Planning out IK team in Advance; I want to do no-grind, but some S-support are a long time off…. advice?

[astrophys]

I'm waiting until the localization, but assuming the localization doesn't do something drastic like axing character or their supports outright or dramatically changing character stats, I assume we have a fairly good idea what the game is going to be like when localized.

As such, I;m trying to figure out whom I should use for my team.

I understand that the team size for IK tends to be lower than in other routes.

Additionally, I want to try to play the route in a "no-grind" manner.

Another thing I want to try to accomplish is to have my Avatar married to Matoi, particularly the brilliantly redheaded Hinoka!Matoi who also happens to gain Lance Fighter as her secondary.

As Hinoka comes in at Ch. 16 in Invisible Kingdom, far latter than in Hoshido, this means that Hinoka!Matoi cannot be started on until that point.

I understand that when the maximum support points are earned, it takes 7 battles for a normal growth rate support to reach S-rank, if what I've been told is correct. I hear that a fast growth takes 6 battles.

So, assuming you can view supports between the back-to-back ch. 16 and 17 (but I know you cannot go to MyCastle) and assuming that Hinoka x Tsubaki gain enough support points in each battle, I should be getting Matoi after 7 battles have been completed….

16 (1st), 17 (2nd), 18 (3rd), 19 (4th), 20 (5th), 21 (6th), 22 (7th); so Matoi would be coming in after Ch. 22 but before Ch. 23, which if I understand correctly would mean she'd Child Seal up to around level 20/10 or so [i.e., level 10 promoted].

But now, to marry her: I'd need to complete these, assuming I could get enough Avatar x Matoi points during her recruitment chapter:

Her gaiden (1st), 23 (2nd), 24 (3rd), 25 (4th), 26 (5th)…. and that's right before the point of no return, two battles short.

HOWEVER, I've overlooked the considerations of other Gaidens… producing a few more children would allow me a few extra battles to build supports in. This would either let me gain Matoi earlier in the game's story (by giving Hinoka x Tsubaki more time to build support and fall in love), or it would give me more battles after Matoi recruited so that they could provide a 6th, 7th, or more (as backup, in case not enough points are gained in a given map) in which Avatar x Matoi could build their S-support.

I've also heard that there are supposedly certain pre-determined MyCastle battles, although I don't know if this is true or how many/when they occur. These could also be helpful for getting a few more battles in which to build supports.

Additionally, there is another consideration…. if I want to be pairing off Tsubaki with Hinoka in IK, that means that I need to first bring him all of the way up to Ch. 16, then have him fight alongside Hinoka somewhere into the chapters 20s (unless more gaidens or fixed optional encounters provide a larger number of chapters than I'm expecting)…. and he won't have the character he's planning to S-rank until Ch. 16, so he'll probably want to be supporting with someone in the meantime, as well as gaining levels so he won't be dead weight and so that he can assist Hinoka out (and not necessarily have to be a pair-up bot exclusively)….

One possibility that I foresee could be having my Avatar himself A-support Tsubaki in the meantime, as the Avatar will be waiting for his future S-support; and I'm planning a +MAG avatar and according to what I've been told about personal pair-up bonuses for the Avatar, supposedly a +MAG avatar would give +1 SPD on C rank, +1 Def on B rank, and another +1 SPD on A rank; he'd give +1 Mag and +1 Res on S-rank, but Tusbaki cannot get that.

Or alternatively I could support Tsubaki with Hinata 2 chapters after Tsubaki joins (mainly for the SPD boost); or Saizou starting in 11….

But anywyas, I'm guessing that I'll have to drag along Tsubaki for my plan to work well, the Avatar is a given to bring along, and I assume that I'll also want Azura for Singing utility.

From there, I have to figure out whom to bring along with my limited slots, not only to be an effective team, but also to ensure that I have enough S-rank capable male-female teams being run in my team so that in no-grind I can generate enough extra paralouges (that can be reasonably completed) to give me the extra maps for support building, as noted above.

Again, from what I've been told, most couples will need 6-7 maps after the second member in the couple is recruited (as they cannot start until then) to produce their kid.

What would people recommend I do, considering the constraints my plans place on my team?

