Fe15 in Fates World

[quasimopho13]

Sorry if this's as already been said, but how do people feel about Fe15 in Fates world.

Fates in my opinion is a fantastic game. As I was playing the game, I noticed it had flaws, but I didn't care because of how much they did well.

One notable example is the premise/foundation. It's just the execution of the story could be better (I think people have said this too)

So how about Fe15 in the Fates world, but with a fleshed out plot. I know that the major seller of fates was choosing a path and that life is gray, but I still think a lot can be done with what's there.

I just have no ideas and want to hear others.

Also Fates did have some great plot moments. Chapter 26 Hoshido comes to mind.

[blah the Prussian]

Well, I always have said that Fates' greatest sin is giving us an interesting character in the form of pre-possession Garon and then throws him away. Maybe have a prequel game centered around Garon in the early days, as he tries to keep his kingdom together in the face of plotting nobles and radical revolutionaries.

[Avestus]

There is no such thing as "Fates world". There's just a series of poorly-linked locations with no detailed background and no sophisticated thought put into their creation. Thus, as of now, there's nothing interesting in it, and i don't want another game with world-building of teenager fanfic level.

[NeonZ]

I don't think it's likely. They didn't even keep Fates' writer for the DLC, I don't think they'd bring him back for a sequel. And, if it's a different main writer, I doubt they'd have any reason to attempt to stick with Fates' setting. At best, you could hope for something like the Awakening Trio or Pegasus Sisters in Gaiden tying the games together.

Edited July 23, 2016 by NeonZ

[Time the Crestfallen]

As much as I think the hate for Fates is more than a little exaggerated, the lore is such a cluster-fuck that even if IntSys would want to set the next FE in the Fates world, they'd be better off cutting their loses and running.

[Book Bro]

Well, I always have said that Fates' greatest sin is giving us an interesting character in the form of pre-possession Garon and then throws him away. Maybe have a prequel game centered around Garon in the early days, as he tries to keep his kingdom together in the face of plotting nobles and radical revolutionaries.

I would be super into this. Just as long as they took the story seriously and kept the shounen anime influences down to a minimum.

[Thane]

I would be super into this. Just as long as they took the story seriously and kept the shounen anime influences down to a minimum.

The question is if Intelligent Systems will look at the feedback and learn from Fates' narrative shortcomings (people may say the hate is exaggerated, but it's not an exaggeration to say that it's not a widely liked story), or if they'll just look at the sales figures and go "welp, anime it is".

[Raguna]

The question is if Intelligent Systems will look at the feedback and learn from Fates' narrative shortcomings (people may say the hate is exaggerated, but it's not an exaggeration to say that it's not a widely liked story), or if they'll just look at the sales figures and go "welp, anime it is".

Considering they built up Fates as the game that would overcome the shortcomings of Awakening's plot, I think even if Intelligent Systems looks back at the feedback, it could still end up going pretty bad. I think there was just too much fanservice being pushed in that they didn't notice how lacking most of the other areas are. A good game stands on both it's gameplay and story and while gameplay changes were fine even if slightly unnecessary for weapons above steel and two-ranged not called shuriken or legendaries, the story was just a pool of disconected places and ideas.

Also it's pretty difficult to make a sequel when you base it off Revelations which is more than likely the canon route. Who's going to the enemy? Hoshido again? Nohr? The flame tribe? When the final boss in Rev is someone that high up in the divinity ladder, it's kind of hard to raise the stakes for any future installments without pulling excuses off the plot's ass.

A prequel would be good, but in all honesty just make a new setting. Give the continent a name, some roads to show us where everything connects, some war meeting strategies before battles so we don't just look like blundering idiots who arrived at the scene at the last minute, develop some culture, present themes to work with that actually mean something, expand or start on the character development of the villains so they don't come off as D-list baddies from Power Rangers and stop contriving inane excuses as to why these characters are allowing such stupid things to happen in the first place.

Edited July 23, 2016 by Raguna

[Thane]

Considering they built up Fates as the game that would overcome the shortcomings of Awakening's plot, I think even if Intelligent Systems looks back at the feedback, it could still end up going pretty bad. I think there was just too much fanservice being pushed in that they didn't notice how lacking most of the other areas are. A good game stands on both it's gameplay and story and while gameplay changes were fine even if slightly unnecessary for weapons above steel and two-ranged not called shuriken or legendaries, the story was just a pool of disconected places and ideas.

I know, they stated that clearly in the interview, and yet, without going on a rant here, so many things feel similar, the final villain in particular.

Also it's pretty difficult to make a sequel when you base it off Revelations which is more than likely the canon route. Who's going to the enemy? Hoshido again? Nohr? The flame tribe? When the final boss in Rev is someone that high up in the divinity ladder, it's kind of hard to raise the stakes for any future installments without pulling excuses off the plot's ass.

Maybe Corrin failed completely as a leader of the new nation and they went berserk. That'd never happen of course, and I've still to understand why the formation of a new country was necessary, but hey, it'd be a cool idea.

