawed. Adjust certain weapon weight and character con values and it's the best weight system FE has had to date.

And despite people always groaning that it screws over pegasus knights, pegasus knights are still among the best characters in those games.