Tips for Conquest (Lunatic)

[Refa]

Oh damn, I'm a moron. Honestly, you should go for first pick Felicia then because I find that she's better in her base class than Jakob is (even though he's more useful for some of the really early maps).

[darkestdarkness]

I think BR lunatic is easier than CQ hard.

that said, how big of a jump is it from CQ hard to lunatic in general? obviously it's going to be harder, but what's the most dominant difference between the two difficulties? number of enemies? buffed stats? enemy skills?

Edited June 1, 2016 by darkestdarkness

[Yunanuy]

Oh damn, I'm a moron. Honestly, you should go for first pick Felicia then because I find that she's better in her base class than Jakob is (even though he's more useful for some of the really early maps).

Yeah, I'm playing as MaMui this time so Felicia will be on the team. Haven't used her yet since I've been playing as FeMui so far, but Jakob has worked well so I'm expecting the same from Felicia.

I think BR lunatic is easier than CQ hard.

that said, how big of a jump is it from CQ hard to lunatic? obviously it's going to be harder, but what's the most dominant difference between the two difficulties? number of enemies? buffed stats? enemy skills?

Birthright is a joke honestly... I've had some resets here and there but that's because I tend to do some stupid things now and then, and I haven't had any major difficulties in any of the chapters.

As far as Lunatic Conquest goes, all of what you said is a big part, but even if I haven't started my run yet, I'm pretty sure skills make the biggest difference. They've been so greedy with skill distribution so far, so that's my best guess all considered.

[Shadow Mir]

I'm a Thracia fan through and through so

Capture isn't nearly as good on Birthright because enemies don't have skills, and I basically just capped a Wyvern Lord to act as a ferry here and there for Azura. On Conquest, especially Lunatic, enemies get pretty hella skills, so sometimes it's really beneficial for the player to grab some of those units with neat skills.

Actually on that note has anyone capped an inevitable end ninja before or does the existence of enemy-only skills make them uncapturable

I'd assume that enemy-only skills would disappear from an enemy unit's skillset if they were captured.

[darkestdarkness]

Yeah, I'm playing as MaMui this time so Felicia will be on the team. Haven't used her yet since I've been playing as FeMui so far, but Jakob has worked well so I'm expecting the same from Felicia.

Birthright is a joke honestly... I've had some resets here and there but that's because I tend to do some stupid things now and then, and I haven't had any major difficulties in any of the chapters.

As far as Lunatic Conquest goes, all of what you said is a big part, but even if I haven't started my run yet, I'm pretty sure skills make the biggest difference. They've been so greedy with skill distribution so far, so that's my best guess all considered.

for a no heart seal run some of the units I would contemplate using are effie (general), benny (general), xander, niles (bow knight), kaze (master ninja), camilla, beruka (wyvern lord), and elise (strategist). arthur is a good pair up bot for effie.

are you planning to do the endgame "legit"? I heard it's hell if you don't rescue cheese it.

Edited June 1, 2016 by darkestdarkness

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

Wait, do you mean support-wise? As in marrying her? You can get several S-supports for the log during one run through bookmarks, so I'm not too worried about that. And I don't pay too much attention to the Kamuisexuals anyways so it's not that big of a loss.

I meant as in options for gaining the bonuses. Anna requires you committing Corrin to her to give her any bonuses. Whereas Niles has a multitude of people he can support in order to pick up the bonuses. So at a bare minimum, Niles as a combat versatility advantage over her.

that said, how big of a jump is it from CQ hard to lunatic in general? obviously it's going to be harder, but what's the most dominant difference between the two difficulties? number of enemies? buffed stats? enemy skills?

Skills (including some really nasty enemy-only ones), better positioning, additional enemies, better gear and better weapon ranks.

[Yunanuy]

for a no heart seal run some of the units I would contemplate using are effie (general), benny (general), xander, niles (bow knight), kaze (master ninja), camilla, beruka (wyvern lord), and elise (strategist). arthur is a good pair up bot for effie.

are you planning to do the endgame "legit"? I heard it's hell if you don't rescue cheese it.