[RafaelAntares]

Personally, I wouldn't use Subaki just because of his poor growths. But if you're determined to get Matoi, then it's up to you.

Units that I always deploy:

Camilla - She's awesome, but I reclassed her to a Wyvern Lord.

Sakura - She has very balanced, you will usually see +5/8 level ups. Also, as a War Priestess, you can give a Bright Bow which deals Magic Dmg to get the most out of her.

Ryouma - Very dodgy and Raijin is a very good weapon. In hard mode, I would throw him in a fort with hordes of enemies and he would always wipe everyone out.

Suzukaze - Mage Killer. However, he's very fragile to Ph Dmg.

Takumi - Will deal a crazy amount of damage to anyone but is very squishy.

Leon - Probably the best mage. Slow though, has Spd Cap of 26(I think?).

Hana - High Str but very squishy. Since she's going to be squishy regardless, I gave her Line of Death, Vantage, Miracle, Swordfaire, Warrior Katana +2, Armourslayer (to take out Generals because I don't have many mages in my team). It may not be the best set up for Hana, but it has worked so far on Hard with no grind.

Edited September 23, 2015 by RafaelAntares

[astrophys]

Well, I mean, I'm fine in principle with dropping Tsubaki later on if need be… but I insist on having him first giving me Matoi, preferably from Hinoka. It works out better (I'd think) in Hoshido due to them arriving within one chapter of each other. Its a much larger gap in IK, which leads to the issue.

Tusbaki will still have early flier utility, in any event.

His daughter, Matoi, has substantially better growths than him; granted, Hinoka has even better growths [and bases, as far as I can tell]; I just want to pull off Matoi in a no-grind context… Hinoka will (most likely) end up with somewhat higher speed, substantially better RES, and marginally better attacking stats, but Matoi's Prodigy should end up making her deal somewhat more damage anyways….

[GoXDS]

ignoring possibly lower recruitment stats (since we haven't really figured that one yet and seems to be small anyways), you could just use him exclusively as Pair Up tool. he nicely provides Def so that works in favor of a front line Guard Stance unit and Pegasus's Spd mods are also great and provides Res so you can tank from both spectrums. and you can also increase the unit's movement range with Pegasus quite a bit.

especially if you're just gonna dump him later, no need to divert exp away from your "main" team

[CocoaGalaxy]

The "irony" of the situation is that, in Invisible Kingdom, precisely because Hinoka arrives so late, you're kind of "forced" to use Subaki if you want a flyer for "the first few chapters". Utility really.

Aside from that..I'm not sure if I can actually give much advice, it's a bit complicated yet straightforward, since I have no idea the whole support shenanigans and what not (and deciding who marries who is already difficult enough...somewhat, "before even factoring in" children)

In general, any child can do well, either despite, or thanks to their parents

Though it is possible for children to get screwed, especially if you recruit them early on (as you probably will need)

It also depends on which characters you want to use

Edited September 23, 2015 by CocoaGalaxy

[Eriotto]

Personally, I wouldn't use Subaki just because of his poor growths. But if you're determined to get Matoi, then it's up to you.

Units that I always deploy:

Camilla - She's awesome, but I reclassed her to a Wyvern Lord.

Sakura - She has very balanced, you will usually see +5/8 level ups. Also, as a War Priestess, you can give a Bright Bow which deals Magic Dmg to get the most out of her.

Ryouma - Very dodgy and Raijin is a very good weapon. In hard mode, I would throw him in a fort with hordes of enemies and he would always wipe everyone out.

Suzukaze - Mage Killer. However, he's very fragile to Ph Dmg.

Takumi - Will deal a crazy amount of damage to anyone but is very squishy.

Leon - Probably the best mage. Slow though, has Spd Cap of 26(I think?).

Hana - High Str but very squishy. Since she's going to be squishy regardless, I gave her Line of Death, Vantage, Miracle, Swordfaire, Warrior Katana +2, Armourslayer (to take out Generals because I don't have many mages in my team). It may not be the best set up for Hana, but it has worked so far on Hard with no grind.

For Sakura i would use exorcits tbh, i know later on her shining bow is destroying enemis but her early as WP is weak cause she can't use this bow at the beggining.