I'm vehemently against prequels since you know how they're going to end anyway. For instance, Garon could've been an awesome character but they chose to take the easy way out and not develop him in Fates. Why play a game about a character that had so little respect that the developers literally had him get eaten after spouting a few nonsensical lines and never mentioned him again?

A prequel would be good, but in all honesty just make a new setting. Give the continent a name, some roads to show us where everything connects, some war meeting strategies before battles so we don't just look like blundering idiots who arrived at the scene at the last minute, develop some culture, present themes to work with that actually mean something, expand or start on the character development of the villains so they don't come off as D-list baddies from Power Rangers and stop contriving inane excuses as to why these characters are allowing such stupid things to happen in the first place.

Isn't this pretty much every single map in Fates, barring maybe a few ones in Conquest (where you conveniently get all the details about the location five minutes in advance - the realism is strong in this campaign)?

That little remark aside, I agree with this.

[Raguna]

I know, they stated that clearly in the interview, and yet, without going on a rant here, so many things feel similar, the final villain in particular.

Maybe Corrin failed completely as a leader of the new nation and they went berserk. That'd never happen of course, and I've still to understand why the formation of a new country was necessary, but hey, it'd be a cool idea.

I'm vehemently against prequels since you know how they're going to end anyway. For instance, Garon could've been an awesome character but they chose to take the easy way out and not develop him in Fates. Why play a game about a character that had so little respect that the developers literally had him get eaten after spouting a few nonsensical lines and never mentioned him again?

Isn't this pretty much every single map in Fates, barring maybe a few ones in Conquest (where you conveniently get all the details about the location five minutes in advance - the realism is strong in this campaign)?

That little remark aside, I agree with this.

Yeah, I think I went on a little bit of a rant of my own. I apologize if it seemed as if I focused on you specifically, but by the end all I really have to say is that I'd prefer a new setting. By the end all I was doing was criticizing what they could do in order to make the next FE world better.

Also, I don't want a prequel either, since by the end, we all know that the ending will just be foreshadowing his Gooron transformation.

Edited July 23, 2016 by Raguna

[NeonZ]

Considering they built up Fates as the game that would overcome the shortcomings of Awakening's plot, I think even if Intelligent Systems looks back at the feedback, it could still end up going pretty bad. I think there was just too much fanservice being pushed in that they didn't notice how lacking most of the other areas are. A good game stands on both it's gameplay and story and while gameplay changes were fine even if slightly unnecessary for weapons above steel and two-ranged not called shuriken or legendaries, the story was just a pool of disconected places and ideas.

I don't think the fanservice is the problem. The story relevant gameplay features that take place between story chapters in Fates are mostly separate from the plot. The excuses to do that are a complaint from some players, but it also means that it has little to do with the main story itself being bad.

The issue here is that they took the criticism of Awakening's story to be a problem with their internal writing talent, and so they went after an external writer. However, it's clear that the collaboration didn't work well. The complaint about the chapters and locations feeling disconnected, for example, likely came from Kibayashi's writing style. He recommended them to simplify the story in order to reach a bigger audience, and his most well known works are episodic, which likely also influenced that.

[Slyfox]

I'd have to say no.

Fates had such an interesting world, but it was so poorly executed that I don't see how we can salvage that mess. I'd rather have something new or, if we need a sequel, a followup to Awakening (it doesn't really need one though, but it left enough things open to be developed).

On the topic of prequels, I'm really biased against them, but good ones do exist such as Crisis Core.

[Millyna]

Tbh, if the game is set in Fates' world, I'd love to have no connection to the story. Maybe it's in a world which is exactly like Fates world but not with the characters. Maybe a story about mercenaries in Nohr who try to survive because of the poor conditions. Maybe they could keep the dragon vein by saying that a lower royal who has interiet the dragon vein because being the grandchield (hi kanna~) of the youngest daughter of a past king who has no real heitrage and no interesst in being a royal and then a story about something like that.

Nohr generally gives a nice surrounding for such stories.

[quasimopho13]

That idea sounds awesome! Nohr seemed a lot like Thracia in that it lacked resources. It'd be sweet if they fleshed that out, especially from the perspective of non-royalty

[NekoKnight]

I think they could do a distant prequel of Fates, maybe something somewhat early on in the founding of Nohr and Hoshido, and after the dragons disappeared. There is nothing really to salvage out of the Fates story setting, so if they want to redo that world, they should distance themselves from the characters and events we know. Close continuity between games would only hinder their efforts.

They could talk about the beginnings of the royal families in each country, the start of their animosity towards each other and also of an age when Dragon Vein users were more common/powerful. I'd like to have *real* manaketes as a class again.

[TheWerdna]

There is no such thing as "Fates world". There's just a series of poorly-linked locations with no detailed background and no sophisticated thought put into their creation. Thus, as of now, there's nothing interesting in it, and i don't want another game with world-building of teenager fanfic level.

