Unit Practicality Thread

[Shadow Mir]

Well i've seen couple of times Famui Cav with Jakob married and promoting him to GK for bonuses.

Let's be honest there he's one of best party-up fodders for Kamui, GK gives creazy bonuses for her as well.

That (using Jakob as hard support) really isn't something I'd condone, especially given that the downsides of pair up are more apparent in this game...

Edited February 13, 2016 by Levant Colthearts

[Espinosa]

Jakob only needs to specialise in one weapon type anyway. Basically choose the one whose 1-2 range weapon is for sale in the armoury (swords/axes for Hoshido, lances for Nohr). Hoshido always has Reaver weaponry for more weapon triangle control.

[Eriotto]

That (using Jakob as hard support) really isn't something I'd condone, especially given that the downsides of pair up are more apparent in this game...

I'm just saying what is point of giving him GK :P

4 str, 4 def, 2 skl, 1 spd, 1mv, +15 avoid, -3 damage taken doesn't sounds bad.

I might use this for lunatic Nohr run someday, but not in my main saves for sure~

[Espinosa]

The main downside of pairup is that the shields are used up even when the enemy was obviously about to whiff you, but even then they fill up so quickly that speaking of any downsides at all is a bit strange.

[Shadow Mir]

The main downside of pairup is that the shields are used up even when the enemy was obviously about to whiff you, but even then they fill up so quickly that speaking of any downsides at all is a bit strange.

Using two units' turns at once isn't a downside?

I'm just saying what is point of giving him GK :P

4 str, 4 def, 2 skl, 1 spd, 1mv, +15 avoid, -3 damage taken doesn't sounds bad.

I might use this for lunatic Nohr run someday, but not in my main saves for sure~

What I'm saying is that I agree with Espinosa that if all Jakob's doing is staying as pair up fodder for Corrin, that's criminally misusing him. That said, I prefer Felicia by a country mile...

Edited February 13, 2016 by Levant Colthearts

[Eriotto]

The main downside of pairup is that the shields are used up even when the enemy was obviously about to whiff you, but even then they fill up so quickly that speaking of any downsides at all is a bit strange.

yeah, that sucks, however Jakob for Kamui defensivly is just awesome.

[Ebony]

I wish there was a way to keep Jakob a butler but everyone seems to turn him into a GK instead. :u

[Tooru]

A Great Knight Jakob in Guard Stance: -7 physical damage, -3 magical damage.

A whatever Jakob in Attack Stance: -5 all damage.

I don't see anything awesome from Great Knight.

I decided to use Great Knight Jakob in one Nohr run.

Before start a new chapter, I always thought over if it is time to reclass. When I noticed that Jakob can ORKO most units in this chapter with Explosive Shuriken or other daggers, I chose to wait.

Then most units promoted, and Jakob lost the advantage of high class base.

However I still reclassed him and give him a Arms Scroll.

Sometimes I did need a Jakob in Guard Stance, especially for the Mov+1.

Other than that, Jakob just attacked as most units, or tank mages as a worse version of Butler.

Edited February 13, 2016 by Tooru

[Espinosa]

Do Distinguished Son, Absolute Protection and Mysterious Appeal not stack by the way? Corrin supported by Jakob in attack stance still takes -5 dmg for me and not the full -7.

[Eriotto]

I wish there was a way to keep Jakob a butler but everyone seems to turn him into a GK instead. :u

I'll leave him as Butler anyway, but for lunatic runs GK Jacob for Kamui is sooo strong. :P

[Tooru]

Do Distinguished Son, Absolute Protection and Mysterious Appeal not stack by the way? Corrin supported by Jakob in attack stance still takes -5 dmg for me and not the full -7.

A strange question.

Absolute Protection is triggered when Corrin is the leader, and it only buffs Corrin.

Mysterious Appeal is triggered when Corrin is the supporter, and it can buff everyone except Corrin.

They will never work at the same time.

"Absolute Protection + Distinguished Son" -> -5 damage.