Husky Effie is def going to be part of the team. Same with Niles cause of Capture and Kaze because Ninja. I'll be using all the siblings and Selena because she was amazing in my first run. I wanted to use Lazwald as well, but the time of his recruitment really sucks so we'll see. Haven't really decided on anyone else yet, and I didn't use Beruka my first time so I'll probably use her this time as well. We'll see about Benny.

And I'll try to do it as "legit" as possible, hell or no. Since I'm not gonna throw myself into whatever PvP this game has until Revelations comes out in Europe I might end up allowing characters to die and sob while I do so if I can't find another way.

I meant as in options for gaining the bonuses. Anna requires you committing Corrin to her to give her any bonuses. Whereas Niles has a multitude of people he can support in order to pick up the bonuses. So at a bare minimum, Niles as a combat versatility advantage over her.

Aaah, I see. Well, she's not important for this run anyways, and unless she has RNG God status I probably won't be using her much later either:p was never a big fan to be honest. Is Corrin her only support option?

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

Aaah, I see. Well, she's not important for this run anyways, and unless she has RNG God status I probably won't be using her much later either:p was never a big fan to be honest. Is Corrin her only support option?

Yeah, she's not really very godly. Her growths are similar to Niles's, but lower in almost all the offensive stats. Corrin is her only marriage option, yeah. Technically, if you were to marry her, you could have Kana as her support and move Corrin over to A-support someone else, but that's still more or less committing to her.

[Nintales]

1- First build the Staff Shop then either the Armory if you plan on using Mozu (to get her a weapon) then the Mess.

2- Spam tonics and use the mess as much as possible. Free statboosters are just that great. Use the lottery to get free items too.

3- Use Niles. Just use him. He gets Shurikenbreaker which allows him to literally fuck all over chapter 25.

4- Use the Royals to death. Xander is a beast on his own, Leo's a magic powerhouse, Camilla's Camilla, and Elise is great.

5- (IMO) pick as a talent Wyvern Rider or get it from Camilla/Beruka. You're gonna like having swordbreaker to draw as much time as possible against Ryoma, having a flier is always great, especially for chapter 21, and Wyverns are cool.

6- Never use your rescues unless necessary until the final boss. You'll need them for the 1-turn kill.

7- You'll also probably need Arthur with Agressor + Axefaire and the Rainbow dude.

8- Use Freeze whenever you need to break an enemy offense. It's really important to have some Freezes nearby.

9- Try to get the KamuiSexuals so you can use them as pair-up bots to have less units to train.

10- Use the Path Bonus items. Keep the boots for the last chapter though because you have yet to decide the unit who's gonna ferry your bosskiller. (personnally it was Niles ferrying Arthur with Pass)

I think that's all.

Point 2 is the most important.

[Hli Tshiab]

Conquest lunatic was really fun but you have to understand the AI of certain enemies and understand how to use your resources to not screw yourself over...

Based on my experience...

1. The Enemy AI in chapter 25, for example, should attack you after you have struck them, so if you can... attack>shelter>sing out of their attack range or the range where other enemies pose a threat, then they should rush at you alone. I believe only the units in front of the gate during chapter 23 runs back IIRC. AI should also not attack if they cannot do damage, so Benny might help in clearing parts of a map by himself. Debuffers and poisoners will attack IIRC, so try to learn which enemy runs which AI. Enemies also like to use attack stance, so know where you place your units!

2. You can use Child chapters to bring units that you have not used up to par with your current team, assuming you've progressed a decent amount in the game. Shigure's Map is one of the easier one to level lower leveled units.

3. If you hold off on your first invasion, it's easy for you to staff abuse units to 20/20 and get easy Staff ranks. A level 9 Nyx takes around 80 Heal uses to hit 20 and she should be at B rank staves. But your turn count might be pretty high and you require a higher level unit. This helps if you have promoted units that need a boost in staff ranks, Ex. Shura/Niles/Anna.

4. Gunter is actually pretty useful, with the +3 Damage and +15 Hit, Although not a great unit, he makes a great pair up bot because he also has access to Sol and Luna. He goes great with Silver Weapons and Dragonstone+ if you need the enemies dead. You might not want to use him in the long run though. But to OHKO Oboro and friends with Dragonstone+ feels pretty good!

