A case for a Sin & Punishment representative.

[Zera]

What do you mean by "appreciate"? I'm sure there are players who would play a S&P character even if they hadn't played a S&P game. And I feel like the roster has already gone beyond the point where adding another first-party character would have it be niche or from a series that's already represented. The only exception I can think of is Splatoon.

[Jedi]

There will be people who enjoyed it yes, but is a S&P character going to drive people to buy the game on a mass scale? Thats part of what the characters all do in smash to a small extent, familiarity or nostalgia is fairly important.

Unless Nintendo/Sakurai is trying to advertise a new game in that case some exceptions exist, but there hasn't been a new S&P too recently. Its also why Golden Sun has absolutely zero chance. Neither are significant enough in the history of Nintendo nor do they have the recency to back them up.

Edited May 16, 2016 by Jedi

[kingddd]

Unless Nintendo/Sakurai is trying to advertise a new game in that case some exceptions exist, but there hasn't been a new S&P too recently. Its also why Golden Sun has absolutely zero chance. Neither are significant enough in the history of Nintendo nor do they have the recency to back them up.

Not to mention the wii game went into bargain bin really fast. My local ebgames store was selling it for literally a dollar and they were overstocked on it. You know something went really wrong when a Nintendo published game was being sold for a dollar here. There is literally little to no interest in the game series at all even amongst most Nintendo fans.

Edited May 16, 2016 by kingddd

[Fire Emblem Fan]

Punch Out was NEVER as niche as S&P. The final boss fight against Mike Tyson ALONE is more popular than S&P. That fight is INFAMOUS. And FE was always popular in Japan, much more so than S&P. You're just plain and simply wrong.

And being niche is CERTAINLY NOT the only reason why S&P doesn't warrant a rep, but it does hurt it greatly. And here's a little factoid to support that: They were going to add Takamaru to Smash 3DS/Wii U, but they didn't because Sakurai thought no one would know who he was, because he was from a niche Japan-only NES game.

So...that part of my argument partially comes from the creator of Super Smash Bros. himself. Popularity helps, and being niche hurts.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Fire Emblem Fan

[Jave]

If Sin & Punishment 3 doesn't happen, we're never getting a rep from that series in Smash.

This is a similar situation to that of Golden Sun, in which if a character didn't get in when it was the right time, it's never getting in.

[Zera]

Not to mention the wii game went into bargain bin really fast. My local ebgames store was selling it for literally a dollar and they were overstocked on it. You know something went really wrong when a Nintendo published game was being sold for a dollar here. There is literally little to no interest in the game series at all even amongst most Nintendo fans.

So what about Punch-Out Wii then?

[Refa]

Sin & Punishment is in a really weird spot and is incredibly niche, I don't know if people would appreciate a S&P character compared to the 58 we have.

NGL, people will appreciate any character as long as they're top tier.

[Jedi]

NGL, people will appreciate any character as long as they're top tier.

True, that is actually very true, but even so! On a marketing scale

[Jave]

@Fire Emblem Fan: Saying Sin & Punishment shouldn't be represented because it's niche is a poor argument, because

1. Fire Emblem characters in Melee. 'Nuff said.

2. Punch-Out is apparently even more niche than Sin & Punishment.

According to VGChartz...

Punch-Out! (2007) sold 0.29 million units worldwide.

Sin & Punishment: Star Successor (2009) sold 0.44 millions units worldwide.

...of course more people know about Punch-Out than Sin & Punishment now that Little Mac is in Smash Bros....

Dude, you REALLY need to check your numbers. Punch Out Wii sold 1.27 million units, and the game generally had great reception.

Why do people keep using VGChartz? Even the site owners have admitted the numbers are made up.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Jave

[kingddd]

So what about Punch-Out Wii then?

Never had a price drop here. It did well.

[Zera]

Dude, you REALLY need to check your numbers. Punch Out Wii sold 1.27 million units, and the game generally had great reception.

Why do people keep using VGChartz? Even the site owners have admitted the numbers are made up.

Jave, you do realize... the article you linked to for "1.27 million" also got it's data from VGChartz? Which is weird, because that's not what shows up there.

[Jave]

Jave, you do realize... the article you linked to for "1.27 million" also got it's data from VGChartz? Which is weird, because that's not what shows up there.

Proof enough of how unreliable VGChartz is. I mean, how can you trust a site that changes its numbers the way this site does?

Either way, it completely invalidates your point since we have no info on sales.

[Hardin]

I know that Nintendo did release data showing the Punch Out did crawl its way over 1 million units (almost all of which were sold in North America). I just for the life of me can't find where it was published.