Edited February 13, 2016 by Tooru

[Wayward Alchemist]

Distinguished Son and the other aura skills don't work from the back of a Pair Up like in Awakening iirc.

[Espinosa]

I've always misread Mysterious Appeal's description then; could've sworn MU was always receiving both the bonuses (guess I was outstating the enemies so heavily I never really noticed).

Similarly, it took me 3 playthroughs to realise what Silas's skill actually does (never had a critically wounded MU apparently). It's pretty odd how I needed to play Lunatic Nohr to find it out. I used to think MU needs to be <50% HP and -paired up with Silas- so that -MU- would get +3 atk/def. I literally thought it was the most useless skill ever. Lunatic Nohr makes this skill ridiculously good in a pinch, such as in Silas's join map.

There's also Camilla's personal skill which was mistranslated as giving +3 atk, +3 def, which seemed broken as hell so I carefully checked and realised it was, as one would expect, the inverse of Elise's personal skill (+3 atk, +1 def), but that one was easy to spot.

[Shadow Mir]

A Great Knight Jakob in Guard Stance: -7 physical damage, -3 magical damage.

A whatever Jakob in Attack Stance: -5 all damage.

I don't see anything awesome from Great Knight.

After seeing this... Why in the seven hells is Great Knight Jakob so hyped again?? Because I ain't seeing it as worthy of the deafening hype.

[The DanMan]

Using two units' turns at once isn't a downside?

Well, higher difficulties still throw a crapton of enemies at you... enemies which cluster together and can dual strike.

[Espinosa]

After seeing this... Why in the seven hells is Great Knight Jakob so hyped again?? Because I ain't seeing it as worthy of the deafening hype.

Again, because Jakob isn't meant to be played as MU's pair-up fodder? GK raw physical bases are incredible. GK Jakob is basically Frederick without weapon ranks, but with an accelerated levelling speed.

[Wayward Alchemist]

^And much better growths to boot. Also, as stated before, GK Jakob is, with support from a Elite Ninja S-ranked Corrin, one half of a deadly, map-clearing power couple, with Corrin having more Spd and 1-2 Range while Jakob is pure beef and has enough Speed to be competent.

[Shadow Mir]

Again, because Jakob isn't meant to be played as MU's pair-up fodder? GK raw physical bases are incredible. GK Jakob is basically Frederick without weapon ranks, but with an accelerated levelling speed.

I agree with you that using Jakob as Corrin's pair up fodder is a criminal misuse of him, but.,. How many Arms Scrolls are in this game, and on all three routes? Because I don't like the thought of having to deal with 3 E ranks.

Edited February 13, 2016 by Levant Colthearts

[Eriotto]

I agree with you that using Jakob as Corrin's pair up fodder is a criminal misuse of him, but.,. How many Arms Scrolls are in this game, and on all three routes? Because I don't like the thought of having to deal with 3 E ranks.

You know in this case you wouldn't probably even care of using Jakob to kill people but to support avatar all the time.

There in game are some best party-up fodders, one of them is first servant, other is Charlotte in most of pairings, other one is Rinkah with her class.

If you want to go this way, you wouldn't probably even care of Jakob taking kills but give it for someone who actually need it.

[Espinosa]

^And much better growths to boot. Also, as stated before, GK Jakob is, with support from a Elite Ninja S-ranked Corrin, one half of a deadly, map-clearing power couple, with Corrin having more Spd and 1-2 Range while Jakob is pure beef and has enough Speed to be competent.

Fred's growths: 65 str/50 spd/55 def

Jakob's growths as a GK: 55 str/40 spd/45 def

Granted, Jakob exists in a game with tamer average growths all-around, but I don't see what you're trying to say.

I agree with you that using Jakob as Corrin's pair up fodder is a criminal misuse of him, but.,. How many Arms Scrolls are in this game, and on all three routes? Because I don't like the thought of having to deal with 3 E ranks.