5. Don't spend too much money on tonics, just when you need the extra boost to do something, most maps can be easily cleared without tonics. You might want money for other things, such as beast killer type weapons or whatever. So if you need extra speed to kill something, then pop a speed tonic, but don't tonic spam units. Units usually need 1-2 tonics to do something, like more speed/defense/damage.

6. If your units turn out fine, you should be able to clear the final chapter without doing a one turn cheese, although it will be difficult. So saving easy child chapters for lategame to grind for exp/Wexp is a good idea. Since your not re-classing, you might have to one turn cheese.

7. Izana and flora makes decent late-game staff bots, but it's better to catch late-game enemies, because they should have max/near-max weapon rank and decent stats and skills.

8. Setting your castle to have only one low level unit, should result in finding Mozu-only castles if you need to slaughter hundreds of defenseless Mozus to get your affection up or to get DVP.

There's more on Enemy AI but they're all pretty similar to what I posted. Conquest might be extra long btw, I've always clocked 40 hours on average when getting all the kids and all pairings.

[Yunanuy]

1- First build the Staff Shop then either the Armory if you plan on using Mozu (to get her a weapon) then the Mess.

I wasn't planning on using Mozu because I don't want to invest too much time on her, but we'll see how it goes. I'm almost at BR Endgame so I'll start my Conquest run soon.

2- Spam tonics and use the mess as much as possible. Free statboosters are just that great. Use the lottery to get free items too.

Yeah! Tonics are literally what I ended up spending my money on last time. They really are lifesavers.

3- Use Niles. Just use him. He gets Shurikenbreaker which allows him to literally fuck all over chapter 25.

Planning to use Niles (and Severa) for Shurikenbreakers:))

4- Use the Royals to death. Xander is a beast on his own, Leo's a magic powerhouse, Camilla's Camilla, and Elise is great.

I'm glad none of them become moot in Lunatic, especially Xander. I figure I'll have my main team set before he joins, so it's nice to hear that he can hold up on his own.

5- (IMO) pick as a talent Wyvern Rider or get it from Camilla/Beruka. You're gonna like having swordbreaker to draw as much time as possible against Ryoma, having a flier is always great, especially for chapter 21, and Wyverns are cool.

Talent won't really matter much because I won't be using Heart Seals:/

6- Never use your rescues unless necessary until the final boss. You'll need them for the 1-turn kill.

Thanks for the tip! I'll try avoiding using them as much as possible.

7- You'll also probably need Arthur with Agressor + Axefaire and the Rainbow dude.

Arthur won't be able to get Aggressor, and I'm only planning on using him till I get his kid then bench him or make him pair-up fodder. Who's Rainbow dude? Rainbow Sage?? Rallyman?

8- Use Freeze whenever you need to break an enemy offense. It's really important to have some Freezes nearby.

Hahah I abused the hell out of Freeze sooo much last time, so I'm expecting the same this time around.

9- Try to get the KamuiSexuals so you can use them as pair-up bots to have less units to train.

I was actually thinking of using Gunther as my Kamui pair-up when he joins because of his personal. And the only Kamuisexuals that join in Conquest are Shura and Izana (?), and Izana will probably used as a staffbot.

10- Use the Path Bonus items. Keep the boots for the last chapter though because you have yet to decide the unit who's gonna ferry your bosskiller. (personnally it was Niles ferrying Arthur with Pass)

I'll keep that in mind and save the boots. I was thinking of killing Shura for the extra boots, but we'll see how it goes:)

1. The Enemy AI in chapter 25, for example, should attack you after you have struck them, so if you can... attack>shelter>sing out of their attack range or the range where other enemies pose a threat, then they should rush at you alone. I believe only the units in front of the gate during chapter 23 runs back IIRC. AI should also not attack if they cannot do damage, so Benny might help in clearing parts of a map by himself. Debuffers and poisoners will attack IIRC, so try to learn which enemy runs which AI. Enemies also like to use attack stance, so know where you place your units!

I didn't use Benny last time and a lot of people have been talking about him, so I'll probably use him this time around.