^This

Now, I wouldn't mind then bringing the Fates world back provided thet actually make it a proper setting rather than said aforementioned collection of locations with no connective tissue.

Honestly if they were to do a prequel I would rather see one for Awakening than Fates. Since at least there we have a pretty major event that reshaped the world from how it was in the older games to how it was in Awakening. That and they could actually, god forbid, actually explain where in the heck Grima came from.

[Thinks Their Own Way]

I never understood the criticism of Fates world needed a name, with the way they divided it up. I feel they made it very clear this part is Nohr territory and this part is Hoshido territory. Hoshido, Nohr and Valla are the only names you have to know so anything beyond that would just feel like useless information.

Edited July 25, 2016 by I'm a Spheal

[Thane]

I never understood the criticism of Fates world needed a name, with the way they divided it up. I feel they made it very clear this part is Nohr territory and this part is Hoshido territory. Hoshido, Nohr and Valla are the only names you have to know so anything beyond that would just feel like useless information.

And yet we spend so much time traversing through towns, neutral areas or what have you that don't matter at all in the grand scheme of things.

[Thinks Their Own Way]

And yet we spend so much time traversing through towns, neutral areas or what have you that don't matter at all in the grand scheme of things.

I'm talking about how we don't need to know very single god damn thing, just tell me the basic information that's important, the backstory that's relevant, and over explain everything like in Awakening.

[Thane]

I'm talking about how we don't need to know very single god damn thing, just tell me the basic information that's important, the backstory that's relevant, and over explain everything like in Awakening.

There are a few things that confuse me about this post.

1) Isn't the name of the world basic information?

2) Wouldn't all of those various areas that are completely forgotten about later on be considered unimportant?

3) When did Awakening overexplain things?

[Thinks Their Own Way]

There are a few things that confuse me about this post.

1) Isn't the name of the world basic information?

2) Wouldn't all of those various areas that are completely forgotten about later on be considered unimportant?

3) When did Awakening overexplain things?

1) To me knowing, this part of the map is Hoshido, this part of the map is Nohr and this area is Valla is more than enough.

2) In terms of character most of those areas are important , not the ninja cave in Conquest. This game loves setting up stuff

3) To me it felt like, they tell you the objection and then they keep on talking and talking about shit that's pretty easy to figure out on your own.

[Thane]

1) To me knowing, this part of the map is Hoshido, this part of the map is Nohr and this area is Valla is more than enough.

2) In terms of character most of those areas are important , not the ninja cave in Conquest. This game loves setting up stuff

3) To me it felt like, they tell you the objection and then they keep on talking and talking about shit that's pretty easy to figure out on your own.

1) Alright, if that's how you feel, then I won't try to convince you otherwise. Personally I think it feels like less of an immersive world without it, but that's just my opinion.

2) I'm sorry but I don't really understand what you're trying to say here.

3) Could you give me an example? The scenes between maps are far longer in Fates and contain much more dialogue, if I remember correctly.

[Thinks Their Own Way]

1) Alright, if that's how you feel, then I won't try to convince you otherwise. Personally I think it feels like less of an immersive world without it, but that's just my opinion.

2) I'm sorry but I don't really understand what you're trying to say here.

3) Could you give me an example? The scenes between maps are far longer in Fates and contain much more dialogue, if I remember correctly.

2) Character Motivations and Goals:

In the Ice Tribe on Conquest, it helps establish Corrin's goal of bringing peace without the usual Nohrian tactics.

Port Dia and Cheve further establish Takumi's descent into madness.

The end of chapter 16 with Shura can show what type of person Corrin can be.

3) One scene that pops into my is when Sumia mistakes punch for a slap (one of the dumbest things ever), and most of Flavia's dialogue came summed up to... She likes you. But instead of just saying that when get an explanation of it.

Those are my thoughts.

[Thane]

2) Character Motivations and Goals:

In the Ice Tribe on Conquest, it helps establish Corrin's goal of bringing peace without the usual Nohrian tactics.

Port Dia and Cheve further establish Takumi's descent into madness.

The end of chapter 16 with Shura can show what type of person Corrin can be.

3) One scene that pops into my is when Sumia mistakes punch for a slap (one of the dumbest things ever), and most of Flavia's dialogue came summed up to... She likes you. But instead of just saying that when get an explanation of it.

Those are my thoughts.

1) The locations are irrelevant to that. If anything, Cheve only highlights how inefficient Corrin is as a protagonist, along with their siblings. The Ice Tribe is pretty much not mentioned afterwards, and Cheve is pretty much only brought up to point out how much CORRIN suffers from being in Nohr.

2) Right but...it's such a short, comical scene; Flavia just comes in to say "eeey, be glad she's not some daisy!" and then they leave. Again, if that's how you feel, I won't try to change your mind, but I really, really don't get it. It's the first time I've ever heard someone complain about that - guess I should add it to my list of things people dislike about Awakenng.