Jakob doesn't need a single Arms Scroll. You reclass him right away (because Buttler is a bad class), use bronze [whatever], then in a couple maps iron and 1-2 range, then steel. Shortly he'll be OHKOing frail units with steel, then OHKOing the same units with 1-2 range and OHKOing bulkier foes with steel. Paladin/GK bases mean you won't notice any decrease in damage compared to your best units at the same time (Jakob with a bronze weapon outdamages Silas attacking with iron). He doesn't really faceroll Nohr Lunatic but you can rely on him in a pinch when you realise you've just been fucked by its glorious map design.

[Eriotto]

Fred's growths: 65 str/50 spd/55 def

Jakob's growths as a GK: 55 str/40 spd/45 def

Granted, Jakob exists in a game with tamer average growths all-around, but I don't see what you're trying to say.

Jakob doesn't need a single Arms Scroll. You reclass him right away (because Buttler is a bad class), use bronze [whatever], then in a couple maps iron and 1-2 range, then steel. Shortly he'll be OHKOing frail units with steel, then OHKOing the same units with 1-2 range and OHKOing bulkier foes with steel. Paladin/GK bases mean you won't notice any decrease in damage compared to your best units at the same time (Jakob with a bronze weapon outdamages Silas attacking with iron). He doesn't really faceroll Nohr Lunatic but you can rely on him in a pinch when you realise you've just been fucked by its glorious map design.

I don't feel like butler is bad class, maybe not good for him actually.

Well i always feel like mounted units are rated highter that not mounted lol.

[Shadow Mir]

Jakob doesn't need a single Arms Scroll. You reclass him right away (because Buttler is a bad class), use bronze [whatever], then in a couple maps iron and 1-2 range, then steel. Shortly he'll be OHKOing frail units with steel, then OHKOing the same units with 1-2 range and OHKOing bulkier foes with steel. Paladin/GK bases mean you won't notice any decrease in damage compared to your best units at the same time (Jakob with a bronze weapon outdamages Silas attacking with iron). He doesn't really faceroll Nohr Lunatic but you can rely on him in a pinch when you realise you've just been fucked by its glorious map design.

Still, just picking one weapon type and specializing in it defeats the purpose of having WT control in the first place, as I see it, especially in Conquest. (I REFUSE to give reverse weapons the time of day as "WT control")

Edited February 13, 2016 by Levant Colthearts

[Wayward Alchemist]

How is Pally!Silas x General!Effie in Conquest Lunatic? They don't really get anything special in terms of marriage seals, but Silas can cart Effie around the map or at least to the front lines and she can wreck face from there. They have great synergy in Guard Stance, too, with Effie boosting Silas's Str and Def and Silas boosting Effie's Skl for effective use of Axes and Spd just a little bit to help her double if she isn't doing so already. Sophie will destroy all. It seems good on paper, but how does it work out in-game?

Edited February 14, 2016 by JothTheConqueror

[Mango Giamatti]

How is Pally!Silas x General!Effie in Conquest Lunatic? They don't really get anything special in terms of marriage seals, but Silas can cart Effie around the map or at least to the front lines and she can wreck face from there. They have great synergy in Guard Stance, too, with Effie boosting Silas's Str and Def and Silas boosting Effie's Skl for effective use of Axes and Spd just a little bit to help her double if she isn't doing so already. Sophie will destroy all. It seems good on paper, but how does it work out in-game?

Why make Effie a general? She's fast enough not to get doubled by most enemies, so defensive formation is unnecessary. Plus, as a Great Knight she'll learn Elbow Room and Shelter (open assault and rescue) since she's married to Silas.

[Duke of Dozel]

Why make Effie a general? She's fast enough not to get doubled by most enemies, so defensive formation is unnecessary. Plus, as a Great Knight she'll learn Elbow Room and Shelter (open assault and rescue) since she's married to Silas.

More STR to make up for not having Berserker Harold for a husband? Why have speed when you one shot everything anyway? But even then, Great Knight is much more efficient. Plus 1 movement + Horse is much better, and once again, beast weapons arent as apparent.

Edited February 14, 2016 by Duke of Dozel