2. You can use Child chapters to bring units that you have not used up to par with your current team, assuming you've progressed a decent amount in the game. Shigure's Map is one of the easier one to level lower leveled units.

I'll keep that in mind!

3. If you hold off on your first invasion, it's easy for you to staff abuse units to 20/20 and get easy Staff ranks. A level 9 Nyx takes around 80 Heal uses to hit 20 and she should be at B rank staves. But your turn count might be pretty high and you require a higher level unit. This helps if you have promoted units that need a boost in staff ranks, Ex. Shura/Niles/Anna.

Hmm... I'm not obsessed with turn counts so that's fine. I'll probably be training Azura for a bit during her chapter as well, as long as the dance exp doesn't become shit after a while...which I'm expecting it does, and Nyx (did you mean Elise?) will be stuck in her Dark Mage promotions so no staff usage... I'll keep it in mind for my other healers though!

4. Gunter is actually pretty useful, with the +3 Damage and +15 Hit, Although not a great unit, he makes a great pair up bot because he also has access to Sol and Luna. He goes great with Silver Weapons and Dragonstone+ if you need the enemies dead. You might not want to use him in the long run though. But to OHKO Oboro and friends with Dragonstone+ feels pretty good!

Nice! I was planning on using him as pair-up fodder if I needed it so I'm glad that works out well.

5. Don't spend too much money on tonics, just when you need the extra boost to do something, most maps can be easily cleared without tonics. You might want money for other things, such as beast killer type weapons or whatever. So if you need extra speed to kill something, then pop a speed tonic, but don't tonic spam units. Units usually need 1-2 tonics to do something, like more speed/defense/damage.

I always try to complete maps without tonics before I start using them, and if I do, I only boost the stats that are necessary so I'll think I'll be good:)

6. If your units turn out fine, you should be able to clear the final chapter without doing a one turn cheese, although it will be difficult. So saving easy child chapters for lategame to grind for exp/Wexp is a good idea. Since your not re-classing, you might have to one turn cheese.

I'm hoping I won't have to cheese it, but we'll see how it goes! I'll try and get as many peeps as I can married (abusing staffs for support points) so I can get more prologues as they seem rather important for exp.

7. Izana and flora makes decent late-game staff bots, but it's better to catch late-game enemies, because they should have max/near-max weapon rank and decent stats and skills.

Oooh, I forgot about Flora. Nice to hear I get another staff bot.

8. Setting your castle to have only one low level unit, should result in finding Mozu-only castles if you need to slaughter hundreds of defenseless Mozus to get your affection up or to get DVP.

Hahah savage. I'm hoping to avoid using My Castle battles though. I want the run to be as "clean" as possible, but I'll do what I have to do.

There's more on Enemy AI but they're all pretty similar to what I posted. Conquest might be extra long btw, I've always clocked 40 hours on average when getting all the kids and all pairings.

Considering my playstyle, I doubt I'll get all the kids/marriages during this playthrough, and even if it takes a long time I want to complete it the way I have in mind for my own sake:)

Thank you to everyone who gave their input! If anyone else has any other ideas, feel free to pitch in! ^^

Edited June 1, 2016 by Valair

[Nintales]

Who's Rainbow dude?

He's that one guy that was brought earlier on the topic with the 4 rallies (Str, Spd, Def, Res) at chapter 23.

[Namarid]

How many units would you recommend using?

[Yunanuy]

How many units would you recommend using?

Personally, when I do things like these I like to focus on training eight units. Four "frontliners", and four peeps for pair-up shenanigans. The rest will be on staff or rally duty (or shuriken/bow sneak attacks). I don't really include some (pre-promoted) units like Xander or Ryoma--or the Avatar by extension--in there since they join with considerable stats and/or have great personal skills or weapons allowing them to hold up on their own.

Update: Just finished Hoshido and omg the feels... I must say while I wish BR Lunatic was a lot more difficult (the final battle was stupid easy..), the story was superior to Conquest's. Well then, off to Conquest Lunatic!