About leon... tbh i think that Elise would be better mage, somehow i feel like it but Leo isn't bad himself as well but maybe not really as a dark knight but sorc more likely

If you have acces to dlc dark flier should be awesome for sakura if you're about to use her offensively, healer role can fit felicia, joker and Deere. : p (also thier ranks with rods is better)

Edit: this also solves problem about not having flying unit in early chapters in IK if you don't wanna use Tsubaki~

Edited September 23, 2015 by eriotto

[eharper256]

I also had a similar dilemma; I wanted to marry Pieri in Nohr, and then Ophelia in IK, but the join times basically mean I've got to grind MyCastle to make the latter scenario plausible, so I was recently considering a flat switch and/or swapping Anna or Flora in for IK.

Speaking of which, can someone clarify what happens if Kamui's secondary class matches the primary of their spouse, and the spouse tries to marriage seal? Am I correct in thinking this produces the analogue class? Or does nothing happen?

[PuffPuff]

Personally, I wouldn't use Subaki just because of his poor growths. But if you're determined to get Matoi, then it's up to you.

Units that I always deploy:

Camilla - She's awesome, but I reclassed her to a Wyvern Lord.

Sakura - She has very balanced, you will usually see +5/8 level ups. Also, as a War Priestess, you can give a Bright Bow which deals Magic Dmg to get the most out of her.

Ryouma - Very dodgy and Raijin is a very good weapon. In hard mode, I would throw him in a fort with hordes of enemies and he would always wipe everyone out.

Suzukaze - Mage Killer. However, he's very fragile to Ph Dmg.

Takumi - Will deal a crazy amount of damage to anyone but is very squishy.

Leon - Probably the best mage. Slow though, has Spd Cap of 26(I think?).

Hana - High Str but very squishy. Since she's going to be squishy regardless, I gave her Line of Death, Vantage, Miracle, Swordfaire, Warrior Katana +2, Armourslayer (to take out Generals because I don't have many mages in my team). It may not be the best set up for Hana, but it has worked so far on Hard with no grind.

...And he makes a great character to use for the DLC's. He gets like Deoxys (Speed Forme) in Pokemon with the Str and Speed draining skills. Main game...he alone can sometimes solo some chapters. He's better as a Lodestar than a Trueblade for the better HP, Luck and Defensive caps.

Kaze is invaluable on the Nohr route. Make him a Swordmaster and it'll be good enough. He does better in that than as an Elite Ninja as Astra is alot more helpful than Lethality.

Hana should get a Quick Draw Katana actually for the +5 speed boost that it offers. It helps alot along with Astra. Line Of Death is very risky for her when it is left to be better for Oboro, or someone dodgy like Kaze/Kaze's daughter.

Edited September 23, 2015 by Oboro

[astrophys]

Of course, another option for me is to compromise and go for a different Matoi, like Sakura!Matoi; she gets pink hair, but that's pretty too. Sakura joins after Ch. 8 (so you get to start using her in 9), while Hinoka joins at the start of 16; Sakura also gets a fast support with Tsubaki that should only take 6 battles to S-rank due to him being her retainer. 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14…. Matoi should be available by around Ch. 15 a the earliest; although given that Sakura is one of your healers, she might not be gaining support as fast unless you stick her in Guard Stance with Subaki (sacrificing some of her healing)…. or you could make her a Peg. Warrior herself, but you probably want your send healer (besides Felicia) available.

And she doesn't have Hinoka passing down Lancefaire access to her directly . But she does directly gain access to a class that has Tomefaire (although two of her A+ supports give that to her anyways) as well as a better magic growth (I estimate 32.5% with Sakura!Matoi vs. 15% with Hinoka!Matoi); perhaps she could make a better Dark Falcon.

Hinoka actually has better Str (+15%), Spd (+5%), Def (+5%), and Res (20%) than Sakura, but Sakura has a huge magic boost over her (+35%) and better luck (+15%). They have equal HP/Skl. According to my work in inferring the formulae of growth inheritance, this implies that the different Matoi versions will vary by half these Growth.

Hinoka!Matoi: Wins by 7.5% Str, 2.5% Spd, 2.5% Def, 10% Res.

Sakura!Matoi: Wins by 17.5% Mag, 7.5% Lck.

Both of them: Tied at HP/SKL (0% difference)