Edited June 1, 2016 by Valair

[omg]

If you want to cheese endgame even semi-reliably without heart seals, you pretty much have to go with a +Str avatar, as otherwise your Str cap will be too low to kill final boss Takumi with only one Dragon Fang proc. You'll also probably want to capture a Pass Falco from Ch. 24. You need to hit 66 displayed attack to get the single Dragon Fang kill with a Gunter pairup and 68 displayed attack otherwise. With all possible boosts (Rally Strength/Laslow/tonic) and A rank swords, that should require 37 Str with a A/B-support GK Gunter pairup or 35 Str with a +7 Str support (A/B-support Berserker Charlotte or A-support Berserker Arthur). The biggest problem you face in Endgame if you aren't cheesing it is the Inevitable End/Staff Savant Maids/Great Masters and Inevitable End Master Ninja hordes raining debuffs on you as you cope with the infinite reinforcements and Takumi's map weapon.

A few tips for the rest of the game leading up to that:

Mess hall stat boosts are pretty useful.

Azura can dance multiple times in one turn with proper use of shelter, which is particularly handy for allowing you to pick off units several squares deep in dangerous staff/attack ranges and then bail them out on the same turn.

Haitaka has Rally Defense, which is pretty useful.

Keep in mind Camilla and Leo gain xp faster as they have internal levels 15 and 18 respectively instead of the 20 most pre-promotes (and units promoted at 20) have.

Ch. 12 is great for giving units you intend to use a chance to catchup, since the pots give your entire team Def+4 for the entire chapter from the very start and more buffs are easily accessible.

You can trap Saizo in the top treasure room in Ch. 17, and you can also block his path outside of the initial starting room until you've dealt with the nearby ninja horde.

Enemies won't attack units they can't damage if those units can counterattack, with the exception of the Faceless in Ch. 21. If a unit with 1-2 range has enough defense, this makes Ch. 23 a lot easier since the lunge chain won't happen and you won't get hit by seal defense. Also in Ch. 23, if you immediately engage the units to your north, you'll draw in that group and trigger the reinforcements so they won't hem you in later. You should capture the 4x rally MoA immediately, since the 3x Rally+Amaterasu ones are in a dangerous group of enemies and somewhat harder to capture.

Shurikenbreaker makes dealing with the hordes of Inevitable End ninja in Ch. 25 much easier. Also, there's a spot in the top left outside the range of the lunge chain.

Don't forget about the Freeze staff, as you get a decent amount of uses.

Most maps lack turtling disincentives, so going slow and turtling lets you abuse auras and control the amount of enemies you engage.

Pretty much every unit is viable.

The DLC and path bonus class change items are overpowered and give you access to promoted class base stats early in the game.

The child paralogues aren't necessary but make the game a lot easier if you do play them.

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

If a unit with 1-2 range has enough defense, this makes Ch. 23 a lot easier since the lunge chain won't happen and you won't get hit by seal defense.

This isn't strictly true. Many enemies will still attack for 0, even if they'll get counterattacked, if they can apply debuffs or poison attacks (Poison Strike, Savage Blow, Grisly Wound). Some of the early Spear Fighters will chicken out, but by and large, the melee enemies will try their damnedest to make sure a player's tanks eat those Seal Def and Seal Spd debuffs.

[avengerfive]

This isn't strictly true. Many enemies will still attack for 0, even if they'll get counterattacked, if they can apply debuffs or poison attacks (Poison Strike, Savage Blow, Grisly Wound). Some of the early Spear Fighters will chicken out, but by and large, the melee enemies will try their damnedest to make sure a player's tanks eat those Seal Def and Seal Spd debuffs.

If you ORKO the enemies, the skills won't go off. However the only units that can reliable tank and kill at 1-2 are Xander and Corrin.

[Shadow Mir]

Anna still can't get you Haitaka and Rallyman. Niles can't really be obsolete because CQ has a lot of great capturable units that will make your life easier (Haitaka's Rally Def is pretty clutch until my wyverns got it, for example). Capturing a pass falco off Hinoka's chapter for a staffer might also help.

Niles's luck is fine. CQ is pretty player phase heavy anyway so you shouldn't be making him hit something that can kill him.

True, though you're leaving me scratching my head with the whole thing about CQ being player phase heavy - I feel that I'd have noticed that by the point I'm at (chapter 14); regardless, it didn't help Niles's case that I was able to get Anna around chapter 10. The whole thing's moot for the OP, anyways, since he's European.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Levant Mir Celestia

[Thor Odinson]

True, though you're leaving me scratching my head with the whole thing about CQ being player phase heavy - I feel that I'd have noticed that by the point I'm at (chapter 14). The whole thing's moot for the OP, anyways, since he's European.

If CQ's really as EP heavy as BR then I wouldn't spend all those tries on chapter 25 trying to not die. The existence of shit like Inevitable End makes player phase more valuable than doing shit like "move Ryoma, click end turn, win" which you can pull off on most chapters of BR vs only a select few on CQ. Even prior to 25 though, there's a lot of things you kinda just want to, remove out of sight before they can get to you.

Remember, this thread IS for Lunatic. There's shit you can get away with on Normal or even Hard that you can't on Lunatic because additional skills/different positioning.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Thor Odinson

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

If you ORKO the enemies, the skills won't go off. However the only units that can reliable tank and kill at 1-2 are Xander and Corrin.

Hmmm, yeah, I suppose if the AI is aware of being ORKOed, that could explain why those Spear Fighters with Seal Def wouldn't bother attacking. I want to say that Effie wasn't strong enough to do that, but it's been so long since that point in my first run of Conquest that I can't be certain.

[Shadow Mir]

If CQ's really as EP heavy as BR then I wouldn't spend all those tries on chapter 25 trying to not die. The existence of shit like Inevitable End makes player phase more valuable than doing shit like "move Ryoma, click end turn, win" which you can pull off on most chapters of BR vs only a select few on CQ. Even prior to 25 though, there's a lot of things you kinda just want to, remove out of sight before they can get to you.

Remember, this thread IS for Lunatic. There's shit you can get away with on Normal or even Hard that you can't on Lunatic because additional skills/different positioning.

I guess I can agree, now that you mention it - I've seen people say that player phase was more important in this game than it was in others, though none of them bothered to give details or examples as to why.

[Yunanuy]

Azura can dance multiple times in one turn with proper use of shelter,

Holy shit I had no idea.... abuse abuse abuseabuse

This isn't strictly true. Many enemies will still attack for 0, even if they'll get counterattacked, if they can apply debuffs or poison attacks (Poison Strike, Savage Blow, Grisly Wound). Some of the early Spear Fighters will chicken out, but by and large, the melee enemies will try their damnedest to make sure a player's tanks eat those Seal Def and Seal Spd debuffs.

Yeah, this actually happened a lot in BR as well. Ninjas would just bomb me with Shurikens, especially those who couldn't counterattack.. (which I shouldn't have allowed in the first place, but BR made me pretty nonchalant about unit placement)

Sooo, I'm on Chapter 10 now on Conquest. Not too many problems so far and I managed to Capture both Haitaka and the Archer with 8 Mag (Mag which is useless for now, but that Archer was the only "unique" one). I can probably persuade one of them for Chapter 10 as I haven't done Mozu's paralogue yet. I was thinking of using the Archer for the Bow Turret (Ch 10) since there's two of them in the chapter and Niles is my only archer...but Rally Defense is also really useful. Which one do you reckon I should get? Headed to bed for now so I'll wait for some input.

Also: is Nyx good? (Seems like she's a bomb glass cannon, but I didn't use her in my first playthrough so I dunno how she'll work out) I feel like I need a(n extra) Tome-user before Leo shows up, and I haven't give Odin any exp so far. I was thinking I'd be fine till I turn Elise into a Strategist, but I'm second guessing myself. I guess I could use her and hook her up with Leo once he joins..

Edit: So Chapter 10 was pretty awful...I somehow managed to do it on my first try but I was clinging to dear life by the end of it. I really wanted to kill Takumi but couldn't get to him in time. I ended up recruiting Haitaka since the Archer would've only been used for this chapter anyways...managed to get Beruka some experience as well, although Camilla stole a lot of it (shame). Makes me wanna try a "no-royal" lunatic run and see how it goes.

Edited June 3, 2016 by Valair